The Trinity definition

[ChristisGod]

Christo....
Trying to be tricky here? Playing scripture chess are we? Love it...

A little puzzled by your statement as if you are suggesting that YHWH could be someone else, other that the Father of all.

The verse addresses YHWH our Father, indeed. He alone presented the promise to future generations through Joel..and even David if you care to find that verse as well

I would be careful in making you next move if I were you.....

APAK

Color coded for Clarity :)

And Scripture always interprets scripture and the N.T. always sheds light on the meaning of the O.T. when it is quoted. This is biblical hermenuetics 101.

Joel 2:32
32 "And it will come about that whoever calls on the name of the Lord
Will be delivered;
For on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem
There will be those who escape,
As the Lord has said,
Even among the survivors whom the Lord calls.

Here we see Paul quote this OT passage about YHWH and apply it to Jesus who is the one and only Lord according to the N.T.

Rom 10:9-13
9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; 10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, "WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED." 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him; 13 for "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED."


So a person must confess Jesus is YHWH(Lord) to be saved. Confess means to agree with so the person confessing Jesus is Lord is in agreement that He is YHWH. Whoever will call upon the name of the Lord ( YHWH) will be saved.

hope this helps !!!

 

[Jane_Doe22]

@marks

This is from Christianity.com

All Christians believe the doctrine of the Trinity. If you do not believe this—that is, if you have come to a settled conclusion that the doctrine of the Trinity is not true—you are not a Christian at all. You are in fact a heretic. Those words may sound harsh, but they represent the judgment of the Christian church across the centuries. What is the Trinity? Christians in every land unite in proclaiming that our God eternally exists as Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Those who deny that truth place themselves outside the pale of Christian orthodoxy.

We believe in one living and true God who is the Creator of heaven and earth; who is eternal, almighty, unchangeable, infinitely powerful, wise, just and holy.

We believe that the one God eternally exists in three Persons: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit; and that these three are one God, co-equal and co-eternal, having precisely the same nature and attributes, and worthy of precisely the same worship, confidence, and obedience. Matthew 3:16, 17; Matthew 28:19, 20; Mark 12:29; John 1:14; Acts 5:3, 4; II Corinthians 13:14.

This doctrine unites all true Christians and separates us from those who are not Christian. You may believe and still not be a Christian, but if you deny this doctrine in your heart, you are not a Christian at all.

Do you agree with the above ?

Why or why not ?

hope this helps !!!

A Christian is a disiple of Christ.
It's about that relationship with Him. Not a person's ability to pass a theology test, as this Christianity.com post makes it out to be.

So a person must confess Jesus is YHWH(Lord) to be saved. Confess means to agree with so the person confessing Jesus is Lord is in agreement that He is YHWH. Whoever will call upon the name of the Lord ( YHWH) will be saved.

^That is relationship based.

 

[jaybird]

@marks

This is from Christianity.com

All Christians believe the doctrine of the Trinity. If you do not believe this—that is, if you have come to a settled conclusion that the doctrine of the Trinity is not true—you are not a Christian at all. You are in fact a heretic. Those words may sound harsh, but they represent the judgment of the Christian church across the centuries. What is the Trinity? Christians in every land unite in proclaiming that our God eternally exists as Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Those who deny that truth place themselves outside the pale of Christian orthodoxy.

We believe in one living and true God who is the Creator of heaven and earth; who is eternal, almighty, unchangeable, infinitely powerful, wise, just and holy.

We believe that the one God eternally exists in three Persons: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit; and that these three are one God, co-equal and co-eternal, having precisely the same nature and attributes, and worthy of precisely the same worship, confidence, and obedience. Matthew 3:16, 17; Matthew 28:19, 20; Mark 12:29; John 1:14; Acts 5:3, 4; II Corinthians 13:14.

This doctrine unites all true Christians and separates us from those who are not Christian. You may believe and still not be a Christian, but if you deny this doctrine in your heart, you are not a Christian at all.

Do you agree with the above ?

Why or why not ?

hope this helps !!!

i dont believe this because:

All Christians believe the doctrine of the Trinity

there is no such command in scripture.

 

[APAK]

Color coded for Clarity :)

And Scripture always interprets scripture and the N.T. always sheds light on the meaning of the O.T. when it is quoted. This is biblical hermenuetics 101.

Joel 2:32
32 "And it will come about that whoever calls on the name of the Lord
Will be delivered;
For on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem
There will be those who escape,
As the Lord has said,
Even among the survivors whom the Lord calls.

Here we see Paul quote this OT passage about YHWH and apply it to Jesus who is the one and only Lord according to the N.T.

Rom 10:9-13
9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; 10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, "WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED." 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him; 13 for "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED."


So a person must confess Jesus is YHWH(Lord) to be saved. Confess means to agree with so the person confessing Jesus is Lord is in agreement that He is YHWH. Whoever will call upon the name of the Lord ( YHWH) will be saved.

hope this helps !!!

I did warn you about what I figured you would present next, and in error. You have lead yourself in circles and confusion here. Do you really know what you have baked here? You have blindly substituted Christ as YHWH = LORD = Christ in both the OT and NT verses. You never looked at any context as well. This shows a lack of understanding and a forced error in an endeavour to force a preset conclusion called your Trinity hoax. Your statement as your conclusion is so ridiculous and embarrassing, I will attempt to finish this game now.

Let me make is simple...there are a few different ways to do it...here's one...

1. Romans 10:9-10 (or to 13) and Acts 2:16 -21, 22-26 indeed do identify the Lord as our Saviour. In agreement here...
2. Something you neglected to know or include. The same Lord our Christ in the NT implicitly thought of Joel 2: 28-32 when he said to us HE INITIATED this promise of salvation. Yahshua explicitly stated that he announced and sent or completed this promise (his death, resurrection and ascension) given by his Father YHWH in Joel.

His Son said his Father, the only one indivisible, unique YHWH made this promise, not he. And he, his Son, our Lord and Saviour was now making it happen or executing this promise for his Father (the LORD of the OT)..have to excuse some translators that confused Lord and LORD in places of the OT..Christ was the fulfillment of his Father's promise, as the instrument of his Father, YHWH..

And where you may ask does he say all this...see Luke 24:49 and Acts 1:4-5

CHECK MATE..game over! YHWH is one, the Father of ALL, including his Son, and can NEVER be his Son....

want to play another one?

APAK

 

[APAK]

i dont believe this because:



there is no such command in scripture.

Hey jaybird long time no see ..hello again brother..APAK

 

[jaybird]

Hey jaybird long time no see ..hello again brother..APAK

hey AP, cool bicycle!

 

[ChristisGod]

I did warn you about what I figured you would present next, and in error. You have lead yourself in circles and confusion here. Do you really know what you have backed here? You have blindly substituted Christ as YHWH = LORD = Christ in both the OT and NT verses. You never looked at any context as well. This show a lack of understanding and a forced error in an endeavour to force a preset conclusion called your Trinity hoax. Your statement as your conclusion is so ridiculous and embarrassing, I will attempt to finish this game now.

Let me make is simple...there are a few different ways to do it...here's one...

1. Romans 10:9-10 (or to 13) and Acts 2:16 -21, 22-26 indeed do identify the Lord as our Saviour. In agreement here...
2. Something you neglected to know or include. The same Lord our Christ in the NT implicitly thought of Joel 2: 28-32 when he said to us HE INITIATED this promise of salvation. Yahshua explicitly stated that he announced and sent or completed this promise (his death, resurrection and ascension) given by his Father YHWH in Joel.

His Son said his Father, the only one indivisible, unique YHWH made this promise, not he. And he, his Son, our Lord and Saviour was now making it happen or executing this promise for his Father (the LORD of the OT)..have to excuse some translators that confused Lord and LORD in places of the OT..Christ was the fulfillment of his Father's promise, as the instrument of his Father, YHWH..

And where you may ask does he say all this...see Luke 24:49 and Acts 1:4-5

CHECK MATE..game over! YHWH is one, the Father of ALL, including his Son, and can NEVER be his Son....

want to play another one?

APAK

I see you ran away from Paul in Romans 10 for a good reason since he called Christ YHWH( LORD) the One Lord who is Lord over all. The One LORD (YHWH) that a person must call upon to be saved that the Apostle Paul declares is Christ the Son, not the Father.

next........................

that was easy to dismantle.

hope this helps !!!

 

[APAK]

hey AP, cool bicycle!

The 'Prisoner' series icon of the late 60s..

 

[APAK]

I see you ran away from Paul in Romans 10 for a good reason since he called Christ YHWH( LORD) the One Lord who is Lord over all. The One LORD (YHWH) that a person must call upon to be saved that the Apostle Paul declares is Christ the Son, not the Father.

next........................

that was easy to dismantle.

hope this helps !!!

Explain your claim if you will...then I will reply....aka ..you need to give me more facts and not a yell across the room..thanks

 

[APAK]

I see you ran away from Paul in Romans 10 for a good reason since he called Christ YHWH( LORD) the One Lord who is Lord over all. The One LORD (YHWH) that a person must call upon to be saved that the Apostle Paul declares is Christ the Son, not the Father.

next........................

that was easy to dismantle.

hope this helps !!!

Let me make it easy for you...you are now confused because Romans 10 calls Lord of all...and there is the LORD of ALL as well...Christ is not the ALL as is Father Christo...don't be so narrow in thought....there is YHWH who is over ALL...and the the Lord over us for salvation as head of the ekklesia and the angels etc...they are two different things...you still have this urge to combine the All and little all as you did with LORD and Lord and YHWH and Christ....utter confusion

We have to call upon the name of the Lord, not YHWH now our Father, for salvation..scripture never says in the NT to call on YHWH for salvation..even though they share spirits as one...another story... this is the reason why we now have a Lord of a human type....that we can understand and his Father as well through him,,,

APAK Out

 

[DNB]

On the contrary, it had everything to do with the deity of Christ. If Jesus of Nazareth was not God in human form, nothing He did on earth would have mattered.

That's circular reasoning.
Besides, the brevity of my explanation was just in rebuttal to marks' sentiment of what Jesus is to him. I was pointing out the fact that nothing in his summary necessitated a god-man, but rather, exclusively a human being. Thus, one of my contentions has always been, where is the glory in Jesus' divinity? There is none, it is defamatory to try and reconcile the atonement with such self-undermining premise. God cannot offer Himself, as an oblation to Himself, in order to placate His own wrath against man. There is no glory to God in this scenario.

 

[jaybird]

On the contrary, it had everything to do with the deity of Christ. If Jesus of Nazareth was not God in human form, nothing He did on earth would have mattered.

its the opposite for me. a man walking on water is a miracle, the Almighty creator of all things walking on water, no one would think different.

 

[justbyfaith]

No one can say that Jesus is the Lord except by the power of the Holy Ghost (1 Corinthians 12:3 (kjv)). There is one Lord (Ephesians 4:5, 1 Corinthians 8:6), and that Lord is the Father (Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21).

I know that I can say these things a million times; and no one with an opposing view has an answer for it; and yet they continue to believe according to their preconceived notions of who God is.

I can only pray that those who deny Christ's Deity will be convicted by the Holy Ghost of sin and of righteousness and of judgment...because it says clearly in John 8:24 that they will die in their sins if they will not believe that Jesus is the great I AM..

 

[justbyfaith]

..have to excuse some translators that confused Lord and LORD in places of the OT..

Would you agree that the Father is YHWH, the LORD?

Well, Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21 calls the Father, the Lord also...

And therefore we can read these things phonetically. When it refers to the LORD, it is referring to the Lord.

'nuff said!

 

[sho]

come on man, stop believing in this.
Yeshua is God in flesh. He said: Glorify me with the glory I had in your being/presence.
He confirmed he was God before he became man.

 

[aspen]

@marks

This is from Christianity.com

All Christians believe the doctrine of the Trinity. If you do not believe this—that is, if you have come to a settled conclusion that the doctrine of the Trinity is not true—you are not a Christian at all. You are in fact a heretic. Those words may sound harsh, but they represent the judgment of the Christian church across the centuries. What is the Trinity? Christians in every land unite in proclaiming that our God eternally exists as Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Those who deny that truth place themselves outside the pale of Christian orthodoxy.

We believe in one living and true God who is the Creator of heaven and earth; who is eternal, almighty, unchangeable, infinitely powerful, wise, just and holy.

We believe that the one God eternally exists in three Persons: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit; and that these three are one God, co-equal and co-eternal, having precisely the same nature and attributes, and worthy of precisely the same worship, confidence, and obedience. Matthew 3:16, 17; Matthew 28:19, 20; Mark 12:29; John 1:14; Acts 5:3, 4; II Corinthians 13:14.

This doctrine unites all true Christians and separates us from those who are not Christian. You may believe and still not be a Christian, but if you deny this doctrine in your heart, you are not a Christian at all.

Do you agree with the above ?

Why or why not ?

hope this helps !!!

all heresies and cults start with a warped view, or rejection of the doctrine of the Trinity; the true nature of God. No one can judge a person's heart, but as far as doctrine goes, stepping outside the boundaries of the foundational doctrine of the Trinity distorts the divinity / nature of Christ and the heresy snowballs from there.

 

[JesusLovesYou]

The utter redundancy of having three all-powerful persons in the Godhead, when only one is required to create the universe, answer all prayers of all mankind, involve Himself in all manner of intervention, providence and maintenance of the universe, and all its inhabitants.

If God does not exist in three persons, how do you explain that in the beginning God said "Let US make mankind in OUR image..." (Genesis 1:26)?

 

[ChristisGod]

all heresies and cults start with a warped view, or rejection of the doctrine of the Trinity; the true nature of God. No one can judge a person's heart, but as far as doctrine goes, stepping outside the boundaries of the foundational doctrine of the Trinity distorts the divinity / nature of Christ and the heresy snowballs from there.

You are 100% correct as every false teaching goes back to a faulty view of God, His nature, character, attributes etc..... and included the 2 natures in Christ since He is one of the Trinity.

 

[jaybird]

all heresies and cults start with a warped view, or rejection of the doctrine of the Trinity; the true nature of God. No one can judge a person's heart, but as far as doctrine goes, stepping outside the boundaries of the foundational doctrine of the Trinity distorts the divinity / nature of Christ and the heresy snowballs from there.

Jesus never teaches anything where his "divinity nature" is crucial to being a believer. This all came along later. The crowds that followed Jesus believed Him to be a prophet, they are called believers.

 

[ChristisGod]

Jesus never teaches anything where his "divinity nature" is crucial to being a believer. This all came along later. The crowds that followed Jesus believed Him to be a prophet, they are called believers.

Sure He did in John 8:24- unless you believe I AM you will die in your sins.

Who is the I AM in Exodus 3:14 ?

John 8:58- before Abraham was even born, I AM (ego eimi) the same I AM is Exodus 3:14

They picked up stone to kill Jesus for Blasphemy.

And the title Son of God is a Divine title of Jesus. Son of in Judaism means having the nature of: so when Jesus is called the son of man He has the nature of man a human nature. It is used often in Daniel and Ezekiel with that meaning.

So the title Son of God has the meaning of the nature of God, a Divine nature. Hence the 2 natures in Christ both human and Divine. the Son of God and the son of man. Both human and Divine decent.

"Son of man" is a common term in the Psalms, used to accentuate the difference between God and human beings. As in Ps. viii. 4 (A. V. 5), the phrase implies "mortality," "impotence," "transientness,"as against the omnipotence and eternality of God. Yhwh looks down from His throne in heaven upon the "children," or "sons," of "man" (Ps. xi. 4, xxxiii. 13). The faithful fail among them (Ps. xii. 2 [A. V. 1]); the seed of Yhwh's enemies will not abide among the "children of men" (Ps. xxi. 10). "Children of men" is thus equivalent to "mankind" (Ps. xxxvi. 8 [A. V. 7], lxvi. 5)."Sons of men," or "children of men," designates also the slanderers and evil-doers in contrast to the righteous, that is, Israel (Ps. lvii. 5 [A. V. 4], lviii. 2 [A. V. 1]). It occurs most frequently, however, as a synonym for "mankind," "the human race" (Ps. xc. 3, cvii. 8, cxv. 16, cxlv. 12); Jewish Encyclopedia

hope this helps !!!