The answer of hell and its origins

[RLT63]

Please show me any scripture that says that the human “soul” is immortal. The "soul" is the living, breathing creature......man or animal...
Solomon wrote....
Ezekiel 18:4...
“Look! All the souls—to me they belong. As the soul of the father so also the soul of the son—to me they belong. The soul who sins is the one who will die.” Souls are not immortal.

Solomon wrote....
"for there is an outcome for humans and an outcome for animals; they all have the same outcome. As the one dies, so the other dies; and they all have but one spirit. So man has no superiority over animals, for everything is futile. 20 All are going to the same place. They all come from the dust, and they all are returning to the dust." (Eccl 3:19-20)

Ecclesiastes 9:5, 10...
“For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing at all, nor do they have any more reward,* because all memory of them is forgotten. . . .Whatever your hand finds to do, do with all your might, for there is no work nor planning nor knowledge nor wisdom in the Grave, (Sheol) where you are going.”

I know that no matter what I show you, you will believe as you wish and that is your prerogative.....no point in continuing to rehash....its all been said. We all have to make our own decisions....Jesus will tell us whether we have the truth or have swallowed the lies.

Likewise you will believe as you wish Revelation 6:9, John sees “under the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God and the testimony they had maintained.” So, the souls of Christian martyrs are in heaven. As 2 Corinthians 5:8 teaches, to be “absent from the body” is to be “present with the Lord” (NKJV).

 

[Aunty Jane]

Nothing like the foolish copycat thesis raising its ugly heads.

Do you know who is the biggest "copycat" of all....? Why do you think his deceptions work so well....? He presents himself as "an angel of light". (2 Cor 11:14-15)

All you have to do is follow the trail back to Babylon and see where all of Christendom's doctrines came from. The RCC got all its doctrines from that city, built by the post flood rebels......and her equally corrupted 'daughters' took many of her false teachings along with them, when they left 'home'.

Why do you think the harlot is called "Babylon the great" or "the greater Babylon"? Why is she depicted as a harlot?
You think original Babylon doesn't figure in that statement? Why are the political elements going to turn on her? She has been in bed prostituting herself with them for centuries.
Why do the merchants of the earth lament her passing? They have made good money off her.
"Babylon the great" is going down and nothing will stop it....like the Titanic, if we have not jumped ship before she sinks, we will go down with her....

We will have to wait and see......Jesus will tell us all in due time if what we have accepted as truth, really is.....

 

[Aunty Jane]

Likewise you will believe as you wish Revelation 6:9, John sees “under the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God and the testimony they had maintained.” So, the souls of Christian martyrs are in heaven. As 2 Corinthians 5:8 teaches, to be “absent from the body” is to be “present with the Lord” (NKJV).

"Souls" can only exist on earth.....there are no "souls" in heaven. Souls breathe......animals are "souls" as you were shown. Souls die.
Adam became a "soul" when God started him breathing. He returned to the dust as God said....no immortal soul was ever mentioned.

"Absent from the body" and "being present with the Lord" is members of the elect giving up their flesh and blood existence here on earth, to be transformed into spirit beings....the only kind of life that can exist in the invisible realm.....the whole purpose of which is to be united with Christ in heaven to rule over redeemed mankind here on earth. That is why they are going to heaven...to be "kings and priests" for us. (Rev 20:6)

Nothing will convince a person who does not want to see what the scriptures actually say.....and in keeping with the Bible's total narrative, its not what they have been led to believe....but its our choice to believe as we want to.

 

[RLT63]

Do you know who is the biggest "copycat" of all....? Why do you think his deceptions work so well....? He presents himself as "an angel of light". (2 Cor 11:14-15)

All you have to do is follow the trail back to Babylon and see where all of Christendom's doctrines came from. The RCC got all its doctrines from that city, built by the post flood rebels......and her equally corrupted 'daughters' took many of her false teachings along with them, when they left 'home'.

Why do you think the harlot is called "Babylon the great" or "the greater Babylon"? Why is she depicted as a harlot?
You think original Babylon doesn't figure in that statement? Why are the political elements going to turn on here? She has been in bed prostituting herself with them for centuries.
Why do the merchants of the earth lament her passing? They have made good money off her.
"Babylon the great" is going down and nothing will stop it....like the Titanic, if we have not jumped ship before she sinks, we will go down with her....

We will have to wait and see......Jesus will tell us all in due time if what we have accepted as truth, really is.....

@Aunty Jane said “The RCC got all its doctrines from that city, built by the post flood rebels......and her equally corrupted 'daughters' took many of her false teachings along with them, when they left 'home'.” I can find enough to disagree with the Catholic Church about without Hislop’s disproven claims

 

[RLT63]

"Souls" can only exist on earth.....there are no "souls" in heaven. Souls breathe......animals are "souls" as you were shown. Souls die.
Adam became a "soul" when God started him breathing. He returned to the dust as God said....no immortal soul was ever mentioned.

"Absent from the body" and "being present with the Lord" is members of the elect giving up their flesh and blood existence here on earth, to be transformed into spirit beings....the only kind of life that can exist in the invisible realm.....the whole purpose of which is to be united with Christ in heaven to rule over redeemed mankind here on earth. That is why they are going to heaven...to be "kings and priests" for us. (Rev 20:6)

Nothing will convince a person who does not want to see what the scriptures actually say.....and in keeping with the Bible's total narrative, its not what they have been led to believe....but its our choice to believe as we want to.

Rev 6:9 - When He opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held.

Rev 6:10 - And they cried with a loud voice, saying, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?”

Rev 6:11 - Then a white robe was given to each of them; and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer, until both the number of their fellow servants and their brethren, who would be killed as they were, was completed.

 

[RLT63]

"Souls" can only exist on earth.....there are no "souls" in heaven. Souls breathe......animals are "souls" as you were shown. Souls die.
Adam became a "soul" when God started him breathing. He returned to the dust as God said....no immortal soul was ever mentioned.

"Absent from the body" and "being present with the Lord" is members of the elect giving up their flesh and blood existence here on earth, to be transformed into spirit beings....the only kind of life that can exist in the invisible realm.....the whole purpose of which is to be united with Christ in heaven to rule over redeemed mankind here on earth. That is why they are going to heaven...to be "kings and priests" for us. (Rev 20:6)

Nothing will convince a person who does not want to see what the scriptures actually say.....and in keeping with the Bible's total narrative, its not what they have been led to believe....but its our choice to believe as we want to.

@Aunty Jane said “Nothing will convince a person who does not want to see what the scriptures actually say.” It seems we can’t read the Bible for ourselves we have to turn to you and your brethren to learn what it “actually says “ . It’s much like the Newspeak in Orwell’s 1984

 

[Aunty Jane]

@Aunty Jane said “Nothing will convince a person who does not want to see what the scriptures actually say.” It seems we can’t read the Bible for ourselves we have to turn to you and your brethren to learn what it “actually says “ . It’s much like the Newspeak in Orwell’s 1984

Since this is what happened with the Jews and Jesus said it was going to happen again.....reading the scriptures and misinterpreting them will lead us nowhere. The truth isn't just what we believe.....it has to be what God has taught us through his son.
Understanding scripture in the context of what the whole of scripture teaches, makes Christendom's version of things into complete nonsense.

But you go your way...and I'll go mine, and lets see what Jesus has to say about things....after all, only his opinion counts.

 

[RLT63]

Since this is what happened with the Jews and Jesus said it was going to happen again.....reading the scriptures and misinterpreting them will lead us nowhere. The truth isn't just what we believe.....it has to be what God has taught us through his son.
Understanding scripture in the context of what the whole of scripture teaches, makes Christendom's version of things into complete nonsense.

But you go your way...and I'll go mine, and lets see what Jesus has to say about things....after all, only his opinion counts.

What are the Jehovah’s Witnesses’ beliefs about Jesus’ return in 1914? | GotQuestions.org

What are the Jehovah’s Witnesses’ beliefs about Jesus’ return in 1914? Do Jehovah’s Witnesses really believe Jesus came back in 1914?

www.gotquestions.org

 

[bbyrd009]

see, you maybe arent realizing that that is Paul, and Paul is yanking your chain

i guess that isnt the right expression; Paul is feeding your misconceptions, like the famous "to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord" that cannot be Quoted. We even have a warning passage about believers reading Paul right

 

[RLT63]

What are the Jehovah’s Witnesses’ beliefs about Jesus’ return in 1914? | GotQuestions.org

What are the Jehovah’s Witnesses’ beliefs about Jesus’ return in 1914? Do Jehovah’s Witnesses really believe Jesus came back in 1914?

www.gotquestions.org

What do Jehovah’s Witnesses believe about the end times and eternal state? | GotQuestions.org

What do Jehovah’s Witnesses believe about the end times? What do Jehovah’s Witnesses believe about the eternal state?

www.gotquestions.org

 

[RLT63]

What do Jehovah’s Witnesses believe about the end times and eternal state? | GotQuestions.org

What do Jehovah’s Witnesses believe about the end times? What do Jehovah’s Witnesses believe about the eternal state?

www.gotquestions.org

What do the Jehovah’s Witnesses believe about the 144,000 and a heavenly/earthly hope? | GotQuestions.org

What do the Jehovah’s Witnesses believe about the 144,000? What do the Jehovah’s Witnesses believe about a heavenly/earthly hope?

www.gotquestions.org

 

[The Learner]

Please show me any scripture that says that the human “soul” is immortal. The "soul" is the living, breathing creature......man or animal...

Ezekiel 18:4...
“Look! All the souls—to me they belong. As the soul of the father so also the soul of the son—to me they belong. The soul who sins is the one who will die.” Souls are not immortal.

Solomon wrote....
"for there is an outcome for humans and an outcome for animals; they all have the same outcome. As the one dies, so the other dies; and they all have but one spirit. So man has no superiority over animals, for everything is futile. 20 All are going to the same place. They all come from the dust, and they all are returning to the dust." (Eccl 3:19-20)

Ecclesiastes 9:5, 10...
“For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing at all, nor do they have any more reward,* because all memory of them is forgotten. . . .Whatever your hand finds to do, do with all your might, for there is no work nor planning nor knowledge nor wisdom in the Grave, (Sheol) where you are going.”

I know that no matter what I show you, you will believe as you wish and that is your prerogative.....no point in continuing to rehash....its all been said. We all have to make our own decisions....Jesus will tell us whether we have the truth or have swallowed the lies.

In general death is defined as seperation James 2:26 Death of spirit-soul is simply seperation from God. We know that the spirit-soul lives in the grave Isaiah 14:1-11. At Resurrection of everyone, all gets a body that is not destroyed by fire. I cor 15, outline the chapter.

 

[The Learner]

The imortality of God is without begining and without end of existence.
"I am that I am" "alpha and omega" "first and last"

Isaiah 41:4
Who hath wrought and done it, calling the generations from the beginning? I the Lord, the first, and with the last; I am he.

Isaiah 44:6
Thus saith the Lord the King of Israel, and his redeemer the Lord of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; andbeside me there is no God.

Isaiah 48:12
Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I am he; I am the first, I also am the last.

 

[The Learner]

Likewise you will believe as you wish Revelation 6:9, John sees “under the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God and the testimony they had maintained.” So, the souls of Christian martyrs are in heaven. As 2 Corinthians 5:8 teaches, to be “absent from the body” is to be “present with the Lord” (NKJV).

 

[The Learner]

Do you know who is the biggest "copycat" of all....? Why do you think his deceptions work so well....? He presents himself as "an angel of light". (2 Cor 11:14-15)

All you have to do is follow the trail back to Babylon and see where all of Christendom's doctrines came from. The RCC got all its doctrines from that city, built by the post flood rebels......and her equally corrupted 'daughters' took many of her false teachings along with them, when they left 'home'.

Why do you think the harlot is called "Babylon the great" or "the greater Babylon"? Why is she depicted as a harlot?
You think original Babylon doesn't figure in that statement? Why are the political elements going to turn on her? She has been in bed prostituting herself with them for centuries.
Why do the merchants of the earth lament her passing? They have made good money off her.
"Babylon the great" is going down and nothing will stop it....like the Titanic, if we have not jumped ship before she sinks, we will go down with her....

We will have to wait and see......Jesus will tell us all in due time if what we have accepted as truth, really is.....

ROFL, clearly you did not read the links I gave. Go back and read them so you don't look igonrant. Your response looks like this:

 

[The Learner]

Three main Christian views on the soul and spirit:​

When scholars assemble everything the Bible says about the soul and spirit, there’s still some room for interpretation. The three main schools of thought come down to how many “parts” humans are made of:

Three parts: Body, soul, and spirit​

Some people believe that in addition to “body” and “soul” we have a third part, a “spirit” that most directly relates to God. This view is called trichotomy. While this has been a common view in popular evangelical Bible teaching, there are few scholarly defenses of it today.
According to many trichotomists, man’s soul includes his intellect, his emotions, and his will. They maintain that all people have such a soul, and that the different elements of the soul can either serve God or give in to sin. A person’s spirit, however, is a higher faculty that only comes alive when a person becomes a Christian (see Romans 8:10: “If Christ is in you, although your bodies are dead because of sin, your spirits are alive because of righteousness”). The spirit is the part of us that most directly worships and prays to God (see John 4:24 and Philippians 3:3).
We’ll explore the main arguments for and against this view later.

​

 

[The Learner]

Two parts: Body and soul​

Others argue that “spirit” is not a separate part of man, but simply another term for “soul,” and that both terms are used interchangeably in Scripture to talk about the immaterial part of man that lives on after our bodies die. The view that man is made up of two parts (body and soul/spirit) is called dichotomy. Those who hold this view often agree that Scripture uses the word spirit (Hebrew “rûach”, and Greek “pneuma”) more frequently when referring to our relationship to God, but such usage (they say) is not uniform, and the word soul is also used in all the ways that spirit can be used.
This is the most-widely held scholarly view on the soul and spirit. Later, we’ll look in more detail at the reasons why many scholars believe spirit and soul are synonymous.

​

 

[The Learner]

One part: the body​

Outside the realm of evangelical thought we find yet another view, the idea that man cannot exist at all apart from a physical body, and therefore the “soul” can’t exist separately after the body dies (although this view can allow for the resurrection of the whole person at some future time).
This view is called monism. According to monism, the scriptural terms soul and spirit are just other expressions for the “person” himself, or for the person’s “life.” Most evangelical theologians don’t hold this view because so many scriptural texts seem to affirm that our souls or spirits live on after our bodies die:

• “Into your hands I commit my spirit; deliver me, LORD, my faithful God.” —Psalm 31:5
• “Jesus answered him, ‘Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.’” —Luke 23:43
• “Jesus called out with a loud voice, ‘Father, into your hands I commit my spirit.’ When he had said this, he breathed his last.” —Luke 23:46
• “While they were stoning him, Stephen prayed, ‘Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.’” —Acts 7:59
• “But I am hard-pressed from both directions, having the desire to depart and be with Christ, for that is very much better; yet to remain on in the flesh is more necessary for your sake.” —Philippians 1:23–24
• “We are confident, I say, and would prefer to be away from the body and at home with the Lord.” —2 Corinthians 5:8
• “. . . to the church of the firstborn, whose names are written in heaven. You have come to God, the Judge of all, to the spirits of the righteous made perfect . . .” —Hebrews 12:23
• “When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God and the testimony they had maintained.” —Revelation 6:9
• “I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony about Jesus and because of the word of God. They had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years.” —Revelation 20:4

 

[The Learner]

Since dichotomy and trichotomy are more common views in the evangelical church today, let’s look at each one in detail.
Learn more in Wayne Grudem’s Systematic Theology online course.

First: Can we be sure that humans have souls?​

Many non-Christian philosophers challenge the idea of a soul or spirit, arguing that humans have no immaterial existence. Perhaps partially in response to this, some evangelical theologians hesitate to affirm dichotomy in human existence, instead arguing for monism, affirming that the Bible views man as a single unified part.
When philosophers assume there’s no spiritual realm beyond the reach of our senses, they naturally go on to argue that there is no God, heaven, angels, or demons. Similarly they deny the existence of a distinct soul within human beings. A spirit or soul cannot be observed by the physical realm. It’s a spiritual concept. Our knowledge of the existence of the human soul must be based on Scripture, in which God clearly testifies to the existence of this immaterial aspect of our beings. The fact that this truth about our existence cannot be clearly known apart from the testimony of Scripture shouldn’t cause us to shrink from affirming it.
As we mentioned in our discussion of monism, Scripture is very clear that we do have a soul that is distinct from our physical bodies, which not only can function somewhat independently of our ordinary thought processes (1 Corinthians 14:14 and Romans 8:16), but also, when we die, is able to go on consciously acting and relating to God apart from our physical bodies.
Jesus told the dying thief, “Today you will be with me in Paradise” (Luke 23:43), even though, for both of them, their physical bodies were soon to die.
When Stephen was dying, he knew he would immediately pass into the presence of the Lord, for he prayed, “Lord Jesus, receive my spirit” (Acts 7:59).
Paul does not fear death, for he says, “My desire is to depart and be with Christ, for that is far better” (Philippians 1:23). He contrasts that with remaining in this life, which he calls “to remain in the flesh” (Philippians 1:24). In fact, he says, “We would rather be away from the body and at home with the Lord” (2 Corinthians 5:8), indicating a confidence that if he were to die physically his spirit would go into the Lord’s presence and there enjoy fellowship with the Lord at once.
The book of Revelation reminds us that “the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the witness they had borne” (Revelation 6:9) are in heaven and are able to cry out to God to bring justice on the earth (Revelation 6:10, see also 20:4).

 

[The Learner]

Clearly, the Bible makes a distinction between our physical bodies and a soul or spirit. Now let’s look at why dichotomists believe the Bible considers the soul and spirit to be the same thing.

5 reasons the soul and spirit are synonymous​

The reasons why many scholars believe humans are made up of two parts, not three, can all be traced back to one essential argument: the Bible uses “soul” and “spirit” interchangeably.

1. Scripture uses “soul” and “spirit” interchangeably.​

When we look at the usage of the biblical words translated “soul” (Hebrew “nephesh” and Greek “psychē”) and “spirit” (Hebrew “rûach” and Greek “pneuma”), it appears that they are sometimes used interchangeably.
In John 12:27, Jesus says, “Now is my soul troubled,” whereas in a very similar context in the next chapter John says that Jesus was “troubled in spirit” (John 13:21). Similarly, we read Mary’s words in Luke 1:46–47: “My soul magnifies the Lord, and my spirit rejoices in God my Savior.” This seems to be an example of Hebrew parallelism—a poetic device that repeats the same idea using synonymous words.
Additionally, people who have died and gone to heaven or hell are referred to as either “spirits” (such as in Hebrews 12:23 and 1 Peter 3:19) or “souls” (such as in Revelation 6:9 and Revelation 20:4).

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