Calvinism

[Grailhunter]

Put a few behind bars? Pretty sure that has nothing to do with Calvinism.

It is about your lack of knowledge because I read your post, that I originally quoted, and it was full of strawman arguments and not actual beliefs of any calvinist I know, including myself. You really don't know what you are talking about.

As a matter of fact I do know what I am talking about. And these things are easy to find. You can kid yourself but you are not pulling the wool over anybody else eyes anymore. The cat is out the bag. The world knows the evils of Calvinism and I know that even within Calvinism that this is a concern.

 

[CharismaticLady]

And you would be wrong.

Well seeing as it is obvious that you do NOT believe the whole gospel of Jesus, I would be right. You believe Calvinism, and only Calvinism. And it isn't even milk, let alone meat.

 

[Waiting on him]

Well seeing as it is obvious that you do NOT believe the whole gospel of Jesus, I would be right. You believe Calvinism, and only Calvinism. And it isn't even milk, let alone meat.

What in your opinion is the milk

 

[Anthony D'Arienzo]

Well seeing as it is obvious that you do NOT believe the whole gospel of Jesus, I would be right. You believe Calvinism, and only Calvinism. And it isn't even milk, let alone meat.

You three-show your hatred for truth in making such comments without any backing from scripture.

 

[Anthony D'Arienzo]

As a matter of fact I do know what I am talking about. And these things are easy to find. You can kid yourself but you are not pulling the wool over anybody else eyes anymore. The cat is out the bag. The world knows the evils of Calvinism and I know that even within Calvinism that this is a concern.

The world loves it's own.

 

[Grailhunter]

The world of Christianity know of you. And as I said, the cat is out of bag. No more lies. No more dodging the questions. No more twisting the scriptures. The world knows the evils of Calvinism and I know that even within Calvinism that is a concern. I despise Calvinism or any other religion that slanders God, but the people, I wish the best for them. The kind hearts of the Holy Spirit that are on this forum could rescue you from this, but will you listen? Or are you committed to slandering God.

 

[John Caldwell]

You three-show your hatred for truth in making such comments without any backing from scripture.

You indicated in Biblical foreknowledge (post 294) that Calvinism is the gospel. I, for one, have a strong distaste for gospels other than the gospel of Jesus Christ. I just do not appreciate cultish belief, and it is worse when held by professing Christians.

Christianity was not in want of another gospel when Calvin articulated the gospel in the context of 16th century philosophy. Believe it or not, Scripture really is enough.

You and @David Taylor insist that this new gospel is true because while not stated in the text of Scripture it is somehow implied, which makes for "good" theology. That is fine. I do not mind people holding whatever views they want to hold. But you should not hate people just because they have a greater appreciation for Scripture than you.

 

[John Caldwell]

I despise Calvinism or any other religion that slanders God, but the people, I wish the best for them. The kind hearts of the Holy Spirit that are on this forum could rescue you from this, but will you listen? Or are you committed to slandering God.

I agree. We cannot hate people, but we pray God will open their eyes and hearts. I think tradition is often too much an obstacle for some.

 

[CharismaticLady]

What in your opinion is the milk

12 For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the first principles of the oracles of God; and you have come to need milk and not solid food. 13 For everyone who partakes only of milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, for he is a babe. 14 But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, that is, those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

Therefore, leaving the discussion of the elementary principles of Christ, let us go on to perfection, not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, 2 of the doctrine of baptisms, of laying on of hands, of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

 

[CharismaticLady]

You three-show your hatred for truth in making such comments without any backing from scripture.

I do not make false claims. There are so many scriptures that he has misinterpreted, that it would take a lifetime to unravel the garbage he has been indoctrinated in, because he won't learn.

 

[Grailhunter]

I agree. We cannot hate people, but we pray God will open their eyes and hearts.

Hate in my beliefs are near to murder. Food for Satan. When I am in a Christian church I am like a kid in a candy store. But I am like a fierce lion when comes to the enemies of the Gospels and those that would slander God. But in between there are men like you and Giuliano, amadeus, and the ladies that can minster to them better than I. You may not be able to get through to them, but what do we tell God if we do not try? Who here does not want the best for them? They think they can hide the truth. Those days are over. The elect! The elect are all around them. The Gospel stands as the truth. The Holy Spirit is there to help, but lol because of free-will they have to make the choice. Do they want to continue and have to explain what they perceive as God's character to God Himself?

 

[John Caldwell]

I do not make false claims. There are so many scriptures that he has misinterpreted, that it would take a lifetime to unravel the garbage he has been indoctrinated in, because he won't learn.

I do not think this can be helped. They are indoctrinated into a tradition and are unable to learn because they are unwilling to consider their tradition may be wrong.

@Anthony D'Arienzo has told us he does not believe the literal method of defining words in Scripture (the plain meaning conveyed by its grammatical construction and historical context) correct because he believes it makes God slave to a dictionary : but instead prefers to assign "biblical meanings" (liberal hermeneutics).

He and @David Taylor reject adopting what is written as belief in favor of "good theology" based on what they believe implied. They seem to believe everyone elses view is just as subjective as their own.

Given such a low regard for Scripture how can they be expected to see what is there in the text? They are too busy looking elsewhere.

 

[Giuliano]

Hate in my beliefs are near to murder. Food for Satan. When I am in a Christian church I am like a kid in a candy store. But I am like a fierce lion when comes to the enemies of the Gospels and those that would slander God. But in between there are men like you and Giuliano, amadeus, and the ladies that can minster to them better than I. You may not be able to get through to them, but what do we tell God if we do not try? Who here does not want the best for them? They think they can hide the truth. Those days are over. The elect! The elect are all around them. The Gospel stands as the truth. The Holy Spirit is there to help, but lol because of free-will they have to make the choice. Do they want to continue and have to explain what they perceive as God's character to God Himself?

The Calvinists could be partially right if we look only at the short term. At Sinai, the people did not want to hear the Voice of God. David said of them that they hardened their hearts. Thus Moses wrote a book of rules for them, a book very hard to understand. Does that mean they are all doomed? No, not if they were truly of Israel. All Israel will be saved.

God blinds some people to the truth; and this is a good thing. It means their sins will not be committed knowingly and willfully. Thus the sins can be easily forgiven as sins of ignorance later. I do not think it's God's Will that everyone alive on the earth comes to "all truth" -- for if they did know the truth and sinned, their judgment would harsher.

Hebrews 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

Thus it is God's Mercy to blind some people's eyes to the truth. God does not allow us to be tempted beyond what we can bear. Until someone is ready to repent, it can be better for them not to lest they fall into temptation too big for them to bear.

Paul doesn't go into how he believes all Israel will be saved; but I believe no one will face final judgment until he knows the truth and that the Thousand Year Reign will play a role.

Does that help explain Romans 1 where we're told God hands some people over to a reprobate mind? This is like the prodigal son who didn't appreciate his father. He wound up in a pig sty before he came to his senses. If we want to live selfishly and like brute beasts, God will allow it. Sooner or later, we will see the errors of our ways.

Romans 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

I think it is a good thing that this is so even if they aren't that pleasant to be around. Their sins are sins of ignorance.

Jesus chided Paul about kicking against the pricks. Well, we see that now too with some people. It's okay. Jesus knows when someone is sick enough of things the way they are that they're ready to try the Path of Love. What is sad to me is that some people need to suffer so much before they are willing to admit they're on the wrong path. It's so pointless; but the world is wondrously made -- they are free at any time to change course, and Jesus will spot that willingness to accept the good news. Calvinists seem to think God extends His Grace randomly. I don't think so. I think God is wiser than that. The person in the pig sty couldn't possibly fix his own problems; nor can the sinner fix his. God helps those who are willing to benefit from it since God is Love and wants the best for us. God does throw pearls before swine or give to the dogs what belongs to the children.

If we want to live like devils, we can't expect God to be a co-conspirator in our wickedness.

 

[Grailhunter]

The Calvinists could be partially right if we look only at the short term. At Sinai, the people did not want to hear the Voice of God. David said of them that they hardened their hearts. Thus Moses wrote a book of rules for them, a book very hard to understand. Does that mean they are all doomed? No, not if they were truly of Israel. All Israel will be saved.

God blinds some people to the truth; and this is a good thing. It means their sins will not be committed knowingly and willfully. Thus the sins can be easily forgiven as sins of ignorance later. I do not think it's God's Will that everyone alive on the earth comes to "all truth" -- for if they did know the truth and sinned, their judgment would harsher.

Hebrews 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

Thus it is God's Mercy to blind some people's eyes to the truth. God does not allow us to be tempted beyond what we can bear. Until someone is ready to repent, it can be better for them not to lest they fall into temptation too big for them to bear.

Paul doesn't go into how he believes all Israel will be saved; but I believe no one will face final judgment until he knows the truth and that the Thousand Year Reign will play a role.

Does that help explain Romans 1 where we're told God hands some people over to a reprobate mind? This is like the prodigal son who didn't appreciate his father. He wound up in a pig sty before he came to his senses. If we want to live selfishly and like brute beasts, God will allow it. Sooner or later, we will see the errors of our ways.

Romans 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

I think it is a good thing that this is so even if they aren't that pleasant to be around. Their sins are sins of ignorance.

Jesus chided Paul about kicking against the pricks. Well, we see that now too with some people. It's okay. Jesus knows when someone is sick enough of things the way they are that they're ready to try the Path of Love. What is sad to me is that some people need to suffer so much before they are willing to admit they're on the wrong path. It's so pointless; but the world is wondrously made -- they are free at any time to change course, and Jesus will spot that willingness to accept the good news. Calvinists seem to think God extends His Grace randomly. I don't think so. I think God is wiser than that. The person in the pig sty couldn't possibly fix his own problems; nor can the sinner fix his. God helps those who are willing to benefit from it since God is Love and wants the best for us. God does throw pearls before swine or give to the dogs what belongs to the children.

If we want to live like devils, we can't expect God to be a co-conspirator in our wickedness.

Very interesting. In the early church there were those that wanted to drop the Old Testament, seeing a difference in character between the God of the Old Testament and Christ. The Gnostics and a fellow named Marcion saw an evilness in the Old Testament God. I have seen this view somewhat expressed today nonchalantly given as a reason for the cruelty of the Mosaic Law, in that God took on the character of evil because of the evilness of man. It always shocks me how a Christian could come to such a conclusion. But history shows that it is not a new idea. Then you have the name it and claim it crowd in Christianity. You just never know where the mind goes.

 

[Anthony D'Arienzo]

I do not make false claims. There are so many scriptures that he has misinterpreted, that it would take a lifetime to unravel the garbage he has been indoctrinated in, because he won't learn.

Why not try one scripture and see what you can do?
Then we can see who is lacking and needs to learn, instead of baseless accusations.

 

[Preacher4Truth]

Still waiting for any of you to use actual Scriptural exegesis.

All you've used so far? Ridicule. Mockery. Hypothesis. Accusations that are baseless. Name calling. Anger. Rage. Straw men. Misrepresentations. It reminds me of Leftists and their methods.

And the most notorious is vain philosophy which is also what you do with your, rarely used, if ever, out of context Scripture when attempting to implement it.

I'll wait for anyone to engage actual Scriptural which means providing Scripture in context minus all the aforementioned juvenile behaviors.

 

[Willie T]

What in your opinion is the milk

I really do believe "the milk" may be just the opposite of what most of us have come to declare it is. All the Jews Jesus preached to lived under a very rigid system of rules, regulations and ceremonial structure that they had been fed on since birth...….. "Yes", the only diet they had known since they were infants: MILK. They were thoroughly comfortable with it...… because it was, basically, just following mindless "Do's" and "Don'ts."

Now, what would be "the meat" Jesus wanted them to graduate to, compared to that previous spiritual diet?

 

[Waiting on him]

I really do believe "the milk" may be just the opposite of what most of us have come to declare it is. All the Jews Jesus preached to lived under a very rigid system of rules, regulations and ceremonial structure that they had been fed on since birth...….. "Yes", the only diet they had known since they were infants: MILK. They were thoroughly comfortable with it...… because it was, basically, just following mindless "Do's" and "Don'ts."

Now, what would be "the meat" Jesus wanted them to graduate to, compared to that previous spiritual diet?

Thanks for your opinion, I believe the same (principles and Oricals) this would be the previous laws. The meat in my opinion would be liberty and grace found in Christ, just my opinion

 

[Anthony D'Arienzo]

John Caldwell,

You indicated in Biblical foreknowledge (post 294) that Calvinism is the gospel.

A proper understanding of the gospel is found in what is called Calvinism. In 1 cor15 in which many run to it says;
15 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

Notice it speaks of the term"according to the scriptures". That is all of the scripture. It is not only the historical facts of the death burial, and resurrection....Both all of the scriptures {plural} that fully reveal the great salvation we embrace.
in fact, your failure to embrace this fullness of biblical usage and understanding is why your ideas come up short.

I, for one, have a strong distaste for gospels other than the gospel of Jesus Christ.

So do we. We really dislike a man-centered gospel, which is a weak gospel and resists truth along the way.
When you try and act as our spokesman inevitably you cease from being truthful, invent your own caricature, or flat out drift into falsehoods.
2tim2;
24 And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,

25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;

26 And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

I just do not appreciate cultish belief, and it is worse when held by professing Christians.

This might be your view. It is sadly mistaken and unkind. Nevertheless, I am okay with it as I understand any defective understanding must portray others in a way that will prevent them from welcoming the truth.

Christianity was not in want of another gospel when Calvin articulated the gospel in the context of 16th century philosophy. Believe it or not, Scripture really is enough.

The Reformers worked to recover and teach the full Gospel of a sovereign God, that had been badly corrupted and perverted.
It was in scripture the whole time. Like fallen leaves can cover the walkway until being raked away...the walkway was there the whole time but obscured. It is the same with men and carnal philosophy obscuring it now.
Calvin among others did what they could, but I doubt anyone here could have done as much without commentaries, google search, sermonaudio, and many other books and tools that help in unpacking "all the scriptures'.

You and @David Taylor insist that this new gospel

We do not need you as our spokesman claiming we believe a "new gospel". You do not agree with us, we do not agree with you at this time. You, however, insist on posting on our behalf and suggesting things we have not said at all.
I will illustrate it for you.
Let's say a poster made a thread on the topic of censorship. he says he is totally against it. Then some non-cals suggest and question the salvation of all Calvinists, which is against the rules. reporting that post and asking if it to be checked out would NOT be the same as a request to censor a person, just because the person had started a different thread on it, totally unrelated to it?

It is not your place to lie and say he is being hypocritical, saying one thing publically and another thing privately. That would be an evil falsehood, a slander, and a total lie. If any poster has to lie in such a way, we could conclude they are somehow twisted.
What would compound such sin, is if they had a way to hide or delete what the poster said, then substitute this slander in place of the truth.
Don't you agree that this would be sub-Christian to the core?
Now, this is the same thing here. You might not agree with how we and millions of others in the confessing church have viewed things. That is fine. Slander and false witness is not the answer, however.

That is fine. I do not mind people holding whatever views they want to hold. But you should not hate people just because they have a greater appreciation for Scripture than you.

This is another example of such slander. Every confession of faith has scripture front and center.Those that hold that confession hold that also.

 

[Waiting on him]

Still waiting for any of you to use actual Scriptural exegesis.

All you've used so far? Ridicule. Mockery. Hypothesis. Accusations that are baseless. Name calling. Anger. Rage. Straw men. Misrepresentations. It reminds me of Leftists and their methods.

And the most notorious is vain philosophy which is also what you do with your, rarely used, if ever, out of context Scripture when attempting to implement it.

I'll wait for anyone to engage actual Scriptural which means providing Scripture in context minus all the aforementioned juvenile behaviors.

Ok, I was kinda deceptive yesterday when I posted where Paul said when he

Galatians 1:15-16 KJV
[15] But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace, [16] To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:


Tecarta BibleWhen Paul speaks of being separated from his mothers womb here, do you believe he is speaking of his literal mother, or Jerusalem above?