Acts 2:38 has been abandoned by Christianity

[mailmandan]

Try again, Dan.

Mark 16....believe...and is....baptized....saved...

Acts 2....baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins.....

Acts 10...believe...remission of sins...

The puzzle is only 3 pieces.

There is nothing to try again. I properly harmonized scripture with scripture (and did not merely isolate, build and ignore) and I reached my conclusions in posts #415 #417 and #419. If you still cannot see the truth past your blinders then I cannot help you any further. Only the Lord can open your eyes to the truth.

 

[Truther]

There is nothing to try again. I properly harmonized scripture with scripture (and did not merely isolate, build and ignore) and I reached my conclusions in posts #415 #417 and #419. If you still cannot see the truth past your blinders then I cannot help you any further. Only the Lord can open your eyes to the truth.

Demolishing Acts 2:38 is not harmonization, Dan.

 

[mailmandan]

Demolishing Acts 2:38 is not harmonization, Dan.

I never demolished it. You demolish multiple passages of scripture through your biased interpretation of Acts 2:38.

 

[user]

If water baptism is absolutely required for salvation, then why did Jesus not mention it in the following verses? (3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26). What is the one requirement that Jesus mentions 9 different times in each of these complete statements? *BELIEVES. *What happened to baptism? *Hermeneutics.

Lets take a look at the scriptures you gave...

John 3:15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

John 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

John 6:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

John 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.



Ok so your focus is on "believe". And, water baptism is not mentioned therefore is not important to salvation.

You have harmonized Nothing! Your ignorance concluded falsely. Those scriptures do not mention Repentance, therefore (by your own testimony) you prove beyond a shadow of any doubt that your are unable to properly harmonize scripture...

Luke 13:3 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.


Notice repent is not in this one...
Ananias says to Paul, why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.


But it is in this...
Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Notice "believe" is in neither of the above. But we know it is necessary and it is in the other scriptures.
Are you now beginning to see the bigger picture?

 

[Wrangler]

Are you now beginning to see the bigger picture?

The only point of contention is the necessity of water. Sometimes when I call my wife, I use a phone. Using a phone is not necessary.

The thief on the cross did not need water.

I think we should differentiate between tradition and Scriptural requirement.

 

[mailmandan]

Lets take a look at the scriptures you gave...

John 3:15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

John 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

John 6:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

John 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Amen! Notice believeth/believe in/on Him "apart from additions or modifications."

Ok so your focus is on "believe". And, water baptism is not mentioned therefore is not important to salvation.

If water baptism was absolutely necessary for salvation, then the Lord would not make so many statements in scripture in which He promises eternal life to those who simply BELIEVE (John 1:12; 3:15,16,18,36; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26; Acts 10:43; 13:39; 16:31; Romans 1:16; 3:24-28; 4:5; 10:4; 1 Corinthians 1:21; 1 John 5:13 etc..). Believe precedes baptism and we are saved the moment we believe. (Acts 10:43-47)

You have harmonized Nothing! Your ignorance concluded falsely. Those scriptures do not mention Repentance, therefore (by your own testimony) you prove beyond a shadow of any doubt that your are unable to properly harmonize scripture...

I have properly harmonized scripture with scripture and continue to do so. You have just shown your ignorance. Repentance actually PRECEDES believing unto salvation and does not need to be spelled out in those passages of scripture in order to figure that out. Repent and believe are two sides to the same coin. (Matthew 21:32; Mark 1:15; Acts 20:21) Campbellites reverse the scriptural order of repentance and faith which leads to their confusion.

Luke 13:3 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

Unless we repent (change our mind) we will not believe unto salvation. *Hermeneutics.

Notice repent is not in this one...
Ananias says to Paul, why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Excellent article on Acts 22:16 - WHAT IS TRUTH: Acts 22:16--Baptism Essential for Salvation?

But it is in this...
Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

When only repent is mentioned in connection with salvation, belief/faith is implied or assumed. Where you have one, you must have the other. When only belief/faith is mentioned in connection with salvation, repent is implied or assumed. If we have truly repented, then we have placed our faith in Christ for salvation. If we have placed our faith in Christ for salvation, then we already repented in the process of changing our mind and choosing to place our faith in Christ for salvation. Repent (change your mind) -- "new direction of that change of mind" -- "faith in Jesus Christ for salvation." *Two sides to the same coin.*

Notice "believe" is in neither of the above. But we know it is necessary and it is in the other scriptures.
Are you now beginning to see the bigger picture?

I saw the big picture several years ago upon my conversion. The big picture is not distort and pervert passages of scripture in an effort to "patch together" your so called gospel plan of salvation by faith + works.

 

[user]

Amen! Notice believeth/believe in/on Him "apart from additions or modifications."

If water baptism was absolutely necessary for salvation, then the Lord would not make so many statements in scripture in which He promises eternal life to those who simply BELIEVE (John 1:12; 3:15,16,18,36; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26; Acts 10:43; 13:39; 16:31; Romans 1:16; 3:24-28; 4:5; 10:4; 1 Corinthians 1:21; 1 John 5:13 etc..). Believe precedes baptism and we are saved the moment we believe. (Acts 10:43-47)

I have properly harmonized scripture with scripture and continue to do so. You have just shown your ignorance. Repentance actually PRECEDES believing unto salvation and does not need to be spelled out in those passages of scripture in order to figure that out. Repent and believe are two sides to the same coin. (Matthew 21:32; Mark 1:15; Acts 20:21) Campbellites reverse the scriptural order of repentance and faith which leads to their confusion.

Unless we repent (change our mind) we will not believe unto salvation. *Hermeneutics.

Excellent article on Acts 22:16 - WHAT IS TRUTH: Acts 22:16--Baptism Essential for Salvation?

When only repent is mentioned in connection with salvation, belief/faith is implied or assumed. Where you have one, you must have the other. When only belief/faith is mentioned in connection with salvation, repent is implied or assumed. If we have truly repented, then we have placed our faith in Christ for salvation. If we have placed our faith in Christ for salvation, then we already repented in the process of changing our mind and choosing to place our faith in Christ for salvation. Repent (change your mind) -- "new direction of that change of mind" -- "faith in Jesus Christ for salvation." *Two sides to the same coin.*

I saw the big picture several years ago upon my conversion. The big picture is not distort and pervert passages of scripture in an effort to "patch together" your so called gospel plan of salvation by faith + works.

Reiterating your ignorance is not a rebuttal.

 

[user]

The only point of contention is the necessity of water. Sometimes when I call my wife, I use a phone. Using a phone is not necessary.

The thief on the cross did not need water.

I think we should differentiate between tradition and Scriptural requirement.

Thank you for your input. The thief on the cross did not enter into the kingdom via NT plan of salvation because , although Jesus was close to death, he was not yet dead...

Hebrews 9:16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
Hebrews 9:17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

 

[mailmandan]

Reiterating your ignorance is not a rebuttal.

You are simply ignorant to my rebuttal.

 

[mailmandan]

Thank you for your input. The thief on the cross did not enter into the kingdom via NT plan of salvation because , although Jesus was close to death, he was not yet dead...

Hebrews 9:16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
Hebrews 9:17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

So in Acts 2:38 (after the death of Jesus) we read - "Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." Of course you interpret that to mean that water baptism is for "in order to obtain" the remission of sins.

Now what about Mark 1:4 (before the death of Jesus) in which we read - "John came baptizing in the wilderness and preaching a baptism of repentance for the remission of sins." Also in Luke 3:3, we read - "And he went into all the region around the Jordan, preaching a baptism of repentance for the remission of sins."

Now was this baptism of repentance for "in order to obtain" the remission of sins or was it for "in regards to/on the basis of" the remission of sins received upon repentance? *Be careful! This was before the death of Jesus. ;)

In Matthew 3:11, we read - I baptize you with water for repentance.. *Now was this baptism for "in order to obtain" repentance? or was it for "in regards to/on the basis of" repentance? Of course, baptized "in order to obtain" repentance makes no sense at all. Repentance precedes water baptism and is unto the remission of sins. (Acts 3:19)

 

[Wrangler]

Thank you for your input. The thief on the cross did not enter into the kingdom via NT plan of salvation because , although Jesus was close to death, he was not yet dead...

By what means did the thief on the cross enter into the kingdom?

 

[Truther]

I never demolished it. You demolish multiple passages of scripture through your biased interpretation of Acts 2:38.

No, all NT baptism verses must harmonize with Acts 2:38.

Acts 2:38 was the beginning of it all.

You pit verses out of context to attempt to debunk Acts 2:38.

There are seminariams that have made a career out of doing that.

We are living in crazy end times.

 

[mailmandan]

No, all NT baptism verses must harmonize with Acts 2:38.

So everything must "conform" to your biased interpretation of your pet verse Acts 2:38?

Acts 2:38 was the beginning of it all.

Mark 1:4 and Luke 3:3 were before Acts 2:38. *Now answer my questions in post #430 that pertain to Mark 1:4; Luke 3:3 and Matthew 3:11 and be careful! This baptism here that John was preaching was before the death of Jesus.

You pit verses out of context to attempt to debunk Acts 2:38.

What verses did I pit out of context? Your biased interpretation of Acts 2:38 has already been debunked. You pit verses out of context in order to try and force them to "conform" to your biased interpretation of your pet verse Acts 2:38.

There are seminariams that have made a career out of doing that.

You are absolutely obsessed with Acts 2:38! You seem to have more faith in the water god than you do in the Savior God. The so called church of Christ has really done a number on you!

We are living in crazy end times.

What's crazy is your absolute obsession with your pet verse Acts 2:38. It's all you talk about.

 

[Truther]

So everything must "conform" to your biased interpretation of your pet verse Acts 2:38?

Mark 1:4 and Luke 3:3 were before Acts 2:38. *Now answer my questions in post #430 that pertain to Mark 1:4; Luke 3:3 and Matthew 3:11 and be careful! This baptism here that John was preaching was before the death of Jesus.

What verses did I pit out of context? Your biased interpretation of Acts 2:38 has already been debunked. You pit verses out of context in order to try and force them to "conform" to your biased interpretation of your pet verse Acts 2:38.

You are absolutely obsessed with Acts 2:38! You seem to have more faith in the water god than you do in the Savior God. The so called church of Christ has really done a number on you!

What's crazy is your absolute obsession with your pet verse Acts 2:38. It's all you talk about.

Correct, Acts 2:38 was the first command to sinners at Pentecost per how to be saved.

This command was repeated through the rest of Acts.

It was not until the rise of the RCC and all of it's protestant daughters was this command abandoned.

 

[Wrangler]

It was not until the rise of the RCC and all of it's protestant daughters was this command abandoned.

It remains in the Bible approved by those denominations. How so abandoned?

 

[Truther]

It remains in the Bible approved by those denominations. How so abandoned?

They stopped obeying Acts 2:38 and teach others to do the same.

They forbid Acts 2:38, by penalty of expulsion.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Those who are born again submit themselves to water baptism by immersion (as practiced by the apostolic churches).

NO Bible, just water-head folly Enoch ads to Bible. Ignoring the NAME in which the sinner is baptised is as bad cursing it.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

<Submit themselves> must still be seen.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

It is no more true that he is a true jew who has been physically circumcised than it is that he is a born again man who has been splashed with physical water.

It is no more true that he is a true Jew who has been physically circumcised than that he who has been splashed with or immersed in physical water, is a born again child of God. But it is as sure as the Word of God that he who is born again is baptised "IN THE NAME" and he who is a born again child of God is one baptised "IN THE NAME of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit-NAME" : OF GOD.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Is that a church movement thing, or just some members professing baptism is not necessary on this board?

There's no one I can see on this board who says <<baptism is not necessary>>. Everyone on this board, alleges baptism in or with water is necessary. I have seen no one here who says baptism "IN THE NAME" is necessary to be saved. I.o.w. I can see on this board only those who maintain the righteousness and works of MAN necessary for salvation, no one who says ONLY GOD'S Righteousness and WORK (of the Holy Spirit) is necessary for full and final and once for all Salvation.