Fear God or Presume acceptance

[Eternally Grateful]

What I believe is that we are not justified based on our obedience. By one man came condemnation, Adam. Humanity, in Adam, sinned. Became condemned, and dead, separated from God.

Jesus was incarnated the last man. The first man, Adam, the last man, Christ. Justification is being forgiven of all sin as we die and are resurrected in Christ's death and resurrection. And in that death and resurrection, we leave Adam, and are now in Christ.

Jesus conquered death because Jesus was righteous. No one else is or was, not like that.

Because our justification is being joined to Christ in His death, and being raised with Him, in His obedience unto death, that is the obedience that saves us. We trust in Him, He is the obedient one.

And as it is His obedience, not ours, that we are justified by, our obedience is not a part of the equation.

Do I think our obedience is necessary? That's not what our justification is based on, so, if you are asking, is our obedience necessary to be justified? No. That is Jesus' obedience. And think about it. If you are obedient, righteous, then what justification do you need? That's why Jesus rose from among all who died. Because He alone is Righteous. In that way. Not only the righteousness of the Law, but real righteousness.

Do I think our obedience is necessary? God made us His children. Do we obey? God made us mammals. Do we breathe? Yes.

Much love!

Sounds like you obeyed the gospel. So you were obedient to life.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I think it was post...#566?
He was teaching that we are justified by Jesus' obedience. This is to say Jesus' obedience of faith is how men are declared righteous by God. But I read that a man is called righteous by faith. Which is to say the man trusts God.

And if you listen to him, I bet he believes the me thing

 

[Eternally Grateful]

You are assuming that I have carnal worries. I leave it to God to judge me. I'm not afraid to die. Fear of death is NOT fear of the Lord.

Nobody knows what God will judge on that day. To have a make believe assumption about that is just to deceive yourself.

There are going to be a lot of surprises. So we should fear the Lord and walk in a way that is worthy of the high calling in Christ.

so basically your in limbo. You have no idea if your saved or not. At best you can just guess.

If your alright with that. I guess my best to you

But the bible says we can KNOW.

I chose to KNOW

 

[Eternally Grateful]

You guys have 11 and 14? I must be slipping, I don't have any.

I have 2.. I try not to ignore. it is a last resort

 

[Episkopos]

so basically your in limbo. You have no idea if your saved or not. At best you can just guess.

If your alright with that. I guess my best to you

But the bible says we can KNOW.

I chose to KNOW

The only way to KNOW without presumption is to walk in the Spirit as we read about in the bible. Walking in His power and life in holiness. When you walk as Jesus walked...in that kind of love, joy and peace...then you KNOW it isn't you doing the works...they are from heaven. :)

But a man's works will be judged.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

The only way to KNOW without presumption is to walk in the Spirit as we read about in the bible. Walking in His power and life in holiness. When you walk as Jesus walked...in that kind of love, joy and peace...then you KNOW it isn't you doing the works...they are from heaven. :)

But a man's works will be judged.

Then you can not know

I can walk in the spirit for two months, Then due to a circumstance, stop walking in the spirit. die the next day, am I saved or lost?

 

[Episkopos]

Then you can not know

I can walk in the spirit for two months, Then due to a circumstance, stop walking in the spirit. die the next day, am I saved or lost?

What do you mean by saved? Saved to what? All Christians are saved FROM death. But many are saved TO shame and dishonour. You need to get away from the indoctrination of the pews and read the bible more carefully.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

What do you mean by saved? Saved to what? All Christians are saved FROM death. But many are saved TO shame and dishonour. You need to get away from the indoctrination of the pews and read the bible more carefully.

There is only one salvation that means anything

Saved from the eternal penalty of sin.

All other things which regard being saved are a byproduct of this. If we do not have this, we are not really saved. We re still dead in our sin

 

[marks]

You need to get away from the indoctrination of the pews and read the bible more carefully.

Why not rather than castigate to show from the Bible what you believe? "Indoctrination of the pews", that must mean, "If you disagree with me, it's because you just parrot what you've been told".

But rather than get into all this personalities stuff, why not have a Biblical discussion?

Is that REALLY too much to ask?

Much love!

 

[marks]

There is only one salvation that means anything

Saved from the eternal penalty of sin.

All other things which regard being saved are a byproduct of this. If we do not have this, we are not really saved. We re still dead in our sin

Pay attention to what Episkopos is saying,

All Christians are saved FROM death. But many are saved TO shame and dishonour.

Daniel 12
1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

For one thing, there is a blending of Israel with the Gentiles in that interpretation. The prophecy is concerning "thy people". And it makes the assumption that this is the redeemed that are raised to shame and contempt.

Will Christians be resurrected to shame and everlasting contempt? What does Scripture say concerning those who trust in the LORD?

Much love!

 

[marks]

Then you can not know

I can walk in the spirit for two months, Then due to a circumstance, stop walking in the spirit. die the next day, am I saved or lost?

Being justified from Jesus' obedience, does your lack of obedience change His? I think not.

Once we become settled on these truths, those lapses in our walk become shorter and fewer I think as we learn to receive the power of Christ in us, without feeling we can't.

Much love!

 

[Episkopos]

There is only one salvation that means anything

Saved from the eternal penalty of sin.

All other things which regard being saved are a byproduct of this. If we do not have this, we are not really saved. We re still dead in our sin

Everyone that died in the wilderness (Exodus) was saved. But they didn't please God. So then you have to get away from yourself and look to God and realize that salvation isn't what you think it is. At least you are not getting what God is looking for. Get your eyes onto the Lord and off yourself...and you just may see something.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Being justified from Jesus' obedience, does your lack of obedience change His? I think not.

Once we become settled on these truths, those lapses in our walk become shorter and fewer I think as we learn to receive the power of Christ is us, without feeling we can't.

Much love!

John says I can know I have eternal life. and it is this knowledge which keeps me believing

why would I doubt this?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Everyone that died in the wilderness (Exodus) was saved. But they didn't please God. So then you have to get away from yourself and look to God and realize that salvation isn't what you think it is. At least you are not getting what God is looking for. Get your eyes onto the Lord and off yourself...and you just may see something.

They may have been saved from egypt

but they died in unbelief

what good was their physical salvation, when they rejected eternal salvation?

 

[marks]

Everyone that died in the wilderness (Exodus) was saved.

Saved out of hard slavery in Egypt, saved from Pharaoh and his army, but not justified by God. Not born from God to be new creatures. We're talking about two very different sorts of salvation here. One physical, and temporal. The other spiritual, and eternal.

Much love!

 

[marks]

They may have been saved from egypt

but they died in unbelief

what good was their physical salvation, when they rejected eternal salvation?

I should remember to read the thread before adding posts!

:)

 

[marks]

John says I can know I have eternal life. and it is this knowledge which keeps me believing

why would I doubt this?

I find this so prevalent throughout the New Testament. That there is something that God does that we are able to know He has done it, and that it's entirely what God wants to do, because He cherishes us.

The One Who made us, and we ran from Him, and now He's been searching for as we keep hiding from Him, and when we are finally able to accept that He just loves us, not because we are so convincingly wonderful, He just loves us, then we can come to enjoy the safety in His arms in all respects, whether we need deliverance from temporal slavery, or deliverance from the slavery of sin, deliverance from the lies of the flesh, into life eternal with Him, to be known and enjoyed.

I just can't believe that anyone who has tasted His love, the depth of His love for us, would easily let it slip away from them. To know His love for me opens the door to walk in His power, because in His love He gives everything to us.

Much love!

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I find this so prevalent throughout the New Testament. That there is something that God does that we are able to know He has done it, and that it's entirely what God wants to do, because He cherishes us.

The One Who made us, and we ran from Him, and now He's been searching for as we keep hiding from Him, and when we are finally able to accept that He just loves us, not because we are so convincingly wonderful, He just loves us, then we can come to enjoy the safety in His arms in all respects, whether we need deliverance from temporal slavery, or deliverance from the slavery of sin, deliverance from the lies of the flesh, into life eternal with Him, to be known and enjoyed.

I just can't believe that anyone who has tasted His love, the depth of His love for us, would easily let it slip away from them. To know His love for me opens the door to walk in His power, because in His love He gives everything to us.

Much love!

Amen, Could not agree more

 

[Episkopos]

They may have been saved from egypt

but they died in unbelief

what good was their physical salvation, when they rejected eternal salvation?

You are still not getting it. They were promised a physical land...Canaan land. So you are being dishonest....as so many modern believers are.

But we have been saved into a race of faith....many who are saved...yes born again...will fail the grace of God. We are not better than the Jews who perished in the wilderness. In fact we are exactly like them.

The stakes are higher. We are to bear an eternal fruit and walk as Jesus walked BY FAITH. But there isn't that much of that around. Most people remain selfish and claim the gift of salvation for themselves without bearing the right kind of fruit. Just like the Israelites did before us.

So we need humility and the fear of the Lord knowing how we are not better than they whom God rejected.

But of course people prefer to be religious and ignore every warning of God.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

You are still not getting it. They were promised a physical land...Canaan land. So you are being dishonest....as so many modern believers are.

But we have been saved into a race of faith....many who are saved...yes born again...will fail the grace of God. We are not better than the Jews who perished in the wilderness. In fact we are exactly like them.

The stakes are higher. We are to bear an eternal fruit and walk as Jesus walked BY FAITH. But there isn't that much of that around. Most people remain selfish and claim the gift of salvation for themselves without bearing the right kind of fruit. Just like the Israelites did before us.

So we need humility and the fear of the Lord knowing how we are not better than they whom God rejected.

But of course people prefer to be religious and ignore every warning of God.

They did not get in because of UNBELIEF

The continued in sin BECAUSE OF UNBELIEF