Secure Eternal Salvation

[Ferris Bueller]

how was the publican justified?
Why was the Pharisee not justified?

The tax collector approached God asking for God's mercy.
The Pharisee approached God with the satisfactory completion of works.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

No Protestant, fundamentalist, or charismatic can be humble!

We are the one's relying on God's grace and mercy in humility.
You are the one's relying on the satisfactory and approved completion of various works.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Trust is works! You must choose (volition)

explain the gospel

Matt 5:7 Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.

Luke 7:47
Wherefore I say unto thee, Her sins, which are many, are forgiven; for she loved much: but to whom little is forgiven, the same loveth little.

the commands in matt 28:19-20

Matt 6:12 And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.

1 Peter 4:8
And above all things have fervent charity among yourselves: for charity shall cover the multitude of sins.

nope

trust is not works. It producuces works.

Grace is unmerited. It is a gift.

A reward or wage is earned.

You work for a reward or wage

Grace is given by by the work of another

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Protests!
In rebellion!
Say “I will not serve”!

"11For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to everyone. 12It instructs us to renounce ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live sensible, upright, and godly lives in the present age" Titus 2:11-12​

Righteous work is the result of God's grace, not the procurer of it as the Catholic church teaches.

Protestants do in fact serve God through the grace they have received through the forgiveness of sin by faith apart from works. Catholics serve God through their works to receive forgiveness of sin (be made righteous). That is the very definition of the works gospel.

 

[theefaith]

The tax collector approached God asking for God's mercy.
The Pharisee approached God with the satisfactory completion of works.

Justified by humility!
Sent away cos of pride!

 

[theefaith]

We are the one's relying on God's grace and mercy in humility.
You are the one's relying on the satisfactory and approved completion of various works.

Not true
Faith hope and charity!
1 cor 13:2 faith without charity avails nothing
Faith and works (prayer, penance, fasting, alms, and the practice of virtue) in Christ all thru the grace of God!

 

[theefaith]

nope

trust is not works. It producuces works.

Grace is unmerited. It is a gift.

A reward or wage is earned.

You work for a reward or wage

Grace is given by by the work of another

no explanation I see!

 

[Eternally Grateful]

no explanation I see!

you will only see what you want to,

My explanation is for ALL examples of someone who gives something based on grace, and ALL examples of earning a wage or reward.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Same old stuff

1. Jesus did not mean what he said.
2. Grace (unmerited favor) must be merited. hence it is not really grace

Same old confusion . . .

1. Jesus indee3 meant what He said. He said that whoever eats of the Bread of Life will live forever.
He ALSO said of those who HAVE eternal life-
Matt. 7:19)
Every tree that does NOT bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.

Matt. 24:13
"He who endures to the end will be saved".

Matt. 5:13
"You are the salt of the earth. But if salt loses its taste, with what can it be seasoned? It is no longer good for anything but to be thrown out and trampled underfoot".

2. Grace is a gift that must be cooperated with - as ALL gifts must be.

STUDY the Bible in its proper context so you will underdtand what it is saying . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Justified has more than one Biblical definition:

1. to show or prove to be just, right, or reasonable: The pleasure we get from these paintings justifies their high cost.
2. to defend or uphold as warranted or well-grounded: Don't try to justify his rudeness.
3. to declare innocent or guiltless; absolve; acquit.

justify​

Faith justifies in that it makes you righteous (see definition #3 above). This is Paul's argument.
Faith all by itself without works secures the righteousness that comes from God, not from you - Romans 3:21. If you had sufficient righteousness to reach out to God to be justified you wouldn't need the righteousness that comes from God. That's why the works argument for justification of the Catholics (being made righteous by faith and works) is a works gospel.

Work justifies in that it shows you to have the righteousness that comes from God (see definition #1 above). That's James' argument (James 2:18, James 2:24).

These two different definitions and usages of 'justified' is what keeps James' argument (James 2:24) from contradicting Paul's argument (Romans 3:28, Romans 4:2, Romans 4:5-6). This simple truth evades the priesthood of the Catholic church. And so they invented this false teaching that says 'faith is works' in their vain attempt to reconcile the two. But all they ended up doing is creating the very works gospel that Paul warned us about. But that seems to be what the Catholic church is all about - getting people to do what the Bible says not to do. This is just another example of that.

Coning from a guy who actually thins that "faith" = "Belief".
You're NO better off than the demons (James 2:19) . . .

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Same old confusion . . .

1. Jesus indee3 meant what He said. He said that whoever eats of the Bread of Life will live forever.
He ALSO said of those who HAVE eternal life-
Matt. 7:19)
Every tree that does NOT bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.

Matt. 24:13
"He who endures to the end will be saved".

Matt. 5:13
"You are the salt of the earth. But if salt loses its taste, with what can it be seasoned? It is no longer good for anything but to be thrown out and trampled underfoot".

2. Grace is a gift that must be cooperated with - as ALL gifts must be.

STUDY the Bible in its proper context so you will underdtand what it is saying . . .

Yawn.

So according to Jesus, if you eat this bread you will live forever UNLESS. (even those the words unless were never mentioned).

that would be like me going and telling everyone to just come and I will give you free rent for life.

And then after they get there. I give them a bunch of rules they had to follow or they would get kicked out.

That's called deception

Sorry my friend. Jesus did not make this distinction. You have him lying to those people or at the least being deceptive.

At the least. Jesus shoudl have said MAY Not die. MAY live forever. MAY have eternal life.

He said no such thing.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Coning from a guy who actually thins that "faith" = "Belief".
You're NO better off than the demons (James 2:19) . . .

"...the devils also believe*, and tremble." James 2:19​

*Strong's #4100

πιστεύω pisteúō, pist-yoo'-o; from G4102; to have faith (in, upon, or with respect to, a person or thing), i.e. credit; by implication, to entrust (especially one's spiritual well-being to Christ):—believe(-r), commit (to trust), put in trust with.

G4100 - pisteuō - Strong's Greek Lexicon (kjv)​

So, as we can see, to 'have faith' does in fact mean belief, or believing. Believe means to 'have faith'. Context shows what it is it that one is having faith in. The demons believe (have faith) that God is one. What they do not believe (have faith in) is the blood of Christ for the forgiveness of sin. But they 'have faith', nonetheless.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Justified by humility!

No, justified by faith, all by itself, apart from works. His humility is the result of his faith. Humility has no power to make one guiltless before God. Only God's forgiveness can do that.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Yawn.

So according to Jesus, if you eat this bread you will live forever UNLESS. (even those the words unless were never mentioned).

that would be like me going and telling everyone to just come and I will give you free rent for life.

And then after they get there. I give them a bunch of rules they had to follow or they would get kicked out.

That's called deception

Sorry my friend. Jesus did not make this distinction. You have him lying to those people or at the least being deceptive.

At the least. Jesus shoudl have said MAY Not die. MAY live forever. MAY have eternal life.

He said no such thing.

And therein lies your confusion in that pathetic analogy.

First of all, the landlord in your scenario would have given the ground rules BEFORE the people moved in.

And Jesus said "WILL live forever" because He is ALWAYS referring to the person who remains faithful in His promises. That's WHO those peomises are for - NOT the unfaiithful.
Scripture is crystal -lear about this (Matt. 7:19-23, Matt. 10:22, Matt. 24:13, Matt. 25:31–46, John 15:1-6, Rom. 11:22, 1 Cor. 4:4, 1 Cor. 9:27, 1 Cor. 10:12, 1 Tim. 4:1, 1 Tim. 4:16, 2 Tim. 2:12, Heb. 3:6, Heb. 3:12-14, Heb. 6:4-6, Heb. 10:26-27, 2 Pet. 2:20-21, 2 Pet. 3:17, 1 John 2:24, 1 John 5:13, Rev. 3:5, Rev. 22:19).

And Jesus was NEVER deceptive about having to cooperate with God's Grace.
- Being baptized (Matt. 28:19-20, John 3:5, Rom. 2:29, Rom. 6:1-11, Col. 2:12-17, 1 Peter 3:21)
- Picking up our cross daily to follow him (Matt. 16:24, Luke 9:23)
- Works of mercy and charity (Matt. 19:21, 25:31–46, Luke 18:22)
- Obeying his commandments (John 14:15, 15:10)
- Doing the will of the Father (Matt. 7:21, James 1:22)
- Suffering with Christ (Matt. 10:38, 16:24, Mark 8:34, John 12:24, Rom. 8:17, 2 Cor. 1:5-7, Eph. 3:13, Phil. 1:29, 2 Tim. 1:8, 1 Peter 2:19-21, 4:1-2)

Only "deceptive" to those who don't know God's Word . . .

 

[Eternally Grateful]

And therein lies your confusion in that pathetic analogy.

First of all, the landlord in your scenario would have given the ground rules BEFORE the people moved in.

And Jesus said "WILL live forever" because He is ALWAYS referring to the person who remains faithful in His promises. That's WHO those peomises are for - NOT the unfaiithful.
Scripture is crystal -lear about this (Matt. 7:19-23, Matt. 10:22, Matt. 24:13, Matt. 25:31–46, John 15:1-6, Rom. 11:22, 1 Cor. 4:4, 1 Cor. 9:27, 1 Cor. 10:12, 1 Tim. 4:1, 1 Tim. 4:16, 2 Tim. 2:12, Heb. 3:6, Heb. 3:12-14, Heb. 6:4-6, Heb. 10:26-27, 2 Pet. 2:20-21, 2 Pet. 3:17, 1 John 2:24, 1 John 5:13, Rev. 3:5, Rev. 22:19).

And Jesus was NEVER deceptive about having to cooperate with God's Grace.
- Being baptized (Matt. 28:19-20, John 3:5, Rom. 2:29, Rom. 6:1-11, Col. 2:12-17, 1 Peter 3:21)
- Picking up our cross daily to follow him (Matt. 16:24, Luke 9:23)
- Works of mercy and charity (Matt. 19:21, 25:31–46, Luke 18:22)
- Obeying his commandments (John 14:15, 15:10)
- Doing the will of the Father (Matt. 7:21, James 1:22)
- Suffering with Christ (Matt. 10:38, 16:24, Mark 8:34, John 12:24, Rom. 8:17, 2 Cor. 1:5-7, Eph. 3:13, Phil. 1:29, 2 Tim. 1:8, 1 Peter 2:19-21, 4:1-2)

Only "deceptive" to those who don't know God's Word . . .

lol

dude, I jut can't take your anger and your unchristlike behavior anymore

He did give the groundrules. He said I give it to you, its yours.

I gave conditions AFTER you moved it. which means I lied about giving it to you. I said it was free, but you really had to earn it.

 

[BreadOfLife]

"...the devils also believe*, and tremble." James 2:19​

*Strong's #4100

πιστεύω pisteúō, pist-yoo'-o; from G4102; to have faith (in, upon, or with respect to, a person or thing), i.e. credit; by implication, to entrust (especially one's spiritual well-being to Christ):—believe(-r), commit (to trust), put in trust with.

G4100 - pisteuō - Strong's Greek Lexicon (kjv)​

So, as we can see, to 'have faith' does in fact mean belief, or believing. Believe means to 'have faith'. Context shows what it is it that one is having faith in. The demons believe (have faith) that God is one. What they do not believe (have faith in) is the blood of Christ for the forgiveness of sin. But they 'have faith', nonetheless.

Nice TRY - but that's NOT even what James was explaining in verse 19.

Pay attentiion:
James 2:18-19
But someone will say, “You have faith; I have deeds.”
Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds. You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder.

James is conp[aring the FAITH (albeit incomplete faith) of some of his readers to that of the demons. According to James - thoier faith is EXACTLY olike the demons because they don't have WORKSm which complete a person's faith - they don't "result" from it.

Faith = Beolief + Works.
THAT'S whatr James is trying to get across to them - and YOU.

 

[theefaith]

you will only see what you want to,

My explanation is for ALL examples of someone who gives something based on grace, and ALL examples of earning a wage or reward.

Even to the rejection of the gospel and scripture say you!

rejection of the teaching authority of the church is rejection of Christ! Matt 18:17

What about repentance?
True Contrition for sin?
True Sorrow for offending God?
Compunction of heart?

 

[theefaith]

No, justified by faith, all by itself, apart from works. His humility is the result of his faith. Humility has no power to make one guiltless before God. Only God's forgiveness can do that.

the gospel verses do not mention faith!
Humility and prayer that’s it!

next
What about repentance?
True Contrition for sin?
True Sorrow for offending God?
Compunction of heart?

 

[BreadOfLife]

lol

dude, I jut can't take your anger and your unchristlike behavior anymore

He did give the groundrules. He said I give it to you, its yours.

I gave conditions AFTER you moved it. which means I lied about giving it to you. I said it was free, but you really had to earn it.

Thanks for at least admotting that you don't takje Jesus seriously when He said that we must do the following . . .

- Be baptized (Matt. 28:19-20, John 3:5, Rom. 2:29, Rom. 6:1-11, Col. 2:12-17, 1 Peter 3:21)
- Picking up our cross daily to follow him (Matt. 16:24, Luke 9:23)
- DO Works of mercy and charity (Matt. 19:21, 25:31–46, Luke 18:22)
- Obeying his commandments (John 14:15, 15:10)
- DO the will of the Father (Matt. 7:21, James 1:22)
- Suffer with Christ (Matt. 10:38, 16:24, Mark 8:34, John 12:24, Rom. 8:17, 2 Cor. 1:5-7, Eph. 3:13, Phil. 1:29, 2 Tim. 1:8, 1 Peter 2:19-21, 4:1-2)

Good luck with that . . .

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Thanks for at least admotting that you don't takje Jesus seriously when He said that we must do the following . . .

- Be baptized (Matt. 28:19-20, John 3:5, Rom. 2:29, Rom. 6:1-11, Col. 2:12-17, 1 Peter 3:21)
- Picking up our cross daily to follow him (Matt. 16:24, Luke 9:23)
- DO Works of mercy and charity (Matt. 19:21, 25:31–46, Luke 18:22)
- Obeying his commandments (John 14:15, 15:10)
- DO the will of the Father (Matt. 7:21, James 1:22)
- Suffer with Christ (Matt. 10:38, 16:24, Mark 8:34, John 12:24, Rom. 8:17, 2 Cor. 1:5-7, Eph. 3:13, Phil. 1:29, 2 Tim. 1:8, 1 Peter 2:19-21, 4:1-2)

Good luck with that . . .

I do take him seriously. In fact I do all of those things (or have done them)

The difference between you and I is you do them hoping because if it you will earn salvation.

I do them because I am saved, and out of gratitude to the one who gave me eternal life.