satan loves to give people a false security in the doctrine of OSAS so that they believe that they can continue in a lifestyle of sinning and still be saved.
Once Saved Always Saved
- Thread starter Charlie24
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
- Status
satan loves to give people a false security in the doctrine of OSAS so that they believe that they can continue in a lifestyle of sinning and still be saved.
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
But does not prevent it, nor reward it.
Again if heaven is full of evil, is it a reward for good people?
Your beliefs have to make some sort of sense.
The mansions that Christ talks about, were they setup for evil?
Is heaven all about evil?
Does Bible refer to heaven as the abode of evil?
Is your neighbor in heaven going to Hitler?
Why would we say there will be evil in heaven?
God saves us from evil, cleanses us, recreates us, new, righteous. And we already live in the heavenly realm, according to Ephesians 2. And 2 Cor. 5.
No, of course there will not be evil in heaven. Well, actually, Satan is currently in heaven, apparently. Though he's scheduled to be cast out. But more to the point, We look for a new heaven, and a new earth, in which righteousness lives.
And my neighbor will be anyone else who repented and believed, just like me.
Much love!
There you go. Your focus is simply on sinning. No need for any further responses.
If we turn our ears away from hearing the law, even our prayer shall be an abomination (Proverbs 28:9); and through the law is the knowledge of sin (Romans 3:20).
You seem to think that being conscious of sin when we commit it is some kind of wrong thing.
The only time we can rightly be unconscious of sin is when we are not committing it.
If we are committing it, then when we "look into the perfect law of liberty" (James 1:25), we will find out that we are still a sinner in need of a Saviour and we must come to Christ in repentance over that.
It is important that we walk in the light as He is in the light (1 John 1:7).
Once Saved Always Saved
Faith-Unbelief - Thompson Chain Reference -
Here is a huge list of scriptures, of many different topics if you would like to look in to faith / unbelief.
Faith-Unbelief - Thompson Chain Reference -
Here is a huge list of scriptures, of many different topics if you would like to look in to faith / unbelief.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Continuing to believe is not new believing. It's the exact same believing you started on the day you were born again. If it wasn't works then it isn't now.
New believing is saving faith. And God gives you rebirth. Now you are different. Now your relationship with God is different. Now the principles which govern your life are different.
It's not the same.
In your view, you are saved today because you believe today, and you will be saved tomorrow if you believe tomorrow. You will be saved the next day, or maybe not, if you believe, or don't, the next day.
In my view. I believe, and God gives me birth. Now I am His child. I will remain His child forever. You go round and round and round about saving faith. Saving faith was many years ago, and I was reborn, and my faith is God's power in me, and you think that's going to just go away?? I don't!
And may you never, for your sake, and theirs, convince anyone otherwise!
God has promised. I'm not about to start thinking He's going to fail me! Preposterous! God does not change, and He has promised.
Much love!
Precious friend, Yes, Obviously, ALL Bible students should know by now,
That God Is MOST HOLY, And, That that sin {evil} CANNOT "Be Allowed
In HIS PRESENCE!" Correct? So, can the righteous become UNrighteous, by
sinning (evil), and NOT go to heaven?
God Said, Through the righteous Saint Paul, or is he UNrighteous?:
Rom 7:18 "For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good
thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good
I find not."
But, Obviously, at the rapture, There Is Going To Be:
A Great Change for All the righteous!:
Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be
changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for
the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and
WE {still living in our SINFUL flesh} Shall Be Changed. For this corrupt-
ible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
(1 Corinthians 15 : 51-53 KJB!) ------- {Or are WE UNrighteous?}
Obvious Confirmation of:
"the fornicating {UNrighteous?} SAINT" in the carnal Corinthian assembly:
1Co 5:5a
"To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh,..."
Obviously then, for the righteous Only, the "evil" flesh, will be Either
"Changed or Destroyed," and, thus "NO evil will enter heaven!," Correct?
Then, Even More Importantly Obvious, Because of The All-Sufficient
BLOOD Of CHRIST, IS The "Much More Abounding" GRACE {UNmerited
Favor}, From God!:
1Co 5:5b "...that the spirit may be saved in The Day of The LORD JESUS."
Obviously, "The Day" = The JUDGMENT Seat Of CHRIST!:
"Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every
man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour.
For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry,
ye are God's building. According The GRACE Of God Which Is Given
unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid The Foundation, and
another buildeth Thereon.
But let every man take heed how he buildeth Thereupon. For other
foundation can no man lay than That is laid, Which Is JESUS CHRIST.
Now if any man build upon This Foundation gold, silver, precious
stones, wood, hay, stubble;..."
{ Wait: Precious friend, do you believe?:
"gold, silver, precious stones" are for the righteous Only,
and the "wood, hay, stubble" are the UNrighteous Only?
Q: Since when are the UNrighteous "co-laborers With God" v. 9? }
Well, Obviously!:
"...Every [we are labourers together with God] man's work shall be
made manifest: for The Day Shall Declare it, because it Shall Be
Revealed by fire; and the fire Shall Try every {co-laborers} man's
work of what sort it is.
If any man's work abide which he hath built Thereupon, he shall
receive a reward. If any man's work shall be burned, he shall
suffer loss: but he himself SHALL BE SAVED; yet so as by fire."
(1 Corinthians 3 : 8-15 KJB!)
What? ONLY the righteous Are SAVED? Then, "The wood, hay
and stubble" Must Have Been the "bad [evil] works OF the righteous!"
Thus, Confirmation That the "evil was Burned By Fire," and thus:
As YOU, and me, And Paul, And God ALL AGREE!:
"NO evil enters heaven," Correct? Precious friend?
Obvious Conclusion, for the righteous ONLY!:
the flesh is SINFUL, and will be destroyed/changed, And:
the spirit then, Must Be "righteous," Because, "it WILL BE SAVED!"
Amen?
Addendum:
What ONE thing Did God Inspire Paul to know Among
the EVIL, divided carnal Corinthian righteous saints?:
1Co 2:2 "For I determined not to know any thing among
you, save JESUS CHRIST, And HIM Crucified."
Praise God For HIS ALL-Sufficient BLOOD! Amen?
--------------------------------------------
"For whom HE Did Foreknow, HE Also Did Predestinate To Be
Conformed To The Image Of HIS SON, that HE Might Be The
Firstborn among many brethren."
(Romans 8 : 29 KJB!) Correct, Precious friend?
Seriously, critics believe God's BLOOD Is INsufficient, and,
That God Is UNable To PERFORM "What HE Has Spoken"?
Conclusion:
There is Obviously A BIG Difference Between "the righteous who sin,"
having the ALL-Sufficient BLOOD of their Savior Cleansing them from
ALL sin, thus, their "spirit IS SAVED In The Day Of The LORD JESUS'
Bema Seat!" {Thus, "NO evil" enters heaven!}
AND:
the UNrighteous who sin, having NO Saviour, and Thus NO BLOOD To
Cleanse them, and, they Will Suffer Eternal Condemnation At The
Great White Throne JUDGMENT! {Confirming: "NO evil enters heaven!"}
Thus, MAXIMIZING evil sin MORE Than The Wonderful Amazing
GRACE Of God, is, well, Backwards And Upside Down, is it not?
Obviously, God's Word Teaches:
"Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. BUT where
sin abounded, GRACE Did MUCH MORE ABOUND!" (Romans 5 : 20 KJB!)
-------------------------------------------------------------
?See you in God’s Great GloryLand! ↑ :) ♫
Last edited:
Saying that faith will never cease in your heart because of the sealing of the Holy Ghost, is different from saying that you will continue to be saved even if you don't have faith.
In the former thing, the person continues to be saved because he continues to have faith.
In the latter, he can still be saved even though he loses faith. That is heresy.
It should be clear that something can occur in the Christian's life, which is called the adoption, to wit, the redemption of the body (Romans 8:23).
This adoption, defined as the redemption of the body, had already occurred in the Galatians (Galatians 4:5-7).
To the Romans, it was something hoped for and not yet seen (Romans 8:24-25).
But according to faith, they have the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen (Hebrews 11:1); that is, the redemption of the body.
This is spoken of in the following.
Rom 8:10, And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
Rom 8:11, But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
Rom 8:12, Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.
Rom 8:13, For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
This adoption, defined as the redemption of the body, had already occurred in the Galatians (Galatians 4:5-7).
To the Romans, it was something hoped for and not yet seen (Romans 8:24-25).
But according to faith, they have the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen (Hebrews 11:1); that is, the redemption of the body.
This is spoken of in the following.
Rom 8:10, And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
Rom 8:11, But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
Rom 8:12, Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.
Rom 8:13, For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
Can clean clothes become dirty clothes? Still clothes...Christians washed.... Can clothes get so dirty and stinky that you do not bother washing them, you just haul them out of the house to the dumpster....LOL...hell.
Very gracious of Paul...humble...then again he is not really known for his sinful lifestyle after the conversion.
They aught to put this in a poem...unfortunately, several interpretations and no consensus
Explanation....
Evil will go to hell...
Those that go to heaven, their substance will change but not their character. If God was going to impose a "heaven character" there would be no need for the physical life or Judgment, Bypassing all the evil and suffering.
Probably the confusion factor, is that people think that the instant in time we are saved...that that is a ticket to heaven that cannot be revoked, and that is wrong and a dangerous belief. This belief negates the need for Judgment Day.
Salvation is rock solid for your average Christian, regardless of their life before they were saved. Christ and the Apostles talk about "points" for Good Deeds but that is not the salvation process...just extra credit...LOL...otherwise all Christians are the same. The average Christian is going to sin...ask forgiveness ...and receive forgiveness ... Pass through Judgment Day easily and go to heaven.
The question of heinous sins that haunt others for their whole life, is a question....that I have.
On the other hand lifestyle sins like LGBTQ, lifetime of various sexual perversions, Abortion doctors and staff, serial killers, ie career and lifetime evildoers will go to hell for eternity. You cannot repent or get forgiveness for some things you continue your "whole life."
This goes back to the impossibility of heaven being full of evil. And the impossibility that God would force good people to exist in heaven with evil for eternity. The evil would out number the good people...and an evil heaven would be no reward for Good people and God could not remain there.
The question, if Hitler could have received salvation in the last five minutes of his life...is a question for me.
The bottom line...the truth...if you want to go to heaven, after you are saved....Beeee Gooood! Do the best you can...that is all that
God can ask.
There is a reason why judgment is called Judgment Day as opposed to ruling day. There can be stipulations and extenuating circumstances that may cause people to sin...do wrong things. There are people that have mental and emotional disabilities that cause them to do wrong things...strange things. Which generates guilt for them that makes things worse and causes them to do more wrong things. I do not believe that Christ will hold this against them as long as they try the best they can....if they can try.
I have friends with youth camps for troubled youth...so I have counseled some youth. The biggest point is to relieve the guilt and throw that to the curb. Then address the behavior and how to prevent it. What help they need to accomplish this?
Last edited:
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Good. No one's trying to take that away from you. But you should not project your experience on everyone else. The Bible warns us to keep believing, so I guess you're really leveling this argument against God.
The thing is that scriptures speaks about salvation. There is salvation from a lot of other things and salvation from eternal punishment or hell. And we can find both salvation in God, by His grace. The former concerns this life on earth and the latter the after life. And we ought to read scriptures, rightly dividing the word in that respect.
There are scriptures that speaks about what Jesus Christ had accomplished by his life, death, and resurrection from the dead, for those whom the Father had given Him to raise up and give them life, eternal life even, and have their home with God. He had saved them from eternal punishment for their sins. That is a done deed, accomplished by Jesus Christ. Nothing could change that anymore. It’s just a matter of time that all the children of God will be revealed. The scriptures speaks of the certainty of this happening in the future time.
Consider now, the elect, still lives in the body of death and is still in the world. He will inevitably be experiencing and will be confronted by so many things pertaining to the things of world and the works of wicked men and the devil. His problem is his corrupted and sinful flesh. Sin dwells in it and wars with his spirit. It is where exhortations and encouragement comes in. For there are temptations and deceptions here and there and everywhere. And so what would we say to one another regarding that, but that, as the apostles did, let us continue and endure.
Jesus said that false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. Such statement should not frighten the true Christian. For in that statement, is the impossibility that the elect will ever be deceived and fall away from Jesus Christ.
Tong
R2852
There are scriptures that speaks about what Jesus Christ had accomplished by his life, death, and resurrection from the dead, for those whom the Father had given Him to raise up and give them life, eternal life even, and have their home with God. He had saved them from eternal punishment for their sins. That is a done deed, accomplished by Jesus Christ. Nothing could change that anymore. It’s just a matter of time that all the children of God will be revealed. The scriptures speaks of the certainty of this happening in the future time.
Consider now, the elect, still lives in the body of death and is still in the world. He will inevitably be experiencing and will be confronted by so many things pertaining to the things of world and the works of wicked men and the devil. His problem is his corrupted and sinful flesh. Sin dwells in it and wars with his spirit. It is where exhortations and encouragement comes in. For there are temptations and deceptions here and there and everywhere. And so what would we say to one another regarding that, but that, as the apostles did, let us continue and endure.
Jesus said that false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. Such statement should not frighten the true Christian. For in that statement, is the impossibility that the elect will ever be deceived and fall away from Jesus Christ.
Tong
R2852
Last edited:
The bible indicates with-in itself that
Once Saved Always Saved is not true,
Though do believe that the Son of God - paid the sacrifices for all of the sins for the entire world - ~ ~ Which pleased the Father for the Son of God to do on be-half of everyone to save them from their sins. ~ Which is effective for every person who are born in this world today.
~ Though Sin has been paid for according to the bible not only for believers, but for all people of the world.
A person can indeed leave the faith, or have doubt in faith, or even lose faith over time if they are not being build up in the Faith in trusting towards God, and having an active relationship with the Father, and the Son of God Jesus Christ.
Which all people have access to be able to do - have a relationship - by and through faith.
Without faith - losing faith - doubting faith - walking away ~ Seems to be a result of no longer staying in belief ~
Which all this being said, it is always possible to leave or lose faith ~
It is possible for me to be wrong but according to what the bible does say It seems a person needs to continue actively in faith, so they do not lose hope, lose faith, leave the faith all together walking away from God and having a hard heart of unbelief.
Once Saved Always Saved is not true,
Though do believe that the Son of God - paid the sacrifices for all of the sins for the entire world - ~ ~ Which pleased the Father for the Son of God to do on be-half of everyone to save them from their sins. ~ Which is effective for every person who are born in this world today.
~ Though Sin has been paid for according to the bible not only for believers, but for all people of the world.
A person can indeed leave the faith, or have doubt in faith, or even lose faith over time if they are not being build up in the Faith in trusting towards God, and having an active relationship with the Father, and the Son of God Jesus Christ.
Which all people have access to be able to do - have a relationship - by and through faith.
Without faith - losing faith - doubting faith - walking away ~ Seems to be a result of no longer staying in belief ~
Which all this being said, it is always possible to leave or lose faith ~
It is possible for me to be wrong but according to what the bible does say It seems a person needs to continue actively in faith, so they do not lose hope, lose faith, leave the faith all together walking away from God and having a hard heart of unbelief.
Triumph1300
Well-Known Member
I have seen many discussions about the OSAS issue.
Saw many posts over the last 40+ years, many convincing messages on both sides of the issue.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
That's why I say we should just focus on, and do what is plain in the Bible about the subject and which is not up for debate.........keep believing.
- Status
Similar threads
