Yahweh Says to Adoni

[Matthias]

It may even be "lord" in Psalms 110:1 …

It is. Not because I say so or wish that it did. It is what is written in the Hebrew text.

Once it’s established, which I leave for you to do, then we’re faced with the fact that it is a title which is never applied to YHWH in scripture. It’s always used in reference to men or angels.

however, Jesus is the "Lord" in 1 Corinthians 8:6; even the one Lord of holy scripture.

I thought we had already agreed on that. If not, let’s do so now.

And I have shown how the Father is the Lord of heaven and earth in Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21, and 2 Corinthians 6:17-18; and how there is one Lord in Ephesians 4:5.

Yes. That’s another thing which I thought we had agreed on. If not, let’s do that now.

How do you make any other conclusion than that Jesus and the Father are the same Lord?

I tried to explain that two you. One person, the Father, is the Lord God, the one God. The other person, the Son, is the Lord Messiah, a human person.

You do not agree that Jesus is the Lord in light of Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21, and 2 Corinthians 6:17-18. When you say that Jesus is the Lord in light of those verses, you are just mouthing words in order to fit a criterium. There is no meaning behind them and therefore they do not qualify for you to have the Holy Ghost
If you did agree that Jesus is the Lord in light of the verses in question, you would also agree that Jesus and the Father are the same Lord.

Because clearly, those verses tell us that the Father is the one Lord of holy scripture; and therefore if Jesus is also the one Lord, it follows that Jesus and the Father are the same Lord.

re #55.

I understand your position but I don’t agree with the conclusions you’ve reached from the scripture you referenced.

Father and Son.

YHWH and Jesus.

The one God and the Messiah.

Those are examples of statements which I recognize and acknowledge.

YHWH and YHWH.

God and God.

Those are examples of statements which I don’t recognize and acknowledge.

 

[heartwashed]

I tried to explain that two you. One person, the Father, is the Lord God, the one God. The other person, the Son, is the Lord Messiah, a human person.

There is one Lord in holy scripture (Ephesians 4:5, 1 Corinthians 8:6).

THINK.

 

[Matthias]

Yes, that is what I'm saying.

Okay. Thank you.

You believe the Trinity is 1 self and 3 selfs.

Would you happen to have access to any trinitarian commentaries which support your belief? I would like to read them, if you do.

 

[heartwashed]

It is. Not because I say so or wish that it did. It is what is written in the Hebrew text.

Once it’s established, which I leave for you to do, then we’re faced with the fact that it is a title which is never applied to YHWH in scripture. It’s always used in reference to men or angels.

See post #60 (Yahweh Says to Adoni).

 

[heartwashed]

Okay. Thank you.

You believe the Trinity is 1 self and 3 selfs.

Would you happen to have access to any trinitarian commentaries which support your belief? I would like to read them, if you do.

I don't spend much of my time reading commentaries.

I prefer to read the holy scriptures and allow the Holy Ghost to illuminate them to me.

 

[Matthias]

There is one Lord in holy scripture (Ephesians 4:5, 1 Corinthians 8:6).

The one God is one Lord. The Messiah is a second Lord. The one God, the Lord God, is the Messiah’s God. The Messiah is “the Lord’s Messiah”.

THINK.

Do you want me to treat you like that?

 

[heartwashed]

The one God is one Lord. The Messiah is a second Lord. The one God, the Lord God, is the Messiah’s God. The Messiah is “the Lord’s Messiah”.

The Messiah cannot be a second Lord; because there is only one Lord (Ephesians 4:5, 1 Corinthians 8:6).

THINK.

 

[heartwashed]

Do you want me to treat you like that?

Don't be such a TSI.

 

[Matthias]

It is actually the Hebrew word adon (not "adoni") in Psalms 110:1.

It’s not in vowelled Hebrew. Are you able to read unvowelled Hebrew? Hebrew language translators are.

Here are the definitions.

אָדוֹן
Transliteration
'āḏôn
Pronunciation
aw-done'

Part of Speech
masculine noun
Root Word (Etymology)
From an unused root (meaning to rule)
Dictionary Aids
TWOT Reference: lord (197x), master(s) (105x), Lord (31x), owner (1x), sir (1x).
Outline of Biblical Usage [?]

1. firm, strong, lord, master
   1. lord, master
      1. reference to men
         1. superintendent of household,of affairs
            
            
         2. master
            
            
         3. king
      2. reference to God
         1. the Lord God
         2. Lord of the whole earth
   2. lords, kings
      1. reference to men
         1. proprietor of hill of Samaria
            
            
         2. master
            
            
         3. husband
            
            
         4. prophet
            
            
         5. governor
            
            
         6. prince
            
            
         7. king
      2. reference to God
         1. Lord of lords (probably = "thy husband, Yahweh")
   3. my lord, my master
      1. reference to men
         1. master
            
            
         2. husband
            
            
         3. prophet
            
            
         4. prince
            
            
         5. king
            
            
         6. father
            
            
         7. Moses
            
            
         8. priest
            
            
         9. theophanic angel
            
            
         10. captain
             
             
         11. general recognition of superiority
      2. reference to God
         1. my Lord,my Lord and my God
         2. Adonai (parallel with Yahweh)

Strong’s Definitions [?](Strong’s Definitions Legend)
אָדוֹן ʼâdôwn, aw-done'; or (shortened) אָדֹן ʼâdôn; from an unused root (meaning to rule); sovereign, i.e. controller (human or divine):—lord, master, owner. Compare also names beginning with 'Adoni-'.

Adon is the root word. This is seen in both adonai and adoni.

 

[Matthias]

See post #60 (Yahweh Says to Adoni).

I read and responded to it. The vowelled Hebrew text is adoni, not adonai.

 

[Matthias]

The Messiah cannot be a second Lord; because there is only one Lord (Ephesians 4:5, 1 Corinthians 8:6).

There are two Lords in Psalm 110:1.

THINK.

 

[heartwashed]

The Hebrew word is "adon"...and it can be translated as "Lord" (capital "L").

see post #60 (Yahweh Says to Adoni).

re #69 and #70.

 

[Matthias]

Don't be such a TSI.

I don’t know what the acronym stand for.

 

[Matthias]

The Hebrew word is "adon"...and it can be translated as "Lord" (capital "L").

See the vowelled Hebrew text. The Hebrew word is adoni and it is properly rendered as “lord” in all 195 occurrences.

YHWH is never described with the title adoni.

 

[heartwashed]

There are two Lords in Psalm 110:1.

No, there is one YHWH and one Lord.

And since YHWH is the Lord (Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21, 2 Corinthians 6:17-18), that indicates two YHWH's...

Which are in all reality one YHWH...since they are one Spirit.

 

[heartwashed]

See the vowelled Hebrew text. The Hebrew word is adoni and it is properly rendered as “lord” in all 195 occurrences.

YHWH is never described with the title adoni.

I don't read Hebrew...

And I also don't take people's word for it when they say that the Greek or Hebrew says something in particular; unless I can verify it with a concordance.

That is conducive to a cult-like mentality wherein the Greek or Hebrew scholar becomes the authority on what the Bible really says.

Because they can be lying.

 

[Matthias]

Not, there is one YHWH and one Lord.

One YHWH and one lord in Psalm 110:1.

And since YHWH is the Lord (Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21, 2 Corinthians 6:17-18), that indicates two YHWH's...

There is only one YHWH.

Which are in all reality one YHWH...since they are one Spirit.

Why not three YHWH’s? And why does David not speak of three YHWH’s in Psalm 110:1?

 

[heartwashed]

One YHWH and one lord in Psalm 110:1.



There is only one YHWH.



Why not three YHWH’s? And why does David not speak of three YHWH’s in Psalm 110:1?

The Holy Ghost's purpose is to glorify Jesus...therefore He doesn't often bring attention to Himself.

 

[heartwashed]

One YHWH and one lord in Psalm 110:1.

One YHWH and one Lord...

For "adon" can be translated as "Lord" (capital "L").

See post #60 (Yahweh Says to Adoni).

 

[Matthias]

I don't read Hebrew...

That’s become clear to me. It’s not necessary to know how to read Hebrew but it helps. We wouldn’t be having the conversation that we are if you could read Hebrew.

And I also don't take people's word for it when they say that the Greek or Hebrew says something in particular; unless I can verify it with a concordance.

Do you have access to a standard Hebrew Lexicon? Your Concordance won’t make the distinction; a Lexicon will.

That is conducive to a cult-like mentality wherein the Greek or Hebrew scholar becomes the authority on what the Bible really says.

Greek and Hebrew scholars don’t operate in a vacuum. If a Hebrew scholar were to say that adoni means LORD or Lord, for example, he or she would promptly be corrected by their peers.