Exactly. Premills have no rebuttal to Amil. Years of calling out the multiple contradictions in their teaching and years of developing the Amil arguments have left Premil helpless to refute the truth.
This world and the wicked are going up in a puff of smoke when Jesus come - thus negating Premil
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Exactly. Premills have no rebuttal to Amil. Years of calling out the multiple contradictions in their teaching and years of developing the Amil arguments have left Premil helpless to refute the truth.
Taken
Well-Known Member
There is EXPRESSLY a Difference between a man BEING “IN Jesus” and “IN Christ”
And Scripture EXPRESSLY tell you.
There is EXPRESSLY a Difference between…
WHO raises up a man “IN Jesus” and
WHO raises up a man “IN Christ”.
There is EXPRESSLY a Difference between…
WHEN a man “IN Jesus” is raised up and WHEN a man “IN Christ” is raised up.
There is EXPRESSLY a Difference between…
WHAT a man “IN Jesus” is CALL:
(IN Jesus, With Jesus, With God, SHALL be saved, IS the REST of the Dead, God shall raise up, during the First RESURRECTION).
AND a man “IN Christ” is CALLED:
(IN Christ, Christ’s Church, a Saint, IS Saved, IS Sanctified, IS Justified, IS Covered, IS Overcome, IS Born Again, IS Caught UP to the Clouds, BY the Lord.)
Knowing Jesus died and God raised Him up, is ONE thing.
Confessing BELIEF Jesus died and God raised Him up, is another thing.
Knowing Jesus died and God raised Him up, AND that Jesus IS the Christ the Son of the Living God, is ONE thing.
Confession BELIEF Jesus died and God raised Him up AND that Jesus IS the Christ the Son of the Living God, is another thing.
It is irrelevant to me WHAT or IF you BELIEVE, or HAVE CONFESSED….
IT IS EXPRESSLY RELEVANT to the Lord, to Christ, to God…….what YOU (or any man) Believes AND Confesses.
Thousands of men WITNESSED Jesus being KILLED….and thereafter SAW HIM ALIVE….
AND BELIEVED, Jesus died and God raised Him UP….PERIOD….
Thousands of those SAME MEN, STILL DID NOT BELIEVE, Jesus IS the Christ, the Son of the Living God….
NOTHING NEW TODAY!
SOME men believe, Jesus died and God raised Him UP….PERIOD.
And SOME men believe, Jesus died and God raised Him UP AND that Jesus IS the Christ the Son of the Living God.
Because YOU IGNORE, the PRECISE Language IN Scripture REGARDING an individual mans BELIEF….
#1 “Jesus died and God raised Him up”
OR
#2 “Jesus died and God raised Him up AND Jesus IS the Christ the Son of the Living God”
YOU ALSO GNORE, the PRECISE Consequence FOR a man WHOSE own “Confession” IS DIFFERENT!
And BY your OWN ignoring and ignorance and stubbornness…..Your response IS TO RETORT….
With name-calling and accusations.
You can name call and accuse ALL DAY LONG….IT DOES NOT CHANGE the DIFFERENCES of what SCRIPTURE SAYS….
Regarding a mans BELIEF, that Jesus died and God raised Him UP…..
or a mans LACK of BELIEF, that Jesus IS the Christ the Son of the Living God.
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
No, there is not. Jesus is the Christ so there is no difference. And everyone knows this except for you. Show me the writing of even one other person in history who agrees with you on this. Good luck. It is out of desperation that you have come up with this nonsense because you know that you needed to do that in order to keep your false doctrine afloat.
Taken
Well-Known Member
FALSE…!!
Amil has REPEATEDLY been ESTABLISHED and STATED BY Premills…
It is plainly stated in Rev 20:
[5] But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
If YOU think the Lord Raising up to the clouds men IN Christ….is ridiculous,
who cares? I don’t.
I know my standing IN Christ.
I know my consequence for standing IN Christ.
If YOU think YOU should be ON Earth suffering the consequences of WRATH and judgements sent down from Heaven….
who cares…?
I don’t.
ENJOY the suffering of the Lamb’s wrath and judgements against you, the suffering of the devils wrath and judgements against you, the suffering of Gods wrath and judgements against you.
Why spend your time whining about WHERE Men IN Christ Are, and WHAT Men in Christ Are doing, while you are ON EARTH enjoying the suffering and judgement of the Lamb, of the devil and of God?
Why are YOU bothered by WHAT applies to Some men, that does not APPLY to you?
IF you are delighting and looking forward to being BODILY Killed during the Last days Tribulation sent down from Heaven….
THAT IS YOUR OPTION to CHOOSE.
I chose my OPTION offered to me, to become crucified with Jesus, satisfying my ONE DEATH REQUIREMENT, and already received SALVATION of my soul, and QUICKENING of my spirit, and have ZERO business to attend to ON EARTH during any portion of the lasts days Tribulation(S) sent down from Heaven….
IF you on the other hand HAVE NOT become crucified with Jesus…..and ARE ON this earth, when Tribulation(s) come down from Heaven…..YEP….that is the time for YOUR OPTION to Physically give your body unto death, so you can then receive your salvation and quickening….along with all the rest of manKIND who at that time chooses to give their BODYS unto Death for the Lord God….and THEY shall be the rest of the dead, raised by God AFTER the Saints IN Christ, reign with Christ for 1,000 years….
THEN will God raise up the REST OF THE DEAD, who became DEAD during the Trib.
WHY have YOU NEVER addressed…
The REST of the DEAD, raised up to immortality, BY God, AFTER the 1,000 year reign of Christ?
Rev 20:
[5] But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
WHY?
Because the REST OF THE DEAD, being raised up….IS an indicator THAT OTHERS were SAVED and RAISED UP, BEFORE THE “FIRST RESURRECTION”….
AND that “IS expressly” what YOU DENY.
Not only DENY, but call it “ridiculous”, and make your testimony AGAINST people who DO BELIEVE IT.
It's not just that he does not know what Amillennialists believe, he doesn't even know what he believes.
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
LOL. Wrong. Premils have done absolutely NOTHING to support their view with SCRIPTURE in this thread.
No one here thinks that and you know it.
No one here thinks that and you know it.
The Lamb's wrath is reserved for unbelievers. Are you trying to accuse those who disagree with your end times doctrine of being unbelievers? Since when does being saved have anything to do with our end times doctrine?
Who are you saying will be suffering the judgment of the Lamb?
Are you afraid of persecution? Is that why you believe in a pre-trib rapture?
2 Timothy 3:12 In fact, everyone who wants to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted,
Raised up BEFORE the FIRST resurrection? LOL. How is that possible? Your view makes it so that the FIRST resurrection is not actually the FIRST resurrection. It's similar to what you do with the LAST trumpet.
The rest of the dead is a reference to those whose names are not written in the book of life who end up being cast into the lake of fire (Rev 20:15).
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
Christian Gedge
Well-Known Member
You remind me of an old assertion that the ‘Kingdom of Heaven’ was different to the ‘Kingdom of God.’
Taken
Well-Known Member
The difference is NOT ABOUT WHAT JESUS IS….Don’t you pay attention?
The Difference IS about WHAT MEN BELIEVE, and WHAT they CONFESS TO BELIEVE!
Sheesh!
Everyone KNOWS what every man BELIEVES? Doubt it.
You say, I do not know Jesus IS the Christ?
WHY LIE?
I have said EXPRESSLY Jesus IS the Christ.
Already showed you, written IN Scripture…..
What you call nonsense IS EXPRESSLY IN SCRIPTURE…
A confession of Belief IN JESUS, and that man SHALL BE SAVED…..IF he keeps that believe and AFTER his body dies.
Rom 10:
[9] That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Where is CHRIST mentioned? Nada
Where is IS SAVED mentioned? Nada
IF…a man believes IN JESUS, he shall be saved after his body dies.
IF…that man believes IN Jesus, after his bodily death, he shall be saved, and God shall raise up his saved soul to heaven.
And while that man continues living his life IN Jesus, which even a child knows IN Jesus, is IN Gods Word. And even the most simplest of minds can comprehend Living IN Gods Word, is Being enlightened to Gods Word.
And a diligent student of Scripture SHOULD KNOW…
A man IN Gods Word (Jesus) Can fall away, CAN stop being enlightened, will stop being WITH and IN Jesus, and Jesus stop being WITH that person.
A diligent student SHOULD KNOW what happens to a man who STOPS being IN Jesus, IN Gods Word….stops being enlightened….
He stops receiving blessing from the Holy Spirit. And he Has forfeited his Salvation.
When his body dies, he will not be saved.
Jesus’ Doctrine IS NOT FALSE, and I agree with Jesus’ Doctrine:
that those IN Jesus “SHALL BE SAVED AFTER THEIR BODILY DEATH”….
AND those IN Christ “ARE SAVED NOW And SHALL be Caught UP to the Clouds, WHEN the Trump of the archangel sounds, and those IN Christ Hear the VOICE of the Lord calling them UP to the Clouds to Meet the Lord in the air……..
BECAUSE they ARE Already MADE WHOLE, and a Faithful Servant OF Christ Jesus.
You pretending all men who believe in Jesus, believe Jesus is the Christ….they don’t!
You pretending Christ saves men who DO NOT BELIEVE His IS the Christ….is a lie.
You pretending a “resurrection” to the Earth, is the same as the “rapture” to the Clouds above the earth, is a lie.
You pretending the FIRST “resurrection”….
Means NO OTHERS HAVE BEEN “resurrected”, or “raised UP” off the Earth.
is a lie.
Men have died on earth, and been raised back up to life ON the earth, which is a resurrection.
Gods ORDER and WAY….is precisely how He contends with every individual man….according to WHAT an individual man Believes….
You seem to think, WHO the Lord God IS…
IS Dependent ON WHO men believe He IS.
FALSE…the Lord God IS WHO HIS IS….
Regardless of what men Believe.
HOW the Lord God contends with every individual man SOLELY rests on WHAT individual men believe.
YOU apparently believe, the Lord God, has Wrath planned FOR YOU….Great, enjoy it.
I do not believe the Lord God has Wrath planned FOR ME….Because by His own Power, He MADE ME WHOLE, body, soul, spirit….Nothing more for me to do, hanging around on the face of the earth, WITH men NOT MADE WHOLE, experiencing Wrath from Heaven……UPON the unrighteous….
WHO ARE … DUH….them NOT MADE WHOLE!
You are here to push your agenda against men who BELIEVE a man MADE WHOLE, by the Power of Christ, IS NOT a man accounted as “unrighteous”…..AND further that GOD SHALL send His Tribulations and wrath down from Heaven UPON the Earth UPON the righteous.
YOU go on and on and on wagging your tongue against men IN Christ who TRUST they have already been delivered from the wrath to come………
Hogwash.
The rest of the dead is a reference to those who became Godly and believing IN Jesus during the Trib and they are raised in the first resurrection.
IF you studied Scripture, MOST of Revelations is ABOUT God fulfilling His Promise to SAVE HIS PEOPLE, who are the Tribes of Israel being SAVED…..
The dead is a reference to those ANTI-God, with Satan’s mark, raised in the second resurrection.
Very odd you think those IN Christ have ANY ROLE whatsoever During the Trib.
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Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
Sheesh yourself. Nowhere in scripture does it say that an unsaved person can be "in Jesus". Only those who are saved are in Jesus/Christ.
I never said that. You are the liar. I said that because Jesus is the Christ there is no difference between being in Jesus and being in Christ.
Taken
Well-Known Member
True, your words do not appear in Scripture.
Gods word appears in Scripture for those who Die IN Jesus God will bring with HIM.
Don’t know about you, because you spend your time implying and attacking in stead of standing for anything…..But God is in Heaven and raises up to HIM, saved Souls….and Souls saved IN Jesus, shall God bring with Him.
1 Thes 4:14
Because…. 1 Thes 4: 16-17
(The Lord is busy meeting with those IN Christ IN the Clouds)
@Spiritual Israelite quote…“I never said that. You are the liar. I said that…”
Spot on. You didn’t but you did.
Your usual profession LAW? POLITICS?
Address the Op and acknowledge the obvious - your theology is messed up!True, your words do not appear in Scripture.
Gods word appears in Scripture for those who Die IN Jesus God will bring with HIM.
Don’t know about you, because you spend your time implying and attacking in stead of standing for anything…..But God is in Heaven and raises up to HIM, saved Souls….and Souls saved IN Jesus, shall God bring with Him.
1 Thes 4:14
Because…. 1 Thes 4: 16-17
(The Lord is busy meeting with those IN Christ IN the Clouds)
@Spiritual Israelite quote…“I never said that. You are the liar. I said that…”
Spot on. You didn’t but you did.
Your usual profession LAW? POLITICS?
Address the Op and acknowledge the obvious - your theology is messed up!True, your words do not appear in Scripture.
Gods word appears in Scripture for those who Die IN Jesus God will bring with HIM.
Don’t know about you, because you spend your time implying and attacking in stead of standing for anything…..But God is in Heaven and raises up to HIM, saved Souls….and Souls saved IN Jesus, shall God bring with Him.
1 Thes 4:14
Because…. 1 Thes 4: 16-17
(The Lord is busy meeting with those IN Christ IN the Clouds)
@Spiritual Israelite quote…“I never said that. You are the liar. I said that…”
Spot on. You didn’t but you did.
Your usual profession LAW? POLITICS?
Taken
Well-Known Member
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
You purposely only quoted part of what I said as if I contradicted myself, but I didn't. It's a fact that I didn't say what you accused me of saying. I indicated that I never said that and then I indicated what I actually said. But, you deceptively left that part out. You obviously have no conscience about lying and being dishonest which is a serious problem. You need to repent of that.@Spiritual Israelite quote…“I never said that. You are the liar. I said that…”
Spot on. You didn’t but you did.
Your usual profession LAW? POLITICS?
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
Exactly! The reason he will not answer this is because he has yet to do so.
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