THE TRANSGENDERISM OF CHRISTIANITY

[Eternally Grateful]

They may have been poor representatives of the movement, but that is the doctrine they claimed to follow.

What chatroom was it? I ask because it must be a different event.

 

[ChristinaL]

OSAS, is not about praying the prayer to receive Christ who is "The Gift of Salvation".



Well, regarding becoming a Christian, you can't earn it, so you can't lose it.

Salvation is not of you.....>Its all of God... Its a GIFT, from God.= ."The Gift of Salvation" and this is RECEIVED by Faith.

God saves Sinners, who are 'Yet sinners', who are still "" ungodly"".. who understand this about themselves.., and want to be forgiven....
So, they turn to the eternal Forgiveness, that is found as The Cross of Christ.

See, Jesus is Salvation., and God has accepted His Sacrifice, His blood and death, so that by This OFFERING of Christ to GOD... for your sin and mine.... GOD can accept us... and forgive us.. .and give US... the believers, = HIS>.. eternal "Gift of Salvation.""

Notice these Gifts.

1.) The Gift of Salvation
2.) The Gift of Righteousness
3.) The Gift of Eternal life.

And here is the understanding...

JESUS is those Gifts.. so, when we put OUR faith in Christ, God then seals us, with the Holy Spirit, having forgiven all our sin...to thereby give the believer a spiritual birth, so that we are now JOINED to Jesus... as "IN CHRIST"..
So to be joined to Jesus is to have what He is... and He is Salvation, Righteousness, and Eternal Life.

This is why Paul teaches us that the born again.. have become = """ "THE... Righteous of God... IN Christ"."""..



Is there a sin that The BLood and Death of Jesus, has not covered, paid for, and dealt with, regarding a born again Christian?

He has paid for them all with His Sacrifice of Himself on The Cross.

Notice,..... Jesus is our "SIN Bearer" because """God hath made JESUS to be SIN for US""">.. "US" = '"the born again, not the water baptized and religious fakirs.

Notice... """"Jesus is the ONE TIME...... ETERNAL ... Sacrifice for SIN"""...

NOTICE>.. "ETERNAL sacrifice for sin".. ...that means past, present, future = ETERNAL Sacrifice for SIN.

So, when that GIFT of Salvation that is the GIFT OF RIGHTEOUSNESS... has been "imputed" to the the born again..... then are literally made free from sin... forever.

Now, what happens to you, if you choose to willfully live in Carnality ????.....such as watch soft porn Netflix movies and programs... using your Netflix cable channel, most nights each week?

So, the Christian sits there, watching a lot of sensuality, occasional nudity...for years.... and they know what they are doing, before God.

That's willfully carnality..

What does that get you?

It typically gets you Hebrews 12:6, more often.

And on the way there.....this carnal pleasure....that you are choosing.....gets you a deadening to the things of God....and it can lead to more carnality.........but, it can't lead you to a loss of your salvation, as this is just carnal behavior, and none of us who are born again, were saved based on our Behavior, as God does not save us <>forgive us based on our Behavior.....>>He saved us, based in The Cross of Christ and that is an Eternal Redemption, not a temporary one.

Well I'm not talking about OSAS which I do believe in, for sincere believers. I am speaking of antinomians. I do otherwise agree with what you were speaking of

 

[Bluemind]

Several years ago I was in another Christian forum and I ran into a cult type following of believers who held to a strange doctrine.

They called the doctrine “hyper grace”. As I debated their beliefs I found that basically what they believed in was a sin all you want and still be saved type doctrine.

Basically they believed the grace of God was like a license to sin. But I also noticed how many of them tried to justify an ongoing sinful lifestyle.

Here is how many of them described it. They believed that when they sinned it was only their body that was sinning, but not their spirit. So in their minds they believed no matter how much they sinned in the body, their spirit remained squeaky clean.

So I gave this doctrine a name. I called it a doctrine of a disassociated identity. Because they do not identify with the sins they commit in the body.

And as I thought about this, I thought, this is kind of like a transgenderism of Christianity. They “identify” as Christians, but in reality they are truly of the Devil.

This is the same type of mentality that is in the transgender movement. They “identify” as something they are not.

This is a strong delusion that has even infiltrated Christianity.

We were warned about those false followers of a cult permissive tradition.

If it be of God and his plan they will find their way to his truth.

It isn't Transgendering our faith though. That is their heretical blasphemy,not ours

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

What chatroom was it? I ask because it must be a different event.

It was at ChristianChat. I see they still have a ban on the topic of Hyper grace there in the forum rules. It was implemented right after they pulled the plug on me for speaking out against it several years ago.

 

[TigersPaw]

Several years ago I was in another Christian forum and I ran into a cult type following of believers who held to a strange doctrine.

They called the doctrine “hyper grace”. As I debated their beliefs I found that basically what they believed in was a sin all you want and still be saved type doctrine.

Basically they believed the grace of God was like a license to sin. But I also noticed how many of them tried to justify an ongoing sinful lifestyle.

Here is how many of them described it. They believed that when they sinned it was only their body that was sinning, but not their spirit. So in their minds they believed no matter how much they sinned in the body, their spirit remained squeaky clean.

So I gave this doctrine a name. I called it a doctrine of a disassociated identity. Because they do not identify with the sins they commit in the body.

And as I thought about this, I thought, this is kind of like a transgenderism of Christianity. They “identify” as Christians, but in reality they are truly of the Devil.

This is the same type of mentality that is in the transgender movement. They “identify” as something they are not.

This is a strong delusion that has even infiltrated Christianity.

I think the confusion ( new guy here in the forum ).
Is that there are three types of Those that believe in Christ.
Christians
Christ Followers
Lapsed Christian

And depending on the perspective one may never develop a relationship with Christ.
My Sister was a False prophet, and that was difficult for me, being and ordained Pastor.
But it allowed me to see how easily people make God about what they can get from him.
And its not Grace.
Churches are failing as we all know. Not all, but each year the word becomes more twisted in how its viewed.
And more fall into themselves.

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

But I found myself thinking What kind of freedom in Christ did he think he has- freedom FROM sin or freedom to sin?

Exactly, a freedom to sin mentality is the same as a license to sin mentality. Another thing I noticed about this group is they were opposed to the law of God, not understanding the teachings of Paul.

To them no law=no sin. So they spoke out against the law of God, but were silent on sin.

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

Churches are failing as we all know. Not all, but each year the word becomes more twisted in how its viewed.
And more fall into themselves.

It was prophesied to happen before the coming of the Lord, it is called the falling away from the faith.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

It was at ChristianChat. I see they still have a ban on the topic of Hyper grace there in the forum rules. It was implemented right after they pulled the plug on me for speaking out against it several years ago.

It’s about like trinity here. Yes that is the one. A dude named Peter Jenz started me on the topic. He attacked me and kept it up because I believed in grace and opposed his lies against me. Yet he continued. He was finally banned. If you remember it was this on member who kept posting videos from a pastor that caused all the issues

Non of the people who accused grace believers could prove their point. I even went to that pastors web page to research. He did not say what he was accused of. It was a mess.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I think the confusion ( new guy here in the forum ).
Is that there are three types of Those that believe in Christ.
Christians
Christ Followers
Lapsed Christian

And depending on the perspective one may never develop a relationship with Christ.
My Sister was a False prophet, and that was difficult for me, being and ordained Pastor.
But it allowed me to see how easily people make God about what they can get from him.
And its not Grace.
Churches are failing as we all know. Not all, but each year the word becomes more twisted in how its viewed.
And more fall into themselves.

There are three basic gospels

1 licentious - I can say a prayer and I am saved forever I am free to do whatever I want and I will

2 legalism. Or as we call it grace plus works. It states I am saved by following a set of rules whatever those rules may be. If I do not I will lose salvation

3 grace through faith

Amazingly. The licentious will call the grace people legalists. And the legalism will call the grace people licentious.

The grace people can’t win a popularity contest. But they will be victorious when it matters through Christ

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Exactly, a freedom to sin mentality is the same as a license to sin mentality. Another thing I noticed about this group is they were opposed to the law of God, not understanding the teachings of Paul.

To them no law=no sin. So they spoke out against the law of God, but were silent on sin.

Yes Jude spoke against it as did James

But you do not fight licentiousness with legalism

 

[Eternally Grateful]

It was prophesied to happen before the coming of the Lord, it is called the falling away from the faith.

Yet licentiousness has been around since Paul.

The falling away is people denying Christ or making their own religion.

 

[TigersPaw]

Exactly, a freedom to sin mentality is the same as a license to sin mentality. Another thing I noticed about this group is they were opposed to the law of God, not understanding the teachings of Paul.

To them no law=no sin. So they spoke out against the law of God, but were silent on sin.

We were built to sin. Its who we are.
They is what do you do with that knowledge.
Do you ignore the Lords grace? or do you embrace it and be guided.
Those who assume sinning in optional are not saved. For it contradicts the entire reason Christ died for us.
Let us put some facts here:

1. Misunderstanding Grace as a License to Sin​

In Paul’s time, there were groups and individuals who misinterpreted his teaching on grace as permission to live however they pleased, as if grace negated any responsibility to live according to God’s standards. This idea essentially promotes a “no law = no sin” mindset. Paul anticipated this misunderstanding and directly addressed it.
Romans 6:1-2: "What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?"
Here, Paul emphatically rejects the idea that grace permits sin. He calls believers to recognize that, in Christ, they have died to sin and are called to live a new, holy life. The grace we receive in Christ should inspire gratitude and obedience, not reckless living.

2. Freedom in Christ Isn’t a Freedom to Sin​

Paul’s teachings consistently emphasize that, while we are no longer under the law’s condemnation (Romans 8:1), we are not free from the moral law itself. We are free from sin’s power over us but called to live righteously through the Spirit. Living under grace means our relationship with sin has changed; we no longer serve sin but God.
Galatians 5:13: "For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another."
Paul reminds the Galatians that the freedom Christ offers isn’t for indulging the flesh. Instead, it is freedom from sin’s power, giving us the ability to live in righteousness and love, empowered by the Spirit rather than the law.

3. Opposing God’s Law Leads to a Dangerous Path​

The attitude of “no law = no sin” disregards the moral guidance God has given and blinds people to the seriousness of sin. When individuals reject God’s law, they often overlook the holiness He calls us to and become more tolerant of sinful behaviors.
Romans 7:7: Paul explains that the law isn’t the problem; it’s sin. He says, "What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet."
Paul sees the law as revealing sin, not causing it. Without an understanding of God’s moral standards, people can become blind to sin’s presence and power in their lives. By rejecting God’s law, some end up ignoring sin entirely.

4. Grace and the Law: A Balanced Understanding​

Paul’s writings emphasize that we are justified by grace through faith, not by observing the law (Ephesians 2:8-9). However, once we are saved, God’s Spirit empowers us to fulfill the law’s righteous requirements (Romans 8:4). Grace enables us to live in a way that pleases God—not to earn salvation, but as a response to His love and mercy.
Romans 3:31: "Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law."Paul clarifies that faith doesn’t nullify the law; rather, it establishes it. Through faith in Christ, believers can live by the law of love, which fulfills the moral requirements of God’s law. We are called to honor God’s law, not as a means of salvation, but as an expression of the Spirit-led life.

5. The Silent on Sin, but Opposed to the Law​

A group you speak of that is vocal about rejecting the law but silent on sin may be avoiding accountability to God’s standards. By focusing on a law-free mindset, they overlook the call to holiness that grace empowers us to live. True grace doesn’t make us indifferent to sin; it moves us to turn from sin and pursue righteousness.
Titus 2:11-12: "For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world."
God’s grace, properly understood, teaches us to reject sin and live godly lives. Grace is transformative, calling us away from sin and toward a life that reflects Christ’s character.

Grace Leads to a Holy Life, Not a License to Sin​

True grace produces a heart of obedience and love for God’s ways. When we grasp the depth of what Christ has done for us, our response isn’t to ignore God’s commands but to embrace a life that reflects His righteousness.
A life saved by grace is marked by gratitude, humility, and a desire to live in alignment with God’s will. This grace motivates us to uphold God’s standards out of love, not obligation, recognizing that true freedom in Christ is freedom from sin, not freedom to sin.
These are my opinions based on these scriptures. There is no whoopsie's or confusion here.

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

1. Misunderstanding Grace as a License to Sin​

In Paul’s time, there were groups and individuals who misinterpreted his teaching on grace as permission to live however they pleased, as if grace negated any responsibility to live according to God’s standards. This idea essentially promotes a “no law = no sin” mindset. Paul anticipated this misunderstanding and directly addressed it.
Romans 6:1-2: "What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?"
Here, Paul emphatically rejects the idea that grace permits sin. He calls believers to recognize that, in Christ, they have died to sin and are called to live a new, holy life. The grace we receive in Christ should inspire gratitude and obedience, not reckless living.

2. Freedom in Christ Isn’t a Freedom to Sin​

Paul’s teachings consistently emphasize that, while we are no longer under the law’s condemnation (Romans 8:1), we are not free from the moral law itself. We are free from sin’s power over us but called to live righteously through the Spirit. Living under grace means our relationship with sin has changed; we no longer serve sin but God.
Galatians 5:13: "For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another."
Paul reminds the Galatians that the freedom Christ offers isn’t for indulging the flesh. Instead, it is freedom from sin’s power, giving us the ability to live in righteousness and love, empowered by the Spirit rather than the law.

3. Opposing God’s Law Leads to a Dangerous Path​

The attitude of “no law = no sin” disregards the moral guidance God has given and blinds people to the seriousness of sin. When individuals reject God’s law, they often overlook the holiness He calls us to and become more tolerant of sinful behaviors.
Romans 7:7: Paul explains that the law isn’t the problem; it’s sin. He says, "What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet."
Paul sees the law as revealing sin, not causing it. Without an understanding of God’s moral standards, people can become blind to sin’s presence and power in their lives. By rejecting God’s law, some end up ignoring sin entirely.

4. Grace and the Law: A Balanced Understanding​

Paul’s writings emphasize that we are justified by grace through faith, not by observing the law (Ephesians 2:8-9). However, once we are saved, God’s Spirit empowers us to fulfill the law’s righteous requirements (Romans 8:4). Grace enables us to live in a way that pleases God—not to earn salvation, but as a response to His love and mercy.
Romans 3:31: "Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law."Paul clarifies that faith doesn’t nullify the law; rather, it establishes it. Through faith in Christ, believers can live by the law of love, which fulfills the moral requirements of God’s law. We are called to honor God’s law, not as a means of salvation, but as an expression of the Spirit-led life.

5. The Silent on Sin, but Opposed to the Law​

A group you speak of that is vocal about rejecting the law but silent on sin may be avoiding accountability to God’s standards. By focusing on a law-free mindset, they overlook the call to holiness that grace empowers us to live. True grace doesn’t make us indifferent to sin; it moves us to turn from sin and pursue righteousness.
Titus 2:11-12: "For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world."
God’s grace, properly understood, teaches us to reject sin and live godly lives. Grace is transformative, calling us away from sin and toward a life that reflects Christ’s character.

Grace Leads to a Holy Life, Not a License to Sin​

True grace produces a heart of obedience and love for God’s ways. When we grasp the depth of what Christ has done for us, our response isn’t to ignore God’s commands but to embrace a life that reflects His righteousness.
A life saved by grace is marked by gratitude, humility, and a desire to live in alignment with God’s will. This grace motivates us to uphold God’s standards out of love, not obligation, recognizing that true freedom in Christ is freedom from sin, not freedom to sin.
These are my opinions based on these scriptures. There is no whoopsie's or confusion here.

It sounds like you have a pretty good understanding into what Paul was saying in his letters about grace, sin, and the law.

If someone is truly made righteous by the grace of God, then they will also DO righteousness by bearing righteous fruit. Jesus said a good tree cannot bear evil fruit.

Peace

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

The grace people can’t win a popularity contest.

The argument was not about salvation through grace, but it was about what the grace of God performs in a true conversion of a born again believer.

The grace of God is given for the obedience of the faith, not as a license to sin. Those who are born of God are made free from sin, they are not made free to keep on sinning.

If someone is truly made righteous by the grace of God, they will also DO righteousness, not to be saved, but because they ARE already saved by grace.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

It sounds like you have a pretty good understanding into what Paul was saying in his letters about grace, sin, and the law.

If someone is truly made righteous by the grace of God, then they will also DO righteousness by bearing righteous fruit. Jesus said a good tree cannot bear evil fruit.

Peace

True

But we must remember, this is a description of what a saved person does. Not what they have to do.

A child of God is freed to act out their creation. We were created to not only recieve love from God. But give it back to him and others.

do you agree?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

The argument was not about salvation through grace, but it was about what the grace of God performs in a true conversion of a born again believer.

Um no sir, it was not.

the argument got so out of hand, and insults and false accusation were slung by both sides. That a bunch of people got Banned. Between this discussion and calvinism, which was also a heated discussion. About 30 people got banned. Most never came back, I assume because they were permanent bans.

In the end, I ended up asking for my profile to be deactivated. And left that chatroom. And that is how I found this one, Because another member said he was a member here and I should try it out. I eventually did go back to that chat. But it has not been the same since that time in their histRoy, which is a shame, it was a great chatroom. And had great people, many of whom are no longer there

The grace of God is given for the obedience of the faith, not as a license to sin. Those who are born of God are made free from sin, they are not made free to keep on sinning.

When you recieve Gods grace and are born again, are you uNader law or under grace?

If someone is truly made righteous by the grace of God, they will also DO righteousness, not to be saved, but because they ARE already saved by grace.

No argument here. And again, this was not the argument in that chatroom.

The argument was over what people believed.

Once again, Are you under law or under grace. instead of falsely accusing. Let’s just discuss this issue. Then try to come to a conclusion. Is this fair?

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

But we must remember, this is a description of what a saved person does. Not what they have to do.

Does a fruit bearing tree have to produce good fruit, or is it made by His creator to naturally bear good fruit? And what did Jesus say about the fruit bearing trees who do not bear good fruit?

Luke 13:6-9

King James Version

​

6 He spake also this parable; A certain man had a fig tree planted in his vineyard; and he came and sought fruit thereon, and found none.
7 Then said he unto the dresser of his vineyard, Behold, these three years I come seeking fruit on this fig tree, and find none: cut it down; why cumbereth it the ground?
8 And he answering said unto him, Lord, let it alone this year also, till I shall dig about it, and dung it:
9 And if it bear fruit, well: and if not, then after that thou shalt cut it down.

We were created to not only recieve love from God. But give it back to him and others.

do you agree?

On those 2 things hangs all the law and prophets. But what does the scriptures say about how we are to show our love to God? We are told…

John 14:21
He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

John 15:10
If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

1 John 5:2
By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.

1 John 5:3
For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Does a fruit bearing tree have to produce good fruit, or is it made by His creator to naturally bear good fruit? And what did Jesus say about the fruit bearing trees who do not bear good fruit?

Luke 13:6-9​

​

King James Version​

​

​

6 He spake also this parable; A certain man had a fig tree planted in his vineyard; and he came and sought fruit thereon, and found none.
7 Then said he unto the dresser of his vineyard, Behold, these three years I come seeking fruit on this fig tree, and find none: cut it down; why cumbereth it the ground?
8 And he answering said unto him, Lord, let it alone this year also, till I shall dig about it, and dung it:
9 And if it bear fruit, well: and if not, then after that thou shalt cut it down.



On those 2 things hangs all the law and prophets. But what does the scriptures say about how we are to show our love to God? We are told…

John 14:21
He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

John 15:10
If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

1 John 5:2
By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.

1 John 5:3
For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

I will ask again,

as a child of God. Are you under law. Or are you under grace.

or maybe you believe you are under both?

Lets try to start from the begining, and not in the middle.. I think it will help us both better understand where the other is coming from

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

Um no sir, it was not.

I have never argued against salvation by grace through faith. My argument was against those who try to turn the grace of God into a license to sin.

When you recieve Gods grace and are born again, are you uNader law or under grace?

Many confuse the law of sin and death to the law of God, but they are not the same.

All men are firstborn under the law of sin and death. I compare it to the law of gravity, we are ALL born under it. What Paul was saying there in simple terms is we are all born under the bondage of sin and death because of our sin nature.

But when we are born again of the Spirit we are no longer in that Adam sin nature ( or in the flesh). We are made free from sin and death ( the law of sin and death) by being given a new nature (heart/mind/spirit) made after the Divine nature that is in Christ.

Romans 8:2
For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

Now concerning the law of Moses, Gentiles were never under that law to begin with, but both Jews and Gentiles were ALL under the bondage of sin and death.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I have never argued against salvation by grace through faith. My argument was against those who try to turn the grace of God into a license to sin

Many confuse the law of sin and death to the law of God, but they are not the same.

All men are firstborn under the law of sin and death. I compare it to the law of gravity, we are ALL born under it. What Paul was saying there in simple terms is we are all born under the bondage of sin and death because of our sin nature.

But when we are born again of the Spirit we are no longer in that Adam sin nature ( or in the flesh). We are made free from sin and death ( the law of sin and death) by being given a new nature (heart/mind/spirit) made after the Divine nature that is in Christ.

Romans 8:2
For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

Now concerning the law of Moses, Gentiles were never under that law to begin with, but both Jews and Gentiles were ALL under the bondage of sin and death.

Once again, I will ask you. Are you Under the law or under grace when you are a child of God

Do you understand what these terms mean?

PS. When you hear the word law. Unless it is speaking about the OT law or the first 5 Books of Moses (called the torah or law) it means the law of moses.

the law of sin and death is the law given moses. Paul called it the ministers of death written and engraved on stones.

so when i ask. That is the context of what I am asking..

if you answer. We can then go deeper and see what the Bible says about the law and about grace