What if you lose your faith?

[Ferris Bueller]

and your doctrine would say that Works don’t save , but you have to have them to “Prove” that you are Saved

Besides not listening you just don't know the Bible very well:

"6In all this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while you may have had to suffer grief in all kinds of trials. 7These have come so that the proven genuineness of your faith—of greater worth than gold, which perishes even though refined by fire—may result in praise, glory and honor when Jesus Christ is revealed." 1 Peter 1:6-7
​

So, now, Bible genius, according to the passage above what proves the genuineness of your faith when Jesus comes back? Falling away and living in sin, or your enduring obedience?

 

[stunnedbygrace]

The Valley of doubt is like the adolescent stage of our faith. The light of Christ in us leads us to see our own failures, we struggle against them and try to conquer our failures of our own strength and will, and fail over and over again, we can fall into legalism, only to stumble back into sin, and we begin to doubt our very salvation In Christ as real. When we read the Word of God, we are drawn to the passages that teach conditional security, and wonder if we were saved to begin with, and to question the things we were taught, when we were being fed by the shepherds of the faith, Many will fall away from the faith in this valley. When we come to the Point of defeat that we finally "Give up trying", And let God do in us, is when we have finally put to death the "old man" and learn to trust in God's providence. Thus we become Young men and young women in the faith. Those who overcome this valley have reached the "full assurance of the faith".

I really like this paragraph. I’m not sure it’s exactly that way for everyone, but I certainly lived as a foolish galatian, and for a very long time because I am stubborn! And foolish! It’s a very depressing and repeating cycle.

 

[David H.]

I really like this paragraph. I’m not sure it’s exactly that way for everyone, but I certainly lived as a foolish galatian, and for a very long time because I am stubborn! And foolish! It’s a very depressing and repeating cycle.

Amen, So did I. The Post was very autobiographical and a testimony of my own journey. I find that when I share these things others find themselves somewhere in this journey as well and can relate. I Know each of us has a different set of circumstances in their journey to overcome. Mine is of a person raised in the church since childhood, Some who are saved at a later age may accelerate right through this adolescent stage, because they reached the point of brokenness before they got saved.

 

[GodsGrace]

All verses have to be "scripture compared with scripture", and "rightly divided".

You dont think so, as long as you can read them like they are in a phone book, as you just explained.
So, i can't change what you dont know.
I can only show you what to see.

It's difficult to rightly divide scripture you don't post because you want me to read your mind.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

to be Of the devil is to Act like the devil, with his spirit of Rebellion —- it will get you Chastised—- NOT Condemned...

No, it plainly says the child of the devil "is not of God".

"10By this the children of God are distinguished from the children of the devil: Anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God" 1 John 3:10
​

The person you say is a fallen, unbelieving born again person, John says is a child of the devil and NOT OF GOD.

 

[Behold]

And that is the problem.

Here is your problem.
You said that if you sin, you don't go to heaven.
I pointed out that you sin.
You've now avoided what you said, because you're dishonest.
You'll avoid it again because you're dishonest.

 

[Behold]

It's difficult to rightly divide scripture you don't post because you want me to read your mind.

Not at all.

Ive answered your questions, except for..>"where in Jude".
Otherwise, ive shown you the answer to that one verse that has you stuck.
Ive shown F. Bueller 10x as much, and he's so darkened that he can't even respond to what I show Him, and he just reposts that one verse, that one verse, that one verse, like his mind is stuck....and it is.

Here is the problem you have.. = Verses, are not going to help you, if i post them, because its verses that have confused you.

Let me show you this.

If you are born again, and not just water baptized into the "cult of Mary"...but if you and GOD have become in Spiritual Union, then this means you are "blood bought". = "you are not your own".....>"you are bought with a price". And that price is the Blood of Jesus, and His death.
So, if that has happened to you, then you are not your own. You BELONG to God, and what you do and think later, has no effect on being already OWNED by God.
So, faith, some faith, no faith, dead faith.....this is all just silliness when comparing it to what God has already completed.


Let me show you one more.

The born again are the inheritance of Jesus. And God has given the born again, each one to Jesus as HIS inheritance = as the spiritual fruit of the Cross.
So, God is not going to take away from Christ, His blood bought redeemed, simply because they can't understand a verse, or because they have no faith one day.
God has GIVEN the Born gain, to Jesus, and God is not going to take them back, GodsGrace, based on some MIND PROBLEM they have with their faith.

John 10:29 "My Father who has given the born again to me, Is GREATER THEN ALL... and NOONE is able to take the born again, out of my hand".

And that mean you, GodsGrace. You are one of the "NO ONE"... if you are born again.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Ive shown F. Bueller 10x as much, and he's so darkened that he can't even respond to what I show Him, and he just reposts that one verse, that one verse, that one verse, like his mind is stuck....and it is.

You haven't been able to get past any of the scriptures I've posted that obliterate your 'saved, born again unbeliever' theology. And I'm still waiting for that verse that says continuing to believe in the blood of Christ is the equivalent of trying to earn your own salvation in a works gospel. Keep searching...

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Why isn't 1 John 2:24-25 also a promise then?

You're really just avoiding the whole point. Born again people don't fall away into sin and unbelief. John says so. So to do that you'd have to 1) have never believed and never been born again, or 2) stopped believing and ceased to be born again, because John makes it clear that born again people don't act and think the way you insist born again people can. This is the point you are completely avoiding. You have saved born again people acting the very way John says saved born again people don't act!

If Born Again people can’t sin why does John also say that if we make the claim that we don’t sin, we are Liars....

Why does God say that he Chastises His Children when they sin?

If we no longer sin, we no longer need Grace, so why does God tell us to go to His Throne Of Grace in Times Of need?

 

[Ferris Bueller]

If Born Again people can’t sin why does John also say that if we make the claim that we don’t sin, we are Liars....

Why does God say that he Chastises His Children when they sin?

If we no longer sin, we no longer need Grace, so why does God tell us to go to His Throne Of Grace in Times Of need?

Born again people do sin. What they don't do is continue to sin. They progress towards holiness. The unsaved, not born again person does not. He languishes unchanged, unconverted in his sin. The very fact they're doing that shows they are not born again and belong to the devil. You say that's not true. You say as long as they said they believe somewhere in the past that person is saved/born again. John says they are not.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Here is your problem.
You said that if you sin, you don't go to heaven.
I pointed out that you sin.
You've now avoided what you said, because you're dishonest.
You'll avoid it again because you're dishonest.

“ They put a yoke on others that they refuse for themselves.....hypocrites!”

 

[GodsGrace]

OSAS is a subversive theology that came about in Paul's day, that Jude wrote about.

You dont know this, but what you accuse me of Teaching, as OSAS, is what they said they said Paul was also Teaching.

Jude explained that what the Devil had done was .....created this idea that God's Grace, is "license" or, what you would refer to as "cheap grace".
And then a person's self righteousness would keep them from ever understanding God Grace, who had been infected by this deception.
That is how the Devil created this deception to work. And it works very well.
You have it.
Ferris has it.
Gen2Rev
Grailhunter
and about 5-10 other people here have it who post about it on this forum, and shout their LEGALISM< for "as long as they can type", that is produced by this same deception that has been born in their minds to believe that God's Grace is "license to sin".

Jude is an important book, as are all.

If you don't post a verse, how is one to respond to you?
I don't see in Jude anything of what you posted above.
Here's what I find in Jude:

Jude teaches that we are to remain strong in the faith and to oppose heresy. NLT Jude Introduction
God's truth must go forward, defended by those that HAVE COMMITED THEIR LIVES TO HIS SON. NLT Jude Introduction
Many false teachers are waiting to destroy YOUR CHRIST CENTERED LIFE. Stand FIRM IN YOUR FAITH and defend God's truth at all costs.
NLT Jude Introduction

Jude begs the believers to remain faithful
Jude 1:5

We are not to live immoral lives.
Jude 1:8

We don't have to be afraid of false teachers IF we are grounded in Christ.
Jude 1:24

 

[GodsGrace]

First you would have to actually understand that Blood Atonement, and the Gospel of the Grace of God, that Paul says is "MY Gospel".

Start there.

Then, you have to do what Hebrews 13:9 says, AFTER you understand the other i just wrote.

Why don't you stop worrying about what I know or understand or believe and just write what you feel you should write to uphold your incorrect theory?

OSAS IS a strange new idea...just like Hebrews 13:9 speaks of strange ideas.

Anyway, I write, of course, for those reading along.
Maybe a new Christian that might be confused by non-biblical ideas that are portrayed here.

 

[GodsGrace]

Yes i love unconditionally.
But that is not the same as teaching.

And you have no idea about what Paul taught, and in fact, if i asked you to explain why Paul said the gospel of the Grace of God is "my Gospel", you would not be able to explain it.

If i asked you to explain the Blood Atonement as the "one time eternal sacrifice for ALL SIN".....you would not be able to explain what Paul is teaching.

and.....The other that you wrote, is just to be insulting, and im immune.

I write Threads that Give all Credit to Christ for saving and keeping you saved, which is "Eternal life", and you come to my Thead and try to deny that Christ keeps you saved., using a verse that "look behold i can read it, so that must mean what it says".

So, yeah, its not helping you to be here, but it is helping others who are not self savers to read your "christ will get rid of me if i dont do this"... type of Cross Rejection.
You live in a religion of trying not to go to hell, based on some symbolic verses, and some that you didn't understand.
And you found some support, as there are always these type people on a forum, so you now think you are empowered and are teaching truth, because some heretics gave you some pats on the back.
You're not teaching truth.

I showed you that Salvation is a GIFT that God will never repent of, and you dont care about that, as you want to argue your one obsession.
The argument is your goal.
So, in that way, you and Ferris Bueller are Identical Twins., and theologically, the same.

You've been telling yourself that you are saved for a long time, but you dont actually believe that Christ keeps you saved.

Thats not good., and you dont care.

How do we have eternal life NOW
If we have to die one day?

 

[GodsGrace]

If Christ is in you, and you aren't going to hell, then stop denying this by saying that if you lost your faith you will go to hell.

And "BLAMELESS". or not.,, regarding never having a faith Crisis, or dead faith.

You will be PRESENTED.......

Before JESUS.... as never having had this issue, which is blameless in that regard, or not.

That is not going to happen to an unbeliever, who is never born again., as they are in hell when they die
They dont meet Jesus.
There are no Christ rejectors that are going to do anything but end up in hell, and then Hit the Grt White Throne Judgement, and then the Lake of Fire.

Are you OK Behold?
Do you read stuff into posts that are not there?

Here. It's simple:

FAITH SAVES.

IF YOU HAVE FAITH .... YOU'RE SAVED
IF YOU DO NOT HAVE FAITH .... YOU'RE NOT SAVED.

EASY.

 

[GodsGrace]

The prodigal son parable is about being a Son, being a bad one, but always a son.
The father had 2 sons.
The one that returned was still a son.
So, that is God's unconditional love.

The verse has a larger context, as Jesus gave this parable before He died on the Cross for all SINNERS who are the "prodigal" in the Parable.
And coming Home to Father, is to be born again... to become 'ONE with God".


The reason you can't be "saved" 34 times, is because being born again, is to have become Saved.
And you are only born again Once.
Being Born again, is the Legit proof you have been saved.

So, to teach that you can be saved more then once, is to teach that you can be born again, again, and again.
So, is that "intelligent" teaching?
No.

What is good teaching?

That if a believer finds himself in a life of sin and feels lost,
he cannot come back to God, confess his sins and be saved again?
As Jesus stated in Luke 15:24

We are always saved...as long as we want to be and want to be friends with God.

 

[GodsGrace]

Posting the entire NT, proves you can cut and paste.
You posted a lot of verses in your post that have nothing to do with your argument, but, it makes you feel good to post them, so....there it is.
Nothing more.

Read my THREAD.....the Thread.
It has already done the "work".
The rest of this, is as i said....just allowing the contrast to be plainly seen for the benefit of those who are not twisted into calvinism or legalism.
For their protection.
And sometimes, a person like you, who is arguing with me, will find a way out.
Ive had many come to me with a thankful heart., as they had lived 20, 30, or a lifetime of...>"i might lose my salvation", and never had peace, because you can't have peace with God and believe that you are responsible to stay saved.

ok then.

What you call LEGALISM....
Jesus called being obedient to God.

Do you think you could go to be with God if you do not obey Him?

John 3:36 Jesus said:
"He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."

 

[GodsGrace]

I don’t have the time to straighten out BOTH you and the “ other” Grace Rejector , Bueller....Why Don’t you guys merge together and make a new name and I can just Enlighten “ Two birds with One Stone”.....All Of this “ Willful Sinning” In my life is VERY Time-Consuming!

You accuse me of merely “ making comments” in lieu of providing Scripture when the Fact is , I just GAVE you one! Are you so Bible- Ignorant That you don’t recognize Romans 10:13? I could see why you would ignore it—- it’s The Atom Bomb for those who oppose OSAS .....You very likely do not possess “ Eyes to See” , but I’ll type it out one more time for you —— “ Anybody that ASKS to be Saved WILL be Saved”......Why are you and Ferris so intent on wasting your time and trying to make God a liar?

You're such a joyful Christian....

Romans 10:13 tell us that if we call on the name of the Lord we will be saved.

Do those that want nothing to do with God call on the name of the Lord?
No.

I know it's difficult to reply to the verses I post...
They confirm what you cannot believe.

 

[GodsGrace]

Lol.....sorry.....sometimes I just can’t resist using Homer Simpson’s line when he was questioned about a Bible verse he made up...

Try this...1John 5:5

What does 1 John 5:5 have to do with forfeiting one's faith?

1 John 5:3-4 are good verses.
3For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments; and His commandments are not burdensome.
4For whatever is born of God overcomes the world; and this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

If we love God we will keep His commandments.
What is born of God overcomes the world.
Our faith overcomes the world.

Is a person that has abandoned God still keeping His commandments?
Is he overcoming the world?
Does he have the faith necessary to overcome the world?

 

[GodsGrace]

Born again people do sin. What they don't do is continue to sin. They progress towards holiness. The unsaved, not born again person does not. He languishes unchanged, unconverted in his sin. The very fact they're doing that shows they are not born again and belong to the devil. You say that's not true. You say as long as they said they believe somewhere in the past that person is saved/born again. John says they are not.

There is definitely a difference between sinning and leading a life of sin.
We sin many times. This is because God is so perfect and so pure that to Him an evil thought on our part is sin (if we dwell upon it).

1 John 3:9 is speaking of living a life of sin.
If it did not mean this, John would be contradicting himself with 1 John 2:1 which tell us what to do when we sin.