Are people with resentment lost?

[jonadutch]

The bible says that , If you forgive, your heavenly Father will also forgive. We must forgive, as we hope to be forgiven.



Are all people whit resentment lost ?




John 20: 23 Says :
If you forgive anyone's sins, they are forgiven; if you retain anyone's sins, they are retained.

Luke 6:37 (NIV) "...Forgive, and you will be forgiven."

Mat 6:14-15 (NIV) "For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But, if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins."

Mark 11:25 (NIV) "And when you stand praying, if you hold anything against anyone, forgive him, so that your Father in heaven may forgive you your sins."

 

[Niki]

If you are asking if a Christian has something happen to them that causes them to resent another, are they lost, I would say no.

We don't loose our salvation from one moment to the next...ongoing sin and issues that need forgiveness are things that often have to be worked through.

I think we do need to keep things fresh though and the Holy Spirit will work in us to encourage us to forgive and deal with things. Some people cling
stubbornly to unforgiveness though, yet we are told to forgive as we have been forgiven.

Self righteousness is another factor here. But, as I said, the Holy Spirit, if we allow Him, will work in us causing us to repent of our hard hearts. Some
people have had horrible things happen....sometimes you have to keep forgiving as thoughts enter your head.

 

[aspen]

Bitterness and resentment are the fruits of self indulgence and pride. Over a life time they can certainly sanctify us for Hell.

 

[JB_Reformed Baptist]

The bible says that , If you forgive, your heavenly Father will also forgive. We must forgive, as we hope to be forgiven.



Are all people whit resentment lost ?




John 20: 23 Says :
If you forgive anyone's sins, they are forgiven; if you retain anyone's sins, they are retained. This I believe only applied to the Apostles.

Luke 6:37 (NIV) "...Forgive, and you will be forgiven."

Mat 6:14-15 (NIV) "For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But, if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins."

Mark 11:25 (NIV) "And when you stand praying, if you hold anything against anyone, forgive him, so that your Father in heaven may forgive you your sins."

The scriptures say, 'he who practices sin is of the devil'. So if the TENOR of ones life is that, then they ought to examine if they are in the faith. :)

He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother. 1Jn 3:8-10

 

[clark thompson]

If they hold on to their bitterness and don't forgive those who wronged them before they die, they do not have salvation. If they hold on bitterness and forgive in years to come, maybe they still have salvation because they may have finally did what the Lord wanted them to do.

 

[Angelina]

Unforgiveness is something that everyone battles with. We can unknowingly hold a grudge that can turn into unforgiveness and eventually bitterness very quickly. The key as you have pointed out, is to forgive from the heart. Unforgiveness can hinder prayers, healing and deliverance. It can also hinder us from hearing clearly from the Lord. I agree with aspen2 here...it can certainly separate us from God's presence because it is a form of rebellion.

Shalom!

 

[Niki]

From some of the responses, I am inclined to ask: so, how about other sins? What if you or I or Joe Blow has a sin they just struggle with and die not having victory over it?

Have they lost their salvation?

Because, even though unforgiveness is unforgiving, do you really know why you need to forgive? Is it so that you don't loose your salvation?

And like I said, what about other sins? Are sins on a sliding scale with forgiveness being one of the worst?

Those are the kinds of things one should ask before tripping over one issue.

So, why is forgiveness so important?

 

[Angelina]

So, why is forgiveness so important?

Matthew 6:9-15
9 “This, then, is how you should pray:
“‘Our Father in heaven,
hallowed be your name,
10 your kingdom come,
your will be done,
on earth as it is in heaven.
11 Give us today our daily bread.
12 And forgive us our debts,
as we also have forgiven our debtors.
13 And lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from the evil one.
14 For if you forgive other people when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15 But if you do not forgive others their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.

Matthew 18
21 Then Peter came to Jesus and asked, “Lord, how many times shall I forgive my brother or sister who sins against me? Up to seven times?”
22 Jesus answered, “I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven times.

Matthew 18:23-30
The Parable of the Unmerciful Servant...
32 “Then the master called the servant in. ‘You wicked servant,’ he said, ‘I canceled all that debt of yours because you begged me to. 33 Shouldn’t you have had mercy on your fellow servant just as I had on you?’ 34 In anger his master handed him over to the jailers to be tortured, until he should pay back all he owed.
35 “This is how my heavenly Father will treat each of you unless you forgive your brother or sister from your heart.”

Colossians 3
13 Bear with each other and forgive one another if any of you has a grievance against someone. Forgive as the Lord forgave you.

...because God commands it and because he will not forgive us, if we do not forgive others... :huh: think about that for a moment....

Shalom!

 

[Niki]

All true...but I am thinking of a deeper reason. :)

 

[Angelina]

Luke 23:34
Jesus said, “Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing.” And they divided up his clothes by casting lots.

John 20:23
1 Again Jesus said, “Peace be with you! As the Father has sent me, I am sending you.” 22 And with that he breathed on them and said, “Receive the Holy Spirit. 23 If you forgive anyone’s sins, their sins are forgiven; if you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven.”

Shalom!

 

[biggandyy]

The scriptures say, 'he who practices sin is of the devil'. So if the TENOR of ones life is that, then they ought to examine if they are in the faith.

That is one of the best sentences I've read in a long time.

 

[This Vale Of Tears]

From some of the responses, I am inclined to ask: so, how about other sins? What if you or I or Joe Blow has a sin they just struggle with and die not having victory over it?

Have they lost their salvation?

Because, even though unforgiveness is unforgiving, do you really know why you need to forgive? Is it so that you don't loose your salvation?

And like I said, what about other sins? Are sins on a sliding scale with forgiveness being one of the worst?

Those are the kinds of things one should ask before tripping over one issue.

So, why is forgiveness so important?

It isn't that forgiveness is unimportant, it's that many Christians don't know what forgiveness is. Jesus tells a parable about a woman seeking justice from an unjust judge. She had been harmed and she pestered the judge repeatedly to prosecute the person who brought her harm. Even this unjust judge surrenders to this woman's recurring supplication and brings her enemy to justice. So much the more, Jesus tells us, will our heavenly father speedily avenge his children who cry out to him day and night.

Is this woman lost? Are we lost when we cry out for vengeance? Or do we simply not have an understanding of what forgiveness is?

 

[JB_Reformed Baptist]

That is one of the best sentences I've read in a long time.

Thanks brother. :)

Along the same vein, I'm reminded of Psalm 1: FF & in this case, verse 3. To wit, "And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season;".. of course this is conditional upon feeding on his word and one would only do that if they are his.

SHALOM

Luke 23:34
Jesus said, “Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing.” And they divided up his clothes by casting lots.

John 20:23
1 Again Jesus said, “Peace be with you! As the Father has sent me, I am sending you.” 22 And with that he breathed on them and said, “Receive the Holy Spirit. 23 If you forgive anyone’s sins, their sins are forgiven; if you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven.”

Shalom!

So tell me Angelina, are we commanded to forgive our enemies and not just those who offend us?

 

[Angelina]

What do you think JB? :huh: IMO unforgiveness holds the bearer in bondage....forgiving others removes the power of the enemy over our thoughts and actions...he can't do much if we don't let him ;)

BB

 

[laid renard]

It isn't that forgiveness is unimportant, it's that many Christians don't know what forgiveness is. Jesus tells a parable about a woman seeking justice from an unjust judge. She had been harmed and she pestered the judge repeatedly to prosecute the person who brought her harm. Even this unjust judge surrenders to this woman's recurring supplication and brings her enemy to justice. So much the more, Jesus tells us, will our heavenly father speedily avenge his children who cry out to him day and night.

Is this woman lost? Are we lost when we cry out for vengeance? Or do we simply not have an understanding of what forgiveness is?

I have always LOOOVED that scripture. It brings me such comfort.

Oh, I forgot to say something. You can still forgive someone, yet ask for justice. There is always consequences to sin, whether we see them on this side of Heaven or the other. Do the crime, do the time.
The Pope visited his shooter behind bars. It was one of the most beautiful photos I have ever seen, with their two heads touching......But it happened behind bars. Forgiveness and justice should co-exist, as far as crimes are concerned, to deter other individuals from committing harm to others. In the end, justice best serves the perpetrator, for it encourages them to repent.

 

[JB_Reformed Baptist]

What do you think JB? :huh: IMO unforgiveness holds the bearer in bondage....forgiving others removes the power of the enemy over our thoughts and actions...he can't do much if we don't let him ;)

BB

Can you show me in scripture where I'm required to forgive my enemy? Specific scripture would be helpful and no rationalizations, please.

NB: We are all aware that we're required to love our enemy as Paul elaborates on in Romans, but thats not forgiveness, is it.

 

[Niki]

It isn't that forgiveness is unimportant, it's that many Christians don't know what forgiveness is. Jesus tells a parable about a woman seeking justice from an unjust judge. She had been harmed and she pestered the judge repeatedly to prosecute the person who brought her harm. Even this unjust judge surrenders to this woman's recurring supplication and brings her enemy to justice. So much the more, Jesus tells us, will our heavenly father speedily avenge his children who cry out to him day and night.

Is this woman lost? Are we lost when we cry out for vengeance? Or do we simply not have an understanding of what forgiveness is?

Some interesting and THOUGHTFUL questions...which is what I like. I like to provoke others to think and like it when I am asked to think :)

Yes, we can agree that forgiveness is not an option...scriptures have been provided and I guess we could say "ignore at your own risk"

What I was actually thinking about was what unforgiveness does to the person who harbors it. And you have brought up something that IMO, should be addressed.

What about those who have done terrible wrong or cause situations? I am currently dealing with a situation involving someone who has done some awful things
and broken up a family through lies, manipulation and false accusation. This person says they are a Christian but their fruit is rotten and if you bite into it,
you get poisoned (not a literal bite...this is a metaphor in case someone is not sure)

This person has personally done great harm to me...which I don't want to go into...and I have forgiven them multiple times. I am at the point now where I would
just like to get them out of my life...if you are guessing this person is a relative, you are right, but I am not talking about my husband...this is another issue entirely.

I have prayed with this person, talked with them, anything and everything you could think of and nothing, I mean absolutely nothing, makes any dent. They continue
to lie and cause problems.

The Bible says we should not have anything to do with someone who is named as a Christian and yet acts in this manner.

I see above where JB wrote about forgiving enemies and yet Jesus said we should forgive.

Anyone want to really examine these things? I will if you will....

Please do not tell me to forgive the person..if you read this post, you know I have. Don't tell me they are going to hell...I've been told all those things.

I think there is demonic activity at work....there seems to be an air around this person that is palatable...or maybe I am overly sensitive?

Thoughts?

 

[Angelina]

Can you show me in scripture where I'm required to forgive my enemy? Specific scripture would be helpful and no rationalizations, please.

NB: We are all aware that we're required to love our enemy as Paul elaborates on in Romans, but thats not forgiveness, is it.

What point are you trying to make here JB? :huh: That we are to love our enemies but not forgive them? Am I correct in saying that Christians are followers of Jesus...and if that is correct, did he not forgive his enemies? even those who nailed him to the cross?

BB

 

[This Vale Of Tears]

Some interesting and THOUGHTFUL questions...which is what I like. I like to provoke others to think and like it when I am asked to think :)

Yes, we can agree that forgiveness is not an option...scriptures have been provided and I guess we could say "ignore at your own risk"

What I was actually thinking about was what unforgiveness does to the person who harbors it. And you have brought up something that IMO, should be addressed.

What about those who have done terrible wrong or cause situations? I am currently dealing with a situation involving someone who has done some awful things
and broken up a family through lies, manipulation and false accusation. This person says they are a Christian but their fruit is rotten and if you bite into it,
you get poisoned (not a literal bite...this is a metaphor in case someone is not sure)

This person has personally done great harm to me...which I don't want to go into...and I have forgiven them multiple times. I am at the point now where I would
just like to get them out of my life...if you are guessing this person is a relative, you are right, but I am not talking about my husband...this is another issue entirely.

I have prayed with this person, talked with them, anything and everything you could think of and nothing, I mean absolutely nothing, makes any dent. They continue
to lie and cause problems.

The Bible says we should not have anything to do with someone who is named as a Christian and yet acts in this manner.

I see above where JB wrote about forgiving enemies and yet Jesus said we should forgive.

Anyone want to really examine these things? I will if you will....

Please do not tell me to forgive the person..if you read this post, you know I have. Don't tell me they are going to hell...I've been told all those things.

I think there is demonic activity at work....there seems to be an air around this person that is palatable...or maybe I am overly sensitive?

Thoughts?

I've heard a pastor once preach that forgiveness is taking someone off of our hook and putting them on God's hook. When God says, "Vengeance is mine, I will repay." I see the last 3 words as a promise to us, especially when "will" is emphasized. Letting go is an act of trust that this promise will come to fruition. It's not abandoning a desire to see somebody get what they deserve, it's abandoning the fear that we won't get justice unless we get it for ourselves. "How long, O Lord," asks the martyrs before the throne of God, "will you tarry to judge and avenge our blood on the inhabitants of the earth"? (Rev 6:10) Allowing God to be our avenger is an act of perfect trust.

 

[Niki]

Yeah...I've heard/read that also Vale and i agree...but I also think forgiveness must go deeper than letting them off our hook...although I agree with that principal and if
that is followed through, I expect less pain and frustration.

And yes, that verse about the martyrs under the throne asking 'how long' is both touching and revealing I find. Do you see a connection to those refusing the mark in that
though or a general principal or both?

You must be familiar with the story of David when he was fleeing his throne because of Absalom? from II Sam

As King David approached Bahurim, a man from the same clan as Saul’s family came out from there. His name was Shimei son of Gera, and he cursed as he came out. 6He pelted David and all the king’s officials with stones, though all the troops and the special guard were on David’s right and left. 7As he cursed, Shimei said, “Get out, get out, you murderer, you scoundrel! 8The Lord has repaid you for all the blood you shed in the household of Saul, in whose place you have reigned. The Lord has given the kingdom into the hands of your son Absalom. You have come to ruin because you are a murderer!”
9Then Abishai son of Zeruiah said to the king, “Why should this dead dog curse my lord the king? Let me go over and cut off his head.”
10But the king said, “What does this have to do with you, you sons of Zeruiah? If he is cursing because the Lord said to him, ‘Curse David,’ who can ask, ‘Why do you do this?’ ”
11David then said to Abishai and all his officials, “My son, my own flesh and blood, is trying to kill me. How much more, then, this Benjamite! Leave him alone; let him curse, for theLord has told him to. 12It may be that the Lord will look upon my misery and restore to me his covenant blessing instead of his curse today.”
13So David and his men continued along the road while Shimei was going along the hillside opposite him, cursing as he went and throwing stones at him and showering him with dirt.14The king and all the people with him arrived at their destination exhausted. And there he refreshed himself.

There really is alot to this forgiveness and allowing God to take care of justice. I think some of us want justice more than revenge. What do you think of that?