UFO changed to UAP

[Timtofly]

you need some serious in depth study and learning

God told us not to study the occult. Do you not concur with God?

 

[An Apologetic Sheepdog]

God told us not to study the occult. Do you not concur with God?

Yes I do concur with God- That doesn't change what I said. You need some serious and in depth study and understanding of Scripture.

 

[Timtofly]

Yes I do concur with God- That doesn't change what I said. You need some serious and in depth study and understanding of Scripture.

If I have not given enough Scripture, what is your excuse for not giving any more than already presented?

 

[An Apologetic Sheepdog]

If I have not given enough Scripture, what is your excuse for not giving any more than already presented?

The issue here isn't the scripture you quote, its your total misunderstanding of it.

Since you lack actual understanding, quoting "more" will accomplish little. I already told you what to do to correct that now you need to get to it and start studying more carefully and in depth.

 

[farouk]

Here in Australia our political system works a little differently, and thus, how us Aussies respond to the pollies are a little different as well. At the beginning of the pandemic most of AU sat and watched Victoria as they struggled the worst and went through insane lockdown after lockdown…crazy loss of freedoms. The Premier of Vic is a left leaning dude…Australia gave him the nick name “Dictator Dan”. Appropriately, we all thought. And laughed, because as a general rule, the rest of us didn’t live under such bozos.
Cue Delta.
Most of us who had watched this thing spread through the rest of the world already had a fairly solid grasp on the fact that once it got going, it wasn’t going to be stopped. And yet when it landed in NSW, they decided they could ‘beat it’ like they had the first wave, by locking us all down. Sure, why not try, right? In Sydney anyway, where it was, for a week or two.
3 months later….anyone with eyeballs and a brain could see it wasn’t working. And instead of abandoning the tactic, the Premier decided in a spasm of panic that to get really tough on it, she’d lock down the rest of the state!
Didn’t help, of course, it continued to spread across Sydney and has now breached into the rest of the state. As it has in other states…but still they persist with the loss of freedoms.
Every day we see and hear of incredible things that make us wonder if this is still our Country. Police gone mad, freedoms stripped away. And worse…people either accepting it all like sheeple…or doing the worst possible thing, in terms of stupidity and pointlessness in order to fight back.

I look at places like Afghanistan and I know we live in bliss. I am thankful for it. I look at the outright racism and intolerance of some and wonder how some people can just…hate…so much. I look at the so very blatant bias of the media, the gullibility of the masses…and while I cannot know for sure if we are nearing Christ’s return….I surely hope for it. The world….seethes, does it not? With violence, with lies, with corruption, with sickness, with agendas. It makes one weary and long for an age where the ‘yoke’ of Christ is everlasting.

@Naomi25

You mentioned Afghanistan.

@Naomi25 I seem to remember there has been for years quite a lot about Aghans wanting to come to Australia; about Australians not wanting Afghans to come; about Aghans halfway to Australia in Nauru and about Nauruans and Australians not wanting to send Afghans back to Afghanistan and about Nauruans not wanting Afghans to stay in Nauru and so it goes.

I guess Covid adds a unique and sad variable to the whole kaleidoscope. (The kaleidoscope has shifted also in Afghanistan.)

I remember how that there was a report, before the Americans and allies went into Afghanistan 20 years ago, some Afghans hijacked an airliner to England. Bleeding hearts in Parliament there said you can't possibly send back the Afghans to Afghanistan. Others said, Hey, wait a minute, if we start giving asylum to hijackers, this will only create a profusion of hijacks from anyone around the world who feels a grievance.

And so it goes...

We need to keep looking up... (Hebrews 12.2).

(And I really don't know about UFOs....)

 

[Naomi25]

@Naomi25

You mentioned Afghanistan.

@Naomi25 I seem to remember there has been for years quite a lot about Aghans wanting to come to Australia; about Australians not wanting Afghans to come; about Aghans halfway to Australia in Nauru and about Nauruans and Australians not wanting to send Afghans back to Afghanistan and about Nauruans not wanting Afghans to stay in Nauru and so it goes.

I guess Covid adds a unique and sad variable to the whole kaleidoscope. (The kaleidoscope has shifted also in Afghanistan.)

I remember how that there was a report, before the Americans and allies went into Afghanistan 20 years ago, some Afghans hijacked an airliner to England. Bleeding hearts in Parliament there said you can't possibly send back the Afghans to Afghanistan. Others said, Hey, wait a minute, if we start giving asylum to hijackers, this will only create a profusion of hijacks from anyone around the world who feels a grievance.

And so it goes...

We need to keep looking up... (Hebrews 12.2).

(And I really don't know about UFOs....)

Actually, I don’t know about Afghani immigrants coming to Australia…may not have come up in my newsfeed, perhaps, I’m not sure. But I do think the whole system is bunk. There has to be a better way to do it. I….don’t think open borders is smart, but if we can’t allow that for security reasons, then we ought to make immigration services a priority, I think. Have the people trying to come into our Countries processes swiftly and legally. It breaks my heart that these people are left in limbo. Especially here in Australia….we have so much jolly room here. Bring them on!

 

[farouk]

Actually, I don’t know about Afghani immigrants coming to Australia…may not have come up in my newsfeed, perhaps, I’m not sure. But I do think the whole system is bunk. There has to be a better way to do it. I….don’t think open borders is smart, but if we can’t allow that for security reasons, then we ought to make immigration services a priority, I think. Have the people trying to come into our Countries processes swiftly and legally. It breaks my heart that these people are left in limbo. Especially here in Australia….we have so much jolly room here. Bring them on!

I guess the question would also be, How to find out - as part of the immigration process - whether they will likely start to behave in Australia in the way so many people have behaved in Afghanistan. Some would say, This is irrelevant.

There is no easy answer.

The believer needs to keep looking up and concentrating on Gospel opportunities.

(I'm probably digressing from UFOs, about which I have no expertise...)

 

[Timtofly]

The issue here isn't the scripture you quote, its your total misunderstanding of it.

Since you lack actual understanding, quoting "more" will accomplish little. I already told you what to do to correct that now you need to get to it and start studying more carefully and in depth.

Still not making your case.

If my knowledge does not agree with yours, then point out where. Obviously you must know what is in my head, and avoiding my post altogether. Since you just declare me without knowledge, it is not because of my post, but because you disagree with what I know in my mind.

 

[An Apologetic Sheepdog]

Still not making your case.

If my knowledge does not agree with yours, then point out where. Obviously you must know what is in my head, and avoiding my post altogether. Since you just declare me without knowledge, it is not because of my post, but because you disagree with what I know in my mind.

Its not your knowledge- its your lack of comprehension of what you read. ( false knowledge would be more appropriate)

I don't feel inclined to write thesis level answers but I will give you some bullets to see what you do with them in terms of actual legitimate research.

Specifically "angels" ( defined as messengers created of a higher nature than humans as opposed to just a person being a messenger)

are demons ( fallen angels)
Can assume physical form
Are not subject to the physical laws of this universe and can manipulate whats there ( cannot create anything)
Can mate and reproduce with humans

Thats for starters

Now lets see what you do

 

[Timtofly]

are demons ( fallen angels)
Can assume physical form
Are not subject to the physical laws of this universe and can manipulate whats there ( cannot create anything)
Can mate and reproduce with humans

Demons are not fallen angels. They are spirits. They enter the mind and take over one's thoughts.

Spirits are not created beings. They are the 3rd part of of the image of God given to the sons of God. Spirit, body, and soul. The body has sexual ability, not the spirit. There are spirits, because humans currently only have a body and soul. The spirit is in the presence of God. Unless a reprobate soul, turned the spirit into a demon. Demon possession is another human's spirit taking over a mind. There have been millions of reprobate humans over the last 6000 years. So millions of demons.

Demons as fallen angels or created beings is science fiction.

 

[An Apologetic Sheepdog]

Demons are not fallen angels. They are spirits. They enter the mind and take over one's thoughts.

Where specifically is this stated at in Scripture?

Spirits are not created beings. They are the 3rd part of of the image of God given to the sons of God. Spirit, body, and soul.

Where is this creation at in Scripture?

There are spirits, because humans currently only have a body and soul. The spirit is in the presence of God. Unless a reprobate soul, turned the spirit into a demon. Demon possession is another human's spirit taking over a mind. There have been millions of reprobate humans over the last 6000 years. So millions of demons.

Interesting ghost story but where is this in Scripture?

 

[Timtofly]

Where specifically is this stated at in Scripture?

Where is this creation at in Scripture?

Interesting ghost story but where is this in Scripture?

It is called an in depth study of Scripture. There are many verses when connected that point out these facts. Adam was stripped of the image of God. That is clearly pointed out in the first 5 chapters of Genesis. And Paul covers this in his letters.

There is no such thing as ghost. Why are you being sarcastic about Scripture?

There is no Scripture that tells us God created spirits as beings. All of creation is explained in Genesis 1. There is nothing left out that was created by God. The only spirit created was part of humankind on day six. This is well known as body, soul, and spirit. Any created spirits, are the third part of the being known as humankind.

When reading God's Word, one has to make the distinction between how spirit is just pneuma or wind, breadth and the third part of what makes us in the image of God, a living spirit. None of Adam's flesh and blood have access to, communication with, nor control over their spirit. Not even, Enoch, Elijah, Moses or any one currently in Paradise. The spirit is given back at the 5th Seal. Revelation 6:11

"And white robes were given unto every one of them."

This is John giving us in symbolic words, how the redeemed are given their spirits back. Only at that point will the redeemed be fully restored to the image of God, as sons of God. Paul clearly says that when Jesus appears at the Second Coming we will be sons of God. Even those currently in Paradise are not fully restored. They are waiting for the same moment.

The correct application of our spirit is something the body puts on. A spirit does not, nor cannot have a physical body. Any made up story about physical demons is pure science fiction. Knowledge that does not exist, but pure human imagination. A spirit or demon can only enter the mind. And God prohibited His chosen people from getting involved in the occult. Satan is the founder of any thought involving this phenomenon. He cannot use those angels which have always been locked up since they made their choice. Those angels never made it to earth. There was never a time angels "got away with anything". Only Satan has been a free being. So the more demonic spirits of fallen humans he can get from reprobate humans, the better he feels. Can humans under their influence change their DNA? Absolutely not.

Any changes in DNA come directly from those humans who were sons of God, mixed with Adam's flesh and blood. The 4 females on board would have carried any DNA from actual sons of God prior to the Flood.

The physical body can only be affected by the physical body. The mind can only be affected by a spirit/demon. Can the brain cause more adrenaline to be produced? Yes, but the brain cannot create different types of adrenaline that changes a person's physical body.

Is it plausible that Satan has been allowed to breed human and animal hybrids? Is that found in Scripture? This is all part of the pagan practices of the occult, portrayed as harmless Greek mythology. A mythology passed on to the Latin Roman Empire.

 

[An Apologetic Sheepdog]

There is no such thing as ghost. Why are you being sarcastic about Scripture?

Its not scripture I was being sarcastic about

It is called an in depth study of Scripture. There are many verses when connected that point out these facts. Adam was stripped of the image of God. That is clearly pointed out in the first 5 chapters of Genesis. And Paul covers this in his letters.

That's a made up story

This is John giving us in symbolic words, how the redeemed are given their spirits back. Only at that point will the redeemed be fully restored to the image of God, as sons of God. Paul clearly says that when Jesus appears at the Second Coming we will be sons of God. Even those currently in Paradise are not fully restored. They are waiting for the same moment.

That's a false read

When reading God's Word, one has to make the distinction between how spirit is just pneuma or wind, breadth and the third part of what makes us in the image of God, a living spirit. None of Adam's flesh and blood have access to, communication with, nor control over their spirit. Not even, Enoch, Elijah, Moses or any one currently in Paradise. The spirit is given back at the 5th Seal. Revelation 6:11

No, that's wrong, totally

 

[Will Joseph]

I believe the Book of Enoch which is not included in some Bibles talks about this idea where fallen angels have sex with daughters of men.

I don't really understand that. Like, if I were an angel, then sex would be the last thing on my mind. I'd be able to fly and save people. Flying is one of the greatest gifts and I wouldn't trade it for donovanosis.

 

[n2thelight]

Interesting but you've made some assumptions about angelic beings which can't be true. Angel's interact physically with human beings, which means that they have physicality. It also takes them time to move from place to place, another result of being a physical part of creation.
I'm also pretty sure that they couldn't produce offspring with humans without being physical (they aren't God.)

What kind of body did the two angels have visiting Lot ?

 

[Oseas]

What kind of body did the two angels have visiting Lot ?

As you know, the book of our LORD has the answer for all things. It is easy to know "what kind of body have the angels", not only of the two which visited Lot, but all angels, inclusive the archangel Michael, who was with Moses and Joshua, among others, and even John wanted to worship him, but he did not permitted to John to do it.

By the way, Hebrews 13:v.1-2 brings us wonderful techings: 1 Let brotherly love continue. 2 Be not forgetful to entertain strangers: for thereby some have entertained angels unawares (they hosted angels not knowing they were angels.

But as you asked, "What kind of body did the two angels have visiting Lot"?

Genesis 19:v.1 to 14 and so on show us clearly how was the body of the angels, they are visibles, but possibly not indentified as such by those who see them.
1 And there came two angels to Sodom at even; and Lot sat in the gate of Sodom: and Lot seeing them rose up to meet them; and he bowed himself with his face toward the ground;

2 And he said, Behold now, my lords, turn in, I pray you, into your servant's house, and tarry all night, and wash your feet, and ye shall rise up early, and go on your ways. And they said, Nay; but we will abide in the street all night.

3 And he pressed upon them greatly; and they turned in unto him, and entered into his house; and he made them a feast, and did bake unleavened bread, and they did eat.

4 But before they lay down, the men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter:

5 And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.

6 And Lot went out at the door unto them, and shut the door after him,

7 And said, I pray you, brethren, do not so wickedly.

8 Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as is good in your eyes: only unto these men do nothing; for therefore came they under the shadow of my roof.

9 And they said, Stand back. And they said again, This one fellow came in to sojourn, and he will needs be a judge: now will we deal worse with thee, than with them. And they pressed sore upon the man, even Lot, and came near to break the door.

10 But the men put forth their hand, and pulled Lot into the house to them, and shut to the door.

11 And they smote the men that were at the door of the house with blindness, both small and great: so that they wearied themselves to find the door.

12 And the men said unto Lot, Hast thou here any besides? son in law, and thy sons, and thy daughters, and whatsoever thou hast in the city, bring them out of this place:

13 For we will destroy this place,because the cry of them is waxen great before the face of the Lord;and the Lord hath sent us to destroy it.

14 And Lot went out, and spake unto his sons in law, which married his daughters, and said, Up, get you out of this place; for the Lord will destroy this city. But he seemed as one that mocked unto his sons in law.

The above biblical description shows us clearly that the angels GOD sends to the earth in flesh and bones, like JESUS who was sent by GOD the Father -the Word- in flesh and bones, so JESUS was and is the Word made flesh. He already existed before the foundation of the World, so "again, when He -the Word-the Word is GOD-bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, He saith, And let all the angels of God worship Him". Hebrews 1:v.6 -

 

[Oseas]

Demons are not fallen angels. They are spirits. They enter the mind and take over one's thoughts.

The above message is a proof of the theory.

Cor.10:v.21- Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord, and the cup of demons: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord's table, and of the table of demons.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

I believe you are referring to what I call the "Genesis 6 incident", angelic (or should I say fallen angelic?) DNA, hybrids and experimenting, etc and in the end times it will be "as in the days of Noah". The argument goes that God would not have wiped out the earth by a flood due to sinning mankind who were the very people God came to save. Something dreadful was going on. Additionally, there are those who think that this name change (UFO to UAP) could finally be an admission of "life" out there (eventually), and pointing to them as "Saviors". The deception will be great. That's some of the stuff I heard.

I remember reading a book by Hal Lindsey years ago where he said it was plausible that the man of sin could portray himself as an alien. Made some sense to me. I mean, he’s certainly not going to say, hey, satan is here to save everyone and bring peace…

 

[n2thelight]

As you know, the book of our LORD has the answer for all things. It is easy to know "what kind of body have the angels", not only of the two which visited Lot, but all angels, inclusive the archangel Michael, who was with Moses and Joshua, among others, and even John wanted to worship him, but he did not permitted to John to do it.

By the way, Hebrews 13:v.1-2 brings us wonderful techings: 1 Let brotherly love continue. 2 Be not forgetful to entertain strangers: for thereby some have entertained angels unawares (they hosted angels not knowing they were angels.

But as you asked, "What kind of body did the two angels have visiting Lot"?

Genesis 19:v.1 to 14 and so on show us clearly how was the body of the angels, they are visibles, but possibly not indentified as such by those who see them.
1 And there came two angels to Sodom at even; and Lot sat in the gate of Sodom: and Lot seeing them rose up to meet them; and he bowed himself with his face toward the ground;

2 And he said, Behold now, my lords, turn in, I pray you, into your servant's house, and tarry all night, and wash your feet, and ye shall rise up early, and go on your ways. And they said, Nay; but we will abide in the street all night.

3 And he pressed upon them greatly; and they turned in unto him, and entered into his house; and he made them a feast, and did bake unleavened bread, and they did eat.

4 But before they lay down, the men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter:

5 And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.

6 And Lot went out at the door unto them, and shut the door after him,

7 And said, I pray you, brethren, do not so wickedly.

8 Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as is good in your eyes: only unto these men do nothing; for therefore came they under the shadow of my roof.

9 And they said, Stand back. And they said again, This one fellow came in to sojourn, and he will needs be a judge: now will we deal worse with thee, than with them. And they pressed sore upon the man, even Lot, and came near to break the door.

10 But the men put forth their hand, and pulled Lot into the house to them, and shut to the door.

11 And they smote the men that were at the door of the house with blindness, both small and great: so that they wearied themselves to find the door.

12 And the men said unto Lot, Hast thou here any besides? son in law, and thy sons, and thy daughters, and whatsoever thou hast in the city, bring them out of this place:

13 For we will destroy this place,because the cry of them is waxen great before the face of the Lord;and the Lord hath sent us to destroy it.

14 And Lot went out, and spake unto his sons in law, which married his daughters, and said, Up, get you out of this place; for the Lord will destroy this city. But he seemed as one that mocked unto his sons in law.

The above biblical description shows us clearly that the angels GOD sends to the earth in flesh and bones, like JESUS who was sent by GOD the Father -the Word- in flesh and bones, so JESUS was and is the Word made flesh. He already existed before the foundation of the World, so "again, when He -the Word-the Word is GOD-bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, He saith, And let all the angels of God worship Him". Hebrews 1:v.6 -

I agree with ya, the question was to michaelvpardo, to show him

 

[n2thelight]

Timtofly said: ↑
"Demons are not fallen angels. They are spirits. They enter the mind and take over one's thoughts."

What's the difference between a spirit and a fallen angel