Biblical Mary

[Taken]

I believe the congregations of Christianity seven….

1. Messianic
2. Martyr
3. Orthodox
4. Catholic
5. Magisterial Protestant
6. Revived Protestant
7. Charismatic

In which all have different views on the Virgin Mary. The perpetual virginity of Mary is the doctrine that Mary, the mother of Jesus Christ, was a virgin ante partum, in partu, et post partum—before, during and after the birth of Christ (Perpetual virginity of Mary - Wikipedia), in which most Christians apparently believe in. I personally believe the Lord Jesus had at least one younger brother. But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother. - James 1:19

On the point of siblings...I would say Jesus had "lawful" siblings, but not natural siblings.

It seems peculiar to me, God said for husband and wife to multiply, and then she not?
Joseph had a valid concern at first, about Mary's pregnancy...
Since it was revealed IN Scripture NOT Until After the Birth of Jesus, could Joseph and Mary THEN have husband and wife relations.
How clerics bypass that notice and continue to call Mary a perpetual virgin...
How a congregation falls for that....weird.

But then, have to consider, nearly every American owns a Bible, but nearly 60% from a few times a year to never read the Bible.

 

[theefaith]

I would phrase that similar, but different.
God did not send "Christ".
God sent His Word, out of Gods mouth, in a body God prepared, in the likeness as a humble man.

Jesus, came to Give Gods Word, of a new better testament, of Salvation (now/then/as long as mortals exist), before physical death.
Expressly called the Son of man. Jesus.

Recruiter, Teacher, Lord.

Later when he began His ministry, it was announced He is the Son of God. (Just as the angel told Mary, he shall be called the Son of God)


Later yet, it was revealed He is the Christ.
Christ is the Power of God.
Jesus didn't come to earth with Power.



I would call Mary, the earthy mother of the Lord Jesus, Son of man.

And Jesus would (DID) call his Mother and Brethren, those who do the will of His Father.

Glory to God,
Taken

so you agree with mother of our salvation?

 

[theefaith]

Jn 19 ? Says spiritual mother?

Well she is not the disciples biological mother what else is there?

 

[BreadOfLife]

But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother. - Galatians 1:19

The word used in that verse is "Adelphos".

Acts 1:15-16
In those days Peter stood up among the believers (Adelphoi) (a group numbering about a hundred and twenty) and said, “BROTHERS (Adelphoi)and sisters, the Scripture had to be fulfilled in which the Holy Spirit spoke long ago through David concerning Judas, who served as guide for those who arrested Jesus.

Did Peter's mom have 120 children?

 

[rockytopva]

The word used in that verse is "Adelphos".

Acts 1:15-16
In those days Peter stood up among the believers (Adelphoi) (a group numbering about a hundred and twenty) and said, “BROTHERS (Adelphoi)and sisters, the Scripture had to be fulfilled in which the Holy Spirit spoke long ago through David concerning Judas, who served as guide for those who arrested Jesus.

Did Peter's mom have 120 children?

But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother. - Galatians 1:19

G80 - adelphos - Strong's Greek Lexicon (kjv)

Adelphos - The Greek word for brother here - Is taken from the root word Alpha as a sense of union. So, there could be a sense of union as in a bond of affection, such as fellow Christians. Or it could be he who is born of the same two parents. The way Galatians 1:19 is worked suggests the latter.

 

[BreadOfLife]

But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother. - Galatians 1:19

G80 - adelphos - Strong's Greek Lexicon (kjv)

Adelphos - The Greek word for brother here - Is taken from the root word Alpha as a sense of union. So, there could be a sense of union as in a bond of affection, such as fellow Christians. Or it could be he who is born of the same two parents. The way Galatians 1:19 is worked suggests the latter.

Actually, it doesn't.

As we know - the word Adelphos is used universally to describe uterine siblings, half and step siblings, cousins, distant relatives, uncles, friends, neighbors, fellow believers, fellow countrymen, etc.

In fact, of the 344 times that this word is used in in the NT -
41 times (12%) are cases where "Adelphos" clearly or probably refers to a family sibling.
47 instances (14%) are cases where "Adelphos" may or may not refer to a family sibling.
A whopping 256 instances (74%) are cases where "Adelphos" cannot or almost certainly does NOT refer to a family sibling.

THIS, coupled with the fact that not ONE verse of Scripture points to MARY having other children - as well as the fact that Jesus gave His mother to the care of John and NOT His so-called "siblings" - makes it highly UNLIKELY that Jesus had uterine siblings.

 

[rockytopva]

Actually, it doesn't.

As we know - the word Adelphos is used universally to describe uterine siblings, half and step siblings, cousins, distant relatives, uncles, friends, neighbors, fellow believers, fellow countrymen, etc.

In fact, of the 344 times that this word is used in in the NT -
41 times (12%) are cases where "Adelphos" clearly or probably refers to a family sibling.
47 instances (14%) are cases where "Adelphos" may or may not refer to a family sibling.
A whopping 256 instances (74%) are cases where "Adelphos" cannot or almost certainly does NOT refer to a family sibling.

THIS, coupled with the fact that not ONE verse of Scripture points to MARY having other children - as well as the fact that Jesus gave His mother to the care of John and NOT His so-called "siblings" - makes it highly UNLIKELY that Jesus had uterine siblings.

Why, then, was it necessary to say, "But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother?" - Galatians 1:19

 

[rockytopva]

When I search for the Virgin Mary I only get one return...

26 And in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God unto a city of Galilee, named Nazareth,
27 To a virgin espoused to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin's name was Mary.
28 And the angel came in unto her, and said, Hail, thou that art highly favored, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women.
29 And when she saw him, she was troubled at his saying, and cast in her mind what manner of salutation this should be.
30 And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favour with God.
31 And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name Jesus.
32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:
33 And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end.
34 Then said Mary unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man?
35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.- Luke 1

Mary, a virgin, bringing forth the Christ having been visited by the Holy Ghost and the power of the Highest. But... After that... No other word on her virginity.

 

[Berserk]

The precursor of later exalted visions of the Virgin Mary is found in Rev. 12, where she is portrayed as the spiritual mother of True Israel, a status created by her Son. Note the 12 stars in her crown:

"A great portent appeared in Heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a crown of 12 stars. She was pregnant [with Jesus] and crying out in anguish in the agony of giving birth (Rev. 12:2)."

Beckwith's Commentary on Revelation (pp. 614-615) sums up the pagan background of the dragon imagery of Rev. 12:
"The origin of the symbolism is found...in the Greek myth of the birth of Apollo. The goddess Leto was with child by Zeus, and when she reached the time of her delivery she was pursued by the dragon Python, who sought to kill her and her child. But...Poseidon provided her a place of refuge in the island of Ortygia., where she brought forth the child the god Apollo...Apollo...slew the dragon (the war in heaven in our passage)."

 

[Paul Christensen]

Only Jesus brings salvation. Mary was just an earthen vessel god chose to use for HIs purposes.

She didn't stay virgin, she had other children, and she sinned. Or the the bible is wrong

The reality is that seeing that the real Mary's body is in the grave and her spirit is with the departed godly in Paradise, the "Mary" that is being reverenced as the Queen of Heaven is actually an idol. Paul says in 1 Corinthians 10 that those who give reverence to idols are actually serving demons. This puts a serious light on the Mary worshipers, because if they are actually worshiping a demon, then one has to doubt whether they have any fellowship with Christ at all.

 

[Berserk]

The reality is that seeing that the real Mary's body is in the grave and her spirit is with the departed godly in Paradise, the "Mary" that is being reverenced as the Queen of Heaven is actually an idol.

So you are saying that John's vision of Mary in Rev. 12 expressed in goddess imagery is an act of idolatry.

 

[rockytopva]

The woman of Revelation 12 could refer to the children of Israel.

 

[Webers_Home]

.

The woman of Revelation 12 could refer to the children of Israel.

Genesis 37:9-11 appears to validate your suggestion.
_

 

[Berserk]

But she is persecuted for giving birth to Jesus. Reference Herod's slaughter of male babies. So the reference to Jesus as the author of spiritual Israel still includes Jesus' mother portrayed here in goddess-like imagery.

 

[Illuminator]

The woman of Revelation 12 could refer to the children of Israel.

Do non-Catholic Christians believe in the numerous spiritual meanings/levels of scripture like Catholics do? All the religions hold to a primary or literal meaning of a verse. But the Catholic Church has historically seen scripture to be polyvalent or having multiple meanings. We see a literal one and several spiritual ones. Its like a good onion with many layers of meaning some hidden some not.

So to a Catholic the exegesis of scripture includes first of all a literal level or what the author intends primarily and then several spiritual levels that the Holy Spirit also intended that may be hidden from what the human authors intended initially (Because its Gods inspired word) at first but upon prayerful study by those in the Church they are revealed.

Catholics have described at least 3 different spiritual levels 1) the allegorical sense which reveals prophetic and spiritual meanings of persons, places, and things from old to new( Biblical typology comes from this). 2). the Moral sense in which the action of God's people help us to see and form virtues in our own lives. 3). The anagogical sense sometimes also called the escatological sense.

So we read scripture as being polyvalent or having many meanings. A good example of this for Catholics is Revelation 12:1-17. Using the 4 different levels Catholics view this verse as being the Church, Israel, and the Blessed Virgin Mary. So instead of being an "either or" the Church views this verse as a "both and" and sees a fuller picture as the Fathers did.

That is just one easy example. But that may explain why Catholic scripture scholars see much more then merely a literal level on many things as we tend to see much more packed into a verse then just the what the human author intended. What is the protestant take on this? Do they also have spiritual levels of exegesis too? If so how many do they recognize?? Just curious?

source

 

[rockytopva]

If Mary is that exalted why is she not mentioned by the Apostle Paul?

 

[Enoch111]

If Mary is that exalted why is she not mentioned by the Apostle Paul?

Because Paul was a "Protestant".:cool:

All kidding aside, the Catholic dogma of Mary has absolutely no biblical support. It is just another burden placed upon Catholics to ensure that they never properly understand the finished work of Christ.

 

[Webers_Home]

.

The "my church" spoken of in Matt 16:18 is very interesting.

The Greek word translated "church" in that passage is ekklesia (ek-klay
see'-ah) which is a bit confusing for some folks. It never refers to a
physical building, nor to a centralized power structure like the Vatican
and/or the US Congress.

Sometimes ekklesia refers to a gathering, and sometimes to a fraternity
(a.k.a. brotherhood) in which affiliation is restricted such as trade unions
and political movements (e.g. Antiva and Black Lives Matter) and service
organizations, e.g. Kiwanis, Lions, and Optimists, and/or to secretive
organizations like The Masons.

The Roman Catholic Church, on the whole, is a world-wide fraternity. But
"the" Church is usually understood to define the fraternity's supreme
hierarchy situated in the Vatican.

Gatherings need not be for worship purposes in order to qualify as an
ekklesia. For example Acts 19:32 which says:

"The assembly was in confusion: Some were shouting one thing, some
another. Most of the people did not even know why they were there."

Now that particular assembly wasn't the gathering of a fraternity. It was
what we might call a flash mob. Nevertheless, even in chaos, it was an
ekklesia.

The seven ekklesia in the book of Revelation represent local clusters of
Christ's followers. Nevertheless, all seven are affiliated with each other, i.e.
they're unified by means of a common belief system.

The "my church" of Matt 16:18 can be represented by as few as the
gathering of two people. (Matt 18:20)
_

 

[Mungo]

Mungo ~

John 1 (Gods Word eternal God)
[1] In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Isa 55: (Gods word in the thing)
[11] So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth; it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

Eph 1: (God Himself)
[9] Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself;

Heb 10: (God prepares a body)
[5] Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me

John 1 (born of God)
[13] Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

Luke 1 ( an angel speaking to Mary)
[28] And the angel came in unto her, and said, Hail, .... thou that art highly favoured, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women.

Luke 1 (Mary informed)
[31] And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS.

Luke 1 (Mary informed)
[35] And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee , and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee:
... therefore also that holy thing
which shall be born of thee
.... shall be called the Son of God.

Luke 1 (Mary agrees)
[38] And Mary said, Behold the handmaid of the Lord; be it unto me according to thy word. And the angel departed from her.

Matt 1: (Joseph discovers.)
[18] Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.

Matt 1: (Joseph discovers.)
[21] And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.

Matt 1: (Joseph waits to consummate marriage)
[25] And knew her not till she had brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name JESUS.

Gods Intent to send His Word, out of His mouth, in a body (it) God prepared, to (a thing)...
Mary was greeted by an angel.
Informed. Surprised, Informed How, Agreed. Nothing whatsoever of God being IN Her.,
Nothing whatsoever of Gods Seed.
Nothing whatsoever of her seed.
Nothing whatsoever of fertilization.
Nothing whatsoever of Mary being sinless.
Nothing whatsoever of that holy thing, (Gods Word), being called "God", called the "Son of God" then.

Prevaricating again.

When you have a straight answer come back and I will look at it.

 

[Mungo]

What don't you get?
God is Spirit...God has a SEED.
Mankind is not a spirit.....Man has a seed.

Two different KINDS of things.
Read Genesis...Kinds of things are reproduced with it own Kinds of thing.

God Can not reproduce.

Prevaricating again.

When you have a straight answer come back and I will look at it.