Was Jerusalem "Babylon the Great" 2,000 years ago?

[Marty fox]

All slain people upon the Earth can't have been killed in any one city but a symbolic city symbolizing false religion and confusion could match that verse.

1 Peter 5:13​

She who is in Babylon, chosen together with you, sends you her greetings, and so does my son Mark.

So then in your view how could the church then be in Babylon? This verse proves that Babylon is a literal city.

 

[grafted branch]

You have to keep in mind Babylon is portrayed as unrepentant, defiant, and continuously engaged in the shedding of innocent blood. Does that fit David throughout his life? No. He was repentant and God eventually forgave him. But he had consequences for his actions to pay in the meantime, such as the death of his child with Bathsheba. Therefore, no, based on that David is the opposite of Babylon, that he was repentant while Babylon never is, ever, David is not in Babylon.

It was an interesting point you brought up, though.

I agree, David would be the opposite of Babylon, but the blood of Uriah is in Babylon according to Revelation 18:24.

If you agree that Christ paid for David’s sin then where is Uriah’s blood? Is it still in Babylon?

 

[Davidpt]

Amazing and convincing post

Convincing post about what? Since when is anyone in Babylon repentant? Since when was David not repentant? To be in Babylon, for one thing, means to never be repentant. David, while responsible for Uriah’s death, was still aligned with God’s purposes, unlike those who align themselves with Babylon. It’s a matter of where one's heart and repentance lie. Babylon symbolizes a system that rejects God, while David, despite his sins, sought God’s mercy and restoration.

 

[Davy]

Your confusement is what actually is Jerusalem?

That don't make sense at all.

 

[Davy]

Does Babylon the Great represent Satan's worldly system?

Nope. It represents the "great city", just like the last verse of Revelation 17 says.

And the identity of the "great city" per God's Word...

Rev 11:7-8
7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.

8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.
KJV

 

[Marty fox]

That's not what it says though.

Rev 18:24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.



If Babylon is a literal city, Jerusalem, it's impossible for "all that were slain upon the Earth" to have been found in her/the city.

Therefore, this Babylon city is not literal, and cannot be Jerusalem. It is as I said, a symbolic city representing religious confusion regarding the worship of a false god. It is the end times false god scripture speaks of in various passages.

Babylon is not Jerusalem but it was a type or shadow of something that would come but ppl always, always fall for teh shadow and never see the bigger picture.

Rome was the shadow of the global beast system. It is not nor will it be the Rev 13 beast.
Jerusalem was the shadow of the religious confusion Babylon. It is not nor will it be Babylon of Rev.

1 Peter 5:13​

She who is in Babylon, chosen together with you, sends you her greetings, and so does my son Mark.

Revelation 18
4 Then I heard another voice from heaven say:

“‘Come out of her, my people,’[b]
so that you will not share in her sins,
so that you will not receive any of her plagues;

9 “When the kings of the earth who committed adultery with her and shared her luxury see the smoke of her burning, they will weep and mourn over her. 10 Terrified at her torment, they will stand far off and cry:

“‘Woe! Woe to you, great city,
you mighty city of Babylon!
In one hour your doom has come!’

Once again then in your view how could the church be in Babylon? These verses proves that it is a literal city.

Jesus told us exactly who Babylon is

 

[Davy]

So far in this thread, it appears that some here want this thread to be about anything other... than JERUSALEM as the "great city" of Revelation 17, and thus the actual meaning of "MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT...".

 

[Davidpt]

If you agree that Christ paid for David’s sin then where is Uriah’s blood? Is it still in Babylon?

I wish I could borrow your mind sometime, because you bring up some of the most interesting questions that never cross my mind. You indeed think outside of the box, something I like to do as well, except I tend to think you might be better at it than I think I am.

To answer your question, was Uriah's blood ever in Babylon to begin with? That's what we should be asking ourselves. Keeping in mind that David doesn't fit anyone in Babylon to begin with. David was not part of that system.

 

[Marty fox]

Revelation 18
24 In her was found the blood of prophets and of God’s holy people,
of all who have been slaughtered on the earth.”

Jesus told us exactly Babylon the great is and that it was in a literal location

Matthew 23
33 “You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell? 34 Therefore I am sending you prophets and sages and teachers. Some of them you will kill and crucify; others you will flog in your synagogues and pursue from town to town. 35 And so upon you will come all the righteous blood that has been shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah son of Berekiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. 36 Truly I tell you, all this will come on this generation.

37 “Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were not willing. 38 Look, your house is left to you desolate.

It really is that simple.

 

[Marty fox]

Convincing post about what? Since when is anyone in Babylon repentant? Since when was David not repentant? To be in Babylon, for one thing, means to never be repentant. David, while responsible for Uriah’s death, was still aligned with God’s purposes, unlike those who align themselves with Babylon. It’s a matter of where one's heart and repentance lie. Babylon symbolizes a system that rejects God, while David, despite his sins, sought God’s mercy and restoration.

1 Peter 5:13​

She who is in Babylon, chosen together with you, sends you her greetings, and so does my son Mark.

So then in your view how could the church then be in Babylon? This verse proves that Babylon is a literal city.

 

[Davy]

Revelation 18
24 In her was found the blood of prophets and of God’s holy people,
of all who have been slaughtered on the earth.”

Jesus told us exactly Babylon the great is and that it was in a literal location

Matthew 23
33 “You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell? 34 Therefore I am sending you prophets and sages and teachers. Some of them you will kill and crucify; others you will flog in your synagogues and pursue from town to town. 35 And so upon you will come all the righteous blood that has been shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah son of Berekiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. 36 Truly I tell you, all this will come on this generation.

37 “Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were not willing. 38 Look, your house is left to you desolate.

It really is that simple.

Yes, it's about the "great city" JERUSALEM at the very end of this world. Not today just yet, but when the coming false-Messiah will arrive there and be setup as God like Apostle Paul showed in 2 Thess.2:3-4, and that Lord Jesus showed in Matthew 24:23-26.

So those today thinking "MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT..." is already manifested today, show they don't really understand much about Bible prophecy involving events for the end of this world.

 

[grafted branch]

To answer your question, was Uriah's blood ever in Babylon to begin with? That's what we should be asking ourselves. Keeping in mind that David doesn't fit anyone in Babylon to begin with. David was not part of that system.

Well here’s what I see, in Leviticus 16, on the day of atonement, there are two goats that are presented before the Lord. Aaron cast lots, one goat is for the Lord and the other is for a scapegoat which remained alive.

When Jesus died on the cross, He represented the goat for the Lord that got killed and sacrificed while Jerusalem represented the scapegoat that remained alive, had transgression and sin put on it, then it was sent away into the wilderness.

That day of atonement was fulfilled when Christ died and I believe it was also a one time event where Jerusalem had transgression and sin put on it as the scapegoat. The blood of Uriah was paid for by the Lord’s goat while the transgression of Uriah’s blood being shed was put on Jerusalem. Jerusalem is Babylon which then agrees with all the blood being found in Babylon in Revelation 18:24.

 

[Marty fox]

Yes, it's about the "great city" JERUSALEM at the very end of this world. Not today just yet, but when the coming false-Messiah will arrive there and be setup as God like Apostle Paul showed in 2 Thess.2:3-4, and that Lord Jesus showed in Matthew 24:23-26.

So those today thinking "MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT..." is already manifested today, show they don't really understand much about Bible prophecy involving events for the end of this world.

Okay good that's a start of who Babylon the great is she is Jerusalem but how and when?

2 Thessalonians 4-5
4 He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God’s temple, proclaiming himself to be God. 3 Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness[a] is revealed, the man doomed to destruction.

If it's about Jerusalem and a literal temple in the future, then what does Paul (who penned the verse above) teach us what the temple of God is?

1 Corinthians 3:16-17 ►

​

Don’t you know that you yourselves are God’s temple and that God’s Spirit dwells in your midst? 17 If anyone destroys God’s temple, God will destroy that person; for God’s temple is sacred, and you together are that temple.

The verse above fits perfectly with 2 Thessalians 2 even down the fact that the person who destroys the temple will be destroyed by God

1 Corinthians 6​

19 Do you not know that your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own;​

2 Corinthians 6:16​

What agreement has the temple of God with idols? For we are the temple of the living God; as God said, “I will make my dwelling among them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.​

If there is a future temple built in Jerusalem it won't be Gods temple.​

 

[Davy]

Okay good that's a start of who Babylon the great is she is Jerusalem but how and when?

2 Thessalonians 4-5
4 He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God’s temple, proclaiming himself to be God. 3 Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness[a] is revealed, the man doomed to destruction.

If it's about Jerusalem and a literal temple in the future, then what does Paul (who penned the verse above) teach us what the temple of God is?

1 Corinthians 3:16-17 ►

​

Don’t you know that you yourselves are God’s temple and that God’s Spirit dwells in your midst? 17 If anyone destroys God’s temple, God will destroy that person; for God’s temple is sacred, and you together are that temple.

The verse above fits perfectly with 2 Thessalians 2 even down the fact that the person who destroys the temple will be destroyed by God

1 Corinthians 6​

19 Do you not know that your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own;​

2 Corinthians 6:16​

What agreement has the temple of God with idols? For we are the temple of the living God; as God said, “I will make my dwelling among them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.​

If there is a future temple built in Jerusalem it won't be Gods temple.​

The Temple of 1 Cor.6 is about the Temple of The Spirit, which can NEVER be corrupted by any man, nor angel, not even by the devil himself. The reason is because Lord Jesus Christ is its CORNERSTONE, and its foundation is made up of the prophets and Apostles, and those in Christ.

If anyone tries... to corrupt it, they are simply "cut off". By that we know Paul in 2 Thess.2:4 was pointing to a traditional stone temple in Jerusalem.

What this means for what Paul showed in 2 Thess.2:3-4 about that coming "man of sin" being exalted as God in that "temple of God", IS ABOUT A FUTURE LITERAL STONE TEMPLE IN JERUSALEM for the end.

Today's orthodox religious Jews in Jerusalem already have the cornerstone for their new 3rd temple already cut. And it's been cut for over a decade now. Those Jews have even tried to place it on the Temple Mount, but were stopped by Israeli's.

Bible prophecy for the "abomination of desolation" being placed by the coming false-Messiah REQUIRES A NEW STONE TEMPLE BUILT IN JERUSALEM FOR THE 'END'.

 

[Marty fox]

The Temple of 1 Cor.6 is about the Temple of The Spirit, which can NEVER be corrupted by any man, nor angel, not even by the devil himself. The reason is because Lord Jesus Christ is its CORNERSTONE, and its foundation is made up of the prophets and Apostles, and those in Christ.

If anyone tries... to corrupt it, they are simply "cut off". By that we know Paul in 2 Thess.2:4 was pointing to a traditional stone temple in Jerusalem.

What this means for what Paul showed in 2 Thess.2:3-4 about that coming "man of sin" being exalted as God in that "temple of God", IS ABOUT A FUTURE LITERAL STONE TEMPLE IN JERUSALEM for the end.

Today's orthodox religious Jews in Jerusalem already have the cornerstone for their new 3rd temple already cut. And it's been cut for over a decade now. Those Jews have even tried to place it on the Temple Mount, but were stopped by Israeli's.

Bible prophecy for the "abomination of desolation" being placed by the coming false-Messiah REQUIRES A NEW STONE TEMPLE BUILT IN JERUSALEM FOR THE 'END'.

I have no idea of how you draw that conclusion from what you posted.

 

[ewq1938]

1 Peter 5:13​

She who is in Babylon, chosen together with you, sends you her greetings, and so does my son Mark.

Revelation 18
4 Then I heard another voice from heaven say:

“‘Come out of her, my people,’[b]
so that you will not share in her sins,
so that you will not receive any of her plagues;

9 “When the kings of the earth who committed adultery with her and shared her luxury see the smoke of her burning, they will weep and mourn over her. 10 Terrified at her torment, they will stand far off and cry:

“‘Woe! Woe to you, great city,
you mighty city of Babylon!
In one hour your doom has come!’

Once again then in your view how could the church be in Babylon? These verses proves that it is a literal city.

Jesus told us exactly who Babylon is

So every person who has been slain on the Earth was slain in Jerusalem. Got it.

 

[Marty fox]

So every person who has been slain on the Earth was slain in Jerusalem. Got it.

You know very well what that's not what I am saying why don't you skip the sacrarium and address the statement below?

1 Peter 5:13​

She who is in Babylon, chosen together with you, sends you her greetings, and so does my son Mark.

In your view then according to the verse above the church is Babylon

 

[CTK]

1 Peter 5:13​

She who is in Babylon, chosen together with you, sends you her greetings, and so does my son Mark.

Revelation 18
4 Then I heard another voice from heaven say:

“‘Come out of her, my people,’[b]
so that you will not share in her sins,
so that you will not receive any of her plagues;

9 “When the kings of the earth who committed adultery with her and shared her luxury see the smoke of her burning, they will weep and mourn over her. 10 Terrified at her torment, they will stand far off and cry:

“‘Woe! Woe to you, great city,
you mighty city of Babylon!
In one hour your doom has come!’

Once again then in your view how could the church be in Babylon? These verses proves that it is a literal city.

Jesus told us exactly who Babylon is

For what it is worth....

Revelation 14:8

8 And another angel followed, saying, “Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she has made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.”

This verse reveals the ultimate collapse of spiritual Babylon, a system of false religion and corruption that has led countless people away from the truth of God. The repeated phrase “is fallen, is fallen” emphasizes the certainty and completeness of Babylon’s downfall. It echoes similar language found in Isaiah 21:9, where the fall of literal Babylon was foretold: “Babylon is fallen, is fallen! And all the carved images of her gods He has broken to the ground.” Just as the ancient city of Babylon fell under God’s judgment for its pride, idolatry, and rebellion, spiritual Babylon—representing false systems of worship—will also collapse under divine judgment.

Here, Babylon is not a literal city but a symbol of spiritual confusion, corruption, and apostasy. The name itself means "confusion" (Genesis 11:9), stemming from the Tower of Babel, where God confused the languages of humanity for their rebellion. In Revelation, Babylon symbolizes a counterfeit religious system that has corrupted God’s truth, blending paganism with Christianity and deceiving the nations into false worship. This ties directly to the papal system and its influence throughout history, which introduced unbiblical traditions, altered God’s commandments, and led people into spiritual “fornication”—a term used to describe idolatry and unfaithfulness to God (Jeremiah 3:6-9).

The angel declares that “she has made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.” This imagery is significant:

The “wine” symbolizes the intoxicating influence of false teachings, doctrines, and practices that Babylon has spread throughout the world. Like wine that clouds judgment, these teachings have spiritually intoxicated and confused people, leading them into rebellion against God.

“Fornication” refers to the unholy alliance between the false church system and worldly powers. This spiritual adultery has compromised God’s truth, replacing it with human traditions and false doctrines. The result is a system that misrepresents God and distorts the Gospel.

By stating that “all nations” have been made to drink this wine, the verse highlights the global reach of Babylon’s influence. No corner of the earth has been untouched by its corruption. From the Middle Ages to the present day, Babylon’s doctrines have infiltrated cultures, nations, and even churches, creating a counterfeit version of Christianity that obscures God’s Word and truth. The announcement of Babylon’s fall serves as both a warning and a declaration of hope:

A Warning: For those who continue to align with Babylon and its false system, this message is a clear call to come out of her before it is too late (Revelation 18:4). God is revealing that Babylon’s power is temporary, and its judgment is certain.

A Hopeful Declaration: For the faithful, this message is a promise that the system that has oppressed God’s people and corrupted His truth will not endure forever. God will bring justice, and Babylon will be fully and finally destroyed.

This second angel’s message stands as a powerful indictment against spiritual Babylon and all it represents. It reminds us that false systems of worship, no matter how powerful they appear, cannot stand against God’s truth and righteousness. Babylon’s fall is both a judgment on rebellion and a call to those still within its grasp to turn back to God.

 

[ewq1938]

You know very well what that's not what I am saying why don't you skip the sacrarium and address the statement below?

1 Peter 5:13​

She who is in Babylon, chosen together with you, sends you her greetings, and so does my son Mark.

In your view then according to the verse above the church is Babylon

The topic is Babylon of Rev, not any other Babylon.

 

[Davy]

I have no idea of how you draw that conclusion from what you posted.

It should be EASY for ALL those who claim to be a Christian. Ask yourself, can Jesus Christ Himself ever be corrupted? No! Of course not. So HOW... can the Temple of The Spirit ever be corrupted, since Lord Jesus is its CORNERSTONE?

Do you even know what a cornerstone is?

Eph 2:19-22
19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief corner stone;

21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:
22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.
KJV

Therefore, ANYONE who thinks that Apostle Paul in 2 Thess.2:4 was pointing to the above "holy temple", of which Jesus is its CORNERSTONE, doesn't really know what that above "holy temple in the Lord" actually is.

And those who do that FALSE pointing, show they are following a FALSE DOCTRINE from the devil and his workers. That because only a NON-BELIEVER would ever come up with such a STUPID IDEA that the Holy Temple of The Spirit could be corrupted by that "man of sin."