BreadOfLife
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"You see that a person is justified by works and not by faith alone" - the Holy Spirit, James 2:24.
Secure Eternal Salvation
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Marymog
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BreadOfLife
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Name ONE single theological position on which the Catholic Church has "changed" its position - or simply admit that you are lyng ahgain.
On the Protestant side, however . . .
Virtually EVERY splintered Protestant sect wasa against the use of contraception until the Anglican Church held its Lambeth Conference in 1930 and changed their poisition.
After that, vurtually EVERY Protestant sect followed suit and allowed contrqception.
Some have since turned back and are now discouraging the use of contraception - but most still allow it.
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Eternally Grateful
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I agree whole heatedly
when the christ says anyone who eats this bread will never die. And someone comes and says they can still die. They refuse to see what Jesus said
BreadOfLife
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Spoken like a person who doesn't understand that salvation is conditoional on our cooperation with God's grace.
The Bible wars us of this over and over and over again - yet your anti-Catholic hatred outshines your interest in the Word of God (Matt. 7:19-23, Matt. 10:22, Matt. 24:13, Matt. 25:31–46, John 15:1-6, Rom. 11:22, 1 Cor. 4:4, 1 Cor. 9:27, 1 Cor. 10:12, 1 Tim. 4:1, 1 Tim. 4:16, 2 Tim. 2:12, Heb. 3:6, Heb. 3:12-14, Heb. 6:4-6, Heb. 10:26-27, 2 Pet. 2:20-21, 2 Pet. 3:17, 1 John 2:24, 1 John 5:13, Rev. 3:5, Rev. 22:19).
Remember - Rom.10:9 says:
If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
HOWEVER - Matt. 7:21 states explicitly:
Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but ONLY the one who DOES the will of my Father who is in heaven.
Don;t just skim through and quote Scripture - LEARN what it means.
Eternally Grateful
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Same old stuff
1. Jesus did not mean what he said.
2. Grace (unmerited favor) must be merited. hence it is not really grace
[QUOTE="Eternally Grateful,
Jesus alone! No conditions no rules no commandments
why does Jesus command us to obey what he gave to the apostles to teach us?
Matt 28:19-20
19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
Jesus alone no conditions??????
Do not need to obey the commandments of God!
Do not need to carry you’re cross!
Do not need sanctification or to grow in grace!
Don’t store up Treasure in heaven!
Do not need to listen to the teaching authority of Christ in His church!
???????????????
Jesus alone! No conditions no rules no commandments
why does Jesus command us to obey what he gave to the apostles to teach us?
Matt 28:19-20
19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
Jesus alone no conditions??????
Do not need to obey the commandments of God!
Do not need to carry you’re cross!
Do not need sanctification or to grow in grace!
Don’t store up Treasure in heaven!
Do not need to listen to the teaching authority of Christ in His church!
???????????????
Illuminator
Well-Known Member
Same old stuff. You never tire of repeating the same old LIE over and over again.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
If you mean in regard to being justified (being made righteous), the only condition for that is trust in the blood of Christ to forgive your sin.
None of these things make you righteous.
These are the things you do after you are made righteous, and because you are righteous.
Only if the teaching authority is really from Christ as evidenced by 1) the witness of the Spirit, 2) the lifestyle of the one who claims to have that authority, and 3) if what they say can be verified from the scriptures.
Eternally Grateful
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Lie?
What lie? I just repeated what Jesus said
John 6:51
I am the living bread which came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever; and the bread that I shall give is My flesh, which I shall give for the life of the world.”
John 6:58
This is the bread which came down from heaven—not as your fathers ate the manna, and are dead. He who eats this bread will live forever.”
are you like breadOfLife and think Jesus lied?
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
Grace, Unmerited favor
If it is of grace it is no longer of works otherwise, grace is no longer grace.
Not by works of righteousness (good deed) which we have done. but by his mercy.
If you work to earn something. Your not given mercy, your given a reward.
Jesus alone, the cross alone. Without the shedding of blood!!!!
you have a choice, trust Christ, or trust your works.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Justified has more than one Biblical definition:
1. to show or prove to be just, right, or reasonable: The pleasure we get from these paintings justifies their high cost.
2. to defend or uphold as warranted or well-grounded: Don't try to justify his rudeness.
3. to declare innocent or guiltless; absolve; acquit.
justify
2. to defend or uphold as warranted or well-grounded: Don't try to justify his rudeness.
3. to declare innocent or guiltless; absolve; acquit.
justify
Faith justifies in that it makes you righteous (see definition #3 above). This is Paul's argument.
Faith all by itself without works secures the righteousness that comes from God, not from you - Romans 3:21. If you had sufficient righteousness to reach out to God to be justified you wouldn't need the righteousness that comes from God. That's why the works argument for justification of the Catholics (being made righteous by faith and works) is a works gospel.
Work justifies in that it shows you to have the righteousness that comes from God (see definition #1 above). That's James' argument (James 2:18, James 2:24).
These two different definitions and usages of 'justified' is what keeps James' argument (James 2:24) from contradicting Paul's argument (Romans 3:28, Romans 4:2, Romans 4:5-6). This simple truth evades the priesthood of the Catholic church. And so they invented this false teaching that says 'faith is works' in their vain attempt to reconcile the two. But all they ended up doing is creating the very works gospel that Paul warned us about. But that seems to be what the Catholic church is all about - getting people to do what the Bible says not to do. This is just another example of that.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Only faith all by itself can secure the righteousness that comes from God.
Works are the result of having the righteousness that comes from God.
It's impossible for works to forgive your sin. Only the mercy and grace of God can forgive sin and make you righteous.
Trust is works! You must choose (volition)
explain the gospel
Matt 5:7 Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.
Luke 7:47
Wherefore I say unto thee, Her sins, which are many, are forgiven; for she loved much: but to whom little is forgiven, the same loveth little.
the commands in matt 28:19-20
Matt 6:12 And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.
1 Peter 4:8
And above all things have fervent charity among yourselves: for charity shall cover the multitude of sins.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
To have faith means to have faith in the blood of Christ (Romans 3:25). The person who believes in the blood of Christ trusts by faith that it is the sufficient payment for sin through which God absolves that believer of all guilt, thus making him righteous in his sight. You can't get that by working righteousness. You get that by believing/trusting in the blood of Christ. That's why justification is a reward of grace, through faith, not a reward of obligation owed to you for righteous work completed (Romans 4:4).
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Call it what you want, but it is clearly delineated from all other things you can 'do' to secure the righteousness that comes from God through the forgiveness of sin.
While you're busy offering up your righteousness, through your works, to be made right with God, we are 'busy' trusting that the blood of Christ makes us righteous through the forgiveness of sin, and our works are the result of that righteousness we have received from God. This difference is why you are Catholic and we are Protesters.
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The nature of vices and virtues!
Pride must at all times:
Protests!
In rebellion!
Say “I will not serve”!
No Protestant, fundamentalist, or charismatic can be humble!
Humility is always:
Is faithful!
Obedient!
Submission to proper authority!
"My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me."
that’s why you’re protesting and we are faithful
Pride must at all times:
Protests!
In rebellion!
Say “I will not serve”!
No Protestant, fundamentalist, or charismatic can be humble!
Humility is always:
Is faithful!
Obedient!
Submission to proper authority!
"My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me."
that’s why you’re protesting and we are faithful
