Something That I Just Don't Understand

[lforrest]

If homosexuals can't be Christians than neither can people who lie or steal or curse etc.

Trying to quote Revelation 21:8?

 

[Renniks]

Also, if someone is threatening suicide, the best thing to tell them is that they will wake up in eternal hell.

They will likely change their mind if they think it is a fact.

I'm not sure it's that simple. Yes, if a non-believer kills himself, he will end up in eternal hell. But, when people are in the state of mind to kill themselves, they aren't exactly rational. IDK. We had a friend take his life and it wasn't that he hadn't heard the gospel. It was a terrible thing for everyone. I tend to think the thing to tell them is that they are will create hell on earth for everyone who knows them. But even that may not change the mind of someone who is believing the lies that the devil feeds him or her. Depression and suicidal thoughts are truly a spiritual battle and if one isn't well equipped with scripture and well acquainted with Jesus, it's going to be a losing battle.

 

[Raccoon1010]

I've created a thread to allow for the topic of degrees of sin and spirit prison verse the lake of fire: Degrees of sin

I've noticed a lot of un-justifying arguments in this thread saying that if your a sinner you are the same, something I disagree with, damned without Jesus is true, but there are degrees of sin.

 

[lforrest]

It just occured to me, all the stories I have heard of people seeing Jesus in person have come from those on the brink of suicide.

Be encuraged the Psalm is true: "The Lord is close to the brokenhearted and saves those who are crushed in spirit."

 

[Grailhunter]

As a spinoff thread to my LGBTQ thread there is something I need to know. Why do a lot of Christians treat members of the LGBTQ community and people who commit suicide as guilty of committing the unforgiveable sin? Newsflash! If either of those things was the unforgiveable sin Jesus would have come right out and said that it was but no the only unforgiveable sin is rejecting Christ and having an unrepentant heart until you die so I fail to understand why Christians automatically assume that if you're gay or you commit suicide you're going to Hell. Especially since you can bet that these people are already struggling enough as it is and a lot of them want help for it but a lot of the time they don't get it and hence why they take their own lives as sad as it is. :'(

LGBTQ = stands for lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, and questioning.
I have seen some good responses to your question and if I am duplicating...forgive me.

I might steal something...
You might go to a drug party and lay with a girl...
Someone might sell someone a faulty car...
We might lie....
Repentance and forgiveness is ours...through Christ our Lord.

But habitual sins and lifestyle sins are the ones that get you.
Can you repent and get forgiveness for something you intend to keep doing?
Homosexuals that get married take a vow to sin the rest of their life.

On the other side of the coin...never hate! Condemn the sin, not the sinner.
The fine line that a person can cross where they cannot get forgiveness is debatable.
Some would say that if Hitler would have found Christ during the last 5 minutes of his life....that we would be shoulder to shoulder with him in Heaven...I do not believe that. It is not a modern belief...there were those in the first few centuries that lived as they liked and got baptized on their death bed.

The other concern is the desire to make all this acceptable....Acceptable on TV...at work...in the classrooms and gym lockers with our kids. If it is acceptable...why not teach our children that? If drugs are legal and acceptable why not teach our children how to correctly use them? There is already a push from the left that sex with consenting children is acceptable...it is the Proverbial slippery slop.

 

[April_Rose]

Trying to quote Revelation 21:8?

What's the verse that says Jesus never turns away those who come to Him though? The only damned homosexuals are the unsaved who have not yet repented and asked Christ into their hearts. So that brings me back to my original question, why do you (and many others on here) automatically assume that they're unsaved. God is the only true judge but yet way too many people seem to be trying to play Him.

 

[lforrest]

What's the verse that says Jesus never turns away those who come to Him though? The only damned homosexuals are the unsaved who have not yet repented and asked Christ into their hearts. So that brings me back to my original question, why do you (and many others on here) automatically assume that they're unsaved. God is the only true judge but yet way too many people seem to be trying to play Him.

You seem inclined to stereotype Christians with the unequal scales of the enemy. And are putting words in my mouth, as well as others. You have no idea what I believe, and I doubt very much anyone else has because I haven't stated it clearly. And I may never do so if it doesn't edify, something I wish everyone would do.

Doesn't coming to Jesus involve repentance? Of course Jesus will strive with those who struggle with this stronghold.

 

[Taken]

As a spinoff thread to my LGBTQ thread there is something I need to know. Why do a lot of Christians treat members of the LGBTQ community and people who commit suicide as guilty of committing the unforgiveable sin? Newsflash! If either of those things was the unforgiveable sin Jesus would have come right out and said that it was but no the only unforgiveable sin is rejecting Christ and having an unrepentant heart until you die so I fail to understand why Christians automatically assume that if you're gay or you commit suicide you're going to Hell. Especially since you can bet that these people are already struggling enough as it is and a lot of them want help for it but a lot of the time they don't get it and hence why they take their own lives as sad as it is. :'(

Scripture is Clear: Become Converted;
• Repentance for having Had Disbelief.
• Heartful Confession of Belief, IN God, IN Jesus IS the Christ.
•Heartful giving OF your body, Crucified with Christ.

Results in A "FOREVER" Permanent Effect, OF;

• Receiving Gods Forgiveness.
• Receiving a Circumcised /New Heart.
• Receiving Gods Spirit.
• Receiving Gods SEED.
• Receiving of the Salvation of your soul.
• Receiving a Quickened (Born Again) spirit.
• Receiving The KINGS SEAL.
• Receiving Avoidance From Wrath (all Wrath...Lords Wrath, Devils Wrath, Gods Wrath)...via "ascension up to Clouds).
• Future Receiving Resurrection in Glory.
• Future Receiving a new Immortal body.

Such a Relationship Established Between;
One man and the Lord God Almighty...
Is NEVER "undone".

Certainly...God desires a Human person in a Converted relationship With the Lord God...
To live a Godly life, with the minds thoughts "like Christ Jesus".

Jesus' Minds thoughts Never preached men to become the role of women or women to become the role of men.
In fact Scripture Teaches the Opposite....

The dilemma appears to Focus on "what people say is acceptable ...to people".

God has provided and established A WAY to "Forever" have a Relationship with Him....
Done Deal!

However a Converted man "chooses" to Live his Life among other People...and the results thereof...(negative or positive) from other people....IS a Burden "each Individual Shall bear those consequences"

Gal 6:
[5] For every man shall bear his own burden.

And Every Converted man, SHALL be "rewarded" By God....According TO the "Works", an Individual DOES, by himself Living a "Godly life and introducing others to a Godly life and promoting a Godly Life".

Those who ARE Converted and Live their Life in "contrast" to A Godly Life...obviously will loose out on "Receiving" such "Rewards" from God.

Such as there IS a hierarchy (in Heaven) and on Earth, so also shall there be a hierarchy of persons IN Gods Kingdom on Earth.

THOSE Converted, who Favor and DO that which IS Godly...ARE they WHO shall receive, a higher Status in the Hierarchy.

Point Being...a Converted man DOES NOT Lose his Right to Enter into Everlasting Life IN the Lords Kingdom....but he may very well Lose Rewards and Hierarchy Status.


Glory to God,
Taken

 

[April_Rose]

You have no idea what I believe, and I doubt very much anyone else has because I haven't stated it clearly.

So then I missed the part where that is my fault. I mean not to sound mean or anything but the fact that you and others haven't been clear enough if you actually don't mean it the way it sounds,.. that's your own fault of how you word it not mine.

 

[lforrest]

So then I missed the part where that is my fault. I mean not to sound mean or anything but the fact that you and others haven't been clear enough if you actually don't mean it the way it sounds,.. that's your own fault of how you word it not mine.

Well if it isn't clear hows about not making assumptions.

 

[April_Rose]

Well if it isn't clear hows about not making assumptions.

Okay,.. how about that goes for everybody here. Like the person I think that it was @Truther who made the assumption (and they were crystal clear on this one) that all people who commit suicide wind up in Hell. People on here reading this might have friends and family members who took their own lives and that was the most ignorant post that I've read on this forum period but yet it wasn't deleted. SMH And no,.. I'm not mad at you or looking for a fight but it seems like I'm the wrong person to get a talking to about making assumptions because I would NEVER say anything like that. That was plain rude and mean.

 

[lforrest]

Okay,.. how about that goes for everybody here. Like the person I think that it was @Truther who made the assumption (and they were crystal clear on this one) that all people who commit suicide wind up in Hell. People on here reading this might have friends and family members who took their own lives and that was the most ignorant post that I've read on this forum period but yet it wasn't deleted. SMH And no,.. I'm not mad at you or looking for a fight but it seems like I'm the wrong person to get a talking to about making assumptions because I would NEVER say anything like that. That was plain rude and mean.

Moderators judge compliance to the rules. If his opinion pains you feel free to offer your own.

 

[April_Rose]

Moderators judge compliance to the rules. If his opinion pains you feel free to offer your own.

I just did. If Jesus had meant that suicide was an unforgiveable sin He would have come right out and said it and even though it might not directly be against the rules I'm appalled that it was still allowed as I already know for a fact that @Mayflower was probably really upset by it due to her comments of how she was once suicidal and laughed at.

 

[Raccoon1010]

I just did. If Jesus had meant that suicide was an unforgiveable sin He would have come right out and said it and even though it might not directly be against the rules I'm appalled that it was still allowed as I already know for a fact that @Mayflower was probably really upset by it due to her comments of how she was once suicidal and laughed at.

My best friend committed suicide and now I'm missing one of my best friends which is not fun or funny. But I will still let God decide his judgments and not take it upon myself to decide what God will do after death. So I don't listen to people unless they can back it up in the scriptures.

 

[Mayflower]

I just did. If Jesus had meant that suicide was an unforgiveable sin He would have come right out and said it and even though it might not directly be against the rules I'm appalled that it was still allowed as I already know for a fact that @Mayflower was probably really upset by it due to her comments of how she was once suicidal and laughed at.

People will think how they think...If they are censored or treated un-Christ-like, then they are not going to hear what anyone else has to say. Just like homosexuality and those who are suicidal. Plus this is the debate thread too. I thought this whole discussion has been pretty friendly regarding the topic...

 

[April_Rose]

People will think how they think...If they are censored or treated un-Christ-like, then they are not going to hear what anyone else has to say. Just like homosexuality and those who are suicidal. Plus this is the debate thread too. I thought this whole discussion has been pretty friendly regarding the topic...

True,.. good point,.. but my point was is that how can anybody not "make assumptions" when a poster is acting like they have all the answers?

 

[Mayflower]

True,.. good point,.. but my point was is that how can anybody not "make assumptions" when a poster is acting like they have all the answers?

The nature of debate is to convince someone they know the answer... Why I usually stay out of it. I do like ethics/morality discussions...

 

[Mayflower]

Okay, I think I understand now. Assumptions based on something said. I would say observation versus perception. Like they teach us this in preschool. They tell us to point out the behavior we see, instead of saying, "that is a bad child."

Same as "hate the sin, love the sinner"

 

[April_Rose]

The nature of debate is to convince someone they know the answer...

From what I've experienced usually they're already convinced they know and are not interested in a discussion in the first place so it leaves me wondering what's the point of them responding in the first place then?

 

[April_Rose]

Okay, I think I understand now. Assumptions based on something said. I would say observation versus perception. Like they teach us this in preschool. They tell us to point out the behavior we see, instead of saying, "that is a bad child."

Same as "hate the sin, love the sinner"

That explains it then,.. I never went to preschool lol but I still see your point. :)