How could God resurrect someone who doesn't exist? lol You still haven't answered my simple questions.
The answer of hell and its origins
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BARNEY BRIGHT
Well-Known Member
WOW, you really have no faith in God do you? So do you believe the angels were never brought into existence, because according to you if persons didn't exist before God brought them into existence it would have been impossible for God to bring them into existence from nothing? And if you do believe God did bring the angels into existence meaning you believe the angels didn't exist until God brought them into existence that proves God can bring persons into existence that didn't exist before he brought them into existence. So even though the angels didn't exist before God brought them into existence, why would it be so hard to.understand and believe that God can bring someone back into existence as a living person, when that person existed before as a living person?
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Patrick1966
Well-Known Member
It's good to understand the word of God. It's good to share his word with others. It's even better to remain humble. Thank God for being given the ability to understand but also remain humble.
Ephesians 2:8–9 “By grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.”
Matthew 18:4 Whoever humbles himself like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.
So, Kingdom Hall told you that Jesus ceased to exist and God recreated Jesus? There was no Savior for 3 days?
BARNEY BRIGHT
Well-Known Member
If you want to deny that the only begotten Son of God didn't die and that he wasn't dead for three days, that's your choice. But as long as anyone believes that way they will remain in their sins. Anyone who says it wasn't the only begotten Son of God that the True God sent to the World of mankind and anyone who says that the only begotten Son of God didn't die and that he wasn't dead for three days and anyone who denies that God didn't resurrect the only begotten Son of God three days after his death will remain in their sins
They are idols.
Yes, to DC.
Isaiah 14:13
Easy-to-Read Version
13 You always told yourself,
“I will go to the skies above.
I will put my throne above God’s stars.
I will sit on Zaphon,[a] the holy mountain where the gods meet.
Footnotes
Isaiah 14:13 Zaphon This Hebrew word literally means “north” or “hidden.”
ZAPHON zā’ fŏn (צָפֹ֗ון; LXX Σαφάν and Σαφών, meaning north). A town lying to the E of Jordan in the territory of Gad (Josh 13:27). It is prob. referred to in Judges 12:1 as the place where the Ephraimites gathered (tr. צָפֹ֑ונָה “to Zaphon” not “northward”) to meet with Jephthah who had just defeated the Ammonites. A battle ensued (Judg 12:4) and the Ephraimites were defeated. Zaphon is known in Egyp. records of the nineteenth dynasty as dapuna, and in one of the Armana letters (q.v.) as Sapuna. A princess called “the lady of the lions” sought help from the Pharaoh to ward off invaders. Some have conjectured that the name Zaphon may indicate that it was once a shrine of Baalzephon (q.v.).
Various identifications have been proposed among which are Tell es Sa’idiyeh (see Zeredah) and Tell el Qos on the N side of the Wadi Rajeb. Both sites command a fine view of the Jordan valley and both are some distance from the Jordan fords (Judg 12:5).
Bibliography F. M. Abel, Géographie de la Palestine (1938), 448; N. Glueck, “Explorations in Eastern Palestine, IV,” AASOR XXVXXVIII (1951), pt. 1, 297-300, 334-355.
The Bible says that “God raised [Jesus] from the dead” (Acts 2:24), however, it seems that Scriptures say the Holy Spirit raised Him from the dead (Rom 8:11; 1 Pet 3:18), but then Jesus says, “Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up” (John 2:19) and we know that He has the power to raise it up again (John 10:18), so who raised Jesus from the dead? Was it God the Father, God the Holy Spirit, or Jesus, the Son of God? Yes…it was….all three in fact. All three Persons are God, and so God truly did raise Jesus from the dead. Jesus is the resurrection and the life (John 11:25), so Jesus cannot die because He is God. His human body could die, but Jesus, never! Since Jesus never sinned, and sin is the wages of death (Rom 6:23), the grave could not possibly hold Him. It says that “God raised him up, loosing the pangs of death, because it was not possible for him to be held by it” (Acts 2:24). Who raised Jesus from the grave? It was God…and by that, we mean all Three Persons of the Trinity. That’s because God is the author of life, has authority over life, and has the power of life within Himself, no matter which of the Three Persons you are referring to.
Conclusion
Since we know that God raised Jesus from the dead, God desires to quicken you to eternal life too, and His Spirit can do just that. When God brings a person to repentance and faith in Christ, they are born again, or born from above by God’s Spirit (John 3:3-7). They become a brand new creation in Jesus Christ (2 Cor 5:17). They are now seen as having Jesus’ very own righteousness (2 Cor 5:21). Unless the Lord returns in our lifetime, we too shall be raised someday, and it will be “in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed. For this perishable body must put on the imperishable, and this mortal body must put on immortality” (1 Cor 15:52-52). Aren’t you ready for that!?Who Resurrected Jesus? Was It The Father, The Holy Spirit, Or Jesus Himself?
Who resurrected Jesus Christ? Did He resurrect Himself? Or did the Father or the Holy Spirit do it? Your Resurrection If you have never been brought to repentance and faith in Jesus Christ, then you will not be resurrected to
www.whatchristianswanttoknow.com
Here is some related reading for you: Historical Evidence of Jesus Christ’s Resurrection
John 20
Easy-to-Read Version
News That Jesus Has Risen From Death
20 Early on Sunday morning, while it was still dark, Mary Magdalene went to the tomb. She saw that the large stone was moved away from the entrance. 2 So she ran to Simon Peter and the other follower (the one Jesus loved very much). She said, “They have taken the Lord out of the tomb, and we don’t know where they put him.”3 So Peter and the other follower started going to the tomb. 4 They were both running, but the other follower ran faster than Peter and reached the tomb first. 5 He bent down and looked in. He saw the pieces of linen cloth lying there, but he did not go in.
6 Then Simon Peter finally reached the tomb and went in. He saw the pieces of linen lying there. 7 He also saw the cloth that had been around Jesus’ head. It was folded up and laid in a different place from the pieces of linen. 8 Then the other follower went in—the one who had reached the tomb first. He saw what had happened and believed. 9 (These followers did not yet understand from the Scriptures that Jesus must rise from death.)
Jesus Appears to Mary Magdalene
10 Then the followers went back home. 11 But Mary stood outside the tomb, crying. While she was crying, she bent down and looked inside the tomb. 12 She saw two angels dressed in white sitting where Jesus’ body had been. One was sitting where the head had been; the other was sitting where the feet had been.13 The angels asked Mary, “Woman, why are you crying?”
Mary answered, “They took away the body of my Lord, and I don’t know where they put him.” 14 When Mary said this, she turned around and saw Jesus standing there. But she did not know that it was Jesus.
15 He asked her, “Woman, why are you crying? Who are you looking for?”
She thought he was the man in charge of the garden. So she said to him, “Did you take him away, sir? Tell me where you put him. I will go and get him.”
16 Jesus said to her, “Mary.”
She turned toward him and said in Aramaic, “Rabboni,” which means “Teacher.”
17 Jesus said to her, “You don’t need to hold on to me! I have not yet gone back up to the Father. But go to my followers[a] and tell them this: ‘I am going back to my Father and your Father. I am going back to my God and your God.’”
18 Mary Magdalene went to the followers and told them, “I saw the Lord!” And she told them what he had said to her.
NOTE: One can not hold onto a body of spirit, only a physical one.
Jesus Appears to His Followers
19 The day was Sunday, and that same evening the followers were together. They had the doors locked because they were afraid of the Jewish leaders. Suddenly, Jesus was standing there among them. He said, “Peace be with you!” 20 As soon as he said this, he showed them his hands and his side. When the followers saw the Lord, they were very happy.21 Then Jesus said again, “Peace be with you. It was the Father who sent me, and I am now sending you in the same way.” 22 Then he breathed on them and said, “Receive the Holy Spirit. 23 If you forgive the sins of anyone, their sins are forgiven. If there is anyone whose sins you don’t forgive, their sins are not forgiven.”
NOTE: sounds Catholic to me.
Jesus Appears to Thomas
24 Thomas (called Didymus) was one of the twelve, but he was not with the other followers when Jesus came. 25 They told him, “We saw the Lord.” Thomas said, “That’s hard to believe. I will have to see the nail holes in his hands, put my finger where the nails were, and put my hand into his side. Only then will I believe it.”26 A week later the followers were in the house again, and Thomas was with them. The doors were locked, but Jesus came and stood among them. He said, “Peace be with you!” 27 Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here. Look at my hands. Put your hand here in my side. Stop doubting and believe.”
28 Thomas said to Jesus, “My Lord and my God!”
29 Jesus said to him, “You believe because you see me. Great blessings belong to the people who believe without seeing me!”
Why John Wrote This Book
30 Jesus did many other miraculous signs that his followers saw, which are not written in this book. 31 But these are written so that you can believe that Jesus is the Messiah, the Son of God. Then, by believing, you can have life through his name.Footnotes
- John 20:17 followers Literally, “brothers.”
1Peter 3:18 is not his ressurrection, it is after his death and before his ressurrection.
So God created Jesus twice? How ridiculous! Jesus has ALWAYS existed. Your own NWT says you're wrong.
NWT John 20 Thomas said to Jesus "My Lord and my God"!
I'll take the word of Thomas over Kingdom Hall any day!
BARNEY BRIGHT
Well-Known Member
1 Peter 3:18 says, "For Christ died once for all time for sins, a righteous person for unrighteous ones, in order to lead you to God. He was put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit. And in this state he went and preached to the spirits in prison"
The New English Bible of 1961 translates 1 Peter 3:18: “For Christ also died for our sins once for all. He, the just, suffered for the unjust, to bring us to God. In the body he was put to death; in the spirit he was brought to life. And in the spirit he went and made his proclamation to the imprisoned spirits.” Other modern translations of 1 Peter 3: 18, 19 read similarly.
Regarding 1 Peter 3:18 is a Greek text, and the words “flesh” and “spirit” are put in contrast to each other, and both are in the dative case; so, if a translator uses the rendering “by the spirit” he should also consistently say “by the flesh,” or if he uses “in the flesh” he should also say “in the spirit.”) So saying at 1 Peter 3:18 that Jesus was put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit is an accurate translation and shows us that Jesus was resurrected with a spirit body and in this spirit body he went and preached to the spirits in prison.
So, the apostle Peter says regarding Jesus’ resurrection, “in the spirit he was brought to life.” This explains why on the resurrection morning when God’s angel rolled the stone from the door of the tomb the soldier guards did not see Jesus rise from the dead and come out, although they did see the materialized angel. (Matthew 28:1-4) This explains why, when the resurrected Jesus met two disciples walking that day to Emmaus and went along with them and started to take supper with them, they did not know him until he began to serve the bread; and then he disappeared.(Luke 24:13-35)
This explains why, when the apostles and other disciples were met together in Jerusalem behind closed doors for fear of the fanatical Jews, Jesus must have come right through the walls. For he amazingly stood right in among them, and, after eating and talking with them, he vanished from them, but not through any unbolted door. (Luke 24:36-44; John 20:19-24) Of course, for Jesus, who had been brought to life in the spirit, to make himself visible to his disciples, he had to materialize on each occasion a body of flesh and bones. Jesus himself then said: “A spirit does not have flesh and bones just as you behold that I have.” Since the flesh-and-bones disciples could not see what was not flesh and bones, they could not see a spirit and they could not see the resurrected Jesus, who was “in the spirit.”
Humans with flesh-and-blood bodies cannot live in heaven. Of the resurrection to heavenly life, the Bible says: “It is sown a physical body, it is raised up a spiritual body. . . . flesh and blood cannot inherit God's kingdom" (1 Corinthians 15:44-50) Only spirit persons with spiritual bodies can live in heaven.
BARNEY BRIGHT
Well-Known Member
BARNEY BRIGHT
Well-Known Member
You can deny that Jesus sacrificed his human body, but the scriptures show that Jesus did sacrifice his human body, he didn't take back the sacrifice. Jesus when resurrected was given immortality and inherited incorruption which no human being has. Jesus certainly didn't have immortality nor was he incorruptible before he sacrificed his human life.
I didn't deny that. Do you know where false accusers will end up?
Getting a JW to answer simple questions is extremely difficult! Do you have to get permission from Kingdom Hall to answer questions?
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BARNEY BRIGHT
Well-Known Member
You are the ones who are saying Jesus was resurrected with his flesh body not me. Jesus was resurrected with a spirit body, you deny that.
Also Jack the fact that you think I have to get permission from anyone shows how argumentive you are. I also don't answer answer questions when I can see the only reason they're asked is to argue with someone, and guess what Jack, I don't care what you think, feel, or have to say about that.
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Actually Jesus said it.
Luke 24 a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see I have."
Didn't Kingdom Hall tell you what happens to all liars? They probably don't even know.
Then why don't you JW's answer simple questions?
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BARNEY BRIGHT
Well-Known Member
No, Jesus didn't say it, human beings are, those who don't believe what the scriptures say. 1 Peter 3:18: 1 Corinthians 15:44, 45 prove Jesus was resurrected with a spirit body. When Jesus walked the earth, he had a fleshly body. But when he was resurrected, he “became a life-giving spirit” and returned to heaven. Likewise, anointed Christians would be resurrected to spirit life. Paul explained: “Just as we have borne the image of the one made of dust, we will bear also the image of the heavenly one.” Human beings are not immortal incorruptible beings, but when those who are Jesus disciples are resurrected, those who will be kings, judges, and priests with Jesus in that Heavenly Messianic Kingdom will be resurrected immortal incorruptible beings. They, like Jesus, won't be human beings anymore.
For 40 days after his resurrection Jesus appeared to his disciples on different occasions in various fleshly bodies, just as angels had appeared to men of ancient times. Like those angels, he had the power to construct and to disintegrate those fleshly bodies at will, for the purpose of proving visibly that he had been resurrected. (Matthew 28:8-10, 16-20; Luke 24:13-32, 36-43; John 20:14-29; Genesis 18:1, 2; 19:1; Joshua 5:13-15; Judges 6:11, 12; 13:3, 13)
Acts 10:40, 41 say, "God raised this One [Jesus Christ] up on the third day and granted him to become manifest, not to all the people, but to witnesses appointed beforehand by God.” tell me Jack, why did not others see him too? It's because he was a spirit creature and when, as angels had done in the past, he materialized fleshly bodies to make himself visible, he did so only in the presence of his disciples. Jesus said to his apostles just before he sacrificed his life that the world will see him no more. (John 14:19) That's exactly how it was too. No unbeliever saw Jesus after his resurrection. Jesus only appeared to his apostles and disciples.
You don't even know Who I'm quoting?
Luke 24 "a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see I have."
Again you evade the Scripture. Luke 24 a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see I have."
See how I quote Scripture? You should try it. It's easy.
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