WAS PETER ACCURSED?

[pepper]

If I get this right you are saying that all Paul said was of the devil
If so please consider this verse
[2Pe 3:15-16 KJV] 15 And account [that] the longsuffering of our Lord [is] salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; 16 As also in all [his] epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as [they do] also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
Peter said what Paul wrote was scripture....it cant be that scripture is of the devil
What does God say about all of scripture?
[2Ti 3:16 KJV] 16 All scripture [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
Given by inspiration of God

Consider this.
Satan tempted Jesus when Jesus was in the Desert during His fast.
Jesus wrested the power of death from Satan on the cross.

Satan however remains Lord of this world.

What better way to pursue disrupting the Gospel good news Jesus sealed with His blood after Jesus was gone home?

When Paul ,Saul,a Pharisee as he identified himself in present tense during his trial before the Sanhedrin, said even Satan can appear as an angel of light? (Damascus road light. Three different accounts of that encounter in scripture. Some where the companions heard a voice. Another where they did not)

I mean this with respect. Do the research yourself.
Paul/Saul contradicted Jesus teachings.

Many of the faithful have done so,researched.

Jesus told His anointed,anointed by Him,to go to the Gentiles with His Gospel. And go into all the world,which of course meant to non-Jews.

What better way to cause division in the world,adversity,than to get a Pharisee,remembering Jesus' scathing condemnation of them during His illegal trial, to go to Jews and non,-Jews wirh "His" ,as Paul referred to it at least 11 times, gospel.

Jesus taught Baptism. Paul said Jesus didn't send Him to Baptize?

Do the research.

Jesus gave His life to seal the New Covenant.
Would He lead His anointed Apostles to levy a curse on anyone who came after them and preached a different Gospel? When there is only one?

The one Jesus said would come after Him was Holy Spirit. The Comforter.

Not a Pharisee.

 

[pepper]

Consider this.
Satan tempted Jesus when Jesus was in the Desert during His fast.
Jesus wrested the power of death from Satan on the cross.

Satan however remains Lord of this world.

What better way to pursue disrupting the Gospel good news Jesus sealed with His blood after Jesus was gone home?

When Paul ,Saul,a Pharisee as he identified himself in present tense during his trial before the Sanhedrin, said even Satan can appear as an angel of light? (Damascus road light. Three different accounts of that encounter in scripture. Some where the companions heard a voice. Another where they did not)

I mean this with respect. Do the research yourself.
Paul/Saul contradicted Jesus teachings.

Many of the faithful have done so,researched.

Jesus told His anointed,anointed by Him,to go to the Gentiles with His Gospel. And go into all the world,which of course meant to non-Jews.

What better way to cause division in the world,adversity,than to get a Pharisee,remembering Jesus' scathing condemnation of them during His illegal trial, to go to Jews and non,-Jews wirh "His" ,as Paul referred to it at least 11 times, gospel.

Jesus taught Baptism. Paul said Jesus didn't send Him to Baptize?

Do the research.

Jesus gave His life to seal the New Covenant.
Would He lead His anointed Apostles to levy a curse on anyone who came after them and preached a different Gospel? When there is only one?

The one Jesus said would come after Him was Holy Spirit. The Comforter.

Not a Pharisee.

And adding this with regard to your citing Peter as the author of 2nd Peter.

The Authorship of Second Peter | Bible.org

I. Introduction There has been much debate over the authorship of 2 Peter. Most conservative evangelicals hold to the traditional view that Peter was the author, but historical and literary critics have almost unanimously concluded that to be impossible. For example: Ksemann states that 2 Peter...

bible.org

 

[Verily]

We have Paul's Three Conversion Accounts

The three accounts of Paul’s encounters with Christ at his conversion are found in the Book of Acts:

Acts 9:1-19 This account describes Paul’s journey to Damascus where he encounters a bright light and falls to the ground. He is blinded and later healed by Ananias, who also baptizes him.

Acts 22:1-21 In this account, Paul recounts his conversion to a crowd of Jews in Jerusalem. He describes the bright light, his fall to the ground, and his encounter with Ananias.

Acts 26:9-23 Here, Paul recounts his conversion to King Agrippa in Caesarea. He describes the light, his fall, and his encounter with Ananias, emphasizing his commission to the Gentiles. These accounts provide slightly different perspectives on the same event, reflecting the context and audience for each retelling.

Pasted below #1

The way this is written shows that Paul is not telling this story

Acts 9:1-19
[1] And Saul, yet breathing out threatenings and slaughter against the disciples of the Lord, went unto the high priest,
[2] And desired of him letters to Damascus to the synagogues, that if he found any of this way, whether they were men or women, he might bring them bound unto Jerusalem.
[3] And as he journeyed, he came near Damascus: and suddenly there shined round about him a light from heaven:
[4] And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?
[5] And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.
[6] And he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what wilt thou have me to do? And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the city, and it shall be told thee what thou must do.
[7] And the men which journeyed with him stood speechless, hearing a voice, but seeing no man.
[8] And Saul arose from the earth; and when his eyes were opened, he saw no man: but they led him by the hand, and brought him into Damascus.
[9] And he was three days without sight, and neither did eat nor drink.
[10] And there was a certain disciple at Damascus, named Ananias; and to him said the Lord in a vision, Ananias. And he said, Behold, I am here, Lord.
[11] And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the street which is called Straight, and inquire in the house of Judas for one called Saul, of Tarsus: for, behold, he prayeth,
[12] And hath seen in a vision a man named Ananias coming in, and putting his hand on him, that he might receive his sight.
[13] Then Ananias answered, Lord, I have heard by many of this man, how much evil he hath done to thy saints at Jerusalem:
[14] And here he hath authority from the chief priests to bind all that call on thy name.
[15] But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:
[16] For I will shew him how great things he must suffer for my name's sake.
[17] And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost.
[18] And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized.
[19] And when he had received meat, he was strengthened. Then was Saul certain days with the disciples which were at Damascus.
[20] And straightway he preached Christ in the synagogues, that he is the Son of God.
[21] But all that heard him were amazed, and said; Is not this he that destroyed them which called on this name in Jerusalem, and came hither for that intent, that he might bring them bound unto the chief priests?
[22] But Saul increased the more in strength, and confounded the Jews which dwelt at Damascus, proving that this is very Christ.
[23] And after that many days were fulfilled, the Jews took counsel to kill him:

For example, the way its worded ....

[7] And the men which journeyed WITH HIM stood speechless

If Paul were telling the story it would go more like.

" And the men which journeyed WITH ME stood speechless"

 

[Verily]

Pasted below #2

Acts 22:1-21: In this account, Paul recounts his conversion to a crowd of Jews in Jerusalem. He describes the bright light, his fall to the ground, and his subsequent encounter with Ananias.


Acts 22:1-21
[1] Men, brethren, and fathers, hear ye my defence which I make now unto you.
[2] (And when they heard that he spake in the Hebrew tongue to them, they kept the more silence: and he saith,)
[3] I am verily a man which am a Jew, born in Tarsus, a city in Cilicia, yet brought up in this city at the feet of Gamaliel, and taught according to the perfect manner of the law of the fathers, and was zealous toward God, as ye all are this day.
[4] And I persecuted this way unto the death, binding and delivering into prisons both men and women.
[5] As also the high priest doth bear me witness, and all the estate of the elders: from whom also I received letters unto the brethren, and went to Damascus, to bring them which were there bound unto Jerusalem, for to be punished.
[6] And it came to pass, that, as I made my journey, and was come nigh unto Damascus about noon, suddenly there shone from heaven a great light round about me.
[7] And I fell unto the ground, and heard a voice saying unto me, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?
[8] And I answered, Who art thou, Lord? And he said unto me, I am Jesus of Nazareth, whom thou persecutest.
[9] And they that were with me saw indeed the light, and were afraid; but they heard not the voice of him that spake to me.
[10] And I said, What shall I do, Lord? And the Lord said unto me, Arise, and go into Damascus; and there it shall be told thee of all things which are appointed for thee to do.
[11] And when I could not see for the glory of that light, being led by the hand of them that were with me, I came into Damascus.
[12] And one Ananias, a devout man according to the law, having a good report of all the Jews which dwelt there,
[13] Came unto me, and stood, and said unto me, Brother Saul, receive thy sight. And the same hour I looked up upon him.
[14] And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth.
[15] For thou shalt be his witness unto all men of what thou hast seen and heard.
[16] And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
[17] And it came to pass, that, when I was come again to Jerusalem, even while I prayed in the temple, I was in a trance;
[18] And saw him saying unto me, Make haste, and get thee quickly out of Jerusalem: for they will not receive thy testimony concerning me.
[19] And I said, Lord, they know that I imprisoned and beat in every synagogue them that believed on thee:
[20] And when the blood of thy martyr Stephen was shed, I also was standing by, and consenting unto his death, and kept the raiment of them that slew him.
[21] And he said unto me, Depart: for I will send thee far hence unto the Gentiles.
[22] And they gave him audience unto this word, and then lifted up their voices, and said, Away with such a fellow from the earth: for it is not fit that he should live.
[23] And as they cried out, and cast off their clothes, and threw dust into the air,

 

[Verily]

Pasted below #3

Acts 26:9-23 Here, Paul recounts his conversion to King Agrippa in Caesarea. He describes the light, his fall, and his encounter with Ananias, emphasizing his commission to the Gentiles. These accounts provide slightly different perspectives on the same event, reflecting the context and audience for each retelling


Acts 26:1-23
[1] Then Agrippa said unto Paul, Thou art permitted to speak for thyself. Then Paul stretched forth the hand, and answered for himself:
[2] I think myself happy, king Agrippa, because I shall answer for myself this day before thee touching all the things whereof I am accused of the Jews:
[3] Especially because I know thee to be expert in all customs and questions which are among the Jews: wherefore I beseech thee to hear me patiently.
[4] My manner of life from my youth, which was at the first among mine own nation at Jerusalem, know all the Jews;
[5] Which knew me from the beginning, if they would testify, that after the most straitest sect of our religion I lived a Pharisee.
[6] And now I stand and am judged for the hope of the promise made of God unto our fathers:
[7] Unto which promise our twelve tribes, instantly serving God day and night, hope to come. For which hope's sake, king Agrippa, I am accused of the Jews.
[8] Why should it be thought a thing incredible with you, that God should raise the dead?
[9] I verily thought with myself, that I ought to do many things contrary to the name of Jesus of Nazareth.
[10] Which thing I also did in Jerusalem: and many of the saints did I shut up in prison, having received authority from the chief priests; and when they were put to death, I gave my voice against them.
[11] And I punished them oft in every synagogue, and compelled them to blaspheme; and being exceedingly mad against them, I persecuted them even unto strange cities.
[12] Whereupon as I went to Damascus with authority and commission from the chief priests,
[13] At midday, O king, I saw in the way a light from heaven, above the brightness of the sun, shining round about me and them which journeyed with me.
[14] And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.
[15] And I said, Who art thou, Lord? And he said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest.
[16] But rise, and stand upon thy feet: for I have appeared unto thee for this purpose, to make thee a minister and a witness both of these things which thou hast seen, and of those things in the which I will appear unto thee;
[17] Delivering thee from the people, and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I send thee,
[18] To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.
[19] Whereupon, O king Agrippa, I was not disobedient unto the heavenly vision:
[20] But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.
[21] For these causes the Jews caught me in the temple, and went about to kill me.
[22] Having therefore obtained help of God, I continue unto this day, witnessing both to small and great, saying none other things than those which the prophets and Moses did say should come:
[23] That Christ should suffer, and that he should be the first that should rise from the dead, and should shew light unto the people, and to the Gentiles.


I dont get the big deal between the three of them

 

[Ezra]

he preached at pentecost 3 thousand souls added peter early on had some confusion ,,but all in all peter was not accursed

 

[pepper]

Galatians 1, Paul makes mention of his Jesus encounter but it differs from the accounts in Acts 9,Acts 22, and Acts 26.

 

[pepper]

Then there is the other school of thought regarding Saul=Paul.
He was not an Apostle. He was merely a vessel.

Remember. None of the Apostles who knew the living Jesus and walked with Him ever referred to Paul as Apostle.


Chapter 8: Paul The False Apostle – Yeshua and the Law versus Paul the False Apostle
Chapter 8: Paul The False Apostle – Yeshua and the Law versus Paul the False Apostle

"...
Paul’s claim of apostleship

Many Christians believe that Paul was the greatest apostle who ever lived! After all, he was the single biggest contributor to the New Testament. But in claiming the title of apostle, Paul was also claiming to have the authority of an apostle to teach the things that he did. This is the same as claiming that he, like the other apostles, had Yeshua’s instructions and blessing to teach what he did. But at the same time, as hard as it is to imagine, Paul virtually never quoted Yeshua! There are only a couple of instances and a handful of words in each instance where Paul actually quoted him. This shocking fact has not been lost on scholars. Many have rightly pointed out that if all we had were Paul’s letters, we would know virtually nothing about what Yeshua did and said. This testifies to the fact that Paul was not there and did not walk with Yeshua during his ministry. So, one has to ask: Did Yeshua really call Paul to be an apostle? We’ve already established that Paul’s doctrine is terribly messed up. Now we’re going to see that there is more than ample evidence to suggest that he wasn’t even a true apostle of Yeshua …let alone the greatest one who ever lived.

There are a number of historical facts, including things that both Yeshua and Paul said as recorded in the Bible, that leave us with some very compelling evidence against his apostleship being recognized in heaven.

There are several interesting facts surrounding this case that should be noted.

Paul’s apostleship was unrecognized by others

Of the 22 times in the Bible where Paul is referred to as an “apostle”, only twice is he referred to as an apostle by someone other than himself! These instances didn’t come from Yeshua or any of the original apostles but from Paul’s close traveling companion and personal press secretary Luke. "

 

[Verily]

Then there is the other school of thought regarding Saul=Paul.
He was not an Apostle. He was merely a vessel.

Remember. None of the Apostles who knew the living Jesus and walked with Him ever referred to Paul as Apostle.

None of the other apostles mentioned any of the other apostles except for Paul.

They (being Peter and Paul) open in each epistle with that office (apostle) none of the others do

The first two are stated this way

Romans 1:1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,

1 Cr 1:1 Paul, called to be an apostle of Jesus Christ through the will of God, and Sosthenes our brother,

The restof Paul's

2 Cr 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timothy our brother, unto the church of God which is at Corinth, with all the saints which are in all Achaia:

Ephes 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus:

Col 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timotheus our brother,

Titus 1:1 Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;

2 Ti 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, according to the promise of life which is in Christ Jesus,

Peter's epistles

1 Peter 1:1 Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,

2 Peter 1:1 Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

 

[Verily]

The one who wrote Acts (Luke) refers to Paul and Barnabas a apostles

Acts 14:3 Which when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul, heard of, they rent their clothes, and ran in among the people, crying out,

 

[Verily]

Paul’s claim of apostleship

Many Christians believe that Paul was the greatest apostle who ever lived! After all, he was the single biggest contributor to the New Testament. But in claiming the title of apostle, Paul was also claiming to have the authority of an apostle to teach the things that he did. This is the same as claiming that he, like the other apostles, had Yeshua’s instructions and blessing to teach what he did. But at the same time, as hard as it is to imagine, Paul virtually never quoted Yeshua! There are only a couple of instances and a handful of words in each instance where Paul actually quoted him.

Can you provide us that list on how many times Peter quoted Jesus in his epistles (just to be fair, consistent)

I cheated, and asked AI (since this one would take more time)

There is no specific record of the Apostle Peter directly quoting Jesus in the Bible. The New Testament focuses on Peter’s interactions with Jesus, his teachings, and his role in the early Christian community, but it does not provide detailed accounts of Peter quoting Jesus verbatim.

Its not always correct, so I know that you must be a fair person and objective and have certainly compared between the two of them and likely have a list you can post to the thread.

 

[pepper]

Luke 6:13, Jesus called together His disciples and chose 12 men whom He called Apostles. They are named in Matthew 10:2-4.

Luke 9:1-6, Jesus sent forth the 12 Apostles to preach the Gospel, heal the sick, and cast out demons.

Luke 10:1 Jesus picked 72 more to go forth and teach in groups of 2

 

[pepper]

The one who wrote Acts (Luke) refers to Paul and Barnabas a apostles

Acts 14:3 Which when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul, heard of, they rent their clothes, and ran in among the people, crying out,

Luke,a physician and the companion, disciple, of Paul,wrote Acts and the Book of Luke.

 

[Verily]

Paul

1 Cr 11:23 For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread:

1 Cr 11:24 And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.

1 Cr 11:25 After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me.

1 Cr 11:26 For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord's death till he come.

Acts 20:35 I have shewed you all things, how that so labouring ye ought to support the weak, and to remember the words of the Lord Jesus, how he said, It is more blessed to give than to receive.

 

[Verily]

Luke,a physician and the companion, disciple, of Paul,wrote Acts and the Book of Luke.

I know, I have been telling you this over and over again

 

[Verily]

Galatians 1, Paul makes mention of his Jesus encounter but it differs from the accounts in Acts 9,Acts 22, and Acts 26.

Where are the problems

 

[Verily]

Luke,a physician and the companion, disciple, of Paul,wrote Acts and the Book of Luke.

So Luke is in on the conspiracy or something?

Luke calls Paul an apostle in Acts 14:14

Luke mentions Ananias and his vision of Paul and his calling before they even came together

Must we now get rid of the book of Luke, the book of Acts and all of Paul's epistles (and Peters since he calls Paul a beloved brother)? And John too, I posted some stuff from John's that supports Paul in one of my posts so it appears we just have Hebrews left?

 

[Verily]

The one Jesus said would come after Him was Holy Spirit. The Comforter.

Not a Pharisee.

That's what Paul says, can you believe this?

Acts 19:1 And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples,

Acts 19:2 He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.

Acts 19:3 And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism.

Acts 19:4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, (Mat 3:11) that is, on Christ Jesus.

Acts 19:5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

Acts 19:6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

Acts 19:7 And all the men were about twelve.

 

[Verily]

Would He lead His anointed Apostles to levy a curse on anyone who came after them and preached a different Gospel? When there is only one?

Peter

2 Peter 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.


2 Peter 2:14 Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:

 

[Verily]

(Damascus road light. Three different accounts of that encounter in scripture. Some where the companions heard a voice. Another where they did not)

I mean this with respect. Do the research yourself.

Okay, here we go, please note that account number one is not Paul speaking. No one doing the speaking would write, " And the men which journeyed WITH HIM stood speechless..."

He would say, "" And the men which journeyed WITH ME stood speechless..."

# 1

This first account describes Paul's Journey but is being told by Luke

Acts 9:1-19 This account describes Paul’s journey to Damascus where he encounters a bright light and falls to the ground. He is blinded and later healed by Ananias, who also baptizes him.

See it?

[7] And the men which journeyed WITH HIM stood speechless, hearing a voice, but seeing no man.


So your quarrel wouldn't be with Paul (but Luke) because Paul's accounts follow after


# 2

This account is Paul's own account to the Jews

Acts 22:1-21 In this account, Paul recounts his conversion to a crowd of Jews in Jerusalem. He describes the bright light, his fall to the ground,
and his encounter with Ananias.

See it?

9] And they that were WITH ME saw indeed the light, and were afraid; but they heard not the voice of him that spake to me.



# 3

This account is Paul's own account to the King

Acts 26:9-23 Here, Paul recounts his conversion to King Agrippa in Caesarea. He describes the light, his fall, and his encounter with Ananias, emphasizing his
commission to the Gentiles. These accounts provide slightly different perspectives on the same event, reflecting the context and audience for each retelling.

See it again?

[13] At midday, O king, I saw in the way a light from heaven, above the brightness of the sun, shining round about me and them which journeyed WITH ME.
[14] And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue,

Here Paul describes the light about all of them. He pretty much says what he said in his second account, only he says nothing about them not hearing the voice he was hearing (only that he heard a voice speaking to me) and not to them.

I keep doing my research over and over again as you tell us to, and keep finding these accusations against Paul falling flat.