Losing Your Salvation - Bible Verses

[Big Boy Johnson]

1 John 1:8 - If we say that we have no sin, (present tense) we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, (past tense) we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

Have fun trying to explain these scriptures away...

1 John 3:6
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not

1 John 2:4
He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

1 John 1:6
if we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:

1 John 2:1
I write these things unto you, that ye sin not


Apparently you believe 1 John 1:9 is not really true because if one confesses their sin God's Word clearly states that the Lord is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from ALL unrighteousness

So in your view the Lord does not actually cleanse us from ALL unrighteousness, right?

 

[Ritajanice]

God tells the truth and keeps His promises.​

Titus 1:2 “In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;”

Belief births you into God’s family.​

John 1:12 “But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:”

Jesus promised you would not perish.​

John 3:16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.”

You are not condemned (reserved for destruction).​

John 3:18 “He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.”

You currently have everlasting life.​

John 3:36 “He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.”

You passed from death unto life.​

John 5:24 “Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”

Jesus will not cast you out for any reason.​

John 6:37 “All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.”

Jesus knows His sheep.​

John 10:27 “My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:”

Jesus gave you eternal life.​

John 10:28 “And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.”

You are in Jesus’ hand and no one can get you out.​

John 10:28b “neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.”

The Father placed His hand over the Son’s and no one is more powerful than Him.​

John 10:29 “My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father’s hand.”

The combined strength of God the Father and God the Son is protecting your soul.​

John 10:30 “I and my Father are one.”

Jesus promised that you would never die.​

John 11:25–26 “Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?”

God is your Father.​

Romans 8:15 “For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.”

You are two-fold the Child of God; by birth and by adoption.​

Romans 8:15 “For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.”

The Holy Spirit bears witness with our spirit reminding us that we are saved.​

Romans 8:16 “The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:”

God is the Judge of the soul and He already gave you His verdict.​

Romans 8:31–33 “What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us? He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things? Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God’s elect? It is God that justifieth.”

Jesus Christ is at the right hand of the Father making intercession for us.​

Romans 8:34 “Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.”

Nothing can separate you from the love of Christ.​

Romans 8:35–39 “Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter. Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.”

You are a new Creature.​

2 Corinthians 5:17 “Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.”

You are made righteous in Christ.​

2 Corinthians 5:21 “For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.”

You are sealed with the Holy Spirit.​

Ephesians 1:13–14 “In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.”

You are saved by grace through faith not by works.​

Ephesians 2:8–9 “For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.”

You are kept by the power of God.​

1 Peter 1:5 “Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.”

You are a citizen of Heaven.​

Philippians 3:20 “For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:”

You are seated in Heavenly places.​

Ephesians 2:6 “And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:”

 

[mailmandan]

Have fun trying to explain these scriptures away... I don't need to explain anything away. I instead properly harmonize scripture with scripture before reaching my conclusion on doctrine. I hope this lesson in Biblical hermeneutics helps.

I don't need to explain these scriptures away. I instead properly harmonize scripture with scripture before reaching my conclusion on doctrine. I hope this lesson in Biblical hermeneutics below helps.

1 John 3:6
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not

Greek scholar AT Robertson has a thorough explanation for you.

Sinneth not (ουχ αμαρτανε). Linear present (linear μενων, keeps on abiding) active indicative of αμαρτανω, "does not keep on sinning." For μενω (abide) see 1 John 2:6; John 15:4-10.

Whosoever sinneth (ο αμαρτανων). Present (linear) active articular participle like μενων above, "the one who keeps on sinning" (lives a life of sin, not mere occasional acts of sin as αμαρτησας, aorist active participle, would mean).

Hath not seen him (ουχ εωρακεν αυτον). Perfect active indicative of οραω. The habit of sin is proof that one has not the vision or the knowledge (εγνωκεν, perfect active also) of Christ. He means, of course, spiritual vision and spiritual knowledge, not the literal sense of οραω in John 1:18; John 20:29.

Doeth no sin (αμαρτιαν ου ποιε). Linear present active indicative as in verse 1 John 3:4 like αμαρτανε in verse 1 John 3:8. The child of God does not have the habit of sin.

His seed (σπερμα αυτου). God's seed, "the divine principle of life" (Vincent). Cf. 1 John 3:1.

And he cannot sin (κα ου δυνατα αμαρτανειν). This is a wrong translation, for this English naturally means "and he cannot commit sin" as if it were κα ου δυνατα αμαρτειν or αμαρτησα (second aorist or first aorist active infinitive). The present active infinitive αμαρτανειν can only mean "and he cannot go on sinning," as is true of αμαρτανε in verse 1 John 3:8 and αμαρτανων in verse 1 John 3:6.

1 John 3 - Robertson's Word Pictures in the New Testament - Bible Commentaries - StudyLight.org

1 John 3, Robertson's Word Pictures in the New Testament, Robertson's Word Pictures of the New Testament is a rich resource for understanding Scripture, delving into original language and cultural nuances.

www.studylight.org

1 John 2:4
He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

1 John 2:3 - By this we know that we have come to know Him, (already know Him/already saved/demonstrative evidence) if we "keep" (Greek word "tereo" - guard, observe, watch over) His commandments. 4 The one who says, “I have come to know Him,” and does not keep (guard, observe, watch over) His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. This does not mean flawlessly obey the 10 commandments 100% of the time under the old covenant of law (sinless perfection) which ONLY Jesus Christ has done. (Ecclesiastes 7:20; Romans 3:23; Hebrews 4:15; 1 John 3:5)

1 John 1:6
if we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:

1 John 1:6 - If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.

*Walking in darkness is descriptive of children of the devil. Walking in the light is descriptive of children of God. Only those who are saved/believers are in the light.

Acts 26:18 - to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.

2 Corinthians 6:14 - Do not be unequally yoked together with unbelievers. For what fellowship has righteousness with lawlessness? And what communion has light with darkness?

Ephesians 5:8 - for you were formerly darkness, but now you are Light in the Lord; walk as children of Light. Children of the devil walk in darkness, not in the light. Children of God walk in the light, not in darkness. IF confirms these positions in verses 6 and 7. It's one or the other.

In 1 John 2:9, we read - He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. In vs. 11 - But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.

*Compare with 1 John 3:10 - In this the children of God and the children of the devil are manifest: Whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, (compare with 1 John 1:6 - does not practice the truth) nor is he who does not love his brother.

*Notice that walks in darkness, hates his brother is descriptive of children of the devil.

1 John 2:1
I write these things unto you, that ye sin not

Keep reading. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. 2 And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world. *So much for sinless perfection.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I don't need to explain these scriptures away. I instead properly harmonize scripture with scripture before reaching my conclusion on doctrine. I hope this lesson in Biblical hermeneutics below helps.


Greek scholar AT Robertson has a thorough explanation for you.

Sinneth not (ουχ αμαρτανε). Linear present (linear μενων, keeps on abiding) active indicative of αμαρτανω, "does not keep on sinning." For μενω (abide) see 1 John 2:6; John 15:4-10.

Whosoever sinneth (ο αμαρτανων). Present (linear) active articular participle like μενων above, "the one who keeps on sinning" (lives a life of sin, not mere occasional acts of sin as αμαρτησας, aorist active participle, would mean).

Hath not seen him (ουχ εωρακεν αυτον). Perfect active indicative of οραω. The habit of sin is proof that one has not the vision or the knowledge (εγνωκεν, perfect active also) of Christ. He means, of course, spiritual vision and spiritual knowledge, not the literal sense of οραω in John 1:18; John 20:29.

Doeth no sin (αμαρτιαν ου ποιε). Linear present active indicative as in verse 1 John 3:4 like αμαρτανε in verse 1 John 3:8. The child of God does not have the habit of sin.

His seed (σπερμα αυτου). God's seed, "the divine principle of life" (Vincent). Cf. 1 John 3:1.

And he cannot sin (κα ου δυνατα αμαρτανειν). This is a wrong translation, for this English naturally means "and he cannot commit sin" as if it were κα ου δυνατα αμαρτειν or αμαρτησα (second aorist or first aorist active infinitive). The present active infinitive αμαρτανειν can only mean "and he cannot go on sinning," as is true of αμαρτανε in verse 1 John 3:8 and αμαρτανων in verse 1 John 3:6.

1 John 3 - Robertson's Word Pictures in the New Testament - Bible Commentaries - StudyLight.org

1 John 3, Robertson's Word Pictures in the New Testament, Robertson's Word Pictures of the New Testament is a rich resource for understanding Scripture, delving into original language and cultural nuances.

www.studylight.org

1 John 2:3 - By this we know that we have come to know Him, (already know Him/already saved/demonstrative evidence) if we "keep" (Greek word "tereo" - guard, observe, watch over) His commandments. 4 The one who says, “I have come to know Him,” and does not keep (guard, observe, watch over) His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. This does not mean flawlessly obey the 10 commandments 100% of the time under the old covenant of law (sinless perfection) which ONLY Jesus Christ has done. (Ecclesiastes 7:20; Romans 3:23; Hebrews 4:15; 1 John 3:5)


1 John 1:6 - If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.

*Walking in darkness is descriptive of children of the devil. Walking in the light is descriptive of children of God. Only those who are saved/believers are in the light.

Acts 26:18 - to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.

2 Corinthians 6:14 - Do not be unequally yoked together with unbelievers. For what fellowship has righteousness with lawlessness? And what communion has light with darkness?

Ephesians 5:8 - for you were formerly darkness, but now you are Light in the Lord; walk as children of Light. Children of the devil walk in darkness, not in the light. Children of God walk in the light, not in darkness. IF confirms these positions in verses 6 and 7. It's one or the other.

In 1 John 2:9, we read - He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. In vs. 11 - But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.

*Compare with 1 John 3:10 - In this the children of God and the children of the devil are manifest: Whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, (compare with 1 John 1:6 - does not practice the truth) nor is he who does not love his brother.

*Notice that walks in darkness, hates his brother is descriptive of children of the devil.


Keep reading. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. 2 And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world. *So much for sinless perfection.

Some people will only see what they want..

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Greek scholar AT Robertson has a thorough explanation for you.

Jesus Christ has a thorough explanation for you.

John 8:34
Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.

Feel free to follow your idols... I'll stick with Jesus!

 

[St. SteVen]

Some people will only see what they want..

The pitfall of presupposition.

/

 

[mailmandan]

Jesus Christ has a thorough explanation for you.

John 8:34
Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.

Feel free to follow your idols... I'll stick with Jesus!

Jesus doesn't need you to stick with your eisegesis and AT Robertson is not my idol. As iron sharpens iron, so one person sharpens another. (Proverbs 27:17)

In regard to John 8:34, the present active participle, continuous habit or practice, not aorist active participle for single act.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

In regard to John 8:34, the present active participle, continuous habit or practice, not aorist active participle for single act.

And yet.... if one commits ONE single sin and does not forsake and confess it to the Lord, they are on the hook for that sin.

The wages of sin is still death which is separation from God... to say this is not true is mocking God Who says what we sow is what we reap (Gal 6:7,8)

1 John 1:7
But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

 

[mailmandan]

And yet.... if one commits ONE single sin and does not forsake and confess it to the Lord, they are on the hook for that sin.

The wages of sin is still death which is separation from God... to say this is not true is mocking God Who says what we sow is what we reap (Gal 6:7,8)

1 John 1:7
But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

The wages of sin is death (Romans 3:23) BUT the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. (Romans 6:23) In regard to walking in the light, go back and read post #363. In regard to 1 John 1:9, notice that - "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness" (1 John 1:9) is IN CONTRAST to - If we say that we have no sin, (present tense) we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us (1 John 1:8) and - If we say that we have not sinned, (past tense) we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. (1 John 1:10) This is not about works salvation.

Certain people seem to misunderstand verse 9 to mean that we "must confess each and every sin that we commit as we commit them" (keep a specific inventory of every sin we have ever committed) as an "additional requirement" to "remain cleansed" and "if we forget a sin we are toast!" Who could actually write an exhaustive list of every sin they have ever committed or ever will commit? Sin is not only missing the mark by what we do but also what we fail to do. (James 4:17)

Believers "confess" (Greek - homologeó) speak the same/acknowledge/agree with God's perspective about their sins and have a settled recognition and ongoing acknowledgment that one is a sinner in need of cleansing and forgiveness in contrast with saying that we have no sin or that we have not sinned. (1 John 1:8-10)

In regard to Galatians 6:7-8, the one who is continuously (Greek present tense) sowing to his own corrupt, flesh which is opposed to God and unrenewed by the Holy Spirit shall of the flesh reap corruption. Descriptive of unbelievers. Our life here is sowing of one kind or another. But he who sows to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap everlasting life. In opposition to reaping corruption, eternal life is reaped by those who sow to the Spirit. Descriptive of believers.

In Romans 8, the apostle Paul also makes a contrast between believers and unbelievers in regard to those who are in the flesh and those who are not in the flesh but in the Spirit. Romans 8:8 - and those who are in the flesh cannot please God. 9 However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

And yet.... if one commits ONE single sin and does not forsake and confess it to the Lord, they are on the hook for that sin.

The wages of sin is still death which is separation from God... to say this is not true is mocking God Who says what we sow is what we reap (Gal 6:7,8)

1 John 1:7
But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

well, Then God better return to earth and die again.

Because without the shedding of blood. there is no forgiveness.

if God did not die for that sin 2000 years ago. You and I have no hope of we commit that sin.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

The wages of sin is death (Romans 3:23) BUT the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. (Romans 6:23) In regard to walking in the light, go back and read post #363. In regard to 1 John 1:9, notice that - "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness" (1 John 1:9) is IN CONTRAST to - If we say that we have no sin, (present tense) we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us (1 John 1:8) and - If we say that we have not sinned, (past tense) we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. (1 John 1:10) This is not about works salvation.

Certain people seem to misunderstand verse 9 to mean that we "must confess each and every sin that we commit as we commit them" (keep a specific inventory of every sin we have ever committed) as an "additional requirement" to "remain cleansed" and "if we forget a sin we are toast!" Who could actually write an exhaustive list of every sin they have ever committed or ever will commit? Sin is not only missing the mark by what we do but also what we fail to do. (James 4:17)

Believers "confess" (Greek - homologeó) speak the same/acknowledge/agree with God's perspective about their sins and have a settled recognition and ongoing acknowledgment that one is a sinner in need of cleansing and forgiveness in contrast with saying that we have no sin or that we have not sinned. (1 John 1:8-10)

In regard to Galatians 6:7-8, the one who is continuously (Greek present tense) sowing to his own corrupt, flesh which is opposed to God and unrenewed by the Holy Spirit shall of the flesh reap corruption. Descriptive of unbelievers. Our life here is sowing of one kind or another. But he who sows to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap everlasting life. In opposition to reaping corruption, eternal life is reaped by those who sow to the Spirit. Descriptive of believers.

In Romans 8, the apostle Paul also makes a contrast between believers and unbelievers in regard to those who are in the flesh and those who are not in the flesh but in the Spirit. Romans 8:8 - and those who are in the flesh cannot please God. 9 However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him.

if 1 John 1: 9 is required. I pit the world when it gets to heaven and finds all the sin they forgot. or did not know they commited..

Alof of people headed to hell.. (can anyone make it to heaven?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I am amazed at all those who can not comprehend the purpose and meaning of the cross.

1 Cor 1 :18 For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. 19 For it is written:

“I will destroy the wisdom of the wise,
And bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.”

 

[mailmandan]

I am amazed at all those who can not comprehend the purpose and meaning of the cross.

1 Cor 1 :18 For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. 19 For it is written:

“I will destroy the wisdom of the wise,
And bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.”

1 Corinthians 1:21 - For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe.

1 Corinthians 2:11 - For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God. 13 These things we also speak, not in words which man’s wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

if they sat for a minute. their gospel is no different than really any gospel the world teaches.

we get to heaven by how good we are. or what we do.. not by what God did.. we must save ourselves. God did not come to save us

 

[mailmandan]

if they sat for a minute. their gospel is no different than really any gospel the world teaches.

we get to heaven by how good we are. or what we do.. not by what God did.. we must save ourselves. God did not come to save us

I run across a lot of "type 2 works-salvationists." They seem to believe that Jesus merely "initially" saved them but after that they must do the rest. Such people believe they must "maintain" their salvation based on their works/performance/achievements/accomplishments.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I run across a lot of "type 2 works-salvationists." They seem to believe that Jesus merely "initially" saved them but after that they must do the rest. Such people believe they must "maintain" their salvation based on their works/performance/achievements/accomplishments.

Paul calls them fools

Galatians 3:1-3

O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you that you should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed among you as crucified? 2 This only I want to learn from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3. Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now being made perfect by the flesh?

 

[Hillsage]

MAR 1:4 John the baptizer appeared in the wilderness, preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins.
5 And all the country of Judea was going out to him, and all the people of Jerusalem; and they were being baptized by him in the Jordan River, confessing their sins.

So, were the sins of the people John baptized forgiven or not?

 

[Ritajanice]

MAR 1:4 John the baptizer appeared in the wilderness, preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins.
5 And all the country of Judea was going out to him, and all the people of Jerusalem; and they were being baptized by him in the Jordan River, confessing their sins.

So, were the sins of the people John baptized forgiven or not?

No.....not until they are Baptised in the Holy Spirit.

 

[mailmandan]

In Matthew 3:11, we read - I baptize you with water "for" repentance.. Was this baptism for "in order to obtain" repentance? OR was this baptism for "in regard to/on the basis of" remission of sins received upon repentance? Getting water baptized in order to obtain repentance makes no sense at all. Repentance precedes water baptism.

 

[Hillsage]

In Matthew 3:11, we read - I baptize you with water "for" repentance.. Was this baptism for "in order to obtain" repentance? OR was this baptism for "in regard to/on the basis of" remission of sins received upon repentance? Getting water baptized in order to obtain repentance makes no sense at all. Repentance precedes water baptism.

Context answers your question. Before he would baptize the religious leaders wanting FORGIVENESS/REMISSION of their sins. What did John say?

MAT 3:7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming for baptism, he said to them, "You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come? :8 Bear fruit that befits repentance,