Therefore, it places its appearing, which we have already established coincides with the second coming of the Lord, at the end of the millennium thus revealing a postmillennial appearing of Christ. Christ connects the appearance of the New Jerusalem at His coming, declaring, “Behold, I come quickly.” It is at this all-consummating event that the New Jerusalem comes “down out of heaven from my God.”
Knitting all these passages together reinforces the Amillennial and Postmillennial positions that Revelation 20 is speaking about a current period of time. It is clear Premillennialism has a major problem here. First, John 14:1-3 ties Christ to the heavenly city and presents that city, which is being prepared, as the eternal hope of the saints. If that city does not appear until after the millennium as a Premillennial reading of Revelation 20 would require then the saints will not experience that prepared city for over 1,000 years.
You did not establish the Second Coming at the end of any millennium. This thread is about a pre-trib rapture, which is actually a pre-trib Second Coming.
The absurdity in your position is that you leave out all the Scripture that shows Jesus and the angels are on the earth during the final harvest.
Premil definitely believe and declare the New Jerusalem descends after the Millennium. You have literally no verse that declares the Second Coming is after a declared and pronounced millennium. Revelation 21 does not describe a Second Coming. Revelation 20 does not describe a Second Coming.
In knitting Scripture together, the 6th Seal is the Second Coming described in the explicit Olivet Discourse. In nearly every Second Coming passage the writer declares that Jesus comes with all the angels and the earth is still a place clearly filled with people who are judged while physically alive on the earth and gathered by those angels for that judgment.
You are erroneously equating the New Jerusalem instead of the clear teaching Jesus comes with angels, not a city, but nice try to avoid the actual reality of the situation.
Matthew 13:36-41
"Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying, Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field. He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man; The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels. As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world. The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity."
Jesus and His angels are clearly on the earth post a Second Coming. Matthew 25:31-32
"When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats."
Still we see Jesus coming with His angels who will be gathering physically alive people on the earth for judgment.
Matthew 24:29-31
"Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other."
This is in reply to several of your first OP posts and not once have you even defined a period of tribulation, which you are allegedly debunking.
So far you are arguing a strawman 7 year tribulation, you do not even believe in, and deny exists, so you are neither post trib, nor pre-trib, yet you change your own topic and turn it into post Millennial, which was not your point, that you have yet to debunk, ie pre-trib.
Revelation 21 is a thousand years after your undefined tribulation, which was a tribulation because Jesus and the angels were on the earth literally killing people by tossing them directly into the LOF.
The Second Coming is after the tribulation of those days, but brings with the Second Coming a totally different type of tribulation, and that tribulation is what you say Jesus comes after, even though the Second Coming is the instigation of the tribulation you deny, and claim does not exist.
Only a few posters even claim a 7 year period of intense tribulation. Some break it up into a period of Satan's wrath and a period of God's judgment. All get it wrong, because people change and re-arrange Revelation to fit their eschatology they erroneously make up by cherry picking verses and then call that knitting together Scripture in direct contradiction of other avoided Scripture.
The Second Coming is after over or nearly 2,000 years of great tribulation the church has experienced off and on, or depending on where they are born.
That tribulation is described in Matthew 24:4-14
"And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many. And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places. All these are the beginning of sorrows. Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake. And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another. And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many. And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved."
This is the tribulation of those days. Of course the Second Coming is post this tribulation as it started immediately with the stoning of Stephen, and the disciples thrown into prison, some several times. Instead of making up your own supposed future, why not examine the facts of history, and what Jesus did say will happen?
Even if you take Mark which states:
"But in those days, after
that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken. And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory. And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven."
You cannot escape defining tribulation from the first century as opposed to when the stars fall. Revelation 6 states that happens at the 6th Seal way before the first Trumpet even sounds. Also the stars fall in conjunction with 2 Peter 3 at the Second Coming, not at the end of existence.
"And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;"
Clearly billions are still on the earth hiding, and the angels will be gathering them for judgment as Jesus Himself will be physically on the earth sitting in Judgment over the living gathered from all over the earth. That does not negate a pre-trib rapture, as the church is gathered first and glorified as a sign to all those on the earth, they are about to be judged, and that is time of intense tribulation. The literal judgment of those alive who are awarded their final state of being, either eternal life or the second death in the LOF. And the Millennium has not even started yet, since you went off topic and threw that point in instead of even defining a tribulation, you are arguing over as if there is not even a post tribulation position either, which is even more absurd arguing for something you don't even believe in.
