The Modern Gospel

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Episkopos

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What you actually stated at least 3 times to me, is "the Cross is not about forgiveness of sin".

That's incredible blasphemy.

As usual, you mislabel everything and make outrageous claims that have no basis in fact, let alone truth.

Since you attack me for what you do...you might want to look a little closer at why you say what you do.
What you just wrote is the definition of LEGALISM.

Holiness is NOT legalism. So then just how are you deflecting what you are doing to me? Well, you think grace is about naming and claiming...in a legal manner, so that you can be immune and not responsible for sin. But that just makes you lawless... a worker of iniquity.

How long have you been so hostile to holiness?
See, you just taught, that the CROSS is not WHY God Accepts us, as "Grace through faith".. but its OUR DOING, OUR DEEDS, Our Works, our WALK, that determines if we are "FORGIVEN"., and that is a FALSE GOSPEL, a cursed Gospel, where you just defined yourself again, as this.. .: Galatians 1:8

You're "gospel" is literally the opposite of Paul's Gospel "of the GRACE of God".

You are deceived by a false understanding of Paul. Grace is the power of God over sin. Maybe you missed this...

And He said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for My strength (not forgiveness) is made perfect in weakness.” Therefore most gladly I will rather boast in my infirmities, that the power of Christ (not forgiveness) may rest upon me. 2 Cor. 12:8

The power of Christ! God's strength! That's what grace is about. The power to NOT sin. No need to be forgiven if we are crucified and walk in His resurrection life. Eternal life trumps sin. So you are making excuses for walking according the flesh...and then CLAIMING to be under grace.
So, again, you are denying the CROSS,

I uphold the cross. You can only point to a historical cross. Your flesh is not only uncrucified...but you rail against the message and purpose of the cross.
and now you've finally explained that in YOUR Deception-Theology, YOU are being forgiven by your HOLY WALK.

Backwards. No one can walk in holiness OUTSIDE of the presence of God. The kingdom of God is real...it's a real place. We go there by entering INTO Christ to be where He is. But you have to leave your flesh behind...so this will not appeal to you.
And that is teaching that YOU are the root of your own forgiveness, (self effort)

False. You misrepresent God and me. I teach that God is merciful. He has always been so. But God is also holy. If you ever meet the Lord you will understand how wholly other that is.
and that theology, Denies the Cross, Denies the Christ, and insults the Grace of God. @Episkopos

You're a very hardened Legalist.
Extreme.
That is a perfect description of your stance vis-à-vis what you read in the bible.
 

Johann

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Amen! Either we are trusting 100% in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of our salvation or else we are 100% lost. Sadly, there are certain folks who view themselves as "holier than thou" and end up exploiting the gospel in order to promote themselves. Such folks are confident of their own righteousness and despise others/look down on everyone else, which should sound familiar. (Luke 18:9-14)
Amen, a passage of great power indeed. Pride, an insidious trait, manifests in myriad forms and guises, necessitating our constant vigilance and guardianship against its subtle encroachments. As we navigate the complexities of life, both personal and communal, the vigilant awareness of pride's potential to distort, divide, and deceive remains crucial. Thus, we are called to cultivate humility, discernment, and a steadfast commitment to truth and integrity, ensuring that pride finds no fertile ground to sow discord or hinder our pursuit of harmony, authenticity, and righteousness.

Shalom to you and family my brother.
Johann.
 
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Episkopos

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Epi, you often speak of “ realms” I just couldn’t understand.

Now look...The Spirit has brought me to understanding these realms.i think you are at a much higher level than I...understanding in the spirit...I’m definitely getting there I believe..Praise God...

Praise God,Brother!!

Commentary.

To become a Christian is to be moved from the first realm into the second realm. We no longer live in the old realm. We cannot have one foot in and one foot out. We cannot live according to the flesh Monday through Saturday, and then live according to the Spirit on Sunday. When you are born again, you are completely uprooted and replanted in this totally new realm, the realm of the Spirit. You now have the mind of Christ with a totally new worldview and perspective on life. You now see with a divine and eternal perspective. It brings about a radical change in your life.
The sample of grace...the aravon...is meant to have us taste and see that the Lord is good. We have an experience of spiritual life, eternal life, and the kingdom realm, at regeneration. But we will lose that place because we don't understand what holiness is and the cost of it. Like Paul in Romans 7...he fell out of the Spirit because of sin in him...DEEPLY lodged in him. Hence Paul's crying out to God to be freed from the power of the flesh. SO as God liberated him through the power of the cross..he went back into the Spirit...and a much wiser man for it.

We need to pay the price, all we have and are, for the sake of Christ, in order to "buy the field" (the kingdom realm) where the treasure is (IN Christ).
 

Episkopos

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people who are self centered, who, like the pharisee, thinks they are righteous and holy. can not grasp the cross. because they think they do not need it.

It is the power of the cross that takes away the power of the flesh and makes us able to receive God's grace that makes us holy....and righteous.
we have seen it in the op for years in many chatrooms..

Sadly, I fear someone's heart may be to hard to see of find the truth of the cross.
Your modern ideas are so artificial that you can make all this stuff up in your imagination...and then claim you are doing what is says in the bible. Repent before it's too late. The kingdom of God is real.
 

Ritajanice

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The sample of grace...the aravon...is meant to have us taste and see that the Lord is good. We have an experience of spiritual life, eternal life, and the kingdom realm, at regeneration. But we will lose that place because we don't understand what holiness is and the cost of it. Like Paul in Romans 7...he fell out of the Spirit because of sin in him...DEEPLY lodged in him. Hence Paul's crying out to God to be freed from the power of the flesh. SO as God liberated him through the power of the cross..he went back into the Spirit...and a much wiser man for it.

We need to pay the price, all we have and are, for the sake of Christ, in order to "buy the field" (the kingdom realm) where the treasure is (IN Christ).
I will pray that the Spirit brings me to understanding your post in my spirit, as I say you are a teacher, way ahead of my understanding in the spirit...

Thank you for posting ,Brother....Love you ,stay strong in the Lord!...
 

Episkopos

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1 Corinthians 1:18 - For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. 19 For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent. 20 Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? 21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
The preaching of the cross is about power from heaven. The power of God. In your scheme grace blinds God to your true condition. So then grace for you is not the power of God...it is the powerlessness of God.

All you have to do is turn everything upside down...from serving the flesh and its interests...to God and His will.
 
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ChristisGod

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One of the most popular of the biblical proverbs is Proverbs 10:12, “Hatred stirs up conflict, / but love covers over all wrongs.” Some translations read, “Love covers all offenses” or “all transgressions.” What does is mean that love covers all wrongs?

This proverb is an example of antithetical parallelism in Hebrew poetry. A close look at the contrast involved helps provide a better understanding. “Hatred” is contrasted with “love.” The “stirring up” is contrasted with a “covering over.” And “conflict” is what hatred is promoting, whereas love seeks to make peace by covering “all wrongs.” To provide an expanded paraphrase: “Hatred looks for a fight and refuses to smooth things over, but love desires peace between warring parties and will not be involved in provoking dissension.”

Love covers all wrongs, but the wicked find motivation from hatred or spite toward others. In contrast, the righteous are motivated by love. Hatred seeks ways to cause trouble, but love looks for ways to forgive.

This same proverb is quoted in 1 Peter 4:8, “Above all, love each other deeply, because love covers over a multitude of sins.” In this context, the proverb emphasizes that love is expressed through forgiveness of sins.

The idea of love being associated with forgiveness is found frequently in Scripture. One important example is found in 1 John 4:10, “This is love: not that we loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as an atoning sacrifice for our sins.” See also John 3:16 and 1 John 3:16. The work of Christ on the cross—the work of our forgiveness—was an act of divine love.

In our own personal relationships, we also show love in our forgiveness of others. One of love’s characteristics is that it keeps no record of wrongs (1 Corinthians 13:5). Love has no list of how or how often it has been offended. Love forgives.

A related idea from Proverbs 10:12 is the concept of “covering” sins. This concept is communicated elsewhere in the Old Testament to describe God’s forgiveness of sins. For example, Psalm 85:2 reads, “You forgave the iniquity of your people / and covered all their sins.” In the New Testament, Romans 4:7 speaks of the blessedness of knowing God’s love and forgiveness: “Blessed are those whose transgressions are forgiven, whose sins are covered.”

James 5:19–20 says, “My brothers and sisters, if one of you should wander from the truth and someone should bring that person back, remember this: Whoever turns a sinner from the error of their way will save them from death and cover over a multitude of sins.” Again, the idea of “covering” many sins communicates the fact of a person’s sins being forgiven.

Our lives are to be characterized by godly love that forgives the sins of others. Our extending of forgiveness is motivated by the truth that God has forgiven our sin through Jesus Christ (Ephesians 4:32). How many times should we forgive? Up to seven times? That was Peter’s question in Matthew 18:21. Jesus’ answer: “I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven times” (Matthew 18:22). Where sin increases, grace increases all the more (Romans 5:20). Love covers a multitude of sins—and it keeps on covering.got?

hope this helps !!!
 

Johann

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The sample of grace...the aravon...is meant to have us taste and see that the Lord is good. We have an experience of spiritual life, eternal life, and the kingdom realm, at regeneration. But we will lose that place because we don't understand what holiness is and the cost of it. Like Paul in Romans 7...he fell out of the Spirit because of sin in him...DEEPLY lodged in him. Hence Paul's crying out to God to be freed from the power of the flesh. SO as God liberated him through the power of the cross..he went back into the Spirit...and a much wiser man for it.
I would have worded it this way--

The example of grace, epitomized in the sacrifice of Jesus on the cross, invites us to "taste and see that the Lord is good" (Psalm 34:8). Through this grace, we experience spiritual life, eternal life, and entry into the kingdom realm at regeneration (John 3:16, Ephesians 2:8-9). However, the journey of faith includes learning about holiness and its profound cost. Reflecting on Paul's struggle in Romans 7, we see him grappling with the reality of indwelling sin that deeply affects him. This struggle illustrates the tension between the desires of the flesh and the Spirit (Galatians 5:17).

Paul's cry for deliverance from the power of sin echoes our own need for God's transformative power through the cross (Romans 7:24-25). The liberating work of Christ on the cross breaks the power of sin and enables us to walk in the Spirit (Romans 8:1-4). Paul's experience teaches us that through the cross, God not only forgives but also empowers us to live victoriously in the Spirit, growing in wisdom and maturity (1 Corinthians 1:18).

Therefore, as we grasp the significance of the cross and its transformative power, we are called to deepen our understanding of holiness and our continual need for God's grace. Through Christ's sacrifice, we are not only forgiven but also empowered to live holy lives, renewed daily by the Spirit (2 Corinthians 5:17). Embracing this truth, we can navigate the complexities of our faith journey with confidence in God's ongoing work of sanctification in our lives (Philippians 1:6).
 
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ChristisGod

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In the Old Testament, even before the sacrificial system for the forgiveness of sin was established (Leviticus 4:20, 26, 28, 31; 5:10, 13, 16, 18; 6:7; 19:22), God was distinguished as a God who forgives sin (Exodus 32:32; 34:6–9). By nature, God is forgiving (Nehemiah 9:17; Daniel 9:9), but He is also just. He does not let sin go unpunished (Exodus 34:7).

The Bible clearly illustrates that repentance is necessary for God to forgive sin. Repentance was required in the Old Testament, just as it is in the New Testament. Several scriptural examples show God withholding His forgiveness from those who did not truly repent (Deuteronomy 29:20; Numbers 15:30–36; 1 Samuel 15:27–35; Isaiah 2:9; Hosea 1:6). However, when people repented of their sins and returned to the Lord, God extended forgiveness (Hosea 14:2; Isaiah 33:24; Jeremiah 33:8; Psalm 65:3; Psalm 78:38). The psalmist declared, “Finally, I confessed all my sins to you and stopped trying to hide my guilt. I said to myself, ‘I will confess my rebellion to the Lord.’ And you forgave me! All my guilt is gone” (Psalm 32:5, NLT).

God offers eternal forgiveness of sins to repentant believers based on the once-for-allatoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ on the cross (Hebrews 10:11–12; cf. Leviticus 16:1–34; 17:11). Christ shed His blood to confirm “the covenant between God and his people. It is poured out as a sacrifice to forgive the sins of many” (Matthew 26:28, NLT). The death of Jesus paid the entire sacrificial price to lift up and carry away the past sins of Old Testament believers and the future sins of New Testament believers (Psalm 130:8; Matthew 20:28; Ephesians 1:7).

Genesis 15:6 says, “Abram believed the Lord, and the Lord counted him as righteous because of his faith” (Genesis 15:6, NLT). Abraham was made righteous before God by faith (see also Romans 4:3–8). Believers in ancient times looked forward by faith to Messiah’s coming, just as believers today look backward by faith to His coming. The sins of all people who repent and put their faith in the Messiah, God’s Son and Savior of the world, are no longer held against them because of the atoning death of Jesus Christ.

The sacrificial system of the Old Covenant was never effective in forgiving or taking away sin (see Hebrews 10:1–10). It did show the seriousness of sin and the need for a substitute to carry away sin (Leviticus 16:7–10, 20–22, 26; Isaiah 53:4). Most importantly, it pointed forward to the day when Jesus Christ would pour out His blood on the cross to take away the sins of the world (John 1:29; 2 Corinthians 5:21).

No sacrifice or ritual is required of humans to cover sin. The only truly indispensable sacrifice is the perfect sacrifice of Jesus Christ (Hebrews 10:13–14). He laid down His life once and for all people, from Adam and Eve to the final family at the end of days. “So Christ has now become the High Priest over all the good things that have come. He has entered that greater, more perfect Tabernacle in heaven. . . . With his own blood—not the blood of goats and calves—he entered the Most Holy Place once for all time and secured our redemption forever” (Hebrews 9:11–12, NLT).Got ?

hope this helps !!!
 

ChristisGod

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Why do the PSA(penal substitution theory) advocates equate salvation with that theory only disregarding all the other atonement theories before that one which is the Johnny come lately to the scene ?

That would mean no one was saved until the invention of PSA which happened during the reformation period.

And if I can be so bold ( which I will be ) they are preaching/teaching another gospel, another jesus. Jesus never taught PSA or hinted at it and I started a thread on that very topic. And Paul completely left out wrath in the gospel which He said He received directly from Christ and said by this gospel you are saved below.

1 Corinthians 15:1-8
Now, brothers and sisters, I want to remind you of the gospel I preached to you, which you received and on which you have taken your stand. 2 By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain. 3 For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, 5 and that he appeared to Cephas, and then to the Twelve. 6 After that, he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers and sisters at the same time, most of whom are still living, though some have fallen asleep. 7 Then he appeared to James, then to all the apostles, 8 and last of all he appeared to me also, as to one abnormally born.

So here is the gospel as outlined by Paul which saves that one must believe.

1- Christ died for our sin
2-Christ was buried
3- Christ was raised from the dead on the 3rd day
4-Christ appeared to many individual people and groups over 40 days
5- Christ appeared to Paul years after His Ascension last of all

Galatians 1
Paul, an apost
le—sent not from men nor by a man, but by Jesus Christ and God the Father, who raised him from the dead— 2 and all the brothers and sisters[a] with me,

To the churches in Galatia:

3 Grace and peace to you from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ, 4 who gave himself for our sins to rescue us from the present evil age, according to the will of our God and Father, 5 to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

No Other Gospel​

6 I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you to live in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel— 7 which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God’s curse! 9 As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let them be under God’s curse!

2 Corinthians 11:4
For if someone comes and proclaims a Jesus other than the One we proclaimed, or if you receive a different spirit than the One you received, or a different gospel than the one you accepted, you put up with it way too easily.

Purification for sin is in the blood of Christ in the Atonement

Matthew 26:26-29
While they were eating, Jesus took bread, and when he had given thanks, he broke it and gave it to his disciples, saying, “Take and eat; this is my body.”
27 Then he took a cup, and when he had given thanks, he gave it to them, saying, “Drink from it, all of you. 28 This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins. 29 I tell you, I will not drink from this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father’s kingdom.”

Hebrews 9:22
Because all things are purged by blood in The Written Law, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.

Leviticus 4:20,26,35
And he shall do with the bullock as he did with the bullock for a sin offering, so shall he do with this: and the priest shall make an atonement for them, and it shall be forgiven them

Leviticus 6:7
And the priest shall make an atonement for him before the LORD: and it shall be forgiven him for any thing of all that he hath done in trespassing therein.

Leviticus 17:11
For the life of the flesh is in the blood, and I have given it to you to make atonement for your souls upon the altar; for it is the blood that makes atonement for the soul.

Hebrews 9
Now the first covenant had regulations for worship and also an earthly sanctuary. 2 A tabernacle was set up. In its first room were the lampstand and the table with its consecrated bread; this was called the Holy Place. 3 Behind the second curtain was a room called the Most Holy Place, 4 which had the golden altar of incense and the gold-covered ark of the covenant. This ark contained the gold jar of manna, Aaron’s staff that had budded, and the stone tablets of the covenant. 5 Above the ark were the cherubim of the Glory, overshadowing the atonement cover. But we cannot discuss these things in detail now. 6 When everything had been arranged like this, the priests entered regularly into the outer room to carry on their ministry. 7 But only the high priest entered the inner room, and that only once a year, and never without blood, which he offered for himself and for the sins the people had committed in ignorance. 8 The Holy Spirit was showing by this that the way into the Most Holy Place had not yet been disclosed as long as the first tabernacle was still functioning. 9 This is an illustration for the present time, indicating that the gifts and sacrifices being offered were not able to clear the conscience of the worshiper. 10 They are only a matter of food and drink and various ceremonial washings—external regulations applying until the time of the new order.

The forgiveness of sins is found only in the blood of Christ- His life which He gave as a sacrifice for sin. That is the heart of the Atonement. It is what the New Covenant is found upon His blood, His life which was given for our sins. Forgiveness is only found in His blood that He gave His life on our behalf. That is how our sins are removed and taken away. That is what the Law required for sin was the blood of the animal sacrifice.

There is no "punishment" above anywhere. There is a sacrifice provided which covers and provides forgiveness of sins. The entire book of Hebrews is built upon the OT Law and how it is fulfilled in Christ.

Jesus said He gave His life as a Ransom. Strongs 3038- Lutron λύτρον. the purchasing money for manumitting slaves, a ransom, the price of ransoming; especially the sacrifice by which expiation is effected, an offering of expiation. Thayers: λύτρον, λύτρου, τό (λύω), the Sept. passim for כֹּפֶר, גְּאֻלָּה, פִּדְיון, etc.; the price for redeeming, ransom (paid for slaves, Leviticus 19:20; for captives, Isaiah 45:13; for the ransom of a life, Exodus 21:30; Numbers 35:31f): ἀντί πολλῶν, to liberate many from the misery and penalty of their sins, Matthew 20:28; Mark 10:45. (Pindar, Aeschylus, Xenophon, Plato, others.)

Matthew 20:28- just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give His life as a ransom for many


conclusion: don't let anyone persuade you of any other gospel than the one Paul said saves you in 1 Corinthians 15. And this includes adding anything on top of the plain and simple meaning that Jesus died for our sins. It also included those who would try and tell you Jesus is no longer a man, that He did not raise from the dead bodily. That is another jesus that Paul condemns in Galatians 1. Paul spent the entire 15th chapter of 1 Corinthians explaining the bodily Resurrection of Jesus which is also our hope.
 

Johann

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You are avoiding me by following me around in my threads. The same backward logic you are using to decipher the bible. Turn everything upside down and you might get closer to the truth.
Speak your mind freely, but know this: when it comes to faithfully following the doctrines as written in Scriptures, you are the last person I would look to for guidance.
J.
 

ChristisGod

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Speak your mind freely, but know this: when it comes to faithfully following the doctrines as written in Scriptures, you are the last person I would look to for guidance.
J.
didn't you just say this in post 22 ? is that pride or humility expressed in your above comments ?

" Amen, a passage of great power indeed. Pride, an insidious trait, manifests in myriad forms and guises, necessitating our constant vigilance and guardianship against its subtle encroachments. As we navigate the complexities of life, both personal and communal, the vigilant awareness of pride's potential to distort, divide, and deceive remains crucial. Thus, we are called to cultivate humility, discernment, and a steadfast commitment to truth and integrity, ensuring that pride finds no fertile ground to sow discord or hinder our pursuit of harmony, authenticity, and righteousness.

Shalom to you and family my brother.
Johann. "
 

Episkopos

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Speak your mind freely, but know this: when it comes to faithfully following the doctrines as written in Scriptures, you are the last person I would look to for guidance.
J.
To each his own. But your doctrinal understanding comes from the "enlightenment" period of history...the renaissance...where humanistic ideals were promoted as a basis for modern civilization. That same spirit infiltrated into the churches through men like Luther...who cleverly adapted the gospel into serving the flesh...and denying the power of God over sin by grace through faith.

The fact that this version of the gospel is so convincing is no accident. God allows it...He sends strong delusion, so that only those who love the truth and know the truth, are able to stay away from its corrupting influence.
 

ChristisGod

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To each his own. But your doctrinal understanding comes from the "enlightenment" period of history...the renaissance...where humanistic ideals were promoted as a basis for modern civilization. That same spirit infiltrated into the churches through men like Luther...who cleverly adapted the gospel into serving the flesh...and denying the power of God over sin by grace through faith.

The fact that this version of the gospel is so convincing is no accident. God allows it...He sends strong delusion, so that only those who love the truth and know the truth, are able to stay away from its corrupting influence.
and don't forget about calvin where many today follow his aberrant doctrines. they were unloving dictators who persecuted those who disagreed with them, hateful men.
 

Episkopos

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and don't forget about calvin where many today follow his aberrant doctrines.
Calvin (religious terrorist that he was) was an idealist who hated people for not being perfect. He signed actual believers over to be burned. At least he didn't write a book that inspired Hitler to do a "Kristelnacht" on the Jews. How amazing is it that no Protestant can see through the charade. We marvel at Catholics and their statues....how can they not see the folly of it. But the Protestant "reformation" is swallowing the whole camel, so to speak.
 

Johann

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To each his own. But your doctrinal understanding comes from the "enlightenment" period of history...the renaissance...where humanistic ideals were promoted as a basis for modern civilization. That same spirit infiltrated into the churches through men like Luther...who cleverly adapted the gospel into serving the flesh...and denying the power of God over sin by grace through faith.

The fact that this version of the gospel is so convincing is no accident. God allows it...He sends strong delusion, so that only those who love the truth and know the truth, are able to stay away from its corrupting influence.
This comes from someone whose own doctrines are incorrect and who now critiquing the Reformers!

The Reformation was a period of theological renewal and reform within Christianity, primarily in response to perceived deviations from biblical teachings and practices in the Roman Catholic Church.
The Reformers, such as Martin Luther, John Calvin, and others, sought to return to the foundational truths of Scripture and emphasized doctrines such as salvation by grace through faith (Ephesians 2:8-9), the authority of Scripture (2 Timothy 3:16-17), and the priesthood of all believers (1 Peter 2:9).
Biblical Foundation of Salvation by Grace through Faith:

Ephesians 2:8-9 (ESV): "For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast."
The Reformers reaffirmed that salvation is entirely a gift of God's grace, received through faith in Jesus Christ alone, apart from human works or merit. This biblical truth counters any notion of the gospel being adapted to serve humanistic ideals or the flesh.
Scriptural Critique of Legalism and Human Effort:

Galatians 2:16 (ESV): "Yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will be justified."
The Reformers emphasized the sufficiency of Christ's sacrifice on the cross and rejected teachings that salvation could be earned through human effort or legalistic adherence to rituals (Galatians 5:1-4).
God's Sovereign Work and Human Responsibility:

2 Thessalonians 2:10-12 (ESV): "They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false, in order that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness."
While God allows delusion as a consequence of rejecting truth, the Reformers upheld the importance of teaching and proclaiming the gospel truthfully and faithfully, trusting in God's sovereignty over human hearts (Romans 9:16).
Conclusion on Truth and Integrity of the Gospel:

John 8:31-32 (ESV): "So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, 'If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples, and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.'"
Ultimately, the Reformers sought to uphold biblical truth and the integrity of the gospel against distortions and additions that had crept into the Church over centuries. Their focus was on returning to the simplicity and purity of the gospel message as found in Scripture.
 

ChristisGod

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The heart of the Gospel is the Resurrection- its the Resurrection that gives life. Jesus said I Am the Resurrection and the Life !

1 Corinthians 15:17- And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins.

The passage declares if Christ is not risen, raised from the dead, resurrected then our faith is in vain and we are still dead in our sins. We are saved by His life/Resurrection not His death. His death atoned for sin but does not give life.

Romans 4:24-25 but also for us, to whom God will credit righteousness—for us who believe in him who raised Jesus our Lord from the dead. 25 He was delivered over to death for our sins and was raised to life for our justification.

Paul declares in Romans 5:10 the following: For if, while we were God’s enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life! Cf Acts 17:31.

John 11:25-26 Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. The one who believes in me will live, even though they die; 26 and whoever lives by believing in me will never die. Do you believe this?”

John 3:14- And just as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, 15 so that everyone who believes will have eternal life in Him

hope this helps !!!
 

ChristisGod

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This comes from someone whose own doctrines are incorrect and who now critiquing the Reformers!

The Reformation was a period of theological renewal and reform within Christianity, primarily in response to perceived deviations from biblical teachings and practices in the Roman Catholic Church.
The Reformers, such as Martin Luther, John Calvin, and others, sought to return to the foundational truths of Scripture and emphasized doctrines such as salvation by grace through faith (Ephesians 2:8-9), the authority of Scripture (2 Timothy 3:16-17), and the priesthood of all believers (1 Peter 2:9).
Biblical Foundation of Salvation by Grace through Faith:

Ephesians 2:8-9 (ESV): "For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast."
The Reformers reaffirmed that salvation is entirely a gift of God's grace, received through faith in Jesus Christ alone, apart from human works or merit. This biblical truth counters any notion of the gospel being adapted to serve humanistic ideals or the flesh.
Scriptural Critique of Legalism and Human Effort:

Galatians 2:16 (ESV): "Yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will be justified."
The Reformers emphasized the sufficiency of Christ's sacrifice on the cross and rejected teachings that salvation could be earned through human effort or legalistic adherence to rituals (Galatians 5:1-4).
God's Sovereign Work and Human Responsibility:

2 Thessalonians 2:10-12 (ESV): "They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false, in order that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness."
While God allows delusion as a consequence of rejecting truth, the Reformers upheld the importance of teaching and proclaiming the gospel truthfully and faithfully, trusting in God's sovereignty over human hearts (Romans 9:16).
Conclusion on Truth and Integrity of the Gospel:

John 8:31-32 (ESV): "So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, 'If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples, and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.'"
Ultimately, the Reformers sought to uphold biblical truth and the integrity of the gospel against distortions and additions that had crept into the Church over centuries. Their focus was on returning to the simplicity and purity of the gospel message as found in Scripture.
the reformation needs reforming- the apple (reformers) doesn't fall far from the tree ( RCC )

they missed the boat in so many places trying to come out of the mother church but carried many of its errors with them while created new aberrant doctrines on top of the old ones- both RCC and reformers have augustine the heretic as their father. calvin/luther quoted him more than anyone else in church history. augustine was a gnostic,
 
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ChristisGod

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This comes from someone whose own doctrines are incorrect and who now critiquing the Reformers!

The Reformation was a period of theological renewal and reform within Christianity, primarily in response to perceived deviations from biblical teachings and practices in the Roman Catholic Church.
The Reformers, such as Martin Luther, John Calvin, and others, sought to return to the foundational truths of Scripture and emphasized doctrines such as salvation by grace through faith (Ephesians 2:8-9), the authority of Scripture (2 Timothy 3:16-17), and the priesthood of all believers (1 Peter 2:9).
Biblical Foundation of Salvation by Grace through Faith:

Ephesians 2:8-9 (ESV): "For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast."
The Reformers reaffirmed that salvation is entirely a gift of God's grace, received through faith in Jesus Christ alone, apart from human works or merit. This biblical truth counters any notion of the gospel being adapted to serve humanistic ideals or the flesh.
Scriptural Critique of Legalism and Human Effort:

Galatians 2:16 (ESV): "Yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will be justified."
The Reformers emphasized the sufficiency of Christ's sacrifice on the cross and rejected teachings that salvation could be earned through human effort or legalistic adherence to rituals (Galatians 5:1-4).
God's Sovereign Work and Human Responsibility:

2 Thessalonians 2:10-12 (ESV): "They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false, in order that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness."
While God allows delusion as a consequence of rejecting truth, the Reformers upheld the importance of teaching and proclaiming the gospel truthfully and faithfully, trusting in God's sovereignty over human hearts (Romans 9:16).
Conclusion on Truth and Integrity of the Gospel:

John 8:31-32 (ESV): "So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, 'If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples, and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.'"
Ultimately, the Reformers sought to uphold biblical truth and the integrity of the gospel against distortions and additions that had crept into the Church over centuries. Their focus was on returning to the simplicity and purity of the gospel message as found in Scripture.
Which the Reformation bought into with their doctrines. Both Luther and Calvin were heavily influenced by Augustine

The errors of the Gnostics were continually rejected by the Early Church, but the Gnostics continued to try to penetrate the Church with their views. The Gnostics even wrote their own gospels, known as the Gnostic Gospels today, where they stole credible names like Mary and Thomas to try to give validity to their teachings.

While many of the attempts of the Gnostics to infiltrate the Church failed, and many of their views are widely rejected today, it seems that their particular view of human nature, free will, and the nature of sin has found wide acceptance in the Church today.

On Free will

Regarding the term “free will,” John Calvin admitted “As to the Fathers, (if their authority weighs with us,) they have the term constantly in their mouths…”[31] He said, “The Greek fathers above others” have taught “the power of the human will”[32] and “they have not been ashamed to make use of a much more arrogant expression calling man ‘free agent or self-manager,’ just as if man had a power to govern himself…”[33] He also said, “The Latin fathers have always retained the word ‘free will’ as if man stood yet upright.”[34] It is a fact that cannot be denied even by those who most ardently oppose the doctrine of free will, that the doctrine of free will and not that of inability was held by all of the Early Church.

Walter Arthur Copinger said, “All the Fathers are unanimous on the freedom of the human will…”[35] Lyman Beecher said, “the free will and natural ability of man were held by the whole church…”[36] And Dr Wiggers said, “All the fathers…agreed with the Pelagians, in attributing freedom of will to man in his present state.”[37] This is a very important point because whenever a person today holds to the belief that all men have the natural ability to obey God or not to obey Him, or that man’s nature still retains the faculty of free will and can choose between these two alternatives and possibilities, he is almost immediately accused of being a heretical “Pelagian” by the Calvinists. This accusation is being unfair to the position of free will since all of the Early Church Fathers held to free will long before Pelagius even existed.

On Original sin

Harry Conn said, “Augustine, after studying the philosophy of Manes, the Persian philosopher, brought into the church from Manichaeism the doctrine of original sin.”[51]

The corruption of our nature, or the loss of our free will, Augustine credited to the original sin of Adam. Augustine said that the “free choice of the will was present in that man who was the first to be formed… But after he sinned by that free will, we who have descended from his progeny have been plunged into necessity.”[52] “By Adam’s transgression, the freedom of’ the human will has been completely lost.”[53] “By the greatness of the first sin, we have lost the freewill to love God.” And finally he said, “by subverting the rectitude in which he was created, he is followed with the punishment of not being able to do right” and “the freedom to abstain from sin has been lost as a punishment of sin.”[54]

Consider the following facts:

  • All of the Early Christians, before Augustine, believed in man’s free will and denied man’s natural inability.
  • The Gnostics in the days of the Early Church believed in man’s natural inability and denied man’s free will.
  • Augustine was a Gnostic for many years, in the Manichaeism sect, and converted to the Church out of Gnosticism.
  • After joining the Church and being appointed a Bishop, Augustine began to deny the free will of man and to affirm the natural inability of man
  • The Church, under Augustine’s influence, began to believe in the natural inability of man, which it never before held to, but which it formerly would refute.

The reason that John Calvin rejected all ancient theologians and dismissed all of their writings on this matter, except for Augustine, is because all ancient theologians affirmed the freedom of the will in their writings, except for Augustine. Gregory Boyd said, “This in part explains why Calvin cannot cite ante-Nicene fathers against his libertarian opponents…. Hence, when Calvin debates Pighuis on the freedom of the will, he cites Augustine abundantly, but no early church fathers are cited.”[80] That is why George Pretyman said, “…the peculiar tenets of Calvinism are in direct opposition to the Doctrines maintained in the primitive Church of Christ…” This we have clearly seen, but he also said, “…there is a great similarity between the Calvinistic system and the earliest [Gnostic] heresies…”[81]
 
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