Is my salvation based upon my knowledge of the Trinity?

[Dcopymope]

In English we use “rise” and “raise” with two distinctly different meanings. “Rise” is what a person or thing does by itself to itself: “I rise every morning at dawn;” “the sun will rise soon.”


“Raise,” on the other hand, is what a person does to some other object or person: “He raised the flag.” “The flag was raised.” The object does not “rise” by itself in this case, but is actually “raised” by someone else! If “raise” is to be used with one’s own self as the object, it must be so stated or plainly understood: “I raised myself so I could see better”!

An examination of all the passages dealing with Christ’s resurrection shows that this is also the intent of nearly all of them. Therefore, when we see “God, having raised up his servant” (Acts 3:26, RSV), we understand God as being one person who raised up someone else (His servant, Jesus). And at Gal. 1:1 we see - “God the Father, who raised [Jesus Christ] from the dead.”

Probably the only place you could find where there appears to be a statement that the Son raised himself (in contrast to the many scriptures to the contrary) would be John 2:19-22.

John 2:19, 21, 22 -

“Jesus answered them, ‘Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.’ .... But he spoke of the temple of his body. When therefore he was raised [not ‘he raised himself’] from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this.” - RSV.

Rather than ignoring this scripture, since at first glance it seems to contradict all the many others about Jesus being raised up by the Father alone, we should make every attempt to understand it in agreement with the other scriptures on the subject.

Obviously Jesus was speaking figuratively here, whereas the other scriptures concerning his being raised are to be understood literally. Figurative Bible language often leads to difficulties in interpretation.

However, Jesus was speaking figuratively of his actual body which his enemies really did destroy (“destroy this temple and ...”). Therefore, one understanding might be that Jesus was merely stating that after the Father had already returned Jesus’ life to a body (“raised” him to life) Jesus was then physically able to raise up that life-filled body: He literally was able to raise himself to his feet again; he raised his own body up from a prone position!

Even noted trinitarian NT Greek scholar A. T. Robertson tells us

“Recall [John] 2:19 where Jesus said: ‘And in three days I will raise it up.’ He did not mean that he will raise himself independently of the Father as the active agent (Rom. 8:11).” - Word Pictures in the New Testament, Vol. v, p. 183.

Additionally, most trinitarian translations translate John 10:17-18 as

“I lay down my life, that I may take it again .... I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again; this charge I have received from my Father.” - RSV.

That Jesus had the “power to take his life again” might seem to be implying that he would actually resurrect himself.

However, we should be aware that, although this translation is understandably the most popular one for trinitarians, it is not the only interpretation. In fact, it is not even the most likely, and, in light of many other scriptures, it is certainly not the most appropriate.

Even some trinitarian Bibles translate lambano in John 10:17, 18 as “receive” instead of “take” (as in the RSV above) and exousia as “right” or “authority” instead of “power” as in the RSV above:

“I have the right [exousia] to lay it down, and I have the right [exousia] to receive [lambano] it back again; this charge I have received [lambano] from my Father.” - New English Bible (NEB); REB; The Emphasized Bible; Weymouth; Young’s Concise Critical Bible Commentary.

Such a rendering, of course, is in line with the Father alone actually raising up the dead Jesus as so many scriptures plainly state.

The very trinitarian New American Standard Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible tells us that exousia can mean several different things including “authority,” “right,” and “power.” It further shows us that the equally trinitarian New American Standard Bible (NASB) translates exousia as “authority” 65 times, as “right” 11 times, and as “power” only 11 times.

:) Well, the verdict is in on those scriptures then, no dead man raising himself from the dead.

 

[CharismaticLady]

(smile), BINGO, and the other verse makes it very, very clear, Isaiah 48:12 "Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I am he; I am the first, I also am the last".

this is one person speaking here.

CharismaticLady, you get the cigar today, ..... but just don't smoke it, ok, bad for the lungs, but you have it on that one.

PICJAG.

Have you ever read the Living Bible? It is like a commentary on every verse in the Bible. It is so clear and the author has the best understanding of anyone I've ever read. So the cigar actually goes to Mr. Taylor.

 

[CharismaticLady]

:) Well, the verdict is in on those scriptures then, no dead man raising himself from the dead.

I want a recount on that verdict!!! They all did.

 

[CharismaticLady]

Well my friend you do not stand alone in this!

I like 1 John 5:7
7 For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one.

It was quoted around 200 AD so it was deleted from later manuscripts, not added.

 

[Grailhunter]

I like 1 John 5:7
7 For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one.

It was quoted around 200 AD so it was deleted from later manuscripts, not added.

May friends sometimes you have to be a historian and a theologian.
The most well known of these forged scriptures is called “the Comma Johanneum Addition.”
The Comma Johanneum as it is referred to, originated as a common literary explanation or formula for the Trinity. The first discussion of the Comma may have been around the 3rd century. Some mention a connection with some of the early church fathers, like Cyprian which debated the oneness concepts of the Trinity. It first appeared in written form during the 4th century in the Latin homily Liber Apologeticus, which was probably written by Priscillian of Avila. This theological formula was circulated from then on, but was not accepted, or at least was not quoted by most of the early Church Fathers in which there was a continual disagreement on the construct of the Trinity.

At some point this short summary of the Trinity made its way into the margin notes of some of the manuscripts that were written after the 5th century. Unlike other examples of popular margin notes that made their way into the scriptures, the Comma Johanneum found its way into the verses of the Bible by way of another avenue. After the early 16th century, the Byzantines began to recopy and retranslate the available Greek texts of the New Testament. At this point some of these copies became known as the “Textus Receptus.” ---Erasmus--- It was in some of these that the formula was added and then later included in some of the Bibles. Most notably the King James Version, which relied heavily on these texts. On the 2nd of June 1927, Pope Pius XI decreed that the Comma Johanneum was open to dispute. The updated " Nova Vulgata" edition of the Vulgate, published in 1979 as a result of the Second Vatican Council, does not include the Comma. In the Catholic study Bible I have that was printed around 1960 it includes a combination of these two scriptures, with a side note that explains that it is a re-phrasing of the scriptures by the Holy See, as it is his prerogative.

As it happened the Comma Johanneum Addition was much more than a re-translation, or an addition, but rather a replacement of the original scriptures with a popular theological statement. They kept the verse numbers in sequence so that it would not be as noticeable.

The scriptures involved are 1st John 5:6-8. The original scriptures read as follows... (Quoting 6 through 8, so it can be read in context)

“6. This is the one who came by water and blood, Jesus Christ; not with the water only, but with the water and with the blood. 7. And it is the Spirit who bears witness, because the Spirit is the truth. 8. And it is the Spirit and the water and the blood; and the three are in agreement.”

This was replaced with what came to be called the Comma Johanneum Addition.

6: This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth. 7: For there are three that bear record in Heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. 8: And there are three that bear witness in Earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.

As one can see there is no chance that this is simply a different translation, but rather a removal of the scriptures and an insertion of a known theological statement for an intended purpose. Of course and again, there is no question that the Trinity exists, just that the Bible does not support the commonly explained formula or description of it. And this is the larger problem, if everybody changes the scriptures to what they believe, then we do not get an accurate reading of the Word of God, but instead a denominational sermon. The Comma Johanneum Addition is a good illustration of the frustration that some had with trying to promote their beliefs and to what extent they would go to, to promote their beliefs above and over the Bible.

 

[Brakelite]

Although we have many clues from what God has said in the Old Testament, and statements that Jesus made, along with the events surround His baptism and transfiguration, that there are three separate personalities that most Bible scholars believe make up the plural God.

But Jesus never taught the trinity directly, so He didn't see it as something significantly essential to believing the gospel and being born again of the Spirit of God. The other reason is that God doesn't have to spill His guts about everything to do with His nature and character just to please the over-curious who get their rocks off by delving into mysteries that we don't have direct access to. If we knew all about Him, He would not be God.

If I see a door with a sign "Authorised Personnel Only", and I am not authorised, then I don't go through that door. I know from what I read in the Bible that God does not always appear as just one person, but there is no enough for me to give a clear definition of God being three persons, except that the Father, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit are all mentioned in the Bible, and these three are identified as God. But I am not authorised to delve into the intricate details of how it is, because we are not given the right or opportunity to do so.

I have the right to believe what I choose about it, based on what I see in the Scripture, but I don't have the right to condemn anyone who doesn't believe what I choose to believe.

Well said. My perspective exactly. Even less do churches have the right to disfellowship anyone or refuse membership to anyone because they don't dare attempt to offer a definition of the Godhead as a dogma to be accepted.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

Although we have many clues from what God has said in the Old Testament, and statements that Jesus made, along with the events surround His baptism and transfiguration, that there are three separate personalities that most Bible scholars believe make up the plural God.

But Jesus never taught the trinity directly, so He didn't see it as something significantly essential to believing the gospel and being born again of the Spirit of God. The other reason is that God doesn't have to spill His guts about everything to do with His nature and character just to please the over-curious who get their rocks off by delving into mysteries that we don't have direct access to. If we knew all about Him, He would not be God.

If I see a door with a sign "Authorised Personnel Only", and I am not authorised, then I don't go through that door. I know from what I read in the Bible that God does not always appear as just one person, but there is no enough for me to give a clear definition of God being three persons, except that the Father, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit are all mentioned in the Bible, and these three are identified as God. But I am not authorised to delve into the intricate details of how it is, because we are not given the right or opportunity to do so.

I have the right to believe what I choose about it, based on what I see in the Scripture, but I don't have the right to condemn anyone who doesn't believe what I choose to believe.

Did you know that the scriptures say it's people who deny the Father and the son that is the AntiChrist. The scriptures don't say it's those who deny the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost

Although we have many clues from what God has said in the Old Testament, and statements that Jesus made, along with the events surround His baptism and transfiguration, that there are three separate personalities that most Bible scholars believe make up the plural God.

But Jesus never taught the trinity directly, so He didn't see it as something significantly essential to believing the gospel and being born again of the Spirit of God. The other reason is that God doesn't have to spill His guts about everything to do with His nature and character just to please the over-curious who get their rocks off by delving into mysteries that we don't have direct access to. If we knew all about Him, He would not be God.

If I see a door with a sign "Authorised Personnel Only", and I am not authorised, then I don't go through that door. I know from what I read in the Bible that God does not always appear as just one person, but there is no enough for me to give a clear definition of God being three persons, except that the Father, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit are all mentioned in the Bible, and these three are identified as God. But I am not authorised to delve into the intricate details of how it is, because we are not given the right or opportunity to do so.

I have the right to believe what I choose about it, based on what I see in the Scripture, but I don't have the right to condemn anyone who doesn't believe what I choose to believe.

When you talk about the Trinity to someone you're talking about who God is. As I said before, I've found no Trinity doctrine in the scriptures nor any concepts of the Trinity. That includes the time that Jesus was baptized or at his transfiguration. Neither of these texts says that Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are coequal or coeternal or that all are God.
Also I'm not talking about anyone's rights. I know people have the right to believe what they wish and express what they believe, but other people have the right to disagree with them and express why they disagree.

 

[Paul Christensen]

Did you know that the scriptures say it's people who deny the Father and the son that is the AntiChrist. The scriptures don't say it's those who deny the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost


When you talk about the Trinity to someone you're talking about who God is. As I said before, I've found no Trinity doctrine in the scriptures nor any concepts of the Trinity. That includes the time that Jesus was baptized or at his transfiguration. Neither of these texts says that Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are coequal or coeternal or that all are God.
Also I'm not talking about anyone's rights. I know people have the right to believe what they wish and express what they believe, but other people have the right to disagree with them and express why they disagree.

I don't bother getting contentious about it. It is a waste of time and energy and just ends up in a bottomless vortex of tit for tat arguments back and forth with people talking past each other.

 

[Joseph77]

I don't bother getting contentious about it. It is a waste of time and energy and just ends up in a bottomless vortex of tit for tat arguments back and forth with people talking past each other.

from Philippians (as exposing the jws false gospel and false teaching):

" Whatever happens, keep living your lives based on the reality of the gospel of Christ, which reveals him to others.

Then when I come to see you, or hear good reports of you,

I’ll know that you stand united in one Spirit and one passion—celebrating together as conquerors in the faith of the gospel.

And then you will never be shaken or intimidated by the opposition that rises up against us,

for your courage will only prove as a sure sign from God of their coming destruction and that you have found a new life.

For God has graciously given you the privilege not only to believe in Christ, but also to suffer for him.

For you have been called by him to endure the conflict in the same way I have endured it—for you know I’m not giving up."

 

[101G]

Have you ever read the Living Bible? It is like a commentary on every verse in the Bible. It is so clear and the author has the best understanding of anyone I've ever read. So the cigar actually goes to Mr. Taylor.

GINOLJC, to all.
first thanks for the reply, second, I have read some scriptures out of the Living Bible, as well as other translation, I compare them on my bible software program for quick reference, and how they translate words. some are helpful, on certian scriptures, but again all of them can be misleading. but if something can help you, that's good.

but the cigar is the Lord Jesus, and he can smoke it whenever he desires, because it will do him no harm...

thanks for the reply and keep up the good work.

PICJAG.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

from Philippians (as exposing the jws false gospel and false teaching):

" Whatever happens, keep living your lives based on the reality of the gospel of Christ, which reveals him to others.

Then when I come to see you, or hear good reports of you,

I’ll know that you stand united in one Spirit and one passion—celebrating together as conquerors in the faith of the gospel.

And then you will never be shaken or intimidated by the opposition that rises up against us,

for your courage will only prove as a sure sign from God of their coming destruction and that you have found a new life.

For God has graciously given you the privilege not only to believe in Christ, but also to suffer for him.

For you have been called by him to endure the conflict in the same way I have endured it—for you know I’m not giving up."

When people use Philippians to try to prove the Trinity doctrine or it's concepts, it can be seen how they will take a scripture out of context to prove the Trinity doctrine or it's concepts. I

 

[Joseph77]

You did not read the post, nor the book?

Nothing concerning proving the trinity doctrine nor it's concepts mentioned.

When you with the jws totally corrupt Scripture, that's time for more understanding of the truth as God teaches.

When people use Philippians to try to prove the Trinity doctrine or it's concepts, it can be seen how they will take a scripture out of context to prove the Trinity doctrine or it's concepts. I

 

[Steve Owen]

When you talk about the Trinity to someone you're talking about who God is. As I said before, I've found no Trinity doctrine in the scriptures nor any concepts of the Trinity.

Most of what follows comes from The Trinity by E. H. Bickersteth, a 19th Century Bishop.
The first text is a reference to God the father or to God generally; the second is a reference to Christ.

1. Psalm 90:2. 'From everlasting to everlasting, thou art God.'
Micah 5:2. 'Whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.'

2. Psalm 93:2. 'Thy throne is established of old; thou art from everlasting.'
Heb. 1:8. 'Unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever.'

3. Isauah 44:6. 'I am the first and the last; and beside me there is no God.'
Rev, 22:13. "I am the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.'

4. Jer. 23:24. 'Do I not fill heaven and earth? saith the Lord.'
Eph. 4:10. He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens that he might fill all things.'

5. Deut. 31:8. 'The Lord, he it is that doth go before thee- He will be with thee; he will not fail thee.'
Matt. 28:20. "Lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world."

6. Mal. 3:6. "I am the LORD, I change not."
Heb. 13:8. 'Jesus Christ, the same yesterday, today and forever.'

7. Job 11:7. "Canst thou by searching find out God?"
Matt. 11:27. 'No man knoweth the Son, but the Father.'

8. Rom. 11:33. 'O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! His ways past finding out.'
Eph. 3:8. 'The unsearchable riches of Christ.'

9. Prov. 16:4. 'The LORD has made all things for himself.'
Col. 1:16. 'All things were created by him and for him.'

10. Deut. 32:4. 'A God of truth and without iniquity.'
John 14:6. 'I am....the truth.' Heb. 4:15. '...Without sin.'

11. 1 Tim. 6:15. 'The King of kings and Lord of lords.'
Rev. 19:16. 'King of kings and Lord of Lords.'

12. Psalm 145:13. 'Thy kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and thy dominion endureth throughout all generations.'
Dan. 7:14. 'His dominion is an everlasting dominion.....and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed,'

13. Isaiah 40:10. Behold, the LORD God will come with a strong hand- His reward is with him.'
Rev. 22:12. "Behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me.....'

14. Psalm 62:12. 'Thou renderest to every man according to his work.'
Rev. 22:12. '....To give to every man according to his work.'

15. Jer. 17:7. 'Blessed is the man who trusteth in the Lord and whose hope the Lord is.'
Psalm 2:12. 'Blessed are they who put their hope in him.' Col. 1:27. 'Christ in you, the hope of glory.'

A few more.

1 Kings 8:39. Thou, even thou only, knowest the hearts of all the children of men.'
Rev. 3:23. "All the churches shall know that I am he which searchest the reins and the hearts."

2. Psalm 103:19. 'His kingdom ruleth over all.'
Acts 10:36. 'He is Lord of all.'

3. Zech. 14:9. 'The LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day there shall be one Lord and his name one.'
1 Cor. 8:6. 'To us there is but....... one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.'

4. Psalm 83:18. 'Thou whose name alone is Jehovah, art the most high over all the earth.'
Phil. 2:9. 'God hath given him a name which is above every name.....'
Col. 1:18. 'That in all things he might have the pre-eminence.'

5. Rom. 12:19. 'Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.'
2 Thes. 1:7-8. 'Taking vengeance on them that know not the Lord.'

6. Rom. 2:5. 'The day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgement of God.'
Rev. 6:16-17. '...And from the wrath of the Lamb: for the great day of his wrath has come; and who shall be able to stand?'

7. Isaiah 40:18. 'To whom then will ye liken God?'
Col. 1:15. 'The image of the invisible God.'
Heb 1:3. 'The express image of his person.'

8. John 17:3. "Thee, the only true God."
1 John 5:20. '.....His Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God and eternal life.'

9. Psalm 119:28. 'Strengthen thou me according to thy word.'
Phil. 4:13. 'I can do all things through Christ which strengthens me.'

10. Psalm 39:7. 'Lord, my hope is in thee.'
1 Tim. 1:1. 'Jesus Christ, which is our hope.'

11. Psalm 91:4. 'He shall cover thee with his feathers, and under his wings shalt thou trust.'
12. Matt. 23:37. "How often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings."

13. Isaiah 43:11. 'I, even I am Jehovah; and beside me there is no Saviour.'
Matt. 1:21. 'Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.'

14. '.... beside me there is no Saviour.'
1 Tim. 1:15. 'Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners.'

15. '.... beside me there is no Saviour.'
Acts 15:11. 'We believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved.'

16. '..... beside me there is no Saviour.'
Heb. 5:9. 'He became the Author of salvation unto all that obey him.'

17. '...... beside me there is no Saviour.'
Heb. 7:25. 'He is able to save them to the uttermost that come unto God through him.'

18. '..... beside me there is no Saviour.'
1 Thes. 1:10. 'Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.'

19. '..... beside me there is no Saviour.'
2 Peter 3:18. 'Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.'

20. '..... beside me there is no Saviour.'
Acts 4:12. 'Neither is there salvation in any other; for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.'

I'll add some texts showing that the Holy Spirit is God tomorrow.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Did you know that the scriptures say it's people who deny the Father and the son that is the AntiChrist. The scriptures don't say it's those who deny the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost


When you talk about the Trinity to someone you're talking about who God is. As I said before, I've found no Trinity doctrine in the scriptures nor any concepts of the Trinity. That includes the time that Jesus was baptized or at his transfiguration. Neither of these texts says that Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are coequal or coeternal or that all are God.
Also I'm not talking about anyone's rights. I know people have the right to believe what they wish and express what they believe, but other people have the right to disagree with them and express why they disagree.

I know I am late to the discussion.

But if you want to see all three in scripture. here is one such passage, If anyone posted this before. forgive me

Is 48:
“Listen to Me, O Jacob And Israel, My called: I am He, I am the First, I am also the Last. 13 Indeed My hand has laid the foundation of the earth, And My right hand has stretched out the heavens; When I call to them, They stand up together.
14 “All of you, assemble yourselves, and hear! Who among them has declared these things? The Lord loves him; He shall do His pleasure on Babylon, And His arm shall be against the Chaldeans.
15 I, even I, have spoken; Yes, I have called him, I have brought him, and his way will prosper.
16 “Come near to Me, hear this: I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; From the time that it was, I was there. And now the Lord God and His Spirit Have sent Me.”

As you can see. Jesus is the one who is sent, He is also creator and sustainor. And he was sent by the Lord God (father) and his Spirit. two distinct entities of the godhead. who sent the third one.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

You did not read the post, nor the book?

Nothing concerning proving the trinity doctrine nor it's concepts mentioned.

When you with the jws totally corrupt Scripture, that's time for more understanding of the truth as God teaches.

People who believe in the Trinity not only don't care what the scriptures say, they think God is so ignorant that he can't communicate clearly to his servants when He inspired his word to be written down. The concepts of the Trinity would be written down in scripture, if it were inspired of God, yet all I see is that those that believe the Trinity twist scriptures and take them out of context to try to prove that doctrine. You can prove anything to yourself you want to believe in when you twist scripture or take it out of context.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

People who believe in the Trinity not only don't care what the scriptures say, they think God is so ignorant that he can't communicate clearly to his servants when He inspired his word to be written down. The concepts of the Trinity would be written down in scripture, if it were inspired of God, yet all I see is that those that believe the Trinity twist scriptures and take them out of context to try to prove that doctrine. You can prove anything to yourself you want to believe in when you twist scripture or take it out of context.

This is kind of rude is it not.

The same could be said of those who do not believe the trinity

 

[Joseph77]

Since the jws reject Jesus, Scripture, and the Creator,
according to His Word, and the Revelation of Jesus of God's Purpose,
it does not matter if
anyone believes the trinity concept or any other concept
as long as and if they still hold
to the false spirit, false teachings, and false teachers in the jws past and present.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

Believers in the Trinity renders Hebrews 1:8 this way: “But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever.” Thus, they feel that Jesus is shown to be the same as Almighty God. Why is this not correct?

First, note the context. In many translations, either in the main text or in the margin, Hebrews 1:9 reads, “God, your God, anointed you.” This makes it clear that the one addressed in verse eight is not God, but one who worships God and is anointed by him.

Secondly, it should be noted that Hebrews 1:8, 9 is a quotation from Psalm 45:6, 7, which originally was addressed to a human king of Israel. Surely the writer of this psalm did not think that this human king was Almighty God and neither did the writer of Hebrews think that Jesus was Almighty God. Commenting on this, scholar B. F. Westcott said: “It is scarcely possible that אלוהים [‘Elo·himʹ, “God”] in the original can be addressed to the king. . . . Thus on the whole it seems best to adopt in the first clause the rendering: God is Thy throne (or, Thy throne is God), that is ‘Thy kingdom is founded upon God.’”


At Isaiah 44:6 Jehovah rightly describes his own position as the one and only almighty God, saying: “I am the first and I am the last, and besides me there is no God.” When Jesus presents himself by the title “the First and the Last,” he is not claiming equality with Jehovah, the Grand Creator. He is using a title properly bestowed on him by God. In Isaiah, Jehovah was making a statement about His unique position as the true God. He is God eternal, and besides him there is indeed no God. (1 Timothy 1:17) In Revelation, Jesus is talking about his bestowed title, calling attention to his unique resurrection.
Jesus was indeed “the First” human to be resurrected to immortal spirit life. (Colossians 1:18) Moreover, he is “the Last” to be so resurrected by Jehovah God personally. Thus, he becomes “the living one living forever and ever.” He enjoys immortality. In this, he is like his immortal Father, who is called “the living God.” (Revelation 7:2; Psalm 42:2) For all others of humanity, Jesus himself is “the resurrection and the life.” (John 11:25) In harmony with this, he says to John: “I became dead, but, look! I am living forever and ever, and I have the keys of death and of Hades.” (Revelation 1:18b) Jehovah has given him the authority to resurrect the dead. That is why Jesus can say that he has the keys to unlock the gates for those bound by death and Hades (gravedom).

 

[Joseph77]

jws serve a god of this world, not Jesus, nor God the Creator.

Believers in the Trinity

So?

 

[Joseph77]

"Stock" political answers. "Spin" trying to influence people to become jws, are always destructive.... leading to destruction of souls.