Were Jesus's brothers born of another woman?

[BreadOfLife]

Yes, I made a note. The veneration you give Mary is virtually indistinguishable from worship. You bestow honor and glory on her that should be reserved for God.

The Catholic Eucharistic rite includes this doxology: “Through Him, with Him and in Him, in the unity of the Holy Spirit, all glory and honor is yours, almighty Father, for ever and ever.” This notion of “all glory and honor” belonging to God is a misnomer, because any Catholic will tell you that Mary is due honor and glory as well. Yet the doxology remains unchanged. Is it time for you to start a petition to change it? Maybe “Through Him, with Him and in Him, in the unity of the Holy Spirit, almost all glory and honor is yours, almighty Father, for ever and ever – but with a healthy dose for Mary as well.”

Use your head.

Didn’t God command His people to “HONOR thy Father and Thy mother” (Exod. 20:12)? We honor different people for different things

If we love God with ALL of our heart, as Scripture commands – is there NO room left for anyone else (Deut. 6:4-5, Mark 12:30)??

The Mass is comprised of TWO main parts: The Liturgy of the Word and the Liturgy of the Eucharist. The Eucharistic doxology pertains to the sacrament of the Body and Blood of our Lord. NOBODY shares in the glory of the Eucharist with God. We are all participants - but the glory and honor is ALL His.

Therefore, the phrase - “ALL glory and honor is yours almighty Father” is perfectly accurate.

 

[BreadOfLife]

So, why did Luke bother to investigate anything then? Luke the Investigator

Let me explain . . .

God is the Author of Scripture. He used men – with all of their faculties and abilities to wrote it down.
They were the instruments He used to record His Word. Just as God used Moses to free His people from Pharoah, He used scribes to convey His Word.

He could have just as easily freed the Hebrew slaves in an instant. However, He didn’t do that. He chose to be glorified by the actions and faith of the human instruments that He used.

This is all rudimentary Christian teaching.

 

[Matthias]

The reason that the Cross rather than the Manger was Paul's focus is simple: he didn't think of Christ as God, so he had no reason to work out any Trinitarian or Binitarian theology.

If he didn’t, then why would anyone who believes what he wrote is the truth? Why not rather believe as and what he believed about Christ?

 

[Matthias]

But the issue is, did Rabbi Paul think of Jesus as "God." My answer to that is "No."

My answer to that as a primitive Christian believer is Jewish monotheism’s answer: “No” and “Yes”.

”No” - not literally.

”Yes” - functionally; representationally, as his shaliach.

 

[RedFan]

If he didn’t, then why would anyone who believes what he wrote is the truth? Why not rather believe as and what he believed about Christ?

I think Paul can be credited with "the truth" even though he didn't opine on a particular theological topic (like the divinity of Christ).

 

[RedFan]

Let me explain . . .

God is the Author of Scripture. He used men – with all of their faculties and abilities to wrote it down.
They were the instruments He used to record His Word. Just as God used Moses to free His people from Pharoah, He used scribes to convey His Word.

He could have just as easily freed the Hebrew slaves in an instant. However, He didn’t do that. He chose to be glorified by the actions and faith of the human instruments that He used.

This is all rudimentary Christian teaching.

Not how I see it. If God rather than Luke was the author as you claim, there would have been zero need for Luke to investigate anything. Using an investigative journalist as an instrument makes no sense at all.

 

[RedFan]

God created all things by Jesus Christ, He adresses the Son as God though.

Where?

 

[Taken]

Were Jesus's brothers born of another woman?

No.

Following the Birth of Jesus from the womb of the Virgin Mary, (married to Joseph)…

Joseph and Mary had at LEAST SIX biological children…
4 sons…Joseph, James, Judas, Simon
At least 2 daughters…names not revealed.

According to MANS LAW…ALL “seven children” were the LEGAL Children of Joseph and Mary…

The HIGHLIGHT of Scripture is in Regard TO: the “FIRST born of the Virgin Mary”, who REMAINED a Virgin While she was betrothed, then married, then delivered her first son,

** AND (PER Jewish Law and Traditional Custom) Mary and Joseph would have WAITED …

* 7 days After the birth of Jesus
PLUS
* 36 days After the birth of Jesus
PLUS
* Whatever number of days until the “Congregation” was Present…
PLUS
The burning of Mary’s sin offering given the Priest…

THEN….
Would Mary and Joseph BE Jewish (Lawfully) allowed to Consummate their MARRIAGE…
AND…
Continue being FAITHFUL servants unto the Lord God … BY MULTIPLYING … as God Directed husbands and wives TO DO!!!

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Matthias]

I think Paul can be credited with "the truth" even though he didn't opine on a particular theological topic (like the divinity of Christ).

I believe that he should be so credited (I’m not anti-Paul; he is a primitive Christian who espoused Jewish monotheism) but the question is why go beyond what he himself believed? (Which is what Church history documents happened.)

“Paul didn’t think of Jesus as God.” - My position (with the caveat in post #864) and yours.

”Paul thought of Jesus as God.” - The position of those who go beyond what you and I say Paul himself believed.

 

[Verily]

Where?

Post # 858

Hebrews 1:8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

His God and Father is speaking to Jesus Christ here (looking forward)) saying,

Psalm 45:6 Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.

Psalm 45:7 Thou lovest righteousness, and hatest wickedness: therefore God, THY GOD, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

By whom God made the worlds

Hebrews 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

God, who created all things by Jesus Christ

Ephes 3:9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

John 1:1-3 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

 

[Matthias]

“In the beginning was that Word, and that Word was with God and that Word was God. This same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by it, and without it was made nothing that was made.”

(John 1:1-3, Geneva Bible)

 

[Verily]

“In the beginning was that Word, and that Word was with God and that Word was God. All things were made by it, and without it was made nothing that was made.”

(John 1:1-3, Geneva Bible)

I have heard that and that as Christ is God's that the Word that was with God was God's since its the same wording between the texts.

1 Cr 3:23 And G1161 ye G5210 are Christ's; G5547 and G1161 Christ G5547 is God's. G2316

John 1:1

In G1722 the beginning G746 was G2258 the Word, G3056 and G2532 the Word G3056 was G2258 with G4314 God, G2316 and G2532 the Word G3056 was G2258 God. G2316

Now I am not a word translator, so my opinion would mean very little, and I even felt the structure of Christ is "God's G2316 would fit so much better if it said, "Word that was with God was God's"G2316. Meaning "belonging to God" in both cases. Like an apostrophe s would make all the difference in John 1:1 to reflect the same flow 1 Cr 3:23.

But you still have Psalm 45:6-7 which Hebrews picks up on it. God calling his Son God there.

 

[Matthias]

I have heard that and that as Christ is God's that the Word that was with God was God's since its the same wording between the texts.

1 Cr 3:23 And G1161 ye G5210 are Christ's; G5547 and G1161 Christ G5547 is God's. G2316

John 1:1

In G1722 the beginning G746 was G2258 the Word, G3056 and G2532 the Word G3056 was G2258 with G4314 God, G2316 and G2532 the Word G3056 was G2258 God. G2316

Now I am not a word translator, so my opinion would mean very little, and I even felt the structure of Christ is "God's G2316 would fit so much better if it said, "Word that was with God was God's"G2316. Meaning "belonging to God" in both cases. Like an apostrophe s would make all the difference in John 1:1 to reflect the same flow 1 Cr 3:23.

But you still have Psalm 45:6-7 which Hebrews picks up on it. God calling his Son God there.

John is a Jewish monotheist. I’m a Jewish monotheist. I read John through the eyes of Jewish monotheism.

John isn’t writing about Jesus (himself a Jewish monotheist) in the prologue of his Gospel. He’s writing about Jesus’ God and Father, Yahweh.

When I read the prologue my mind is directed to the Genesis creation - God spoke and what had previously only been with him, in his mind / thought / plan, was brought into existence.

 

[Verily]

John is a Jewish monotheist. I’m a Jewish monotheist. I read John through the eyes of Jewish monotheism.

John isn’t writing about Jesus (himself a Jewish monotheist) in the prologue of his Gospel. He’s writing about Jesus’ God and Father, Yahweh.

I have no idea what you just said, you gotta come down to my level, its really easy to speak over my head, like I am 12.

 

[Matthias]

I have no idea what you just said, you gotta come down to my level, its really easy to speak over my head, like I am 12.

I’m a civil engineer. As an engineer, things exist only in my mind - let’s say a bridge, for example - before I cause it - the bridge - to be built, bringing it into existence.

You aren’t an engineer but there are things which exist only in your mind - thoughts, ideas, projects, plans. I’m sure you could give me an example.

***

God - Yahweh, the God and Father of Jesus - spoke, verbally expressed what was in his mind, and what had previously only existed in his mind - let’s say animals, for example - came into existence.

John is leading his readers back to Genesis in the prologue. The same God who created the heavens and the earth in the beginning is, John will go on to suggest, working to bring into existence the new creation. This new creation begins with, and is seen in, his Son.

 

[Verily]

I’m a civil engineer. As an engineer, things exist only in my mind - let’s say a bridge, for example - before I cause it - the bridge - to be built, bringing it into existence.

You aren’t an engineer but there are things which exist only in your mind - thoughts, ideas, projects, plans. I’m sure you could give me an example.

***

God - Yahweh, the God and Father of Jesus - spoke, verbally expressed what was in his mind, and what had previously only existed in his mind - let’s say animals, for example - came into existence.

John is leading his readers back to Genesis in the prologue. The same God who created the heavens and the earth in the beginning is, John will go on to suggest, working to bring into existence the new creation. This new creation begins with, and is seen in, his Son.

Thats creative but doesnt it just reduce Christ to a concept before he came into this world? Especially since by him God made the worlds.

Or am I still not gettting you? I am not very good at this.

 

[Matthias]

When I see and hear Jesus @Verily I see and hear my lord but, more than just that, I see and hear my God working in him.

 

[Verily]

When I see and hear Jesus @Verily I see and hear my lord but, more than just that, I see and hear my God working in him.

Absolutely I can understand that. The LORD would teach sinners "in the way" and Jesus is the way (who spake only those things given him of the Father to speak). That makes sense, yes.

 

[Aunty Jane]

My answer to that as a primitive Christian believer is Jewish monotheism’s answer: “No” and “Yes”.

”No” - not literally.

”Yes” - functionally; representationally, as his shaliach.

Paul wrote representatively of all the apostles when he said.....
“For even though there are so-called gods, whether in heaven or on earth, just as there are many “gods” and many “lords,” 6  there is actually to us one God, the Father, from whom all things are and we for him; and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things are and we through him.”

As a Jewish monotheist, Paul did not present the Christ as an equal with his God in any way, but as a humble servant of his God. (Acts 4:27) One who would also serve his God as his “apostle” and “High Priest”. (Heb 3:1)

Before, during and after his earthly mission, Jesus was the “logos”......”The Word”......God’s spokesman....the one who spoke God’s words to his earthly servants. He was always God’s “shaliach”...”the firstborn of ALL creation”......the one “through whom” (the agent) all creation came from the Father.....as his Father’s representative.

This focus on a doctrine invented by a corrupted church alters the very nature of God, who alone is the Creator. Not once is Jesus given that designation. Under the guidance of his God and Father, the Son fashioned the raw materials that were created into all that exists. (Prov 8:30-31; Col 1:15-17; John 1:2-3)
There is no impediment to the pre-human existence of the spirit being who became the man Jesus Christ. God’s first and only direct creation....he is the “us” and “our” in Gen 1:26. (Rev 3:14)

To give him the title “theos” simply means “a divine mighty one”.....it is not a word that describes Yahweh exclusively, exactly as “Lord” is not a substitute for “God”.
“Divinity” is not necessarily “deity”. Yahweh shares that designation with no one.

The Greek word “pro·sky·neʹo” is also a word with more than one meaning.....it can mean “worship” when directed to Yahweh, but not to any human. That same word must be translated “obeisance” in connection with respectful bowing before a fellow human. Jesus received the respectful honour due to him as God’s firstborn, even from the angels. But as a human he was not “worshipped”, nor did he ever seek it.

Looking at Christ through Jewish eyes instead of Catholic ones, paints an entirely different picture of who Jesus was, and who he is now.

He is, was, and always will be, what he called himself....”the Son of God”. (John 10:31-36)

 

[RedFan]

Post # 858

Hebrews 1:8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

His God and Father is speaking to Jesus Christ here (looking forward)) saying,

Psalm 45:6 Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.

Psalm 45:7 Thou lovest righteousness, and hatest wickedness: therefore God, THY GOD, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

By whom God made the worlds

Hebrews 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

God, who created all things by Jesus Christ

Ephes 3:9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

John 1:1-3 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

None of these quotes are from Paul, except Eph. 3:9 -- which doesn't support Christ's divinity.