If OSAS is false, then what?

[Taken]

WHAT IS TRUE, is some men WILL willingly lay down their Life FOR GOD, and WILL TAKE their Salvation (according to Gods Order and Way), and forever Be WITH God, through this life and the next. OSAS.

What is TRUE, is some men WILL believe, Enjoy Gods Blessings and HOPE they endure to their end, and BeCOME Saved.

What is TRUE, is some men WILL believe and BE enticed, tempted, entrusting, evil spirits, wicked men, (out of desiring their false promised or out of fear of their threats) and Fall Away from Believing in God, and NOT become Saved.

What is TRUE, is some men WILL hear, but Never Believe, and will NOT Become Saved.

What is TRUE, is Believing men ARE called, (many are called to become saved)....but they do not submit, according to Gods Order and Way.

What is TRUE, is many are called...but FEW are Chosen.
God First Chose ALL of mankind, before the world was. Before man became sinful. Wrote every mans NAME in his Book of Life.
Once mankind CHOOSES HIM, (according to Gods Order and Way); Gods is Faithful to choose that man.
Men who DO NOT choose God, God BLOTS OUT their name from His book of life. That man will forever be separated from God. Body and Soul destroyed, and their memory forgotten.

A man, willfully who gives his bodily life, Crucified with Christ Jesus, shall have his NAME, entered into the Lambs Book of Life...never subject to be Blotted Out. THESE are the ones, WHOLLY whole, body, soul, spirit, who shall be resurrected, redeemed, BY the Lord Himself...BEFORE the Last great Tribulation. BeCAUSE they are NOT subject to/appoint to WRATH.

Rev 3:10
[10] Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

And the Last great 7 yr Tribulation IS CENTERED on...Gods ANGER and Gods WRATH.

Rom 1:
[18] For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness.

Isa 13:
[11] And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.

 

[quietthinker]

IF, OSAS isn’t true.
THEN: There IS NO Salvation “GIVEN” a man while that man “IS” alive “in his flesh.”

The whole concept of RECEIVING “salvation” NOW, while alive in ones flesh, Highly hangs on the Facts:
* World Population has exponentially Increased since the beginning.
* As world population Increases, SO ALSO does corruption, Wicked men, (which is men of Power, ie parents, teachers, government reps etc. acting with Deception, underhandedness, deceit, and power of force and power to punish for rejecting their demands), which because of corruption, effects the drawing men AWAY from God, to follow and trust THEM.
(Open Eyes NOW, Open Ears NOW...They already world wide are preaching, THEY are the World’s SAVIOR of life, vacs, wars...They already world wide are preaching THEY are the World’s SAFETY Net from FEAR, Loss, etc.
* And of course there are evil spirits, always roaming about enticing men to reject God, and Trust him.

Salvation FOR 4,000 years, WAS “promised” men “who” Believed and Continued their Believe to the day of their physical death.
OLD Covenant, according to Law. (Ie Gods Order and Way).
The Law did not SAVE them. Continued (endured) Belief and the Promise Saved them, after their physical death.

* The OLD Covenant was fulfilled...the OLD Law was fulfilled...BUT NOT DESTROYED, which means the A man under the Law (ISRAEL), could continue under the Law, Continue belief, and at the time of his physical death, He will be SAVED when his body dies.

A GENTILE man, BELIEVING, continuing (enduring) believing, to the time of his physical death, ALSO, shall be SAVED when his body dies.
Like an ISRAELITE, (believers), Gentiles, (believers) are on their own WILLPOWER, (up against, powerful evil spirits and powerful wicked men),
To KEEP believing.

A believing man CAN, be enticed, tricked, tempted, vulnerable, to reject God, and trust Wicked men, and trust Evil spirits...
BECAUSE, that man IS relying on his own will power....
(And we already know, spirits and powerful men have more power than the population at large.)

* THE NEW “better” Testament...Promise, Covenant...(Heb 7:22) IS an ASSURANCE of a man to receive Gods Gift of Salvation....BEFORE his physical bodily death. “IF” that man TAKES his SALVATION,
(According to Gods Order and Way).
It’s a Service of Agreement, by the mans heartful word of Confession....
And thereafter the WORKS of God of Forgiveness and Conversion.
This WAY, requires that mans...spiritual bodily death...Crucified with Christ Jesus...and Heartful confession of Belief.
* That man BY Gods Works, satisfies his ONE required Bodily Death, satisfies his ONE receiving of God Saving the life in the mans soul, satisfies the ONE circumcision of his heart, (natural spirits thoughts), Receiving a new Born again spirit from Gods Seed....
* That forgiven man WHOLLY...body, soul, spirit...has satisfied Gods requirements to FOREVER and ALWAYS, be “WITH” God and God “WITH” that man.
* That man IS Forgiven for have HAD been Against God (ie the mans SIN), IS Saved, IS Quickened, IS Sanctified (set apart unto God), IS covered with Gods Light ie Gods Spirit IN that man, (his forgiven sin not seen nor remember any more), IS Justified, (to be redeemed ONLY by the Lord God).
* This man CAN NEVER fall away from God, NEVER reject God, NEVER be separated or WITHOUT God.
* This man IS KEPT forever WITH God, BY GODS POWER IN that man.

* God CAN NOT stand against Himself. Gods Spirit IN a man would be standing against Himself, IF Gods Power failed and ALLOWED that man, (who Submitted to God)...to REJECT God.

* OSAS....IS expressly Applicable to men WHO, HAVE heartfully and wholly, body, soul, spirit, Submitted unto God...and God HAS WHOLLY, body, soul, spirit ...accepted that mans spiritual death, (crucified with Christ Jesus,) saved that mans soul and quickened that mans spirit, and Forgiven that mans SIN Against God...once and forever....WHILE that man was alive in his flesh.

* God IS a jealous God. He wants EVERYONE of his creations TO WANT TO FOREVER Be “WITH” Him.
* For ALL the Gifts and Blessing and Goodness God has Given mankind....
* WHAT does mankind HAVE that is SO Precious, TO GIVE TO GOD?
**** ONE THING**** the mans Bodily LIFE.

John 15:
[13] Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

We are all going to bodily die.
Yet a man who is WILLING to Give his life unto Death, FOR the Love of God.
There is no other WAY for a man to TRULY SHOW HIS LOVE to God...

AND the bonus, unto God?
Every man WHO lays down his LIFE...FOR GOD...
Ta da...that man Becomes Gods Inheritance.

Who does not want ALL of their inheritance?

Continued;

Taken, lengthy explanations that go all over the place are more a sign of not knowing than knowing. maybe that's worth considering!

 

[Taken]

Taken, lengthy explanations that go all over the place are more a sign of not knowing than knowing. maybe that's worth considering!

Scripturally one thing affects another thing. I already know people prefer a one liner response rather than a 10 minute read, to an in-depth topic. And...we have numerous threads and thousands of posts on this one topic alone and still, people don’t get it.

Personally, I prefer the whole, who, when, when, why, where; when someone is giving a response to a challenging topic., rather than, you’re wrong, that’s a lie, blah, blah.

Thanks for your input.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[BloodBought 1953]

According to the armenians doctrines, i am saved. Apparently sin dont mean a thing to yall. One of your cohorts even said “sin isnt the reason for a loss of salvation.” Yall got that easy believism thing going on.

The Sin Issue was taken care of 2000 years ago....if one desires to be Saved all they have to do is “ cash - in” on what was already accomplished FOR them at the Cross .....How does one “ cash -in?” Simply Believe the Good News Found In 1 Cor15:1-4....... it’s Paul’s Gospel .....Given to him by Jesus personally.....you can forget everything else.... THIS is what God is going to Judge you by....Paul said so.If you don’t Trust this Gospel to the point that you REST in it, God says in Hebrews that you are guilty of “ UNBELIEF”...... serious stuff.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

. If i aint no good now, i doubt i’ll be worth much more up there.


You are “ half-way Home ” But you don’t realize it..... Anybody that thinks that they are “ good enough” for Heaven is Damned.....at least you have made it past “ that” stumbling block....You have at least escaped the “ Fools Paradise” That 90% of the World and many so called “ Christians “ live in.....Anybody that doesn’t see that they are a Lost Sinner that does not merit Heaven has not even reached the “ Starting Gate” Of Christianity.....There is more hope for you than there is for the many Legalist that like to post here....you will be in my prayers...

 

[quietthinker]

Scripturally one thing affects another thing. I already know people prefer a one liner response rather than a 10 minute read, to an in-depth topic. And...we have numerous threads and thousands of posts on this one topic alone and still, people don’t get it.

Personally, I prefer the whole, who, when, when, why, where; when someone is giving a response to a challenging topic., rather than, you’re wrong, that’s a lie, blah, blah.

Thanks for your input.

Glory to God,
Taken

One has an ear when questions are asked.
There are preachers a dime a dozen of those who feel they need to 'tell the world' what they think without considering the hearers...if any.

If a short statement of pertinence doesn't get people to enquire how ever will a 'dissertation' capture their attention?
The things we have recorded of the man who came from heaven (Jesus) are short clips. Even he gives us this direction, 'be careful how you hear' Luke 8:18 ... Mark 4:24

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Not a problem. I know your not familiar with the doctrine, and I wanted to clear up some misconceptions.

Besides, it’s usually the OSAS types who get accused of taking sin lightly because they understand that their sins are forgiven. That took ME by surprise.

I don’t “ take sin lightly”..... never. I just know what to do with it when it happens.....I go “BOLDLY” to the “ Throne Of Grace” like I was told to....That's a place of Forgiveness , because as much as the Legalists HATE it—— “ Where Sin abounds, Grace “ Super” abounds”
God hates it when I Sin ( me too) .....He will chastise me when I “ stumble” and although He Hates the Sins I commit , I suspect He is very pleased when I trust in His amazing Grace , and the “Bolder“ I am , the better He likes it—-He knows that my “ Boldness” is in direct proportion to my Faith in the Power Of the Shed Blood Of His Son....

 

[BloodBought 1953]

I dont know how to answer this. I suppose i could say yes, but i wouldnt believe it. Theres no way i can have any hope till i get clean. I asked a preacher, baptist, last year if i had to get my act together first before getting saved, he said no. I just cannot accept that God would save me while willingly sinning like i do.
Now, if i didnt actively plan my sinning, had my act together, and was living a good fruit showing life, then yea. I’d have all the confidence in the world. Thats always been the case though. Heres what i trust, i sin more than half this board combined on a given day, i dont feel bad about most of the sins i commit daily. I dont want a false assurance. I dont wanna think im saved, then get to Heaven and find out im not saved. I just want God to fix me, and i keep asking, and nothing. Now you tell me… does that sound like im of the elect? It sure dont to me.

You don’t “ clean up the house” and then invite Him in.....You invite Him in and “ HE” cleans up the house....you provide the “Trusting” by simply Believing the Gospel Of 1Cor15:1-4, and “ HE” will take care of all that Cleaning......

A man can change—- he can “turn over a New Leaf”..... but only God can TRANSFORM , and that is what He is wanting to do for you if you will simply Trust Him to do it....Remember that “ Inside Of the cup thing?” .......let God Transform your “ inside” and the “ outside” will take care of itself....

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

You don’t “ clean up the house” and then invite Him in.....You invite Him in and “ HE” cleans up the house....you provide the “Trusting” by simply Believing the Gospel Of 1Cor15:1-4, and “ HE” will take care of all that Cleaning......

A man can change—- he can “turn over a New Leaf”..... but only God can TRANSFORM , and that is what He is wanting to do for you if you will simply Trust Him to do it....Remember that “ Inside Of the cup thing?” .......let God Transform your “ inside” and the “ outside” will take care of itself....

so how many times do you have to ask Him??

 

[BloodBought 1953]

so how many times do you have to ask Him??

Once will get the job done.....

“ASK and you shall receive”
“ Anybody that ASKS for mercy, shall receive it”
“ Anybody that ASKS to be Saved WILL be saved”

The Key to Christianity is seeing that you are a hopeless , helpless Sinner That MUST have a Savior.....simply TURN to that Savior ( Saving Repentance) and cry out like the wicked publican did.....he saw his lost condition and cried out, “ Lord,have Mercy on me a Sinner!” ....Jesus said That man went home “Justified”......that means Saved....Forever.

God has granted you with the Self Insight to see that you are a Sinner, and as I said earlier....you are light years ahead of most Lost people .....now take the next step if you want to be Saved.....Ask God to show you the same Mercy that he gave to that sinful tax collector—— cry out, “Lord Jesus , have Mercy on me a Sinner” .......That “ asking “ worked for the publican....it worked for me ....it will work for you.....may God Bless you in the understanding of these things....

 

[Ferris Bueller]

I dont know how to answer this. I suppose i could say yes, but i wouldnt believe it. Theres no way i can have any hope till i get clean. I asked a preacher, baptist, last year if i had to get my act together first before getting saved, he said no. I just cannot accept that God would save me while willingly sinning like i do.
Now, if i didnt actively plan my sinning, had my act together, and was living a good fruit showing life, then yea. I’d have all the confidence in the world. Thats always been the case though. Heres what i trust, i sin more than half this board combined on a given day, i dont feel bad about most of the sins i commit daily. I dont want a false assurance. I dont wanna think im saved, then get to Heaven and find out im not saved. I just want God to fix me, and i keep asking, and nothing. Now you tell me… does that sound like im of the elect? It sure dont to me.

You haven't come to the end of yourself yet. I'm confident that all genuinely born again people who have had a Luke 18:13 experience will tell you that they got to the point where they did not want to sin anymore but were helpless to do anything about it. That's called 'repentance'. You have to have a change of mind about your condition and want to not sin anymore in order to receive salvation. For salvation to happen you have to have this change of mind AND have faith in God's forgiveness:

"21I have declared to both Jews and Greeks that they must turn to God in repentance and have faith in our Lord Jesus." Acts 20:21​

By your own admission you simply aren't there yet. Willfully sinning and not feeling bad about it is not the repentant heart in which the gospel word of God's forgiveness is retained and grows.
Repentance gets a lot of flack these days because it is misunderstood to be the works gospel where one attempts to earn salvation by performing works of righteousness. But that is not what repentance is. Repentance is a change of mind about sin and God with a corresponding desire to live different commensurate with that change of mind (Acts 26:20). That has to happen in a person before they can come to a Luke 18:13 experience. That is a work of God. He prepares the heart to receive and retain the gospel. Can a person resist that work? IMO, yes.

 

[Bob Estey]

Hello all. No doubt, the question of OSAS has been a huge debate around here as of late. And for the most part, i feel like we know who is for and against it.

so what i’d like to know, if OSAS isnt true, then what is true? I’ve never gotten an honest answer from those on this forum as to this question. And my main thoughts on this are, 1. If OSAS isnt true, then what is the requirement to get to Heaven? 2. Since sin no longer matters, are we free to just live however we want?

I believe we are saved, and I believe the Lord's discipline can be very harsh if we persist in our sin.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

Hello all. No doubt, the question of OSAS has been a huge debate around here as of late. And for the most part, i feel like we know who is for and against it.

so what i’d like to know, if OSAS isnt true, then what is true? I’ve never gotten an honest answer from those on this forum as to this question. And my main thoughts on this are, 1. If OSAS isnt true, then what is the requirement to get to Heaven? 2. Since sin no longer matters, are we free to just live however we want?

The requirement to get to heaven is for a sinner to repent, believe the gospel, get baptized, and then enduring to the end without returning to his/her former sins and lusts.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

so truth is considered a “work around” when you dont like what it says.

OR more likely when "truth" is really nothing more than a "Theological paradigm".

 

[Bob Carabbio]

I believe we are saved, and I believe the Lord's discipline can be very harsh if we persist in our sin.

BOY HOWDY!!! It's my personal experience that when we begin to NEGLECT "so great salvation", HE sends "Wake up calls" that can be pretty brutal!!!!

 

[ChristisGod]

BOY HOWDY!!! It's my personal experience that when we begin to NEGLECT "so great salvation", HE sends "Wake up calls" that can be pretty brutal!!!!

Yes indeed Bob and those the Lord loves He disciples.

Hebrews 12
In your struggle against sin, you have not yet resisted to the point of shedding your blood. 5 And have you completely forgotten this word of encouragement that addresses you as a father addresses his son? It says,

“My son, do not make light of the Lord’s discipline,
and do not lose heart when he rebukes you,
6 because the Lord disciplines the one he loves,
and he chastens everyone he accepts as his son.”

7 Endure hardship as discipline; God is treating you as his children. For what children are not disciplined by their father? 8 If you are not disciplined—and everyone undergoes discipline—then you are not legitimate, not true sons and daughters at all. 9 Moreover, we have all had human fathers who disciplined us and we respected them for it. How much more should we submit to the Father of spirits and live! 10 They disciplined us for a little while as they thought best; but God disciplines us for our good, in order that we may share in his holiness. 11 No discipline seems pleasant at the time, but painful. Later on, however, it produces a harvest of righteousness and peace for those who have been trained by it.

12 Therefore, strengthen your feeble arms and weak knees. 13 “Make level paths for your feet,” so that the lame may not be disabled, but rather healed.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

The requirement to get to heaven is for a sinner to repent, believe the gospel, get baptized, and then enduring to the end without returning to his/her former sins and lusts.

Hogwash......and a False Gospel....Are you aware of the Fate of those that spread “ false , perverted Gospels ?”

Read Gal 1:8 ...

“ former sins” are Chastised By God if you are a Child of God.....they are also covered by the Blood and are “ forgotten” as far as Salvation is concerned....

 

[Michiah-Imla]

“ former sins” are Chastised By God if you are a Child of God.....they are also covered by the Blood and are “ forgotten” as far as Salvation is concerned....

Unless you do this:

“Because ye have made your iniquity to be remembered, in that your transgressions are discovered, so that in all your doings your sins do appear; because, I say, that ye are come to remembrance, ye shall be taken with the hand.” (Ezekiel 21:24)

So get off the lie of Once Saved Always Saved:

“She hath wearied herself with lies, and her great scum went not forth out of her: her scum shall be in the fire. In thy filthiness is lewdness: because I have purged thee, and thou wast not purged, thou shalt not be purged from thy filthiness any more, till I have caused my fury to rest upon thee.” (Ezekiel 24:12-13)

“I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity. There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out.” (Luke 13:27-28)

So don’t think you can continue to work the occasional sin and still stay saved.

 

[GEN2REV]

if OSAS isnt true, then what is true? I’ve never gotten an honest answer from those on this forum as to this question.

The first bald-faced lie right in the OP.

Great way to start and lets everybody know who they're dealing with and what can be expected herein.

Not worth anybody's time.

 

[GRACE ambassador]

So get off the lie of Once Saved Always Saved:

Precious friend, we will Never get away from The Truth Of God's ETERNAL
Salvation, to be Consummated When we Undeserving Are Glorified!
(1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 and 1 Corinthians 15:51-58). i.e.:

12 Dozen Plain and Clear Scriptures should not be ignored, Correct?:

God's OPERATION On All HIS New-born babes In CHRIST!
+
God's ETERNAL Assurance!

God Would Never Have us get away From HIS Most Precious TRUTH!
Amen?

GRACE And Peace...