What is the affect on The Fall and The Atonement, if Adam was not the first human?

[Ritajanice]

I don't see that "ALL who believe" requirement in this scripture.

Romans 5:18-19
Consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people,
so also one righteous act resulted in justification and life for all people.
19 For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners,
so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous.

]

I was brought to initially believe in Jesus, by God, he then gifted me the faith to believe and understand that Jesus was who the Bible says he was, ...you can’t believe in Jesus without having our spirit Born Again...there was much more to my testimony which I’m not prepared to share on this board.

You can initially believe in Jesus..but without God given faith , no one can know about him in their spirit..our spirit must be Born Again...Spirit gives birth to spirit.

We know that God exists, we know Jesus existed, only by Gods Living witness indwelling our spirit when he makes it Born Again.

We know God in our spirit that is where the Living Holy Spirit witnesses Gods truth to our heart/ spirit.

You need the Holy Spirit to be able to believe in Jesus as we believe and worship in spirit and truth.

Human belief is meaningless, it has no power...only the power of the Holy Spirit has the power to bring your spirit Alive in Christ/ Spirit.

 

[Behold]

They clearly didn't know what sin was,

/

But they knew GOD.
And God told them..."DONT DO THAT".

They CHOSE to do it......so, blaming Satan for THEIR CHOICE...is not scriptural.

See, if Satan comes to you today,, and would temp you to download porn......and you do.
That is not his Fault, that is YOUR CHOICE, as YOU did the deed, not Him. @St. SteVen

 

[Behold]

You can initially believe in Jesus..but without God given faith ,

this is not true.

the fact is, everyone believes....... everyone has faith.

20 forum members have all types of faith in all types of things..

some have faith that "mary flew to heaven", and God didnt' gift that fatih to them.

Unbelievers, have Faith that the "big bang" is true.,. .and God didnt give them that faith.

all people have "the measure of Faith", and when this is given to GOD, as "faith in Christ" then that FAITH CHOICE is accepted by God, who then forgives their sin, and after He does, He gives them the new Birth.

God does not birth someone, before he forgives their sin, as you keep teaching.

 

[Ritajanice]

Those who teach that you must give God your faith is an un- truth...how can you give God your faith in Jesus without knowing him in your spirit...their teaching is un- truth...you only have to initially believe in Jesus,,even then God brings you to believe in Jesus.

Those who don’t understand being chosen and predestined to become Born Again wouldn’t understand any of this.

They may have their own human faith, but,it’s nothing it has no power as we need to be Born Again of incorruptible seed.....again they don’t understand what Born Again of incorruptible seed means..

 

[Behold]

Those who teach that you must give God your faith is an un- truth...

Jesus said "all that believe"..

Paul said.>"ALL that call on the name of Jesus".

John said..>"WHOSOEVER believes"...

So, you are correcting Jesus.., Paul, and John, .

Why?

Because that is the rot of Calvinism.
Its demonic. Its a "doctrine of devil's". Hebrews 13:9

 

[Ritajanice]

The faith that grows @St. SteVen is the seed that God planted into our hearts/ spirit when we become Born Again of incorruptible seed..that is the only Living seed that will grow just as Gods written word says.

Born Again of incorruptible seed that liveth and endureth forever...the seed liveth and endureth forever in our hearts/ spirit....because the seed was planted into our hearts/ spirit, via Gods Living Holy Spirit.

Spirit gives birth to spirit...a Living spiritual birth.that only God can do via His Spirit, that’s Alive Active and everywhere..you can NEVER choose to be Born Of The Spirit..not in a million years.

 

[St. SteVen]

Human belief is meaningless, it has no power...only the power of the Holy Spirit has the power to bring your spirit Alive in Christ/ Spirit.

I suppose that is the tangible aspect. A transformed life.
Reminds me of this...

John 9:25 NIV
"... One thing I do know. I was blind but now I see!”

]

 

[Ritajanice]

I suppose that is the tangible aspect. A transformed life.
Reminds me of this...

John 9:25 NIV
"... One thing I do know. I was blind but now I see!”

]

Amen!!!

 

[Behold]

I suppose that is the tangible aspect. A transformed life.

Would a transformed life, be denied based on "Forum posts and Threads" that try to cast doubt on the word of God?

Or Threads that "imply" that "Jesus's teaching is Heretical"?

for example?

Is that the "transformed Life" that is that behavior?

Is that the "FRUIT" of the "transformed Life" ? ????????????????

 

[Ritajanice]

I suppose that is the tangible aspect. A transformed life.
Reminds me of this...

John 9:25 NIV
"... One thing I do know. I was blind but now I see!”

]

What did Jesus say about “ fruit”?

We are being transformed into Jesus image as a Born Again, there can be no stopping it..God is the one in control..we aren’t!

He spoke scripture through me a couple of days back to a guy on FB...it’s like the Holy Spirit takes us over...we are used for His purpose and his plan.

Everything we do say should Glorify the Lord.

Not always the case as self can get in the way as we well know.

Recognise self, you are then onto a winner so to speak.

 

[St. SteVen]

He spoke scripture through me a couple of days back to a guy on FB...it’s like the Holy Spirit takes us over...we are used for His purpose and his plan.

Agree.

John 14:26 NIV
But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name,
will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.

Ephesians 2:10 NIV
For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works,
which God prepared in advance for us to do.

Luke 12:11-12 NIV
“When you are brought before synagogues, rulers and authorities,
do not worry about how you will defend yourselves or what you will say,
12 for the Holy Spirit will teach you at that time what you should say.”

]

 

[JBO]

And Adam proved that was true , as "death came on us all" by one man's sin..... (Paul teaches) (NT)

Right now.. "the body is dead because of Sin", and that is "the fall of Adam" that is the fall of us all.

Wrong, but since you continue to blame God for your sins, so be it.

There is so much rhetoric about "the fall". It is really odd that those words, that phrase, that concept occurs in the Bible. It is man-made.

 

[JBO]

How so?

The spirit of man comes from God. Original sin, the imputation of Adam's sin unto all mankind, makes God the creator and giver of a spirit dead in sin.

Actually, they were deceived. I don't think they had any intention to sin.
They clearly didn't know what sin was, nor did they really understand the consequences. IMHO

What were the consequences in your view?

Then it is not sin.

1Jn 3:4 Everyone who practices sin also practices lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness.

Lawlessness is disobedience of law. It is a choice. A choice is a conscious decision between two alternatives.

 

[JBO]

Agree.

John 14:26 NIV
But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name,
will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.

That was directed specifically to the twelve, not to you, not to me or anyone else.

 

[JBO]

He spoke scripture through me a couple of days back to a guy on FB...it’s like the Holy Spirit takes us over...we are used for His purpose and his plan.

My response to anyone who says, "God told me...." is "God told me to ignore you".

 

[St. SteVen]

The spirit of man comes from God. Original sin, the imputation of Adam's sin unto all mankind, makes God the creator and giver of a spirit dead in sin.

What do you make of this?

1 Corinthians 15:21-22 NIV
For since death came through a man,
the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man.
22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive.

]

 

[St. SteVen]

That was directed specifically to the twelve, not to you, not to me or anyone else.

Seriously? Happens to me all the time.

/

 

[Ritajanice]

Seriously? Happens to me all the time.

/

Remember Gods word says...

◄ 1 Corinthians 2:14 ►

Audio Crossref Comment Greek Verse (Click for Chapter) New International Version The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit. New Living Translation But people who aren’t spiritual can’t receive these truths from God’s Spirit. It all sounds foolish to them and they can’t understand it, for only those who are spiritual can understand what the Spirit means. English Standard Version The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned. Berean Standard Bible The natural man does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God. For they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned. Berean Literal Bible But the natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God; for they are foolishness to him, and he is not able to understand them, because spiritually they are discerned

 

[JBO]

What do you make of this?

1 Corinthians 15:21-22 NIV
For since death came through a man,
the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man.
22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive.

]

To be in Adam is to be living physical human being. Everything physical dies. To be in Christ is to be living spiritual being. Everything spiritual lives.

! Corinthians 15:21-22 is speaking of the resurrection. We die a physical being, we are raised, resurrected, a spiritual being.

That has nothing whatsoever to do with the imputation of Adam's sin upon anyone.

 

[St. SteVen]

To be in Adam is to be living physical human being. Everything physical dies. To be in Christ is to be living spiritual being. Everything spiritual lives.

! Corinthians 15:21-22 is speaking of the resurrection. We die a physical being, we are raised, resurrected, a spiritual being.

That has nothing whatsoever to do with the imputation of Adam's sin upon anyone.

What were the consequences of eating the forbidden fruit in the garden?

1 Corinthians 15:21-22 NIV
For since death came through a man,
the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man.
22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive.

]