Carnal Hypocrisy of Sabbath Commanders

[robert derrick]

This is just a ridiculous play on words. The Ten Commandments are written IN God's law and the ceremonial/sacrificial laws that were "shadows of things to come" are written IN the Mosaic Law. Happy?

Not yet. Hold on a sec:

He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou?

In the law, not in the 'Mosaic' law.

Now, I'm happy.

God doesn't play word games, but gives every letter of His Scripture perfectly to His prophets and apostles, to pass on perfectly in every jot and tittle to us for our benefit.

All the law of God is law of Moses in the OT, and all the law of God is law of Christ in the New.

Frankly, sir, I am finding myself happily surprised at your willingness to be corrected. I mean, you don't give way easily without a fight, which I respect, but you are much better than them that just ignore a sound argument, and only go on to repeat mantra.

Sincerely, just drop the commandment part of your sabbath, so as not to be condemning others for not keeping it with you, and truly your perfecting in knowing Jesus will come to pass.

 

[robert derrick]

I keep answering your ridiculous arguments with solid exegesis such as the Ten Commandments existed before Sinail, including the Sabbath, but you refuse to acknowledge the Bible or the truth of it.

Did God want to test the faithfulness of the people to "MY LAW" by ordering them to rest on Sabbath? Yes, He did, proving that the commandment to rest on Sabbath was an ALREADY EXISTING LAW that God had in His HEAVENLY CODE OF LAW long before the people got anywhere near Sinai.

You've already been shown that Joseph called adultery "sin against God", but you keep on ignoring the facts and arguing some ridiculous notion there were only three laws that existed before Sinai.

Stop lumping the Ten Commandments and the Mosaic Law in together when the Bible clearly makes a distinction between these two different laws, the one written by the hand of Moses and the other by the finger of God.

Remember the old saying, Less exegesis, and more reading what is written, makes every Christian a wise counsellor.

See earlier corrections on how the Lord would see if His people would obey his law, when He gave it. Not before, because he had not yet given it.

It's the old no-retrograded-activation rule of God.

When His previous commandments of murder, circumcision, passover, and sabbath were lumped into His one law of Moses, that is when they became carnal commandments to be done away with at the cross.

Once written in the law, no more separate from the law. Simple.

 

[robert derrick]

If the Ten Commandments Jesus spoke at Sinai aren't the "law of Christ", who's flippin laws are they? Satan's? The Michelin Man's?

Moses.

As Moses the servant of the LORD commanded the children of Israel, as it is written in the book of the law of Moses.

Be ye therefore very courageous to keep and to do all that is written in the book of the law of Moses.

And keep the charge of the LORD thy God, to walk in his ways, to keep his statutes, and his commandments, and his judgments, and his testimonies, as it is written in the law of Moses, that thou mayest prosper in all that thou doest, and whithersoever thou turnest thyself.

There are of course more, but you get the gist of it: statutes, commandments, judgments, testimonies written in the law of Moses, including the first and second great commandments.

Of which the great commandments are now written in the book of the law of Christ, which is written by the apostles, not Moses.

Now, you've tried to fill me in on some pseudo mysteries, and I'll give you one:

All Scripture is law of God and good for instruction of righteousness.

But now, only Scripture of the apostles is law of Christ for men to obey.

The law and word of God are one and the same:

For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.

But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

Understand that you are speaking of the word of God, when speaking of His law, and you will cease trying to separate His commandments from His word.

His word of commandment to His people in the OT was to keep a Sabbath as by law, beginning in the wilderness. His word by His apostles does not.

 

[Phoneman777]

I don't have sabbath commander's law in my heart.

Only those who "keep the commandments of God (which includes the Sabbath Jesus spoke at Sinai) go to heaven (Revelation 22:14 KJV)

For a memorial is the future

Sorry, memorials serve to bring remembrance of things that are past.

A Sabbath isn't even spoken of a memorial

God made the 7th day Sabbath because He rested from all His works which He created and made, says Genesis 2:1-3 KJV.

The blessing was physically, if obeyed. Adam was not blessed by God having rest after creating him. The blessing of keeping the law of God is not being judge as by law.


God didn't wink at Abel's murder, but confronted him with it, put a mark on Cain for life, and also condemned him in Scripture of John's epistle.

If the law of Moses were in effect in the day of Cain, man would have killed him in obedience to the law.


If any man says the sabbath commandment was included, then like elsewhere they are adding your own law to Scripture.

The dream commandment of sabbath with exceptions is false. And it isn't even the Sabbath commandment given by God of old.



Already corrected.




Then said the LORD unto Moses, Behold, I will rain bread from heaven for you; and the people shall go out and gather a certain rate every day, that I may prove them, whether they will walk in my law, or no.

The law was spoken of in future, God would see if they will keep written law, when He gives His law to them.

That law began with the sabbath to test them in gathering of manna.

Some proved not to walk in His law, but gathered on the Sabbath anyway.

The law was not retrograde, as man's unjust laws.



Only one commandment and law was made in Eden: to eat freely, but not of that tree.




True, in the matter of gathering manna, of which gathering the sabbath law was a test of obedience, before they got to Sinai.




Is it pishitta or peshitta? Anyway, pershitta meshitta.

I am in His sabattismos now. Others can dutifully wait another week.



It will be kept again on earth by the natural seed serving the returned Christ.

There is no sabbath nor any day of distinction in the new heaven and earth, where there is no need of sun nor moon to shine, because the Lamb is the light thereof.

The carnal dream of an eternal sabbath day, is carnal.

And it's If we get there. Trust in a pseudo-sabbath makes religious people proud in their boasts, just as the Pharisee Jews had in their religion.



Antinomial of man, is not antinomial of Christ.



When He made the sabbath law, is when He proved them in the wilderness, before ever getting to Sinai.


I don't waste breath begging people to do what I know they will not do. Neither does the Lord.

What you are begging for, is to stop showing how the new modernized sabbath is not even the Lord's Sabbath of old.

Bro, you're like the kid in the airsoft arena who won't admit when he's been shot. I keep blasting you with irrefutable logic and you just keep getting back up reenergized by one ridiculous line of reasoning after the next. Please, just stop.

 

[Phoneman777]

Moses.

As Moses the servant of the LORD commanded the children of Israel, as it is written in the book of the law of Moses.

Be ye therefore very courageous to keep and to do all that is written in the book of the law of Moses.

And keep the charge of the LORD thy God, to walk in his ways, to keep his statutes, and his commandments, and his judgments, and his testimonies, as it is written in the law of Moses, that thou mayest prosper in all that thou doest, and whithersoever thou turnest thyself.

There are of course more, but you get the gist of it: statutes, commandments, judgments, testimonies written in the law of Moses, including the first and second great commandments.

Of which the great commandments are now written in the book of the law of Christ, which is written by the apostles, not Moses.

Now, you've tried to fill me in on some pseudo mysteries, and I'll give you one:

All Scripture is law of God and good for instruction of righteousness.

But now, only Scripture of the apostles is law of Christ for men to obey.

The law and word of God are one and the same:

For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.

But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

Understand that you are speaking of the word of God, when speaking of His law, and you will cease trying to separate His commandments from His word.

His word of commandment to His people in the OT was to keep a Sabbath as by law, beginning in the wilderness. His word by His apostles does not.

When you acknowledge Hebrews 4:9 in the Peshitta says it's our Christian duty to keep the Sabbath, I'll continue our debate, otherwise I'm done.

 

[Robert Gwin]

"arrange (rules or laws) into a systematic code" such as the Code of Hammurabi. Of course, the Ten Commandments existed before Sinai, and at Sinai were merely "arranged into a systematic code".

It will always be wrong to violate any of them, thus proving the eternal nature of them. Everyone thinks they're great until the issue of the 4th one comes up.

Thanks for clarifying that Pman. I fully agree God's commandments existed before Sinai, in reality they always existed as He has. But, they did not become law for God's people until the people accepted the covenant God presented to them through Moses Ex 19:8.

 

[Robert Gwin]

No, I rest on the Sabbath, according to the 4th commandment.

Rest? You are telling me that you have never did any work from the time you became a believer from Friday dusk to Saturday dusk?

 

[Phoneman777]

Thanks for clarifying that Pman. I fully agree God's commandments existed before Sinai, in reality they always existed as He has. But, they did not become law for God's people until the people accepted the covenant God presented to them through Moses Ex 19:8.

Would you agree that it was the will of God that everyone everywhere keep the commandments which existed before Sinai and did not begin at Sinai but were merely codified at Sinai?

If so, why should we conclude that God is only interested that Jews be obedient but the rest of us can do what we want?

The Bible is clear the purpose of the Israel was to INDOCTRINATE the pagan world so that they would stop their human sacrifices an worshipping the sun and conform their lives to God's plan, which Israel was supposed to execute but failed repeatedly due to the fact they were so rebellious and prone to evil that eventually then nailed the Savior to the Cross and thus cut themselves off FOREVER from God as a "chosen nation". The Christian church is now the depository of all of the "promises to the fathers".

 

[Phoneman777]

Rest? You are telling me that you have never did any work from the time you became a believer from Friday dusk to Saturday dusk?

If I told you I've never murdered anyone since becoming a Christian, you'd have no problem accepting that, so why is keeping the Sabbath so problematic? It's literally a commandment you keep by doing nothing.

 

[Robert Gwin]

Would you agree that it was the will of God that everyone everywhere keep the commandments which existed before Sinai and did not begin at Sinai but were merely codified at Sinai?

If so, why should we conclude that God is only interested that Jews be obedient but the rest of us can do what we want?

The Bible is clear the purpose of the Israel was to INDOCTRINATE the pagan world so that they would stop their human sacrifices an worshipping the sun and conform their lives to God's plan, which Israel was supposed to execute but failed repeatedly due to the fact they were so rebellious and prone to evil that eventually then nailed the Savior to the Cross and thus cut themselves off FOREVER from God as a "chosen nation". The Christian church is now the depository of all of the "promises to the fathers".

Would you agree that it was the will of God that everyone everywhere keep the commandments which existed before Sinai and did not begin at Sinai but were merely codified at Sinai? Actually no sir not at that time. Those laws were only for the Israelites and proselytes who joined themselves to them. Jesus came only to the Jews, and did not open up to all nations until the new covenant put on force on Pentecost of 33CE. Jesus personally chose the apostle Paul to be the leader as the apostle to the nations. The law covenant was kept in force till 36CE likely to provide a buffer for the rapid changes under the new covenant.

We don't think about it much now, but put yourself in their shoes, Jehovah's people's lives were basically their religion, and then a drastic change. Imagine the turmoil of deciding which way was correct. Most did not accept Jesus, likely I wouldn't have either, but I am glad I didn't have to find out.

 

[Robert Gwin]

If I told you I've never murdered anyone since becoming a Christian, you'd have no problem accepting that, so why is keeping the Sabbath so problematic? It's literally a commandment you keep by doing nothing.

Again, I ask you sir, you are indicating to me that you have never violated the Sabbath since you accepted your faith? I hate to say it, but I bet if I watched you, you violate it every single week. Yes I salute you for actually knowing when the Sabbath is, but I think you likely are ignorant of what constitutes work. Likely you realize that violation of the Sabbath was death, correct? So everyone you know including yourself would have to be put to death. A simple act like gathering firewood was a violation sir, check out this account: (Numbers 15:32-36) . . .While the Israelites were in the wilderness, they found a man collecting pieces of wood on the Sabbath day. 33 Those who found him collecting wood brought him up to Moses and Aaron and the whole assembly. 34 They committed him into custody because it had not been specified what should be done to him. 35 And Jehovah said to Moses: “The man should be put to death without fail, and the whole assembly should stone him outside the camp.” 36 So the whole assembly brought him outside the camp and stoned him so that he died, just as Jehovah had commanded Moses.

I guess it don't really matter, if we are in error about the Sabbath Law no longer being in force, myself, you, and every single individual we know are dead people anyway. I kinda think that Paul was correct however, and the Sabbath was not part of the Law of the Christ.

 

[Phoneman777]

Would you agree that it was the will of God that everyone everywhere keep the commandments which existed before Sinai and did not begin at Sinai but were merely codified at Sinai? Actually no sir not at that time. Those laws were only for the Israelites and proselytes who joined themselves to them. Jesus came only to the Jews, and did not open up to all nations until the new covenant put on force on Pentecost of 33CE. Jesus personally chose the apostle Paul to be the leader as the apostle to the nations. The law covenant was kept in force till 36CE likely to provide a buffer for the rapid changes under the new covenant.

We don't think about it much now, but put yourself in their shoes, Jehovah's people's lives were basically their religion, and then a drastic change. Imagine the turmoil of deciding which way was correct. Most did not accept Jesus, likely I wouldn't have either, but I am glad I didn't have to find out.

I don't know...if your kid got stuck having to pay for the crimes of others, how long would it take for you to say, "Alright, people, that's enough"?

That's why the "whole duty of man" is to "fear God and keep His commandments", plain and simple.

 

[Phoneman777]

Again, I ask you sir, you are indicating to me that you have never violated the Sabbath since you accepted your faith? I hate to say it, but I bet if I watched you, you violate it every single week. Yes I salute you for actually knowing when the Sabbath is, but I think you likely are ignorant of what constitutes work.

Those are pretty bold assumptions, friend. I've stuck to Biblically defined terms and conditions, so can you do so also?

Likely you realize that violation of the Sabbath was death, correct? So everyone you know including yourself would have to be put to death. A simple act like gathering firewood was a violation sir, check out this account: (Numbers 15:32-36) . . .While the Israelites were in the wilderness, they found a man collecting pieces of wood on the Sabbath day. 33 Those who found him collecting wood brought him up to Moses and Aaron and the whole assembly. 34 They committed him into custody because it had not been specified what should be done to him. 35 And Jehovah said to Moses: “The man should be put to death without fail, and the whole assembly should stone him outside the camp.” 36 So the whole assembly brought him outside the camp and stoned him so that he died, just as Jehovah had commanded Moses.

I've got news for you: if you break ANY ONE OF THEM, YOU'RE GOING TO HELL. So, the best thing for us to do is invite Jesus into our heart and allow Him to live out His obedient life through us, and that's how we can be "innocent of the Great Transgression" which is presumptuous, deliberate, habitual, known sin.

I guess it don't really matter, if we are in error about the Sabbath Law no longer being in force, myself, you, and every single individual we know are dead people anyway. I kinda think that Paul was correct however, and the Sabbath was not part of the Law of the Christ.

Hammurabi wrote 282. The Romans, thousands. The U.S.A., millions. What wisdom is demonstrated by Christ when He spoke the Ten Commandments at Sinai which remarkably covers every single offense against God possible known to the universe. So, the Law of Christ is simply this: if we love God, we'll keep the first four, and if we love our neighbor, the last six.

 

[Robert Gwin]

I don't know...if your kid got stuck having to pay for the crimes of others, how long would it take for you to say, "Alright, people, that's enough"?

That's why the "whole duty of man" is to "fear God and keep His commandments", plain and simple.

I know where you are coming from Pman. But think about it honestly, why do people vote for politicians? Because they have faith that they will make changes for the better correct? Do you honestly think they believe the world is passing away and they should be seeking the Kingdom of God first? There are so many people out there that still believe that we can be our own gods and literally correct the problems. I have a good friend who is very well educated secularly, and he is fully convinced that future generations are going to be able to solve this world's problems. I mean that literally, and he is not incorrect that in the strides in which we have advanced in they have been very successful. God's people however realize the Bible is right, and this world is spiraling downward.

Remember satan told Eve she could be her own god, choosing for herself her path, and when Adam chose to join her it meant the same thing, God did right in allowing them to prove their case because in the long run people will have to learn that we need God, we cannot be our own gods that is why Jehovah has to let it go to the point of extinction to show not only mankind, but the faithful angels that we need God for our survival. Does this make any sense sir? Mat 24:22

 

[Robert Gwin]

Those are pretty bold assumptions, friend. I've stuck to Biblically defined terms and conditions, so can you do so also?
I've got news for you: if you break ANY ONE OF THEM, YOU'RE GOING TO HELL. So, the best thing for us to do is invite Jesus into our heart and allow Him to live out His obedient life through us, and that's how we can be "innocent of the Great Transgression" which is presumptuous, deliberate, habitual, known sin.
Hammurabi wrote 282. The Romans, thousands. The U.S.A., millions. What wisdom is demonstrated by Christ when He spoke the Ten Commandments at Sinai which remarkably covers every single offense against God possible known to the universe. So, the Law of Christ is simply this: if we love God, we'll keep the first four, and if we love our neighbor, the last six.

Now that we have that settled Pman, and you realize that you deserve death because of violating the Sabbath, along with everyone else you know, would you like to discuss hell sir? It is a very fascinating topic, and you might be intrigued to know that everyone who dies goes there, but not permanently.

 

[robert derrick]

Only those who "keep the commandments of God go to heaven (Revelation 22:14 KJV)

True.

(which includes the Sabbath Jesus spoke at Sinai)

False.

Only those who "keep the commandments of God (which includes the Sabbath Jesus spoke at Sinai) go to heaven (Revelation 22:14 KJV)
Sorry, memorials serve to bring remembrance of things that are past.
God made the 7th day Sabbath because He rested from all His works which He created and made, says Genesis 2:1-3 KJV.
Bro, you're like the kid in the airsoft arena who won't admit when he's been shot. I keep blasting you with irrefutable logic and you just keep getting back up reenergized by one ridiculous line of reasoning after the next. Please, just stop.

Sorry, memorials serve to bring remembrance of things that are past.

They become past only after the ordinance is made to do so.

God made the 7th day Sabbath because He rested from all His works which He created and made, says Genesis 2:1-3 KJV.

Already corrected. The first sabbath was commanded pertaining to the gathering of man.

Please, just stop.

When you stop commanding your pseudo-sabbath, I'll stop rebuking it.

When you acknowledge Hebrews 4:9 in the Peshitta says it's our Christian duty to keep the Sabbath, I'll continue our debate, otherwise I'm done.

Peshittia meshitta.

Conclusion:
1. The Sabbath commandment as all commandments of the Lord for the OT, were written within the law of Moses, and were done away with it at the cross.

2. The commandments of the Lord for His church were then given to His apostles after His resurrection, which include 9 written as of old.

3. The sabbath commanded today is a false one that is not the Lord's Sabbath of old, being ridden with men's exceptions for man's commandment.

 

[Phoneman777]

I know where you are coming from Pman. But think about it honestly, why do people vote for politicians? Because they have faith that they will make changes for the better correct? Do you honestly think they believe the world is passing away and they should be seeking the Kingdom of God first? There are so many people out there that still believe that we can be our own gods and literally correct the problems. I have a good friend who is very well educated secularly, and he is fully convinced that future generations are going to be able to solve this world's problems. I mean that literally, and he is not incorrect that in the strides in which we have advanced in they have been very successful. God's people however realize the Bible is right, and this world is spiraling downward.

Remember satan told Eve she could be her own god, choosing for herself her path, and when Adam chose to join her it meant the same thing, God did right in allowing them to prove their case because in the long run people will have to learn that we need God, we cannot be our own gods that is why Jehovah has to let it go to the point of extinction to show not only mankind, but the faithful angels that we need God for our survival. Does this make any sense sir? Mat 24:22

We have to agree that whether mankind determines to do or not do the "whole duty of man" doesn't make that duty any less than what it is: "fear God and KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS".

 

[Phoneman777]

Now that we have that settled Pman, and you realize that you deserve death because of violating the Sabbath, along with everyone else you know, would you like to discuss hell sir? It is a very fascinating topic, and you might be intrigued to know that everyone who dies goes there, but not permanently.

Grace is not a license to keep violating any of God's laws, including the Sabbath, right?

 

[Phoneman777]

True.


False.








They become past only after the ordinance is made to do so.




Already corrected. The first sabbath was commanded pertaining to the gathering of man.




When you stop commanding your pseudo-sabbath, I'll stop rebuking it.


Peshittia meshitta.

Conclusion:
1. The Sabbath commandment as all commandments of the Lord for the OT, were written within the law of Moses, and were done away with it at the cross.

2. The commandments of the Lord for His church were then given to His apostles after His resurrection, which include 9 written as of old.

3. The sabbath commanded today is a false one that is not the Lord's Sabbath of old, being ridden with men's exceptions for man's commandment.

Excuse me, but the second the Sabbath was created it was a memorial to Creation Week. What part of Genesis 2:1-3 KJV do you not see confirming this?

 

[robert derrick]

Excuse me, but the second the Sabbath was created it was a memorial to Creation Week. What part of Genesis 2:1-3 KJV do you not see confirming this?

False. Not at first.

When it is first made as commandment in Exodus 16, it was to test the obedience of the Israelites by the gathering and baking of manna.

When it was made law in Exodus 20, it was made a shadow of God's rest, and Paul confirmed that Psalms 95 was as a foreshadowing of Christ's rest.

The point of this thread is proven: the modern sabbath commanded by carnal men is hypocritical with working exceptions to fit the times.

The Lord's Sabbath is not commanded to day, much less kept as written.

You keep your exception-ridden corban-filled sabbath all you want.

It's a vain show for wanna-be sabbath keepers.

Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances, (Touch not; taste not; handle not; Which all are to perish with the using) after the commandments and doctrines of men?

Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body; not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh.

There is no honor with God in a show of fleshly obedience to a carnal commandment of men.