Earning Knowledge of God / Eternal Life

[marks]

Verse 4: This could be debated. To me it just means that when Christ returns (at the end of time) we will be glorified with Him.

Colossians 3:4 KJV
4) When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

What do you consider debateable?

Is it the fact that Paul wrote that if you've been raised with Christ, that you've died, and you are hid in Him, and that when He appears, you also will appear with Him in glory. Is that the issue? The certainty of the statement?

Isn't this what the passage plainly states?

Much love!

 

[GodsGrace]

You would do better to ask questions that to post your guess, and in particular when you post like this.

I admitted I don't know you enough to know your position on the matter.
Not much more I can do..
I did reply to what you stated.

Let me ask you. Do you believe in 2 classes of Christians, the Spiritual Christian, and the Carnal Christian?

Much love!

There's no such thing as a carnal Christian.

 

[marks]

I admitted I don't know you enough to know your position on the matter.

So than why post anything? If you don't know? "Gee, sounds like you think sin is ok", or whatever it is you meant there, isn't that better left unsaid if you don't know?

Much love!

 

[GodsGrace]

Colossians 3:4 KJV
4) When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

What do you consider debateable?

Is it the fact that Paul wrote that if you've been raised with Christ, that you've died, and you are hid in Him, and that when He appears, you also will appear with Him in glory. Is that the issue? The certainty of the statement?

Isn't this what the passage plainly states?

Much love!

I'll tell you what it does NOT state.....
What it states is correct, of course.

What it does NOT state is whether or not salvation can be lost.
If you can find it in verse 4, it would be nice to hear it explained from you.

And,,,I'm not sure what you believe...as I've already stated.
Is it only OSAS?
Is it, like some believe, that good works are not necessary?
Is it, like some believe, that doing good works is a SIN because we're not trusting in Jesus?

Many belief systems out there marks.

 

[GodsGrace]

So than why post anything? If you don't know? "Gee, sounds like you think sin is ok", or whatever it is you meant there, isn't that better left unsaid if you don't know?

Much love!

Where did I say that?

 

[GodsGrace]

So than why post anything? If you don't know? "Gee, sounds like you think sin is ok", or whatever it is you meant there, isn't that better left unsaid if you don't know?

Much love!

I don't know anybody on these forums.
Should I stop posting altogether?
Do YOU know all MY beliefs?

 

[marks]

Many belief systems out there marks.

All I can say is, in what I believe, I can read all these passages and believe them exactly as written. It seems many cannot due to their beliefs. Which is to me a huge red flag.

Much love!

 

[marks]

I don't know anybody on these forums.
Should I stop posting altogether?
Do YOU know all MY beliefs?

Well no, and I wouldn't presume to say that you maybe think something, particularly that would be considered by most to be negative, without actually knowing what you believe.

Post as you wish, some things are productive, and fruitful, others are not.

Much love!

 

[GodsGrace]

All I can say is, in what I believe, I can read all these passages and believe them exactly as written. It seems many cannot due to their beliefs. Which is to me a huge red flag.

Much love!

Good for you.
BUT
seems like you CANNOT show me where, in Colossiand 3:4 it states that man cannot lose his salvation.
OR
in any of those 4 verses YOU posted to prove some point or other.

And please reply to my post no. 145 because it doesn't sound like something I'd say.

 

[GodsGrace]

Well no, and I wouldn't presume to say that you maybe think something, particularly that would be considered by most to be negative, without actually knowing what you believe.

Post as you wish, some things are productive, and fruitful, others are not.

Much love!

Well, THIS conversation sure isn't.
Please respond to my post 145.
Thanks.

 

[marks]

Where did I say that?

You didn't stay that exactly, you said,

Verse 2: Tells us to set our minds on things above...NOT on things here on earth...IOW,,,not to be carnal.
What you teach sounds like we could be carnal and still be saved. (I'm not sure 100% what you believe so I apologize if I've misunderstood).

Which was why I followed up with the question about "carnal Christians". Apparently you believe then that being fleshy means you are not saved.

Being carnal is basically a synonym for not walking in the Spirit, and instead walking according to the flesh.

Was that not what you were thinking, "Gee, sounds like you think sin is ok"? If sin means you aren't saved then that's the conclusion, right?

Much love!

 

[marks]

Good for you.
BUT
seems like you CANNOT show me where, in Colossiand 3:4 it states that man cannot lose his salvation.

It says that if you've been raised with Christ, that you've died and are hid with Christ in God. And when Christ appears, you will also appear with Him in glory.

So then, have you been raised with Him? Then you will appear with Him. Is that somehow not true? I believe what the Bible says.

Much love!

 

[marks]

I'll tell you what it does NOT state.....
What it states is correct, of course.

What it does NOT state is whether or not salvation can be lost.
If you can find it in verse 4, it would be nice to hear it explained from you.

And,,,I'm not sure what you believe...as I've already stated.
Is it only OSAS?
Is it, like some believe, that good works are not necessary?
Is it, like some believe, that doing good works is a SIN because we're not trusting in Jesus?

Many belief systems out there marks.

My question was, what part of this passage do you consider debateable? Please post the verse, bold the words that are debateable, and share with me what the debate would be specifically.

Is it that "shall appear" should actually be translated "may appear"? Or what? What part is debateable?

Much love!

 

[GodsGrace]

You didn't stay that exactly, you said,


Which was why I followed up with the question about "carnal Christians". Apparently you believe then that being fleshy means you are not saved.

Being carnal is basically a synonym for not walking in the Spirit, and instead walking according to the flesh.

Was that not what you were thinking, "Gee, sounds like you think sin is ok"? If sin means you aren't saved then that's the conclusion, right?

Much love!

Looks like you're doing what you accused me of doing.
You sure read a lot into words...this is the problem some have even when reading scripture.

IF a person is NOT walking in the spirit,,,he is walking in the flesh.
You cannot do both at the same time.

Galatians 5:16-17
16But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not carry out the desire of the flesh.
17For the flesh sets its desire against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; for these are in opposition to one another, so that you may not do the things that you please.

What I was thinking...I guess YOU could read minds...
is that OSAS is NOT a biblical concept/teaching.
We cannot be carnal AND be saved....
just as Paul states in Galatians 5.

 

[GodsGrace]

It says that if you've been raised with Christ, that you've died and are hid with Christ in God. And when Christ appears, you will also appear with Him in glory.

So then, have you been raised with Him? Then you will appear with Him. Is that somehow not true? I believe what the Bible says.

Much love!

It's true IF you CONTINUE in the faith:

Colossians 1:21-23
21And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds,
22yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach—
23 IF indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard

John 8:31 JESUS said:
31So Jesus was saying to those Jews who had believed Him, “If you continue in My word, then you are truly disciples of Mine


Do you also believe the above?
It's part of the bible.

 

[GodsGrace]

My question was, what part of this passage do you consider debateable? Please post the verse, bold the words that are debateable, and share with me what the debate would be specifically.

Is it that "shall appear" should actually be translated "may appear"? Or what? What part is debateable?

Much love!

Are you discussing Colossians 3:4?
THIS is the debate here:
YOU are stating that OSAS is in that verse.
I'M saying it's nowhere to be found.

I can't prove a negative.
Why don't YOU show me where it states in Col 3:4 that OSAS is a correct doctrine?

 

[GodsGrace]

My question was, what part of this passage do you consider debateable? Please post the verse, bold the words that are debateable, and share with me what the debate would be specifically.

Is it that "shall appear" should actually be translated "may appear"? Or what? What part is debateable?

Much love!

PS
I don't know what you mean by SHALL APPEAR and MAY APPEAR.

Seems like you've had this ARGUMENT before.
I'm not here to argue.
If you want to discuss, fine...

 

[marks]

PS
I don't know what you mean by SHALL APPEAR and MAY APPEAR.

Seems like you've had this ARGUMENT before.
I'm not here to argue.
If you want to discuss, fine...

Shall appear means it will happen. May appear means maybe it will and maybe it won't.

I'm just wondering what specifically in the passage you thought was debateable.

 

[marks]

Are you discussing Colossians 3:4?
THIS is the debate here:
YOU are stating that OSAS is in that verse.
I'M saying it's nowhere to be found.

I can't prove a negative.
Why don't YOU show me where it states in Col 3:4 that OSAS is a correct doctrine?

This passage states in no uncertain terms that the one who has been raised with Him now will appear with Him then.

So my question is, Is that true? Will those who have been raised with Christ in this life in fact appear with Christ in glory when He is revealed?

Because according to this passage, yes, they will. So who is it that would be lost? If someone who had been raised with Christ, who had died with Christ, and was hid with Christ, if they do not actually appear with Christ in glory, this Scripture would be false for that person.

I believe the Bible is exactly true, and that this part is exactly true also.

Much love!

 

[marks]

It's true IF you CONTINUE in the faith:

I'm not seeing that caveat in that passage. It makes a plain and clear statement, which we either believe or we don't.

Besides . . . according to the Bible . . . not continuing in the faith means you were not in the faith to begin with. There are various passages that teach this.

Much love!