How are we to reckon ourselves as being dead to sin?
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Waiting on him
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It is okay, Daddy is on the way and he’s gonna vindicate them, when he’s murdered all the adversaries.
Waiting on him
Well-Known Member
Galatians 1:13-16 KJV
[13] For ye have heard of my conversation in time past in the Jews' religion, how that beyond measure I persecuted the church of God, and wasted it: [14] And profited in the Jews' religion above many my equals in mine own nation, being more exceedingly zealous of the traditions of my fathers. [15] But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace, [16] To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
[13] For ye have heard of my conversation in time past in the Jews' religion, how that beyond measure I persecuted the church of God, and wasted it: [14] And profited in the Jews' religion above many my equals in mine own nation, being more exceedingly zealous of the traditions of my fathers. [15] But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace, [16] To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
Waiting on him
Well-Known Member
Now that we have an understanding of what the flesh is. Maybe we can have a real conversation?
Don't sell yourself short sister, you are a mature daughter in Christ Jesus and I thoroughly enjoy you posts and interactions with members--the one who is a late starter is me-but by the grace of God we are all in this race, a marathon, not a 100 sprint-so we both can "catch up" with the others, God willing.
Ecc_9:11 I returned, and saw under the sun, that the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, neither yet bread to the wise, nor yet riches to men of understanding, nor yet favour to men of skill; but time and chance happeneth to them all.
1Co_9:24 Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain.
Heb_12:1 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,--
Shalom to you and family
J.
The guy Epi is wrong on all accounts--being born again is--
Joh 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
Except a man be born anew (ean mē tis gennēthēi anōthen). Another condition of the third class, undetermined but with prospect of determination. First aorist passive subjunctive of gennaō. Anōthen.
Originally “from above” (Mar_15:38), then “from heaven” (Joh_3:31), then “from the first” (Luk_1:3), and then “again” (palin anōthen, Gal_4:9).
Which is the meaning here? The puzzle of Nicodemus shows (deuteron, Joh_3:4) that he took it as “again,” a second birth from the womb. The Vulgate translates it by renatus fuerit denuo.
But the misapprehension of Nicodemus does not prove the meaning of Jesus. In the other passages in John (Joh_3:31; Joh_19:11, Joh_19:23) the meaning is “from above” (desuper) and usually so in the Synoptics. It is a second birth, to be sure, regeneration, but a birth from above by the Spirit.
Robertson
In reply, he said to him, Omein, omein, I say to you, unless someone is born anew [born again, Yn 1:13; Dt 10:16; 30:6; Jer 4:4; Isa 52:1; Ezek 44:7,9], he is not able to see the Malchut Hashem.
3) "Except a man be born again," (ean me tis gennethe anothen) "Except anyone (or unless anyone) is born from above," born anew, receives a new nature, a Divine nature, "Born of God," Joh_1:13. (This Divine birth certifies one as a "new creature," Gal_6:15; Eph_2:10, Jas_1:18; 1Jn_5:1.
Notice the Aorist, Passive, Subjunctive
4) "He cannot see the kingdom of God." (ou dunatai idein ten basileian tou theou) "He is not able to see the kingdom of God," he cannot, is not dynamic enough to perceive the Spiritual domain of God. Their minds are darkened with ignorance, Eph_4:18. You see, Nicodemus was talking about "learning," while Jesus spoke of Divine living and Divine wisdom, that must be prefixed by fear of God, and trust in Jesus Christ, Pro_1:7; Joh_8:24. Perceiving spiritual matters of depth is possible only following salvation or reception of a new Divine nature, 1Co_2:14; 2Co_4:3-4.
Except: Joh_3:5-6, Joh_1:13; Gal_6:15; Eph_2:1; Tit_3:5; Jas_1:18; 1Pe_1:3, 1Pe_1:23-25; 1Jn_2:29, 1Jn_3:9, 1Jn_5:1, 1Jn_5:18
again: or, from above, Jas_1:17, Jas_3:17
he cannot: Joh_3:5, Joh_1:5, Joh_12:40; Deu_29:4; Jer_5:21; Mat_13:11-16, Mat_16:17; 2Co_4:4
There is so much to learn, so little time.
J.
Jim B
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Jim B
Well-Known Member
Episkopos, pay no attention to what "amigo" says. His doctrine is all screwed up! In his eyes, he alone is righteous and correct and everyone else is being led by Satan.
Sorry, your rabbi is preaching an heteron gospel.
Gal 1:6 I wonder that ye are so quickly removed from Him who did call you in the grace of Christ to another good news;
Gal 1:7 that is not another, except there be certain who are troubling you, and wishing to pervert the good news of the Christ;
Gal 1:8 but even if we or a messenger out of heaven may proclaim good news to you different from what we did proclaim to you—anathema let him be!
Gal 1:9 as we have said before, and now say again, If any one to you may proclaim good news different from what ye did receive—anathema let him be!
Gal 1:10 for now men do I persuade, or God? or do I seek to please men? for if yet men I did please—Christ's servant I should not be.
Unto a different gospel (eis heteron euaggelion). See note on 2Co_11:4 for distinction between allo and heteron as here. It is not here or there a mere difference in emphasis or spirit as in Php_1:18 so long as Christ is preached. These men as in 2Co_11:4 preach “another Jesus” and a “different gospel” and so have fallen away from grace and have done away with Christ (Gal_5:4). Hence the vehemence of Paul’s words.
Robertson
Well said--
And an appeal to emotions is not going to help. You have discernment, don't you?
Thank you brother. And shalom to you and yours as well.
amigo de christo
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amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
Point to Christ till the last and final breath my friend . HE alone is our hope and our salvation .
Praise be to the glorious Lord .
It is an Imperative--are you in denial that one MUST be born again?
Joh_3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
Joh_3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
Joh 3:7 μὴG3361|PRT-N|Not θαυμάσῃςG2296|G5661|V-AAS-2S|do wonder ὅτιG3754|CONJ|that εἶπόνG2036|G5627|V-2AAI-1S|I said σοιG4771|P-2DS|to you, ΔεῖG1210|G5719|V-PAI-3S|It is necessary for ὑμᾶςG4771|P-2AP|you [all] γεννηθῆναιG1080|G5683|V-APN|to be born ἄνωθενG509|ADV|from above.
Verb, Present, Active, Indicative--
Ye must be born anew (dei humas gennēthēnai anōthen). Jesus repeats the point in Joh_3:3 (dei and the infinitive instead of ean mē and the subjunctive) with anōthen (from above) only and not ex hudatos.
Robertson
Contents: Nicodemus and the new birth. The last testimony of John the Baptist.
Characters: God, Jesus, Holy Spirit, Nicodemus, John the Baptist, Moses, John’s disciples.
Conclusion: Since the natural man, however gifted, moral, or refined, is absolutely blind to spiritual truth and impotent to enter the kingdom, a new birth through Christ as the channel and the Holy Spirit as the power is an absolute necessity. Heaven is a prepared place for a prepared people. The only gateway to it is—Jesus.
Key Word: New birth, Joh_3:3.
Strong Verses: Joh_3:3, Joh_3:6, Joh_3:7, Joh_3:16, Joh_3:18, Joh_3:19, Joh_3:36.
Striking Facts: Joh_3:14. The bitten Israelite was healed by simply looking to the brazen serpent, not by looking at his wound, although he must of course be conscious of his condition. One look healed the bite. So one look of faith to Jesus saves. It is not the way we look, but the object we look at that heals.
SB
Why are you so vehemently opposed to what stands written--Dei-MUST-be born again?
You are responsible for other members eternal destinies-would they believe you, or what stands written, the very Scriptures you don't even "work with"
I thought you said God commanded you to study Hebrew and Greek?--so why not using it?
This phrase born anew, this idea of rebirth, runs all through the New Testament. Peter speaks of being born anew by God’s great mercy (1Pe_1:3); he talks about being born anew not of perishable seed, but of imperishable (1Pe_1:22-23).
James speaks of God bringing us forth by the word of truth (Jas_1:18). The Letter to Titus speaks of the washing of regeneration (Tit_3:5).
Sometimes this same idea is spoken of as a death followed by a resurrection or a re-creation. Paul speaks of the Christian as dying with Christ and then rising to life anew (Rom_6:1-11).
He speaks of those who have lately come into the Christian faith as babes in Christ (1Co_3:1-2). If any man is in Christ it is as if he had been created all over again (2Co_5:17).
In Christ there is a new creation (Gal_6:15). The new man is created after God in righteousness (Eph_4:22-24). The person who is at the first beginnings of the Christian faith is a child (Heb_5:12-14). All over the New Testament this idea of rebirth, re-creation occurs.
it in New Testament times. The Jew knew all about rebirth.
When a man from another faith became a Jew and had been accepted into Judaism by prayer and sacrifice and baptism, he was regarded as being reborn.
"A proselyte who embraces Judaism," said the rabbis, "is like a new-born child."
So radical was the change that the sins he had committed before his reception were all done away with, for now he was a different person. It was even theoretically argued that such a man could marry his own mother or his own sister, because he was a completely new man, and all the old connections were broken and destroyed. The Jew knew the idea of rebirth.
If the rabbis and Jews knew about the idea of rebirth--why not you? What makes you so exceptional that you don't NEED to be born from above?-and then IMPOSE that to your followers?
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You see...and your cohorts... that God is a teddy bear to you and a tormentor to all who are not like you. What if you had it exactly backwards? What if God hated hypocrisy, judgmentalism, smug self-assurance, and the religious ego MORE than what you look down on others for?
What if God gave grace to the humble instead?
What if Jude's "twice dead" describes those who were born again but then went after other spirits...like Cain, Balaam, and Korah, to not only ship-wreck their faith but also destroy the life that God wanted for them to have?
What if "work out your own salvation with fear and trembling" was a warning directed especially to the rich and entitled society that we are all part of?
The bible warns us of what it will be like at the end... mockers.. unspiritual...enemies of the cross. Now you'd think that people who thought that the bible was more important to follow than the living God Himself, would at least take it seriously.
Lizbeth, you are willing to throw anyone under the bus to preserve your own "foundation" which is your "self" as you see it being in Christ. Compare that self-preservational attitude with Paul who was willing to lose his salvation ...his precious foundation of self...so that his brethren might be saved. Compare your attitude to that of Moses who defended his people...even when he could have smugly condemned them and got away with it.
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Waiting on him
Well-Known Member
I figured they’d have already voted to take you out of this world. I was surprised to see you’re still alive.
Unbelievable-and here you are ABOVE the Scriptures--and your words ooze with dripping sarcasm-
I am shocked that so quickly you are being turned from the One who granted you the kri'ah (calling), summoning you by the Chen v'Chesed Hashem of Moshiach. I am shocked that so quickly you are being turned from this to a different "Besuras HaGeulah."
Not that there is another, mind you! Except that there are some individuals disturbing and troubling (5:12) you, desiring to twist and pervert the Besuras HaGeulah (Yeshayah 40:9; 60:6) of Moshiach.
1) "I marvel that ye are so soon removed," (thaumazo hoti houtos tacheos metatithesthe) "I wonder, marvel, that you all are so rapidly removing, drifting," and so soon after their conversion and his recent visit. The shocking, sharp expression indicates an almost disillusion, Paul had in their fickle turn or drift toward Judaism, as in 2Th_2:2.
2) "From him that called you into the grace of Christ," (apo tou kalesantos humas en Chariti Christou) "From the one who called you by (the grace of Christ;” The Galatians were giving ear to religious renegades, a drift that caused Paul alarm, though he had not lost faith in their personal loyalty or general soundness in the faith, Gal_4:11; Gal_4:20; Gal_5:9-10.
3) "Unto another gospel," (eis heteron euangellion)"with reference to, or with regard toward another kind (of) gospel." The (Gk. heteros) "another" gospel distinguishes it as a spurious, putrid one, in contrast and conflict with the gospel of Christ, Rom_1:16; 1Co_15:1-3.
Any gospel that mingles law, (ceremonials and rituals) with grace, as a means of acquiring or retaining justification, sanctification, or salvation is "another gospel." The proclaimer (Preacher) of such is still under the curse (anathema) of God! Gal_1:8-9. Ceremonials and rituals and pictorial ordinances of Christ no more impart grace in obtaining or retaining salvation than did those of the Law. Those who preach that they to are under God's anathema of preaching "another gospel today," by perverting the gospel of Christ, Act_10:43; 2Jn_1:8-11; Rom_4:5; Eph_2:8-9; Rom_11:6.
On the same principle, he calls it another gospel, that is, a gospel different from the true one. And yet the false apostles professed that they preached the gospel of Christ; but, mingling with it their own inventions, (19) by which its principal efficacy was destroyed, they held a false, corrupt, and spurious gospel. By using the present tense, (“ye are removed”) he appears to say that they were only in the act of failing. As if he had said, “I do not yet say that ye have been removed; for then it would be more difficult to return to the right path. But now, at the critical moment, do not advance a single step, but instantly retreat.”
I am shocked to the core with your heteron gospel, having no fear of eternal consequences-dragging others down with you.
Why don't you PM me, and you and I can have a healthy debate?
I don't see any mention of hell in anything concerning being born again or not. I think the hell comes from the religious minds who interpret the bible falsely. ....and to their own advantage.
If someone says....unless you put on your glasses...you cannot read the paper. Does that mean that if you forgot your glasses..you are going to hell? Or you are not "saved" ????
What kind of person is so obsessed with being saved that every verse is meant as a zero-sum game of salvation or not?
How can people discuss anything with such indoctrination?
And when salvation IS in the balance..those verses are deemed to be for others.
So then unwittingly...if the warnings are meant for those who WILL be saved...and you see those verses for others and not yourselves... then...
Waiting on him
Well-Known Member
The imagination is very active with these. But pretending has no effect on reality. Not even if it is religious in nature.
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