Self Control

[Ritajanice]

Therein is my challenge Rj, ie loving the nut jobs. At least its easier when folk admit it, I've got some wiggle room but when it's denied (nut job) I gotta bite my tongue, polish my thinking cap, pack my bags.....and whistle Waltzing Matilda.

I can admit to being “ thick” as well, by the worlds standards, hehehe....thank God we have these amazingly highly intellectual people..where would we be without them, surgeons, politicians, mind you some of these governing bodies are crazy about money and lifestyles.

I thank God I was brought up extremely poor, my mother used to put newspaper on her stairs, I also remember sleeping in freezing conditions with coats on the bed. and an Elsan toilet outside, which didn’t flush, I will always remember the smell of those slop buckets on the lorries, when they came round to empty...just sharing.

 

[Hepzibah]

Because the imprint of what we were remains in our minds/brains, and we can follow it unwittingly. Therefore, the commands to put off the old man, and put on the new.

Much love!

Once again, confusing the old man with 'self'.

If anyone cares at all about scripture really says, and not what they just think it says: it says nowhere that self is to be put to death, but that self is to be denied. Death to self is from the far eastern religions. As this new idea is sweeping the church, it makes me suspicious about where it is going.

 

[Behold]

Look 'working out your holy life' is the same as 'working out your salvation.' How do you think you 'work it out.' By reading Paul's words day in day out as your salvation life and walk? I would think we need to live it?

You spent most of your post trying to state your reason for not wanting to respond,. and then when you responded to my post, you again starting talking about self effort as "working out your Salvation".

So, again, your SALVATION, if you are born again, and not just water baptized,............ is The Cross of Christ.
HE is Salvation up there doing that for you, 2000 yrs ago.
= What JESUS accomplished is Salvation., and its HIS LIfe, its HIS Redemption that is found in HIS sacrifice that is : Salvation.

So, when you then say, that is you "trying to live it', then you are substituting YOUR 'living it" for What CHRIST has done for you, and proving your understanding of Salvation, is "self effort" or "living the life".
And that is not how you "work out your Salvation".

Your Salvation....Its a GIFT from God, that comes to you THROUGH Christ when you give God your Faith in Christ.
God then 'imputes" HIS Salvation to you, that is the finished work of Jesus, on the Cross.

You can't 'live that' and you can't "do that"........you can only receive and reap the eternal benefit of what Christ has completed for you as HIS Salvation that HE Died to provide to you.

And once you have HIS Salvation, that is "the GIFT of Salvation"..... then you are to learn how to exist within HIS Salvation, that has caused the born again to become a "new Creation".

This understanding, of who you have BECOME as a """NEW CREATiON, In Christ"".... is how you "work out your Salvation", that you have received.

Simplify? Less "Storm'?...

Ok.
Lets say someone knocks on your door and says...."You are now the King of Bolivia".... 'you have a castle, and a staff"...

So, someone has decided to GIFT YOU with a KINGDOM.....and now you its all yours.
Do you have any idea how to run it? Do you have any idea how to BEHAVE in this new Situation?
You are now the KING, and you have a kingdom, but you have not learned how to "work it out" yet.

You need the KNOWLEDGE the "how to"...

Its the same with receiving the "Kingdom of God" that is "within you", Jesus said.
You have it, you have HIS Salvation, but you dont know how to function in it, as His "new Creation".
You have to Learn how... You have to "work it out".. by learning what you have become IN THERE..
You dont DO IT.... you LEARN IT.....as its all Revelation Knowledge, its all SPIRITUAL ,and you receive it just like you received God's Salvation.

This is called "the perfecting of the Saints" and its why God sends """Teachers"", who are actually "called".
And they deliverer the "know how", that is always Spiritual Knowledge that is Spiritually Discerned., as this is the "knowledge of God".

See it?

So, that is not.>"trying to do it'.. or "trying to live it'...or trying to "get there" or trying to "keep it"........ Its coming into the knowledge of GOD regarding who you have become "in Christ" as a "new Creation", who already EXISTS THERE for Eternity.
To gain this knowledge, and to perfectly exits in this revelation of what it means to have become "THE Righteousness of God in Christ", is how you "work it out"... Its how you "work out your Salvation".

Few make it, because most are trapped by some doctrine of the Devil, like Calvinism, or one of the "ism's", i posted previously.
And that is why they argue their man made Doctrine, that has deceived them out of TRUTH.... and say its the "holy spirit".

Paul says. of these BELIEVERS.....>"WHO has BEWITCHED YOU, that you should not obey the TRUTH"..

@APAK ...... Have you ever been to a forum that is just completely owned by Calvinism, or Hyper Calvinism's TULIP lies ?

These people dont talk about Jesus...they dont talk about Grace, they dont talk about the Cross, they Dont talk about Paul, they dont talk about ANYTHING but the doctrine of devils that owns them, owns their MIND.

And who is that?
Its the one they created their forum to IDOLIZE.

 

[Behold]

Behold, if only you had ears to hear yourself.

You regularly use the phrase 'most christians' you clearly don't include yourself......what a toss!

Im not aware that you actually understand anything at all about Redemption as the New Covenant, that is found as what Jesus said is "Finished", just before He died, that is God's = """"Gift of Salvation."""

I conclude that if you were asked to explain what it means to have become a "new Creation" in Christ, you would have to "google it" to try to fake your answer.

See, Ive listened to you for 3-4 yrs here..., both after you changed your alt's photo, and before, and you have little to nothing to say that is of any spiritual or moral value, that could benefit a Christian.

You are able to ramble on or "acid rap"... about basic "intro to philosophy", commentary, ......but, that's all you can produce, other then ignorant innuendo, or utterly confused statements that only make sense to you.

See you there in your next 2000 posts... @quietthinker

 

[quietthinker]

Im not aware that you actually understand anything at all about Redemption as the New Covenant, that is found as what Jesus said is "Finished", just before He died, that is God's = """"Gift of Salvation."""

I conclude that if you were asked to explain what it means to have become a "new Creation" in Christ, you would have to "google it" to try to fake your answer.

See, Ive listened to you for 3-4 yrs here..., both after you changed your alt's photo, and before, and you have little to nothing to say that is of any spiritual or moral value, that could benefit a Christian.

You are able to ramble on or "acid rap"... about basic "intro to philosophy", commentary, ......but, that's all you can produce, other then ignorant innuendo, or utterly confused statements that only make sense to you.

See you there in your next 2000 posts... @quietthinker

I see you are spinning off in your own head.....again, pretending you know.

Matthew 23:13
“Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You shut the door of the kingdom of heaven in people’s faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will you let those enter who are trying to

 

[Behold]

I see you are spinning off in your own head.....again, pretending you know.

Matthew 23:13
“Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You shut the door of the kingdom of heaven in people’s faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will you let those enter who are trying to

I never teach "the Law".

So, try again.

 

[quietthinker]

I never teach "the Law".

So, try again.

You are unaware that anything that tells you what to do, comes under the banner of Law.

 

[Behold]

You are unaware that anything that tells you what to do, comes under the banner of Law.

Jesus told you what to Believe.

Paul told you the same.

Neither of those is under the law...

Why?
Because GRACE is not "of the law".

 

[Pearl]

Why do we need to control something that we have put to death?

Really? most Christians I know have lost it - their self control - at one time or another. Perhaps you are unique in that you haven't. And why is self control listed as a fruit of the Spirit if we don't need it?

Galatians 5:22-23
But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control.

 

[Behold]

If anyone cares at all about scripture really says, and not what they just think it says: it says nowhere that self is to be put to death,

Paul teaches what Brother Marks is sharing with you.

Paul teaches the born again, that "the old man of sin is CRUCIFIED with Christ", and you are to "reckon HIM dead".

 

[Wrangler]

Self Control​

Do you possess it?

Where does it come from?

Was self control a weakness before you became Born Again or was it a strength?

Afraid it was a weakness for me , I was a complete and utter nut job....only the Holy Spirit can give me self control ....he’s still working on it.

Praise God!!

Great thread Rita! Thank you so much for starting it. So timely too in light of the replies to @Pancho Frijoles Introduction thread. (I was going to start a thread on this topic due to the replies in @Pancho Frijoles' Intro thread.)

I believe @Pancho Frijoles Intro thread is a case study in Christians on this very forum NOT possessing self control.

• Yes, we should evangelize.
• However, we should evangelize effectively and not resort off the bat to coercive proselytizing. I've learned it is far more effective and even a pre-requisite to build rapport and caring, trusting relationship BEFORE diving into something so personal as religious conversion. As the saying goes, people don't care how much you know until they know how much you care.

To answer the OP question, I always had great self-control and discipline with one weakness in anger management before I was sealed by the Spirit.

Wrangler

 

[quietthinker]

Jesus told you what to Believe.

Paul told you the same.

Neither of those is under the law...

Why?
Because GRACE is not "of the law".

You tell me what they (Jesus and Paul) told me what to believe (as if you know) but what did Jesus and Paul tell you?.....was it to tell people good news or was it to give them advice? What is it that you hear?

Your postings are all about advising and condemning those which don't agree with your tunnel visioned advice.

 

[Behold]

You tell me what they (Jesus and Paul) told me what to believe (as if you know)

Paul was sent by Jesus, to bring "The Gospel of the Grace of God" to the Gentiles. = Specifically, tho "ALL are welcome to come to the Cross of Christ".

Why Paul?

Let me show you.

Because the OT was transitioning into the NT, and that is a change......regarding God's dealing with Humanity.

See, the BIBLE is the "progressive revelation" that reveals How God has dealt with man, and how God is dealing with man, and how God is going to deal with man, in the future.

See, in the OT< God is only dealing with the JEW.....His "chosen".......but, as the OT is ending, and The Cross of Christ is that transition into the NEW Covenant, .. God has set the Jew, "aside" for a time........ "the time of the Gentiles"....and Jesus, called Paul into a specific ministry that is for the GENTILES........and that is why Paul is the "Apostle to the gentiles".
He's the only one., so, as you are a gentile, and as the "bride of Christ" is mostly Gentiles, you are to study Paul's Doctrine, as found in His Epistles, to learn what you need to know, if you are indeed born again, and not just water baptized and religious.

Your postings are all about advising and condemning those which don't agree with your tunnel visioned advice.

The reason you perceive what i show you as "behold's opinion" is because you are not a student of Paul's Epistles..."Pauline Theology".
If you become one, as the NT directs you to do, then once you study Paul's doctrine, you'll recognize mine, instantly.
But not until.

 

[quietthinker]

@Behold
If you have ears to hear, then hear!

'NORMAL' OPERATION

With practised smiles and trendy garb
‘fine thank you how are you?’
is heard amongst ‘together folk’
we’re well when we are blue

The water’s tested as we go
to see how we will fare
it’s safe to take the plunge I hear
our judgement frail and bare

In nakedness we interact
with covered eyes and ears
alone we walk amongst our walls
of hate and hurt and fears

The cynic speaks, the charged refrain
just take your angles home
we’re well you know, be positive!
viscerally I groan

Ahhh, flatter me with charming words
the ones I want to hear
transparency does not belong
to them, of that I’m clear.

The song, the song, ten thousand tongues
their mouths they have no lie
the truth, whatever it may be
a compromise means die

So just as steel will sharpen steel
one hand will wash the other
a thirsty, hungry, searching soul
is one I call my brother.

©

 

[Wrangler]

most Christians I know have lost it - their self control - at one time or another.

This observation rings true and is aligned with a SciFi thing called "The Force", which is at odds what some claim about the Spirit/Being Saved/Being Born Again. The 2nd group claims that sin is impossible once this status is achieved.

Force sensitive beings in Star Wars have the ability to be distracted OR focused on and in The Force. I believe this is how the Spirit life truly is. And this explains why we observe most Christians not displaying self control; they are distracted.

Like Padawan learners in Star Wars, the word among Christians is disciple, which comes from the root word discipline. In real life, Chrsitians must remain humble Padawan's, mindful of the ever present need to remain disciplined. Only in this way, can we achieve a power greater than that of an ordinary Christian - self control and the rest of the fruit of the Spirit.

 

[Behold]

@Behold
If you have ears to hear, then hear!

NORMAL OPERATION

just do this.

1 Corinthians 11:1

And go here.

Romans 3:21-28

Hebrews 13:9

2 Corinthians 5:19

John 3:17

Romans 4:8

 

[Wrangler]

As in all things, once we are born again we are so much more aware of our failings, weaknesses and faults.

I believe this is the consequence of our new found humility. The very first thing we need self control over is our ego.

 

[Behold]

The 2nd group claims that sin is impossible once this status is achieved.

Its the LAW (of Moses) including the 10 commandments......... that have the OT authority to define carnal behavior, as "sin".

This is to be "under the dominion of the LAW"

The born again are "not under the LAW.......but under GRACE".. according to the NT, New Covenant.

This means..>"where there is no LAW, there is no Transgression, defined".

A.) """""""Christ is the END... OF... THE...LAW.....for Righteousness, to/for everyone who is born again (Believes).""""""""

This does not mean that you will never commit some carnal behavior..
It means that the OT LAW has no more authority OVER a NT= Born again CHRISTian, to define their deeds as "sin".

 

[APAK]

You spent most of your post trying to state your reason for not wanting to respond,. and then when you responded to my post, you again starting talking about self effort as "working out your Salvation".

So, again, your SALVATION, if you are born again, and not just water baptized,............ is The Cross of Christ.
HE is Salvation up there doing that for you, 2000 yrs ago.
= What JESUS accomplished is Salvation., and its HIS LIfe, its HIS Redemption that is found in HIS sacrifice that is : Salvation.

So, when you then say, that is you "trying to live it', then you are substituting YOUR 'living it" for What CHRIST has done for you, and proving your understanding of Salvation, is "self effort" or "living the life".
And that is not how you "work out your Salvation".

Your Salvation....Its a GIFT from God, that comes to you THROUGH Christ when you give God your Faith in Christ.
God then 'imputes" HIS Salvation to you, that is the finished work of Jesus, on the Cross.

You can't 'live that' and you can't "do that"........you can only receive and reap the eternal benefit of what Christ has completed for you as HIS Salvation that HE Died to provide to you.

And once you have HIS Salvation, that is "the GIFT of Salvation"..... then you are to learn how to exist within HIS Salvation, that has caused the born again to become a "new Creation".

This understanding, of who you have BECOME as a """NEW CREATiON, In Christ"".... is how you "work out your Salvation", that you have received.

Simplify? Less "Storm'?...

Ok.
Lets say someone knocks on your door and says...."You are now the King of Bolivia".... 'you have a castle, and a staff"...

So, someone has decided to GIFT YOU with a KINGDOM.....and now you its all yours.
Do you have any idea how to run it? Do you have any idea how to BEHAVE in this new Situation?
You are now the KING, and you have a kingdom, but you have not learned how to "work it out" yet.

You need the KNOWLEDGE the "how to"...

Its the same with receiving the "Kingdom of God" that is "within you", Jesus said.
You have it, you have HIS Salvation, but you dont know how to function in it, as His "new Creation".
You have to Learn how... You have to "work it out".. by learning what you have become IN THERE..
You dont DO IT.... you LEARN IT.....as its all Revelation Knowledge, its all SPIRITUAL ,and you receive it just like you received God's Salvation.

This is called "the perfecting of the Saints" and its why God sends """Teachers"", who are actually "called".
And they deliverer the "know how", that is always Spiritual Knowledge that is Spiritually Discerned., as this is the "knowledge of God".

See it?

So, that is not.>"trying to do it'.. or "trying to live it'...or trying to "get there" or trying to "keep it"........ Its coming into the knowledge of GOD regarding who you have become "in Christ" as a "new Creation", who already EXISTS THERE for Eternity.
To gain this knowledge, and to perfectly exits in this revelation of what it means to have become "THE Righteousness of God in Christ", is how you "work it out"... Its how you "work out your Salvation".

Few make it, because most are trapped by some doctrine of the Devil, like Calvinism, or one of the "ism's", i posted previously.
And that is why they argue their man made Doctrine, that has deceived them out of TRUTH.... and say its the "holy spirit".

Paul says. of these BELIEVERS.....>"WHO has BEWITCHED YOU, that you should not obey the TRUTH"..

@APAK ...... Have you ever been to a forum that is just completely owned by Calvinism, or Hyper Calvinism's TULIP lies ?

These people dont talk about Jesus...they dont talk about Grace, they dont talk about the Cross, they Dont talk about Paul, they dont talk about ANYTHING but the doctrine of devils that owns them, owns their MIND.

And who is that?
Its the one they created their forum to IDOLIZE.

....................my patience is really getting thin with you Behold. Keep the way you are responding to me and I will really unload on you, and you will not like it at all.

Here's a heavy sampler....

You are a handful, indeed. There's no getting through to you at all. You are too argumentative and serve no useful purpose to anyone, including yourself. I think you have deeper issues here than your lack of knowledge and understanding of scripture and you inability to attempt yes, try to work out your salvation life. When are you going to start Behold?

You sit upon your high position in your chamber as a type of holy lifeguard, for all to see you, as you preach waves upon waves of childish gibberish scripture-sounding words in attempt to save someone or fellowship with other believers in this ocean of people. And yet you do not want to give up your bullhorn when you might see a person drowning or a believer needing some encouraging words in places where there are many rip currents in life. And you know why you grip to this mouth piece with dear life, you are ill-equipped to save anyone Behold! You are not being a warrior for God. You want the colorful uniform to wear and yet do not want to work for reward or rank as God expects; don't hide your talents. You want to stay a newbie all your life and whine.

You are scared to get off you high seat and run out to save anyone with the gifts you have been given. You do not lead a life of salvation Behold, at least read in your posts. You are not what you think you are. You are afraid to get in the water and learn to swim as your grace and spiritual gifts given of God are for that very purpose -use them, pray to God to know his purpose in your life; this is a major part of living and walking in the Spirit. You have to recognize in your walk that you are BEING useful for the Kingdom of God TODAY, and not just as inanimate prop or poster displaying random, changing and annoying spiritual writings on its face. So what is holding you back mate? Get off the dime and get a life as Christ.

 

[Wrangler]

Why do we need to control something that we have put to death?

Because of the difference between literal and figurative. Many Bible readers get confused between the 2.