The Pre-Trib Rapture

[Truth7t7]

The rapture applies ONLY to the Converted, being removed from the face of the Earth. Lifted up. Those IN Christ, called UP by the Lord, to meet the Lord.

The Second Coming, IS:...the Return of WHO was sent once.
Who was sent once?

Son of Man...a baby
Who was he revealed? Teacher, Preacher, Prophet, Truth, Life, Power of God who IS Christ.
John 3:16
[16] For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Who shall men on earth SEE returning?
Son of Man...or human eyes will not SEE Him.
With Power...ie Christ.

Who shall men meet in the air, RAPTURE? The Lord
...the Lord
...Son of Man
...Christ

Is God not omnipresent?
Here, called by this name?
There, called by that name?

Saints, Christ’s Church, shall come WITH the Son of Man, Christ the Power, Lord who shall sit on His Throne WITH His saints.
Shall men on earth, with earthly eyes, SEE the saints With the Son, the Christ Returning to Earth? No.

The second coming and resurrection/rapture of the saved believers takes place on the "Last Day" (The End)

 

[Taken]

The second coming and resurrection/rapture of the saved believers takes place on the "Last Day" (The End)

Nope.

 

[Truth7t7]

And ye know not the hour your LORD does come .
Its a one time event my friends . That ol ark door aint gonna open up a second time .
Once the master of the House has risen up and closed that door , WAILING for all begins who knew not Christ . WRATH TIME .
And by the looks of things with all this inquity going through the roof and them hollering world peace and safety
ME THINKS TIME IS RUNNING OUT .

Yes the signs are clear, but the antichrist and two witnesses will precede the end, and its not going to be a world secret

Literal plagues will be brought upon the world by the two witnesses, a remake of Moses/Aaron against Pharaoh of egypt

 

[Truth7t7]

Nope.

Yep

 

[Truth7t7]

Still quoting "the end" nonsense.

I grow tired of proving you wrong with scripture as your blindness and lack of understanding seem boundless.

You have proven nobody wrong, your lack in scriptural argument says it all, crickets!

 

[Timtofly]

How can Jesus leave heaven at the 6th seal and remain in heaven to open the 7th seal?

There is no verse that declares Jesus opens the 7th Seal in heaven.

Jesus will wait until His throne is set up in Jerusalem, and He is seated in the Temple before the 7th Seal is opened. There is a verse, Matthew 25:31 that states He is sitting on a throne on earth. After the Lamb's book of life is opened, the judgment of the sheep and goats starts. The goats have their names removed from the Lamb's book of life.

 

[Taken]

Yep

Let me see...Disagreement continues. Obvious. So what.

 

[Truth7t7]

There is no verse that declares Jesus opens the 7th Seal in heaven.

Jesus will wait until His throne is set up in Jerusalem, and He is seated in the Temple before the 7th Seal is opened. There is a verse, Matthew 25:31 that states He is sitting on a throne on earth. After the Lamb's book of life is opened, the judgment of the sheep and goats starts. The goats have their names removed from the Lamb's book of life.

Many claim Jesus will literally return and rule "On This Earth" In A Millennium this being false in deception

Jesus warned his followers against this teaching, Jesus wont be found anywhere upon this earth as many claim

The Antichrist will be in Jerusalem, claiming to be Messiah Returned, "Beware"!

"Believe It Not" "Go Not Forth"

Matthew 24:23-27KJV
23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
25 Behold, I have told you before.
26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.
27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Revelation 13:13-14KJV
13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

Revelation 19:20KJV
20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

 

[Taken]

There is no verse that declares Jesus opens the 7th Seal in heaven.

There is no scripture that says Jesus opens any seals.
John’s recording is from what John Saw while he was “up hither”, and observed the Lamb opening all of the Seals.

Rev 4
1] After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.

Rev 7
[1] And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see.
[3] And when he had opened the second seal, I heard the second beast say, Come and see.
[5] And when he had opened the third seal, I heard the third beast say, Come and see. And I beheld, and lo a black horse; and he that sat on him had a pair of balances in his hand.
[7] And when he had opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth beast say, Come and see.
[9] And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
[12] And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;
Rev.8
[1] And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour.

 

[ewq1938]

Which rapture and which resurrection are you talking about?

There is one rapture, just after the first resurrection.

The great tribulation can be seen at the 5th seal.

No, it is a time before the Great Tribulation.

Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
Rev 6:11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

That time when they are killed is future to the dead being told they have to wait for vengeance.

The wrath of God begins with the 1st trumpet after the 7th seal is opened.

No, the bible says the wrath of God is at the 7th trump:

Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
Rev 11:16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
Rev 11:17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

LOL. And the wrath of God ends with the 7th trumpet. I'm not sure what translation you are reading, but it can't possibly be KJV.

Nothing you say matches what the bible says.

 

[Truth7t7]

There is no scripture that says Jesus opens any seals.
John’s recording is from what John Saw while he was “up hither”, and observed the Lamb opening all of the Seals.

Rev 4
1] After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.

Rev 7
[1] And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see.
[3] And when he had opened the second seal, I heard the second beast say, Come and see.
[5] And when he had opened the third seal, I heard the third beast say, Come and see. And I beheld, and lo a black horse; and he that sat on him had a pair of balances in his hand.
[7] And when he had opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth beast say, Come and see.
[9] And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
[12] And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;
Rev.8
[1] And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour.

Your eschatology is a joke,scripture clearly states the lamb of God was the only one worthy to open the seven seals on the book

Revelation 5:5KJV
5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.

 

[Phoneman777]

Clear? Quote it please. I quoted scripture that is actually clear what the mark is about and it's not related to worship or Sunday. [/QUOTE Romans 8:7 KJV says the wicked can't keep God's commandments even if they wanted to, so since the UNMARKED are said to "keep the commandments of God", the MARKED are breaking them.

I don't know what you think the Mark is, but if it's got nothing to do with God's law, you're wrong.

 

[Phoneman777]

And what does any of that have to do with keeping the sabbath on Saturday or not? Nothing. You think I have the mark of the beast just because I don't believe the sabbath commandment applies to New Testament believers? I believe in Christ as my Lord and Savior and surrender my life to Him, but I'm going to hell if I'm mistaken in my understanding of the sabbath? That's ludicrous. Salvation is by grace through faith in Christ, not by grace through keeping the sabbath.

Colossians 2:16 Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.

I believe the Sabbath was a shadow of the things that were to come. Now, we rest in Christ every day.

Hebrews 4:7 God again set a certain day, calling it “Today.” This he did when a long time later he spoke through David, as in the passage already quoted: “Today, if you hear his voice, do not harden your hearts.” 8 For if Joshua had given them rest, God would not have spoken later about another day. 9 There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God; 10 for anyone who enters God’s rest also rests from their works,just as God did from his. 11 Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will perish by following their example of disobedience.

Again, if I happened to be mistaken about this, that means I'm going to hell? Where does scripture teach such a thing?

Anyone who breaks the Sabbath and knows they ought to be keeping it doesn't have Jesus in their heart. The time will soon arrive when God's law will take center stage on the world theatre, and all will be laid bare then.

 

[Truth7t7]

Anyone who breaks the Sabbath and knows they ought to be keeping it doesn't have Jesus in their heart. The time will soon arrive when God's law will take center stage on the world theatre, and all will be laid bare then.

The false prophetess Ellen G. White teaches Sunday observance is the mark of the beast, scripture teaches other wise

Ellen and 7th day Adventist that follow this false prophetess claim Sunday observers aren't going to the eternal kingdom, Ellen G White is a deceiver

Scripture below teaches commandment breakers are the least "In The Kingdom"!

Matthew 5:19KJV
19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

 

[Timtofly]

I didn’t say it was wrong. I wondered how you knew the Day.

Do you mean the day the 7th Trumpet sounds? Or the day it stops sounding?

 

[ewq1938]

I don't know what you think the Mark is, but if it's got nothing to do with God's law, you're wrong.

Again, you cannot provide a single scripture showing the mark is related to God's law or Sunday worship. That should bother you but it likely doesn't.

However, I have provided scripture showing what the mark is, allowing the buying and selling.

 

[Truth7t7]

Do you mean the day the 7th Trumpet sounds? Or the day it stops sounding?

Fairy tale eschatology

 

[Timtofly]

Other Scripture points out that He was resurrected.

Three days into the 2nd half of the 70th week.

He remained on earth for another 40 days into the 2nd half of the 70th week, before His ascension.

He didn't remain cut off.

The week wasn't cut off, and the 2nd half of the week wasn't cut off.

Sorry, nothing to do with Gentiles' fulness or lording.

Of course Jesus was cut off from being Prince and reigning in Jerusalem. Just because you refuse a future Millennium reign of Christ as King on earth, does not mean God refuses that reign on earth.

Jesus did not reign in Jerusalem for the second half a 7 year period, then started the 1,000 year Millennium.

Your historicism has failed you.

 

[Timtofly]

The rapture applies ONLY to the Converted, being removed from the face of the Earth. Lifted up. Those IN Christ, called UP by the Lord, to meet the Lord.

The Second Coming, IS:...the Return of WHO was sent once.
Who was sent once?

Son of Man...a baby
Who was he revealed? Teacher, Preacher, Prophet, Truth, Life, Power of God who IS Christ.
John 3:16
[16] For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Who shall men on earth SEE returning?
Son of Man...or human eyes will not SEE Him.
With Power...ie Christ.

Who shall men meet in the air, RAPTURE? The Lord
...the Lord
...Son of Man
...Christ

Is God not omnipresent?
Here, called by this name?
There, called by that name?

Saints, Christ’s Church, shall come WITH the Son of Man, Christ the Power, Lord who shall sit on His Throne WITH His saints.
Shall men on earth, with earthly eyes, SEE the saints With the Son, the Christ Returning to Earth? No.

Jesus will return as King. He will sit on a throne in a temple in Jerusalem.

 

[Truth7t7]

Of course Jesus was cut off from being Prince and reigning in Jerusalem. Just because you refuse a future Millennium reign of Christ as King on earth, does not mean God refuses that reign on earth.

Jesus did not reign in Jerusalem for the second half a 7 year period, then started the 1,000 year Millennium.

Your historicism has failed you.

Your claim a 1000 year kingdom on earth fails you, found no place in scripture, a fairy tale!

A Fairy Tale Eschatology!