Let's discuss..cessation after death?

[marks]

Lol…yes…abiding means remaining in trust and not abiding means not remaining in trust…
You’ve done it again, lol. You think Christ saying abide in me means you can’t stumble and do otherwise. But men who have struggled to fully and radically trust will just scoff at that because they’ve lived the struggle. I can’t quite get at your seeming disconnect between reality and scripture. He says abide in me so it must mean I always do…
I don’t get it.

Have you missed me, mark?

I do miss you when you are not posting, actually, yes. Are you surprised?

I see us existing in a state of recreation in Christ, but we struggle to live accordingly.

But stumbbling doesn't mean you are no longer in Christ.

The disconnect is in the renewing of the mind. The unrenewed mind thinks in fleshy ways, even though they be reborn. As the mind is renewed, we come to think in spiritual ways. As we think, that leads to what we choose, and feel, and do.

I too live, have lived that struggle. You have helped in in that along my way. Are you surprised by that also?

When you are immersed into Christ you stay there. But if you think you are still fleshy, if you fail to take note of your fleshy thoughts, you won't act like it.

When you try to put away the fleshy thoughts, you will find that you can do so to a point, that is, the working out of your salvation what God is working into you. You will not have more desire and ability to please God than God has given you.

And because we can see Jesus, we know God's intent for us, and because we can see ourselves, we know how short we fall.

But that's the unrenewed mind, and in fact, by a complete trust in Jesus, in our reconciliation to Him, this will also be the trust that we have new life, and we can fully live that life.

If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. We can live in the Spirit without walking in the Spirit. We can be reborn but not act reborn.

We can struggle to improve our character, which is what we tend to do, and we can by trusting Jesus walk in the Spirit, which is a new character.

Improving our character is good, but walking in the Spirit is abundant life.

Much love!

 

[Johann]

Lol…yes…abiding means remaining in trust and not abiding means not remaining in trust…

Just leave it and don’t bother with religious men who find it scandalous. Lol.

Then I'll leave it alone/Stallone then and by the way, my info on my profile page is the real me just in case Marks thinks I am a phoney...no offense M.
J.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Well, I think men who walk in the Spirit perform amazing feats. And I don’t think men sin while they are walking in the Spirit. I have not walked in the Spirit, in holiness. But…I just run my race of trust in peace and joy and leave everything to whatever God decides for me. I have walked over a year without my passions torturing me, which is still an amazement to me. Not getting angry and murdering people any more is great relief.

 

[Johann]

And I don’t think men sin while they are walking in the Spirit.

You reckon?

 

[stunnedbygrace]

But stubbling doesn't mean you are no longer in Christ.

As you know, we disagree about that. Our definition of remaining in Him is different just as our definition of death is different. I think abiding in Him means remaining in trust and I think death means cessation of life not eternal existence.

 

[Johann]

I have not walked in the Spirit, in holiness.

Read Romans 6,7 and 8 again


Eph_4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

Php_3:12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.

Guess we are still going on unto perfection or have we already obtained it?
What is perfection?
Holiness?

 

[Johann]

Lol. I’m just an arthritic and decrepit old country gal…

Stay strong in Christ, now I know the vacillating "moods" or fluctuating emotions? Correct me if I had made a wrong assumption.
J.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

I do miss you when you are not posting, actually, yes. Are you surprised?

No, I’m not. We’ve been caught aloft on a current or two in these threads where I knew your heart was burning within you just as mine was in me. I’ve shared that loft with Lambano before too,and DaveH and episkopos and…Nancy and there’s been a faint loft of that unity in here today with johann. I’ve become fond of him very quickly. It’s easier to love you guys unceasingly without my passions ruling me. It’s also easier to endure the times God disappears to my senses. There’s still the feeling at times that I’m doing nothing for God and those…sighs of thirst, but they aren’t as violent without my passions tossing me about.

 

[marks]

Then I'll leave it alone/Stallone then and by the way, my info on my profile page is the real me just in case Marks thinks I am a phoney...no offense M.
J.

Just different taste, that's all! I think what I wrote came across differently from how I meant it, just ignore that.

Much love!

 

[Johann]

and there’s been a faint loft of that unity in here today with johann.

Lol!..a "faint" loft?

 

[marks]

As you know, we disagree about that. Our definition of remaining in Him is different just as our definition of death is different. I think abiding in Him means remaining in trust and I think death means cessation of life not eternal existence.

What does it mean to you to "live in the Spirit"?

Galatians 5:25 KJV
If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.

If we "live in the Spirit", we are admonished to "also walk in the Spirit". How can it be that we might "live in the Spirit" without "walking in the Spirit"?

And if we are not "walking in the Spirit", does that mean we are walking according to the flesh?

Galatians 5:16 KJV
This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

Can we "fulfill the lust of the flesh" even while we "live in the Spirit"? It seems to me that this chapter is teaching us that this is the way life is, that we may "live in the Spirit" while at the same time fulfilling the lust of the flesh. I mean, that's not our ideal state. But this is what is being described here, would you agree with that?

Much love!

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Read Romans 6,7 and 8 again


Eph_4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

Php_3:12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.

Guess we are still going on unto perfection or have we already obtained it?
What is perfection?
Holiness?

Oh I love those verses…The first one is like the tower of Babylon but in reverse sort of, like…if and when we come to speak the same language of the Spirit in the unity of love, then nothing we purpose to do will be impossible for us! I sometimes feel we are on the cusp of it, that loft, that burning of heart but then it’s gone and the feeling is we all are not quite ready for it.

and the second verse, same thing. Trying to grab that…thing we have in fact been grabbed for. The feeling that when one member suffers we all do and that distinct feeling that it has to be together in that unity, that loft, that we will grab hold of what we have been grabbed for.

great verses.

 

[Johann]

There’s still the feeling at times that I’m doing nothing for God and those

I know that feeling...alone and doing nothing for God..
J.

 

[Johann]

great verses.

I'm beginning to really enjoy your openness saying it from your heart.
J.
The real me, still yamming making melodies for our Lord and Savior.

 

[Johann]

Can we "fulfill the lust of the flesh" even while we "live in the Spirit"? It seems to me that this chapter is teaching us that this is the way life is, that we may "live in the Spirit" while at the same time fulfilling the lust of the flesh. I mean, that's not our ideal state. But this is what is being described here, would you agree with that?

You have a powerful way of expressing your thoughts in words brother.
J.

 

[BarneyFife]

Anyway, no skin of my nose . . .

Much love!

I think I'm gonna try Mel Gibson. He's a good man, right?
(Isn't that just awful? How could I say that?)

I'm doing well, thank you! Life is a struggle but God is good!!!

Much love!

I heard dat!

 

[stunnedbygrace]

What does it mean to you to "live in the Spirit"?

Galatians 5:25 KJV
If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.

If we "live in the Spirit", we are admonished to "also walk in the Spirit". How can it be that we might "live in the Spirit" without "walking in the Spirit"?

And if we are not "walking in the Spirit", does that mean we are walking according to the flesh?

Galatians 5:16 KJV
This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

Can we "fulfill the lust of the flesh" even while we "live in the Spirit"? It seems to me that this chapter is teaching us that this is the way life is, that we may "live in the Spirit" while at the same time fulfilling the lust of the flesh. I mean, that's not our ideal state. But this is what is being described here, would you agree with that?

Much love!

Ive kind of seen it more as…since I have been given life by the Spirit, so I should walk in the Spirit. But it takes monumental trust to be taken into that. He isn’t going to take everyone into that. He decides if and when. If someone is not firm and faithful in trust regarding earthly matters, how can He tell them about heavenly things? He’s not going to take someone not faithful in little things into bigger things. It’s better to be among the righteous than to offend Gods holiness. Better to be a living dog than a dead dog. In training in the righteousness that is by trust, we’re given many chances. We fall many times but get back up. But holiness is different. Uzzah was struck dead instantly for mishandling holiness, Moses was refused entrance because he failed to properly display Gods holiness, saphira and her husband struck dead by the Holy Spirit in the apostle. We should be smart like the men who feared after they saw that and had great respect for the apostles while refusing to join in with them for fear of offending the Holy Spirit. He makes a place among the nations for righteous men and He makes a place for the holy also. Would it be bad to be counted among the righteous and be ruled over by the saints? If that’s the place He chooses for me, it will be because it’s the very best place for me. Who could object to being ruled over by the saints? Some of them lost their very heads to save me for their Lord many centuries later! The vessels used in the temple were holy and if they became contaminated, they weren’t washed, they were destroyed, smashed. The man had to enter the holy of holies with a rope tied around him in case He made a misstep in the holiest place and was struck dead. And no excuses can be made that it never happened NT because saphira and her husband were NT, yet a righteous man argued with God about going to a street called Straight and he was okay. So…holiness is different.

 

[marks]

I think I'm gonna try Mel Gibson. He's a good man, right?
(Isn't that just awful? How could I say that?)

I heard dat!

Anyone for Little Bo Peep?

Much love!

 

[BarneyFife]

@Johann

Nice..

.

.

.

 

[The Disciple John]

That's the key question. How do you answer?

Much love!

Simply put, death is a state.

I don't mean to be long-winded. Forgive me, please.
Death is the opposite of life.
Death is a state of unconsciousness, and cessation of life, where the soul (life) is taken away, and the soul (person) ceases to exist... with only one way of getting it back (Psalms 104:30).
Death is described in the Bible at numerous scriptures.
Genesis 3:19; Psalm 104:29; Psalms 145:4; Ecclesiastes 3:20; Ecclesiastes 12:7

The problem here though, is the conflict between God and man - man who doesn't seem to realize how Satan is using him to promote his lies.

Here God is delivering a message by a chosen angel - must be a very high one. The angel uses symbolism, and the man laughs in God's face, and says, "I'm taking it literal. The symbolism can go to hell."

Holy angel of God :

Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
But for the fearful, and unbelieving, and abominable, and murderers, and fornicators, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, their part shall be in the lake that burneth with fire and brimstone; which is the second death.
Revelation 20:15; Revelation 21:8​

Man :

It's hell! It's a place of fiery torment!​

God :

​

You tell me marks. Is that not going against God?
Is that not what Satan wants - rebels on his side, opposing God?

I just added a bit of humor. However, going against God is serious. I'm confident you agree with that.
Can you answer the question I asked though, which everyone else has avoided?
Is death and hell also tormented in the lake of fire? How would you answer?
Thank you for bearing with me. :)