Spotting the Heretic

[Enoch111]

We are spirit beings who are in union with God's Spirit, for eternity,

More FALSE DOCTRINE from the specialist in bogus theology.

Angels are spirit beings. Humans consist of body, soul, and spirit (the whole man) and will remain perfected and glorified human beings in eternity.

And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole [1] spirit and [2] soul and [3] body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. (1 Thess 5:23)

However, only those who are children (sons) of God will be perfected and glorified in order to resemble Christ.

Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew Him [Christ] not. Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when He shall appear, we shall be like Him; for we shall see Him as He is. And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure. (1 John 3:1-3)

 

[Behold]

More FALSE DOCTRINE from the specialist in bogus theology.

Angels are spirit beings.
Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew Him [Christ] not. Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when He shall appear, we shall be like Him; for we shall see Him as He is. And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure. (1 John 3:1-3)

Let me help you.

God is "A" Spirit, not just "Spirit" as you find in a bible you should put in a dumpster.
Man is created in the "Image of God".. the "likness">.
When man fell he died spiritually, as this is the essence of a human and IS God.
Colossians 2 says that man is "dead" in sin.
So, God understands that the main part of a person is DEAD....and Jesus came to make this main part, ALIVE. = Born Again.
When we look at the term "new Creation" In Christ... we are talking about the born again SPIRIT.
When man if born again, his SPIRIT is reborn, and this is what becomes in "UNION" with God and Christ.
is God a tri-part being? Sure. Is man? Sure., but the essence of Man is the same as God, and that is "Spirit".
The Bible is a spiritual book. All the verses are spirit and light. WE are to walk in the Spirit. We are filled with the Holy Spirit. We are born again by the Spirit of God.
Everything with God is "Spirit" related, included Man, His word, His redemption....everything.

 

[Nancy]

While this is truth, yes -
there are rules God Gives us, for the assembling together whether 2 or 3 , 200, or 3000,
that the forum does not even care about as if to be an assembly of believers.
i.e. the instructions of Scripture , OT and NT, God Gives, are very clear about not even greeting nor discussing things with those who bring a false gospel (and the true danger of sharing their crime / judgment from talking with them) and the true danger seen daily of people who are taken in by the false gospel, because they think , it "looks like" , to them, those false gospel bringers are okay with all the others around here so they must be okay and they follow them to the path to destruction, their souls lost ....

i.e. as being like Athens, sites on the internet are just that,
the sites with God's Restrictions are not following God's Directions for a meeting of born-again believers.... thus so much , so many led astray... (I don't think that is everyone's purpose, but that's obviously what happened since forums open to the public unbelievers started, the one's that let unbelief keep positing their ideas as if okay for anyone ) ....

Can anyone find light, does anyone find truth on the internet ? Yes. A few. But has anyone ever been saved from a forum ? Not according to internet responses/ queries/ requests for anyone who was saved, or heard of anyone saved, has responded in over ten years .... it is dangerous like sodom and gomorrah.... maybe worse.....

Yes, God will hold those who are proponents of erroneous doctrine, and their teachers will be held even more accountable. My belief is that this site is no different than the people in Church's...many just would never talk like that face to face with their fellow congregants. I have learned much on this site...even from those I do not agree with. And...I have grown to love many on here, even though we might not agree on everything 100% because, NOBODY has 100% unity in the Truth. For instance, I could never take communion in a Catholic Church and visa versa because we do NOT agree and there would be no union in it.
And, we really do not know who was saved by some thing they read on here...newbies need to be taken under a wing of the more mature Christians because, they do seem ready to get off of this site as soon as they are on it!
So, if somebody sincerely wants the Truth...they will wade through the muck and trust God to teach them discernment so they will not be fooled...but new Christians might not be ready for sites like these. We can express our opinions on here, right or wrong but then...the mods also have their own beliefs.
God Bless
nancy

 

[farouk]

Yes, God will hold those who are proponents of erroneous doctrine, and their teachers will be held even more accountable. My belief is that this site is no different than the people in Church's...many just would never talk like that face to face with their fellow congregants. I have learned much on this site...even from those I do not agree with. And...I have grown to love many on here, even though we might not agree on everything 100% because, NOBODY has 100% unity in the Truth. For instance, I could never take communion in a Catholic Church and visa versa because we do NOT agree and there would be no union in it.
And, we really do not know who was saved by some thing they read on here...newbies need to be taken under a wing of the more mature Christians because, they do seem ready to get off of this site as soon as they are on it!
So, if somebody sincerely wants the Truth...they will wade through the muck and trust God to teach them discernment so they will not be fooled...but new Christians might not be ready for sites like these. We can express our opinions on here, right or wrong but then...the mods also have their own beliefs.
God Bless
nancy

Wise words, @Nancy; a lot of life experience there...

 

[Nancy]

Its the difference between :
Salvation and Discipleship

Salvation is , God puts you into His family.= DONE. Born again. = Blood Atonement.

Discipleship is your walk of faith, that you commit to, or "abide in"...as your determined lifestyle.
Lifestyle is Discipleship.
JESUS on the CROSS, is Salvation.

The heresy is this.....its when a person teaches that this walk of discipleship, is how you keep yourself SAVED.
That is where the heresy is found.

Salvation is GOD doing it for you, on a Cross, and you are Born Again.
You RECEIVE this from God, as its a GIFT....."The GIFT of Salvation"..
So, NOW, once you are IN GOD....."in Christ",....Spiritually, and eternally, you start living a life based on this born again result that you already have.
You are to walk in this Salvation, as your faith....walk.
So, you are put into God's Spirit by GOD, and that is why your born again Spirit ABIDES in God.
Then you live a LIFESTYLE that reflects your Salvation. = your discipleship.

This discipleship happens because you are ALREADY saved......that is why you are a DISCIPLE.
Its not your discipleship that caused you to be born again and it can't keep you "in God", as you are already In Christ.
Very important that you understand that one causes the other, and the other is a result of what is already happened.
The heretic is trying by discipleship to maintain what GOD has already given to you as a GIFT of Salvation.. "the GIFT of Righteousness".

We walk as a Disciple of Christ, because we ARE ALREADY BORN AGAIN and SAVED......not to keep it, but because we are already God's.

All well and good Behold but...you still have not addressed the scriptures I posted... :)

 

[farouk]

All well and good Behold but...you still have not addressed the scriptures I posted... :)

@Nancy Scripture has to be our guide...

 

[justbyfaith]

You have no control over your SPIRIT.,

On the contrary, see 1 Corinthians 14:32.

We abide in Christ by being IN CHRIST = born again.

We are born again and continue to be born again through faith in Jesus Christ.

The heresy is this.....its when a person teaches that this walk of discipleship, is how you keep yourself SAVED.
That is where the heresy is found.

I think that I agree with you there.

This discipleship happens because you are ALREADY saved......that is why you are a DISCIPLE.

There too.

You have been led to believe that GRACE is "license",

I believe that grace is the enabling power of God. Those who teach grace falsely teach it as license...they teach that it does not matter what you do, you are saved no matter what. This is a distortion of the truth. The reality is that if you are saved you will not just do anything...there will be restraint. But, as you have that restraint given by the Holy Ghost, whatever you do you will continue to be saved; because you are acting under that restraint.

In other words the heretic is so pride filled, so full of SELF and Self Righteousness, that they believe they have the power to UNDO God's redemption.
This is stupid on so many levels, and not just Theologically, but, worst of all..... its so very very offensive to God for this to be taught and Preached.

It depends on what kind of faith you have, really. If your faith is nominal, lukewarm, shallow, you can fall away (Luke 8:13). If it is a heart faith unto righteousness (Romans 10:10), you have everlasting life and cannot lose your salvation (John 6:47).

2. The blood of Jesus that saved you, keeps you saved.

Amen. Note that the blood of Jesus also sanctifies you (Hebrews 13:12, Hebrews 10:29, 1 John 1:7).

I have news for you.... all ye heretics...there is no SHED BLOOD found in "repenting and confessing"... and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness found for your NEXT 456 sins.

Why then, does scripture say, that if we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us of our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness? There is a logical contradiction here that you may have to think about in order to see.

And neither of you ever quote any of their teaching, as that would be the honest thing to do, hear me?

To quote the teaching of the gnostics would be to in effect preach their gospel and to do so would make a man accursed (Galatians 1:6-9).

 

[Nancy]

Wise words, @Nancy; a lot of life experience there...

Ah yes Farouk...but don't we all have life experience? All different and unique! God is Unique on steroids, lol.

 

[farouk]

Ah yes Farouk...but don't we all have life experience? All different and unique! God is Unique on steroids, lol.

What I meant, @Nancy, was that for you to have written those Scriptural sentiments, you must have spent years meditating about it all...

 

[aspen]

Tbe evil in this world is proof that the Devil is alive and well.

Jesus said that all unbelievers are "of your Father the Devil".
Now you know why there are so many evil people in this world doing so many evil things..
They are doing their FATHER's will.
Believe it.

which is a call to love others through service, not look for demons behind every bush. as christians, we are never going to root out the devil - that is God's job. we are called to heal the wounds and pick up the pieces.

 

[Behold]

On the contrary, see 1 Corinthians 14:32.

Thats a different situation.
That is not talking about a born again spirit in the person.
That is talking about PROPHETS, not the born again, and the spirits, is referring to controlling according to order, the gifts of the Spirit.

Its the same idea as..."let it be 2 or 3".....in a Church service, who are speaking in Tongues..
"let it be by 2 or 3", is the ORDER.....how it is to be controlled so that its not a wild situation, total disorder.

So, you can't even SEE your Spirit.
This is a different situaiton, vs, controlling your SELF......= Prophets controlling their gift or their "spirit" in that context.

 

[Behold]

which is a call to love others through service, not looking for demons behind every bush. as christians, we are never going to root out the devil - that is God's job. we are called to heal the wounds and pick up the pieces.

There are a few places you can root out the devil.
Get him out of your Theology.
Get him out of your family.
Get him out of your Church.

other then that, we can cast Him out, and we can Pray to have God undo what He has caused within a life or within a circumstance.

 

[Nancy]

What I meant, @Nancy, was that for you to have written those Scriptural sentiments, you must have spent years meditating about it all...

Thanks Farouk, yes I have in many ways always thought about God. I have many more questions than I do answers for sure, but He takes us as far as we will obey His voice.

 

[Behold]

All well and good Behold but...you still have not addressed the scriptures I posted... :)

John 15:4
"Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit by itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in me."

This verse is speaking about bearing Spiritual Fruit.
Fruit bearing is done before other people....or as James says..."i'll show YOU my faith, by my works".
This fruit bearing is related to walking in the Light, and dying to self.
This is the spiritual process of not only growing in Grace, but, being dedicated to pursuing more of God.
God gives you the Light of revelation when you are really sincere and have been for a while.
You have to STUDY and STICK.


John 15:7
"If you abide in me, and my words abide in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you."

Jesus also said that you shall have what you believe... that all things are possible if you have Faith. (believe).
And he said that not just to the Apostles, but as a general rule of Spiritual Power.
FAITH, is power, even in the heart of an unbeliever.
For example.....if you are a person who says...>"my mama had cancer, and i bet i get it ".
You have just committed FAITH against yourself.
Be careful of your own words as words are what change everything.
Faith" is WORDS believed.
Bad words believed = Faith.



1 John 2:6
"Whoever says he abides in him ought to walk in the same way in which he walked."



"ought to walk".... = you should.....does not mean you will.
Demas was a convert of Paul. Demas left Paul and returned to his old life.
The bible does not follow up.
Where is Demas? He's in Heaven.
Why? Because he was born again.
See, its not the good people or the nice people who go to heaven.
its not just the perfect disciple or the bad disciple that goes to heaven.
Its ALL the born again.



1 John 2:28
"And now, little children, abide in him, so that when he appears we may have confidence and not shrink from him in shame at his coming."

This verse is actually related to most of MY Threads that deal with "sinning and confessing".

Paul wrote in Hebrews that we are to leave the baby bottle stage of repenting and confessing and GROW up in our understanding of God's Grace so that we can walk in "VICTORY" over our flesh. (no more sinning). (no more guilt). = Perfect understanding of the effectual work of the Blood of Jesus.
When we dont have this, then the life is 50 yrs of sinning and repenting, and then we face Jesus after we die, or are Raptured.
Who could be proud of that sinning and repenting life? - "shrink back at his coming".



John 13:35

"everyone will know you are my disciple, if you love one another".

Agape` love, not the Eros kind .
This is actually the Love of God in you, loving Through you.

But here is the catch.
The devil has read this verse long before you showed up.
So, he will send in his people and they will talk about God's love, and seem sweet and teach the devil's lies while they talk about "love, love, love, all you need is love".
This means that "knowing them by their Fruit", ... you really have to know your Pauline Theology or these sweet loving Devil's will ruin your faith, and that is the ruin of your Christianity.

 

[justbyfaith]

That is talking about PROPHETS, not the born again,

The prophets are not born again?

That's news to me...

In context, 1 Corinthians 14:23 is talking about New Testament believers who have the gift of prophecy....these are definitely born again.

 

[aspen]

There are a few places you can root out the devil.
Get him out of your Theology.
Get him out of your family.
Get him out of your Church.

other then that, we can cast Him out, and we can Pray to have God undo what He has caused within a life or within a circumstance.

perhaps temporarily, with prayer, but it can turn into a trap. it can become a preoccupation, which takes away from our sanctification. remember, the devil was always close to Jesus - Judas, Peter, in the Temple. in fact, Jesus rebuked Peter when he denounced the evil he saw in the crucifixion.

also, we do not know what role the devil will ultimately play. sometimes a Judas is part of God's plan. it reminds me of the Judas in the Lord of the Rings, Golem. he, of course, was a necessary part of the story.

 

[FollowHim]

God is A Spirit. = Holy.
We are spirit beings who are in union with God's Spirit, for eternity, = born again INTO God....

Jesus is coming for His Bride, and we are going to our real home, at last.

You could be right, in theory. Except we are created being into which God breathed life. We have a spirit and soul. It appears we are bound to this physical existence to the extent we need a resurrection of the body to gain eternal life with Jesus. If we were just a spirit resurrection would not be necessary.

I have spoken to some who believe their eternal spirit is born into them when they are born again, and this spirit is set free when the flesh dies. Unfortunately we are bound to our bodies, not free agents. So when our bodies die we die. There is a sence in which our souls exist separate from our bodies, Samuel came back to talk to King Saul, Elijah and Moses appeared talking to Jesus on the mountain of transfiguration, in revelation the souls of the dead speak out about justice for their deaths.

But Jesus says we will have a body, and marriage will be no more. Paul says our bodies will be changed from an earthly dwelling to a heavenly dwelling. This all suggests you are wrong in your proposition. God bless you

 

[justbyfaith]

Concerning the soul and spirit:

Hebrews 4:12.

 

[Nancy]

'

John 15:4
"Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit by itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in me."

"This verse is speaking about bearing Spiritual Fruit.
Fruit bearing is done before other people....or as James says..."i'll show YOU my faith, by my works".
This fruit bearing is related to walking in the Light, and dying to self.
This is the spiritual process of not only growing in Grace, but, being dedicated to pursuing more of God."
God gives you the Light of revelation when you are really sincere and have been for a while.
You have to STUDY and STICK.


John 15:7
"If you abide in me, and my words abide in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you."

Jesus also said that you shall have what you believe... that all things are possible if you have Faith. (believe).
And he said that not just to the Apostles, but as a general rule of Spiritual Power.
FAITH, is power, even in the heart of an unbeliever.
For example.....if you are a person who says...>"my mama had cancer, and i bet i get it ".
You have just committed FAITH against yourself.
Be careful of your own words as words are what change everything.
Faith" is WORDS believed.
Bad words believed = Faith.



1 John 2:6
"Whoever says he abides in him ought to walk in the same way in which he walked."



"ought to walk".... = you should.....does not mean you will.
Demas was a convert of Paul. Demas left Paul and returned to his old life.
The bible does not follow up.
Where is Demas? He's in Heaven.
Why? Because he was born again.
See, its not the good people or the nice people who go to heaven.
its not just the perfect disciple or the bad disciple that goes to heaven.
Its ALL the born again.



1 John 2:28
"And now, little children, abide in him, so that when he appears we may have confidence and not shrink from him in shame at his coming."

This verse is actually related to most of MY Threads that deal with "sinning and confessing".

Paul wrote in Hebrews that we are to leave the baby bottle stage of repenting and confessing and GROW up in our understanding of God's Grace so that we can walk in "VICTORY" over our flesh. (no more sinning). (no more guilt). = Perfect understanding of the effectual work of the Blood of Jesus.
When we dont have this, then the life is 50 yrs of sinning and repenting, and then we face Jesus after we die, or are Raptured.
Who could be proud of that sinning and repenting life? - "shrink back at his coming".



John 13:35

"everyone will know you are my disciple, if you love one another".

Agape` love, not the Eros kind .
This is actually the Love of God in you, loving Through you.

But here is the catch.
The devil has read this verse long before you showed up.
So, he will send in his people and they will talk about God's love, and seem sweet and teach the devil's lies while they talk about "love, love, love, all you need is love".
This means that "knowing them by their Fruit", ... you really have to know your Pauline Theology or these sweet loving Devil's will ruin your faith, and that is the ruin of your Christianity.

"This verse is speaking about bearing Spiritual Fruit."
Yes, it sure is, and is that not what God desires from us?

"Fruit bearing is done before other people"
Not always, and many times it is something some do for accolades so, they have their reward...but then you have the anonymous folks in the background...Gods unsung servants.

"Jesus also said that you shall have what you believe... that all things are possible if you have Faith."
Well, yes as, we cannot please Him without faith. All things are possible with prayer and faith...as long as these things we pray are in line with His will, and not for selfish reasons.

"Demas left Paul and returned to his old life....Where is Demas? He's in Heaven."

"For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come,and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame."
Hebrews 6:4-6

"This means that "knowing them by their Fruit", ... you really have to know your Pauline Theology or these sweet loving Devil's will ruin your faith, and that is the ruin of your Christianity"
I would say that ALL theology is just as important as Pauls. OT, NT, Gospels, Revelation and so on.

"Agape` love, not the Eros kind .
This is actually the Love of God in you, loving Through you."
Yes, I do know the difference between the different kinds of love spoken of in the bible, Agape is sacrificial and we should helping our brothers and sisters in Christ BEFORE we do the world. Be there for one another and make sure others needs are taken care of before ours.

"The devil has read this verse long before you showed up.
So, he will send in his people and they will talk about God's love, and seem sweet and teach the devil's lies while they talk about "love, love, love, all you need is love".

Yes, the devil knows every jot and tittle in the Word...better than any human could. I'm not a huggy bear kissy face kind of person, and I prefer ALL of God's attributes, not JUST His love. He is JUST..."He wages war in righteousness" His wrath is just, his mercies are new everyday, He is a jealous God but, in all these things He remains Holy.

If one truly wants to know the truth, God will reveal it to them. :)

 

[farouk]

'

"This verse is speaking about bearing Spiritual Fruit."
Yes, it sure is, and is that not what God desires from us?

"Fruit bearing is done before other people"
Not always, and many times it is something some do for accolades so, they have their reward...but then you have the anonymous folks in the background...Gods unsung servants.

"Jesus also said that you shall have what you believe... that all things are possible if you have Faith."
Well, yes as, we cannot please Him without faith. All things are possible with prayer and faith...as long as these things we pray are in line with His will, and not for selfish reasons.

"Demas left Paul and returned to his old life....Where is Demas? He's in Heaven."

"For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come,and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame."
Hebrews 6:4-6

"This means that "knowing them by their Fruit", ... you really have to know your Pauline Theology or these sweet loving Devil's will ruin your faith, and that is the ruin of your Christianity"
I would say that ALL theology is just as important as Pauls. OT, NT, Gospels, Revelation and so on.

"Agape` love, not the Eros kind .
This is actually the Love of God in you, loving Through you."
Yes, I do know the difference between the different kinds of love spoken of in the bible, Agape is sacrificial and we should helping our brothers and sisters in Christ BEFORE we do the world. Be there for one another and make sure others needs are taken care of before ours.

"The devil has read this verse long before you showed up.
So, he will send in his people and they will talk about God's love, and seem sweet and teach the devil's lies while they talk about "love, love, love, all you need is love".

Yes, the devil knows every jot and tittle in the Word...better than any human could. I'm not a huggy bear kissy face kind of person, and I prefer ALL of God's attributes, not JUST His love. He is JUST..."He wages war in righteousness" His wrath is just, his mercies are new everyday, He is a jealous God but, in all these things He remains Holy.

If one truly wants to know the truth, God will reveal it to them. :)

@Nancy, The fruit of the Spirit passage in Galatians is relevant also. :)