John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

[True Faith]

Go ahead and throw out your Bible and see if God continues to “talk to you”…

Go ahead, temp Him.

You see, what you lack is faith in God, this is evident in your replies and comments...
Sure you can say your faith is in God yet you need the Bible to prove your faith in God...

I use the Bible to disprove all your lies and your false doctrines..

I am using your own faith in the Bible against you because if your faith were completely in God Himself, you would not be bringing up scripture that you claim supports your lies and false doctrines...

Example:

You claim that Jesus is God Himself, but do not even understand that when you say "God the Son" he is still God Himself just in human form, which is why you nee John 1:14 to stake this claim.

So, John 1:1,14, according to your faith and your doctrine, Establishes Jesus as God Himself and no other...
That belief then makes Both God the Son and God Himself Liars...

John 6:38 For I have come down from heaven not to do mine own will but the will of him that sent me.

There is not a scripture anywhere in the Bible that will support Jesus being God Himself where God could lie or where Jesus would ever lie.....

John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Hebrews 6:18 That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:

I didn't need the Bible to tell me that God is incapable of lying because to tell a lie is to commit a sin against God.

How do I know this???

God placed his laws inside me.

Thou shalt not bear false witness...

Jeremiah 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

if you have to use your Bible to establish your doctrine, faith or beliefs... it is not God you have faith in but the Bible.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

My faith is not in a Book it is in God Himself...

I find this statement of yours to be an abomination!

Josiah the King would not have been alerted to the seriousness of the sad state of his kingdom save by the book of the law that they found in the temple! (2 Chronicles 34; 2 Kings 22).

That book, that you so brazenly dismiss, has been a preserve for my life and close communion with God!

Your attitude toward the written word is despicable!

 

[Michiah-Imla]

You see, what you lack is faith in God, this is evident in your replies and comments..

You are the temper himself.

The Lord rebuke you!

Sure you can say your faith is in God yet you need the Bible to prove your faith in God...

Everyone needs the Bible!

Who do you think you are?

I use the Bible to disprove all your lies and your false doctrines..

What doctrine “of mine” are you refuting? Using a Bible to prove that you don’t need a Bible? Such foolishness!

You claim that Jesus is God Himself

When did I make this claim?!

No wonder you don’t like reading the Bible, you have no capacity to follow a simple conversation online! Much the anything in the Bible!

There is not a scripture anywhere in the Bible that will support Jesus being God Himself

I agree.

Who are you arguing with??

if you have to use your Bible to establish your doctrine, faith or beliefs... it is not God you have faith in but the Bible.

Rubbish!!!

 

[True Faith]

I find this statement of yours to be an abomination!

Josiah the King would not have been alerted to the seriousness of the sad state of his kingdom save by the book of the law that they found in the temple! (2 Chronicles 34; 2 Kings 22).

That book, that you so brazenly dismiss, has been a preserve for my life and close communion with God!

Your attitude toward the written word is despicable!

There is my point yet again... using the Bible, a Book, to establish your faith and beliefs as well as your false doctrine...

I just told you that you would use scripture to try and prove your faith, belief and false doctrine...

 

[True Faith]

You are the temper himself.

The Lord rebuke you!



Everyone needs the Bible!

Who do you think you are?



What doctrine “of mine” are you refuting? Using a Bible to prove that you don’t need a Bible? Such foolishness!



When did I make this claim?!

No wonder you don’t like reading the Bible, you have no capacity to follow a simple conversation online! Much the anything in the Bible!



I agree.

Who are you arguing with??



Rubbish!!!

here we go again...lol... more lies and false accusations... you did not read what I wrote at all... I said I use it to disprove your lies and your false doctrine... I use your own words against you...and be careful how you address the Spirit that Guides me...

There is only one unpardonable sin, so be careful...

 

[True Faith]

@Michiah-Imla well the way you are going about this whole thing it is a good assumption... I could be wrong.. and if I am wrong please tell me who you believe that Jesus is then??

 

[True Faith]

@Michiah-Imla if your faith was in God instead of the Bible and if I were the tempter himself, then when you said " You are the tempter himself! The Lord Rebuke you!" I would not still be sitting here and talking with you...

You didn't even do that right and you use the Bible..

in order for it to work you have to have Faith in God Himself, which you do not.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

You claim that Jesus is God Himself

Look you liar, WHERE DID I MAKE THIS CLAIM?!

Care to answer?

Or just go on with your rubbish?

 

[Michiah-Imla]

@Michiah-Imla if your faith was in God instead of the Bible

Another foolish statement.

The two are inseparable. I have faith in God through his word.

Who or what corrupted your mind to say such nonsense?

 

[True Faith]

@Michiah-Imla I asked you a question and you did not even read it...

 

[True Faith]

Another foolish statement.

The two are inseparable. I have faith in God through his word.

Who or what corrupted your mind to say such nonsense?

Ahhh so you are afraid that I might actually speaking the truth and that God is Guiding me else you would have been sound in your first statement of me being the tempter myself...

 

[True Faith]

Another foolish statement.

The two are inseparable. I have faith in God through his word.

Who or what corrupted your mind to say such nonsense?

Again if you need the Bible to establish your faith in God then your faith is not in God Himself and do not believe that God will talk to you..... you put limitations on God... why???.. if you lost your sight and your hearing in one night, how will you ever be able to read the Bible or Express your beliefs?

 

[Michiah-Imla]

You claim that Jesus is God Himself

You lied.

Game Over.

And your high-handed proud behavior in not repenting of your lie reveals your character.

The Lord have mercy on you!

YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF YOUR SELF!

If I were a weak Christian you would have been responsible for the loss of one for whom Christ died.

“And through thy knowledge shall the weak brother perish, for whom Christ died?” (1 Corinthians 8:11)

Repent of this behavior before it’s too late.

Here’s more scripture you can snub your nose at:

“Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.” (John 8:44)

 

[True Faith]

You lied.

Game Over.

And your high-handed proud behavior in not repenting of your lie reveals your character.

The Lord have mercy on you!

YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF YOUR SELF!

If I were a weak Christian you would have been responsible for the loss of one for whom Christ died.

“And through thy knowledge shall the weak brother perish, for whom Christ died?” (1 Corinthians 8:11)

Repent of this behavior before it’s too late.

Here’s more scripture you can snub your nose at:

“Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.” (John 8:44)

Good one... it's not a lie.. I did ask you and you never answered actually... so without an answer it cannot be a lie...

 

[Michiah-Imla]

if you lost your sight and your hearing in one night, how will you ever be able to read the Bible or Express your beliefs?

Are you blind and deaf?

If the answer is ‘no’ then you’re just playing games to justify your pile of dung.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

Good one... it's not a lie.. I did ask you and you never answered actually... so without an answer it cannot be a lie...

Another lie.

I came into this thread to address your dismissive attitude towards scripture.

You came out of nowhere and accused me of saying that ‘Jesus is God’ without prior inquiry.

Get your story straight!

You’re digging a deeper hole for yourself!

 

[True Faith]

Another lie.

I came into this thread to address your dismissive attitude towards scripture.

You came out of nowhere and accused me of saying that ‘Jesus is God’ without prior inquiry.

Get your story straight!

You’re digging a deeper hole for yourself!

I actually did ask...

@Michiah-Imla well the way you are going about this whole thing it is a good assumption... I could be wrong.. and if I am wrong please tell me who you believe that Jesus is then??

why is it that you ignored it???

 

[True Faith]

Are you blind and deaf?

If the answer is ‘no’ then you’re just playing games to justify your pile of dung.

that question was directed at you and actually is a valid question because the way you look at it if you do not have the Bible you cannot know God...

 

[True Faith]

You lied.

Game Over.

And your high-handed proud behavior in not repenting of your lie reveals your character.

The Lord have mercy on you!

YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF YOUR SELF!

If I were a weak Christian you would have been responsible for the loss of one for whom Christ died.

“And through thy knowledge shall the weak brother perish, for whom Christ died?” (1 Corinthians 8:11)

Repent of this behavior before it’s too late.

Here’s more scripture you can snub your nose at:

“Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.” (John 8:44)

Do you know what it means when someone gives an example???...

I was giving an example... hence the word "Example" then I went on to give an example... because I said "You claim that Jesus is God Himself" I was not talking about you, yet you took offense because you did not read it in context... So, if you took offense then something is completely wrong with you reading comprehension...

Show me one place where I said that you made the claim??? you will not find it anywhere because I was giving you an example based upon scripture and false doctrine....

So no I have not told a lie, you just got offended and did not ask for clarification as to what that means...

 

[Kermos]

Kermos, you have to admit that in Titus 2:13 the use of even the term 'God' capitalized, is dubious because of the confusion in syntax. And there are about a dozen like this one in the NT.

This is the same view cited by some scholars, both Catholic and Protestant, and Trinitarian or not. You first have to admit this point is true.

And if you do, then as you must know, we use the local and outer context to assess, decide and draw a conclusion of what the verse is all about. Not only really trying to say what is the message, as you have never really pointed that out yet, also and just as importantly, who are the main subjects in play.

As they say, context is supreme and King, especially in this scripture under study.

You just cannot make a stupendous claim that Jesus is clearly the one God in Titus 2:13. Even most Trinitarians would shy away from you and your opinion.

Now I would suggest, in attempting to be seriously helpful, concentrate on the context of Titus 2:13.

Happy trails!

The sum total of your post is that there is a great God that is not God.

In effect, APAK, you have two gods which is a lawless sin that you practice (Matthew 7:23).

Titus 2:13 truthfully exegeted with Greek grammar rules applied maintains consistent Apostolic testimony.
Here is the English-Greek full word-for-word of Titus 2:13:

awaiting-προσδεχόμενοι the-τὴν blessed-μακαρίαν hope-ἐλπίδα and-καὶ appearing-ἐπιφάνειαν the-τῆς glory-δόξης the-τοῦ great-μεγάλου God-Θεοῦ and-καὶ Savior-Σωτῆρος us-ἡμῶν Christ-Χριστοῦ Jesus-Ἰησοῦ

All of "God", "Savior", "Christ", and "Jesus" are genitive, singular, and masculine thus they are to be taken together as a single cohesive unit according to Greek grammar rules, and this unit has the genitive singular adjectives "glory" and "great" pointing at this unit for all the genitive singular words are inextricably tied together according to Greek grammar rules.

The logical "and" in the phrase "our great God and Savior, Christ Jesus" (Titus 2:13) is linguistically tied to Jesus Christ because the word "hope", which is singular, as well as the word "glory", which is singular, in the phrase "looking for the blessed hope and the appearing of the glory of" (Titus 2:13); therefore, Paul singularly refers to "our great God" and "Savior" and "Christ Jesus" as One singular.

See that linguistically, "hope" and "glory" would need to be plural in order for "our great God" and "Savior" and "Christ Jesus" to be disassociated in the evil manner which you think applies.

THE APOSTLE PAUL INDISPUTABLY CALLS JESUS "THE GREAT GOD" (τοῦ μεγάλου Θεοῦ) WITH "LOOKING FOR THE BLESSED HOPE AND THE APPEARING OF THE GLORY OF THE GREAT GOD AND SAVIOR OF US, CHRIST JESUS" (TITUS 2:13).

The Greek grammar rules make it utterly clear in order to avoid confusion, yet you have managed to confuse yourself unto eternal punishment according to your current state. You confuse Paul's words while you neglect the greater Apostolic testimony.

Immanuel (Matthew 1:23 "God with us"), Jesus, is truly Almighty God, YHWH, with us (Revelation 1:8) (see see the Truth [John 14:6] that God had me compose in post #283 to expose the deception of tigger 2 and Rich R).