SALVATION

[Episkopos]

Many Christians have discovered a way to make salvation static...by turning it into a "status". But then that also puts God in a box. When you make a wind static...it isn't wind anymore. The same goes for God's salvation. It moves.

 

[Helen]

Did you publish a book, @"ByGrace"? (Publishing details?) or maybe you meant 'my book' as an expression?

Haha! No, no clever writer here....the best I do is to keep a journal.
Yes, I was meaning “in my book” ..should have said “in my opinion” ....but old habits die hard.

 

[farouk]

Haha! No, no clever writer here....the best I do is to keep a journal.
Yes, I was meaning “in my book” ..should have said “in my opinion” ....but old habits die hard.

A diary can indeed be a good way to discipline one's thoughts as one meditates in the Scriptures day by day...

 

[Isika Emmanuel]

I have some messages related to salvation. God gave me deep revelation about it recently. Can I share them?

 

[Isika Emmanuel]

I have some messages related to salvation. God gave me deep revelation about it recently. Can I share them?

 

[Isika Emmanuel]

I have some messages related to salvation. God gave me deep revelation about it recently. Can I share them?

 

[Heart2Soul]

I have some messages related to salvation. God gave me deep revelation about it recently. Can I share them?

If you are looking for someone to give you their approval then I give you my approval....lol...share away!

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Ephesians 2:8, 9. If God has provided this salvation as a free gift, how am I to add anything to that?

Many times free gifts, as salvation, are conditional and meeting the condition(s) does not earn the free gift gift but is necessary to receive the free gift. Therefore meeting the necessary condition(s) does not add to the free gift but is a necessary part of receiving the free gift.

Example: Joshua 23:13-16
Verse 16- "When ye have transgressed the covenant of the LORD your God, which he commanded you, and have gone and served other gods, and bowed yourselves to them; then shall the anger of the LORD be kindled against you, and ye shall perish quickly from off the good land which he hath given unto you."

The promised land was a conditional covenant God made with Israel where God gave them the land, it was a free gift. Yet for Israel to receive this free gift and remain on it was conditional that they remain faithful to God and not turn to idolatry. For if they "bowed yourselves" to other gods then they would "perish quickly from off the good land which He hath given you". By turning to false gods they forfeited the free gift.

Likewise in Eph 2:8 the promise of salvation is a free gift that is conditional upon one having faith and one must maintain that faith unto death (Revelation 2:10) for if one turns from God in unbelief he will forfeit that promise of salvation (Hebrews 3:12).

 

[Dave L]

Many times free gifts, as salvation, are conditional and meeting the condition(s) does not earn the free gift gift but is necessary to receive the free gift. Therefore meeting the necessary condition(s) does not add to the free gift but is a necessary part of receiving the free gift.

Example: Joshua 23:13-16
Verse 16- "When ye have transgressed the covenant of the LORD your God, which he commanded you, and have gone and served other gods, and bowed yourselves to them; then shall the anger of the LORD be kindled against you, and ye shall perish quickly from off the good land which he hath given unto you."

The promised land was a conditional covenant God made with Israel where God gave them the land, it was a free gift. Yet for Israel to receive this free gift and remain on it was conditional that they remain faithful to God and not turn to idolatry. For if they "bowed yourselves" to other gods then they would "perish quickly from off the good land which He hath given you". By turning to false gods they forfeited the free gift.

Likewise in Eph 2:8 the promise of salvation is a free gift that is conditional upon one having faith and one must maintain that faith unto death (Revelation 2:10) for if one turns from God in unbelief he will forfeit that promise of salvation (Hebrews 3:12).

Conditional salvation = salvation only for the self-righteous. Grace has no conditions. But the saved will live holy lives because of the new birth.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Conditional salvation = salvation only for the self-righteous. Grace has no conditions. But the saved will live holy lives because of the new birth.

The Bible says the faithless (unbelievers) will be lost, therefore salvation is conditional upon one having and maintain faith.

Romans 5:2 faith is what gives one access to grace, therefore receiving grace is conditional upon one having and maintaining grace.

If grace were totally unconditional then everyone would be saved.

 

[Dave L]

The Bible says the faithless (unbelievers) will be lost, therefore salvation is conditional upon one having and maintain faith.

Romans 5:2 faith is what gives one access to grace, therefore receiving grace is conditional upon one having and maintaining grace.

If grace were totally unconditional then everyone would be saved.

Conditional salvation is salvation by works. In this case, people save themselves.

 

[larry2]

The promised land was a conditional covenant God made with Israel where God gave them the land, it was a free gift. Yet for Israel to receive this free gift and remain on it was conditional that they remain faithful to God and not turn to idolatry. For if they "bowed yourselves" to other gods then they would "perish quickly from off the good land which He hath given you". By turning to false gods they forfeited the free gift.

Likewise in Eph 2:8 the promise of salvation is a free gift that is conditional upon one having faith and one must maintain that faith unto death (Revelation 2:10) for if one turns from God in unbelief he will forfeit that promise of salvation (Hebrews 3:12).

Hi Ernest T. Bass, thanks for your reply. In your statement here, I believe you’ve given me a perfect opportunity to illustrate what I believe to reflect God’s working with us in our eternal salvation we’ve been given when we believed on Christ Jesus.

1Co 10:9 Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents.
1Co 10:10 Neither murmur ye, as some of them also murmured, and were destroyed of the destroyer.
1Co 10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

Dear brother Bass, would you consider Moses to have been saved, or the elect of God as it were? At least I do, but Moses failed to believe God.
Num 20:12 And the LORD spake unto Moses and Aaron, Because ye believed me not, to sanctify me in the eyes of the children of Israel, therefore ye shall not bring this congregation into the land which I have given them. (Were they killed?)
Deut 32:50 And die in the mount whither thou goest up, and be gathered unto thy people; as Aaron thy brother died in mount Hor, and was gathered unto his people:

Deut 32:51 Because ye trespassed against me among the children of Israel

Can you believe that Moses is in heaven now? What about Mat 17:2? And (Jesus) was transfigured before them: and His face did shine as the sun, and His raiment was white as the light.
Mat 17:3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with Him (Jesus). Evidently Moses had suffered as the result of a sin unto death because of unbelief.

Now we can lose reward. Blue Letter Bible said it like this: “Sin will cause us to suffer loss of some of our reward in heaven. It will not cause us to lose our salvation but rather the rewards earned through obedience to Christ.”

Blessings in Christ Jesus.

 

[CoreIssue]

Ephesians 2:8, 9. "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." Now, if salvation is a gift, we can't do anything to earn it, but you read in (Philippians 2:12) that you must work out your own salvation with all fear and trembling. If God has provided this salvation as a free gift, how am I to add anything to that? There are many different ways that the word salvation is used in the Bible, such as safety from enemies, but I will limit this booklet's teaching to four aspects concerning salvation of the soul.

First - It is provisional. If you accept Jesus as your savior, you will be saved. (Romans 10:9-10) "If you say with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved, (10) For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation."

Second - When you become saved, it is at this time that you are born again and have overcome the penalty of sin, or become saved from the great white throne judgment and the resulting lake of fire. (Repeating John 5:24), "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life." In (Romans 8:1) "There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus."

Third - The working out your own salvation referred to in (Philippians 2:12) is learning to overcome the habit of sin in our lives. This is the experiencing part of our salvation and is another step in our growth as a Christian. (2 Peter 1:5-7) tells us to "Add to your faith virtue, knowledge, temperance, patience, godliness, brotherly kindness and charity." To realize this growth in our lives, we must learn to begin counting our old man dead. (Romans 6:6) "Knowing this, that our old man (The Adamic nature) is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.” (Ephesians 4:22) “That ye put off concerning the former conversation (Manner of life) the old man who is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;” (Colossians 3:9) “Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds." We all have an old man we should count as dead that still wants to rule our lives. Even though the Apostle Paul knew he was saved, he experienced all kinds of problems with the old man trying to control his life. (Romans 7:14-25) states that (15) he ends up doing that which he hates. In (16,17), Paul realizes that if he agrees that the law is good, then it is no more him that was responsible, but sin that was in him. In looking for an answer he says (24) "Who shall deliver me?" (25) "I thank God through Jesus Christ"

(Romans 8:1). "There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus." And in (Romans 8:4) it says that "The righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us (Not by us), who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit."

Fourth - We will be saved from this corrupt world. In (Romans 8:18-23), Paul states (18) "For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us. (21) Because the creature (Creation) itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. (22) For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now." John states in (1 John 3:2) "Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is."

Blessings in Christ Jesus.

The term for number three is sanctification.

To many pervert working out your salvation to mean works for salvation.

 

[CoreIssue]

Actually, Paul was afraid of being rejected from the kingdom. Being cut-off, disqualified, from the race of Christ.

There is no such thing as a salvation "status". We are all in a race. No one wins anything before crossing the finish line. We are all "in play" as it were.

This is a further indicator that we need to work out our salvation.

Paul afraid? Nonsense.

The start and finish line is repentance by grace through faith. An instantaneous act that is eternal. Once saved always saved.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Conditional salvation is salvation by works. In this case, people save themselves.

Salvation is conditional upon one having faith and NT faith is an obedient work required by God. No verse indicates that salvation is conditional upon a person being disobedient. Since all men are doing one of two things, obedience or disobedience, o one was ever saved who impenitently remained disobedient to the will of God.

 

[Dave L]

Salvation is conditional upon one having faith and NT faith is an obedient work required by God. No verse indicates that salvation is conditional upon a person being disobedient. Since all men are doing one of two things, obedience or disobedience, o one was ever saved who impenitently remained disobedient to the will of God.

You believe in salvation by works. Here's why; the gospel is an announcement that all who believe have eternal life. But you turn the gospel into law and make salvation a work of the flesh when you say "whoever chooses to believe has eternal life".

Faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit, not a decision to believe at a fleshly level. So those to whom God gives the Holy Spirit hear the gospel as an announcement of their salvation because they believe what they hear about it. And they want to repent and live holy lives according to their new nature.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Hi Ernest T. Bass, thanks for your reply. In your statement here, I believe you’ve given me a perfect opportunity to illustrate what I believe to reflect God’s working with us in our eternal salvation we’ve been given when we believed on Christ Jesus.

1Co 10:9 Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents.
1Co 10:10 Neither murmur ye, as some of them also murmured, and were destroyed of the destroyer.
1Co 10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

Dear brother Bass, would you consider Moses to have been saved, or the elect of God as it were? At least I do, but Moses failed to believe God.
Num 20:12 And the LORD spake unto Moses and Aaron, Because ye believed me not, to sanctify me in the eyes of the children of Israel, therefore ye shall not bring this congregation into the land which I have given them. (Were they killed?)
Deut 32:50 And die in the mount whither thou goest up, and be gathered unto thy people; as Aaron thy brother died in mount Hor, and was gathered unto his people:

Deut 32:51 Because ye trespassed against me among the children of Israel

Can you believe that Moses is in heaven now? What about Mat 17:2? And (Jesus) was transfigured before them: and His face did shine as the sun, and His raiment was white as the light.
Mat 17:3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with Him (Jesus). Evidently Moses had suffered as the result of a sin unto death because of unbelief.

Now we can lose reward. Blue Letter Bible said it like this: “Sin will cause us to suffer loss of some of our reward in heaven. It will not cause us to lose our salvation but rather the rewards earned through obedience to Christ.”

Blessings in Christ Jesus.

Moses was not perfectly sinless, no Christian is perfectly sinless. Yet God never required perfect sinlessness in order for one to be saved. All God has required is a faithful obedience which Moses had, as Abraham, David, etc. When the Christian does sin he must CONDITIONALLY repent of his sin as required by God for God will not forgive the impenitent. Moses repented of his sin and God forgives but Moses still had a consequence for his sin in not being allowed to take Israel into the promises. So men can have to still face the consequence of their sin even though God forgives that sin but the wages of sin is spiritual death NOT loss of rewards for one's impenitent sins.

In Matthew 18 Jesus gives the parable of the servant with a debt he could not repay and he begged for mercy and the King had compassion upon him and forgave his debt. Matthew 18:26-27. OF course the meaning of the parable is God is the King and the servant is man who has sin he cannot do anything about by himself alone so he seeks God Who in mercy forgives that sin. Yet this forgiven man would not show compassion and forgive his fellow servant. As a result the King had this servant put in torment and would no longer forgive his sins, Matthew 18:34-35 cf Mark 11:26.

So this servant in the parable went from being lost in his sins, forgiven of his sins, back to being lost in torment and not having his sins forgiven by God. He did not lose any rewards but lost God's forgiveness thereby became lost in his unforgiven sins again.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

You believe in salvation by works. Here's why; the gospel is an announcement that all who believe have eternal life. But you turn the gospel into law and make salvation a work of the flesh when you say "whoever chooses to believe has eternal life".

Faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit, not a decision to believe at a fleshly level. So those to whom God gives the Holy Spirit hear the gospel as an announcement of their salvation because they believe what they hear about it. And they want to repent and live holy lives according to their new nature.

The Bible shows that God requires obedience to His will in order for one to receive salvation (Hebrews 5:9). Again, no person in the Bible was ever saved by remaining impenitently disobedient to God's will.

Romans 6:16 "Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?"

Paul says we all serve either one of two masters, we are serving either:

1) sin unto death
or
2) obedience unto righteousness

I serve obedience unto righteousness. Those who have allowed themselves to follow Luther's faith onlyism do not like to be confronted with Rom 6:16 in declaring which master they serve.


Paul's response to the idea that "grace only" saves in Romans 6 is "God forbid".

 

[TruthBeliever]

what about Acts 2:38:
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.