arviddag
New Member
Psalm 1:6 For the LORD watches over the way of the righteous, but the way of the wicked leads to destruction.
I have difficulty believing that souls will be damned to the Lake of Fire
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Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
Yep...destruction....but not torture. (Matt 10:28) So many people can’t understand the fact that a loving God has no need to punish people consciously for eternity.....eternal death is enough. It lasts forever but there is no conscious suffering. (Ecclesiastes 9: 5, 10) To “destroy” something is to make it completely unfit for use.
Going by your logic, I can live it up, no fear of eternal consequences, for I will be unconscious, dead, "destroyed"
Ever noticed that for every verse quoted there are 1K heteros answers and opinions?
Pro_16:25 There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
It’s not my logic.....I know my God and I know what his word teaches......he does not need to punish the wicked in a conscious way eternally. What a waste of his time and energy. And what would it accomplish? Absolutely nothing, for the wicked have no way out. The only alternatives ever offered in the Bible were “life or death”...never “heaven or hell”.
So for the wicked, as Jesus said.....God will “destroy” (body and soul) those he has consigned to “Gehenna” (Matt 10:28) ...but not those in “hades”, which will give up its dead. (Revelation 20:13-14)
Those in “hades” will come back to life, both those who did good things, and those who did vile things in ignorance.....(John 5:28-29) Jesus will call all the dead from the same place...their graves, where they have been “sleeping” peacefully..... some for thousands of years.
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
Yes...which means some of us have it right, and some of us are fooling ourselves....just as well Jehovah knows which is which.....eh?
...like the five wise and five "foolish" virgins....eh?Yes...which means some of us have it right, and some of us are fooling ourselves....just as well Jehovah knows which is which.....eh?
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
No....because I have no belief in life after death except by resurrection, I have hope to be among those who will enjoy life on earth under the rule of God’s appointed King and his elect. I am not one of the chosen ones, but I look forward to being guided by them as they lead us back into reconciliation with our Creator. Each has been specially chosen by God for their positions in heaven, so they will be the best rulers we humans have ever had.
I look forward to the life that God purposed for us in the beginning.....he did not put us here as a training ground for heaven.....life on earth in paradise was supposed to last forever. Adam and his wife threw that away, but Christ came to get it back for us.
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
I wonder if your hypothetical circumstance actually exists. In my experience, those who "live it up" as you say are not at all concerned with temporal consequence let alone eternal consequence.
In addition, before one is able to fear death and destruction of the soul, one must first value life.
Consider our Lord Jesus for example. Most of us would agree that he is so precious, that had he stayed dead after his crucifixion, his loss to humanity would be impossible to measure.
Until we see that each one of us, in God's eyes, is invaluable and precious, we will not understand that destruction and loss of a human life is unbearably lamentable.
Dropship
Well-Known Member
GUEST- "Congratulations on becoming Chancellor mein fuhrer, and what are your plans now?"
ADOLF- "I plan to take a little sightseeing trip"
GUEST "Oh how nice, anywhere in particular?"
ADOLF- "Poland, Norway, Holland, Belgium, France, Greece, North Africa, Russia.."
ADOLF- "I plan to take a little sightseeing trip"
GUEST "Oh how nice, anywhere in particular?"
ADOLF- "Poland, Norway, Holland, Belgium, France, Greece, North Africa, Russia.."
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
I know my friend . It must be dealt with too . Expose the harlots religion .
Yup, them's the weeds.
You know I used to go on really toxic forums, and I saved a lot of "funny" memes. And eventually I started to get a bad feeling. Like a sense that there was something wrong, a demonic presence coming from my electronics. I looked over my saved images, hundreds of them, and realized, not a single one of these memes were funny. Not a single one. They were just hateful and cruel. I don't even know why I saved them, its like my eyes were blinded, they just passed over everything wrong and didn't see the sin in it, and I was just absentmindedly picking up all this stuff and saving it as I was browsing. And as weird as it sounds, I feel like I was somehow accruing it to my soul as well.
My wife's dad was a blue collar guy and she told me that he would pin up pornography in his work station in the basement and didn't see anything wrong with it, even if his children saw it. When she complained it made her uncomfortable, she would be told "It's just sex, everyone does it, who cares?".
I believe that being "blinded" by sin is a real thing, you literally can't see the evil. You're so immersed in it that it all just seems normal to you. So yeah, evil people don't think of themselves as evil. Hitler was fighting his good crusade in the name of God for the liberation of Europe from the bankers and communists.
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
Jesus taught the people that satan masquerades as a friend rather than an enemy. He is a master deceiver.....this is how he gets into the psyche of those people who are easily led by what the flesh demands, and they fail to interpret the evil as evil because it becomes the “norm” in satan’s world.
Like the junk food that tastes good, but is slowly killing people, they will always prefer what tastes good over what is good for them....obesity today is the polar opposite of the problem of malnutrition, but has the same cause.....poverty....and the same effect...early death.
The kind of death that is permanent is of course way more serious than physical death, which has the hope of the resurrection....spiritual junk food will lead to permanent death. We all have spiritual choices, so we need to make them with knowledge, not easily manipulated emotion.
Dropship
Well-Known Member
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
To his ancient people Jehovah said.....
“‘And when someone wicked turns away from the wickedness that he has committed and begins to do what is just and righteous, he will preserve his own life. 28 When he realizes and turns away from all the transgressions that he has committed, he will surely keep living. He will not die.
29 “‘But the house of Israel will say: “The way of Jehovah is unjust.” Is it really my ways that are unjust, O house of Israel? Is it not your ways that are unjust?’
30 “‘Therefore, I will judge each one of you according to his ways, O house of Israel,’ declares the Sovereign Lord Jehovah. ‘Turn away, yes, turn completely away from all your transgressions, so that they will not be a stumbling block bringing guilt upon you. 31 Rid yourselves of all the transgressions you have committed and acquire a new heart and a new spirit, for why should you die, O house of Israel?’
32 “‘I do not take any pleasure in the death of anyone,’ declares the Sovereign Lord Jehovah. ‘So turn back and live.’” (Ezekiel 18:27-32)
Is this not God’s plea to all of us?
We can be like Israel and accuse Jehovah of not being fair in his righteous requirements, but it is we who are not being honest with ourselves....we can then justify all kinds of things that we are told is not acceptable to God, even though they are acceptable to ourselves.
If God takes no pleasure in the death of even the wicked, then why would he take pleasure in torturing them forever?
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
There are no genuine Christians involved in any political war. Our war is spiritual and so are our weapons.
2 Cor 10:3-5...
“For though we walk in the flesh, we do not wage warfare according to what we are in the flesh. 4 For the weapons of our warfare are not fleshly, but powerful by God for overturning strongly entrenched things. 5 For we are overturning reasonings and every lofty thing raised up against the knowledge of God, and we are bringing every thought into captivity to make it obedient to the Christ”.
We are to....”Return evil for evil to no one. Take into consideration what is fine from the viewpoint of all men. 18 If possible, as far as it depends on you, be peaceable with all men. 19 Do not avenge yourselves, beloved, but yield place to the wrath; for it is written: “‘Vengeance is mine; I will repay,’ says Jehovah.” 20 But “if your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink; for by doing this you will heap fiery coals on his head.” 21 Do not let yourself be conquered by the evil, but keep conquering the evil with the good.”
True Christians show that they are by their actions...not their pathetic excuses.....our judge will not accept them. (1 John 4:20-21) In the wars of the nations, it is acceptable to kill your own “brothers” just because they live in another nation with a different political ideology.
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Must admit, I enjoy your passion for Jesus and His word @Aunty Jane as I have witnessed over and over again how you "unpack" the truth, point by point, something I really enjoy for a man like me.
Can you show me how to do this?
Yours in Christ
J.
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
Well thank you Johann, but its just the way my mind works......what I believe has to make logical sense to me, and I have been 'unpacking' the Bible for the last 50 years. I am first and foremost a Bible student, (I will never graduate because there will never be a time when I know it all, so I am a work in progress.)
I always have to start at the beginning and work my way through any scenario so that it is in logical order in my mind. I don't just want to know "what"...but "why" and "how" and what results or consequences came about......so it's like a movie in my head, and I can see the players doing what the Bible says they did....an over active imagination I suppose, but it helps me remember scripture and the scenes I have already played in my mind....and I can join them up.
The Bible to me is like a big jigsaw puzzle.....where you have pieces that fit together over here, and other pieces that fit over there, and yet the big picture on the box tells me that there is so much more to fill in the spaces. Every time I get to fill a space, I get an immense feeling of satisfaction, knowing that when I have asked Jehovah to help me fill those gaps, they always come together so smoothly.
When Luke wrote his gospel account and also the book of Acts, it was addressed to The·ophʹi·lus...who apparently was a Christian, having been orally taught about Jesus Christ and his ministry. Luke’s written statement served to assure him of the certainty of what he had learned previously by word of mouth.
Luke wrote....
"I resolved also, because I have traced all things from the start with accuracy, to write them to you in logical order, most excellent The·ophʹi·lus, 4 so that you may know fully the certainty of the things that you have been taught orally." (Luke 1:3-4; Acts 1:1)
This resonated with me straight away.....he 'resolved to trace all things with accuracy and then to write them in logical order'.
The Bible to me is one story.....a beginning...a middle...and an end. The details are fascinating, but all of them have to fit in their right places.
I don't find the Bible illogical at all, but I do find Christendom's interpretation of it makes me shake my head....so many contradictions where there doesn't need to be any.
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