Do you not believe Satan exists?

[Helen]

Job said: ↑
Do you not believe Satan exists?

Just curious...

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@face2face said: ↑

No and yes...
Maybe for another thread.

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@breathofdesire said:

Are you going to make a thread about it? I have some interesting idea's about satan.

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ByGrace says:
Well, I am listening. Go for it! :)

.

 

[FHII]

Huh? People are contemplating if Satan exists? Am I misunderstanding something? I obviously didn't look at a particular thread....

Yes, Satan exists.

 

[Helen]

Huh? People are contemplating if Satan exists? Am I misunderstanding something? I obviously didn't look at a particular thread....

Yes, Satan exists.

Yes I saw it on a thread ..they had this little conversation as a side-line...so I just posted it. I too have thoughts about what, who, and why of Satan. :)

 

[Job]

Satan's greatest deception is convincing people he doesn't exist.

It's working........even among believers.

o

 

[breathofdesire]

In my most humble opinion, I see satan to be as real as our wants and lusts let him be.

I think that satans main power comes from how much we allow our self's to be mastered by sin. What I'm saying is that this is just a fallen Angel, he is not even in league with God, or the other Angel's that kept their place.

I see him as a weakling to them, not to us, if we continually let him in our minds. But alas the world now is one big shopping center for peoples wants and their evil desires. Satan is very strong now, but that doesn't have to be the same for the people of God.

 

[FHII]

Satan's greatest deception is convincing people he doesn't exist.

It's working........even among believers.

o

Straight out of The Screwtape Letters.

 

[FHII]

In my most humble opinion, I see satan to be as real as our wants and lusts let him be.

I think that satans main power comes from how much we allow our self's to be mastered by sin. What I'm saying is that this is just a fallen Angel, he is not even in league with God, or the other Angel's that kept their place.

I see him as a weakling to them, not to us, if we continually let him in our minds. But alas the world now is one big shopping center for peoples wants and their evil desires. Satan is very strong now, but that doesn't have to be the same for the people of God.

Like it. Not sure if I agree with alk of it. For sure he is not as strong as Michael and esoecially Gabriel. But he does have power enough to fight them and wage war.

We are lower than angels, but have a greater power.

 

[aspen]

Satan's greatest deception is convincing people he doesn't exist.

It's working........even among believers.

o

Nah, I think it's dualism within Christianity - he has always wanted to be equal with God rather than just part of creation

 

[breathofdesire]

Like it. Not sure if I agree with alk of it. For sure he is not as strong as Michael and esoecially Gabriel. But he does have power enough to fight them and wage war.

We are lower than angels, but have a greater power.

Remember we are talking about a character who is widely unknown, when comparing the human zeitgeist now. What is known in heaven by the heavenly hosts is far more clearer, than what we know.

 

[Dan57]

Anyone who questions whether Satan actually exist, has not met my ex wife ;)

 

[breathofdesire]

Anyone who questions whether Satan actually exist, has not met my ex wife ;)

 

[aspen]

Seems to me many Christians talk about Satan more than Christ. We are not called to have a personal relationship with him; nor is he omnipotent, omnipresent, or omniscient, but it doesn't seem to stop many from giving him what he craves, attention.

 

[face2face]

The Bible is silent on a supernatural evil being but plenty of evidence for adversaires of different sorts.
The Apostle Peter was one LOL
How did Jesus define Satan there?....
"You (Peter) are not setting your mind on God’s interests, but on man’s."

 

[VictoryinJesus]

John 8:43-44 KJV

[43] Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word. [44] Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.



Question: who did the devil murder?

 

[amadeus]

Anyone who questions whether Satan actually exist, has not met my ex wife ;)

This may have been intended as a joke, but it may be point on... if satan is simply an "adversary" of God's and the things of God. People do act that way simply because they are people and following the ways of their own flesh instead of the Way of God.

Our flesh when it works to take the lead in our activities is certainly our adversary [satan] in our walk with God.

Look for example to Peter, who is praised for receiving a revelation from God:

"He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven." Matt 16:15-17

Then in the same chapter he is rebuked and called "satan" for he had indeed now become the adversary of God.

"Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee.
But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men." Matt 16:23

Is not satan our adversary in the world of you or of me as described in this verse?

"For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world." I John 2:16

Whether there is or there is not a separate being called satan or the devil does not really matter insofar as our walk with God and the battles we are to fight, does it? Alone we will lose. If, however, we stay always on God's side, will we not win?

People may want to blame something or someone outside of themselves for their troubles, but if they can defeat the "old man" in themselves, who can stand against them?

 

[Helen]

Do I believe Satan exists? Yes.
Luke 10:18 "And He said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven." Jesus said that He saw it ..good enough for me. :)

John 8:43-44 KJV

[43] Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word. [44] Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.



Question: who did the devil murder?

Good question !! :)

My 'best guess' would be that he was the prime mover behind Cain killing Abel.
And every murder ever since..
But that does sound like a cope out as in- " The Devil made me do it."
And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil......"
Adam said...."she gave me of the tree, and I did eat." .."And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat."
"As in Adam all die...." Spiritual murder?
Maybe it means that at The Tree the serpent slew man...and at the other Tree ✟ The Last Adam redeemed all that Satan slew?

*I am really looking forward to seeing some replies here...Good question Victory.

(I must say I have always loved the verse that says-
"They heard the voice of the Lord God walking in the Garden in the cool of the day... "
I always try to keep my ear open for His Voice, as He 'walks through' the inner Garden of our spirit and soul. )

 

[Dcopymope]

If there are Christians that believe Satan isn't a literal entity, then I guess they believe Jesus was being tempted by an imaginary being.

(Luke 4:1-13) "And Jesus being full of the Holy Ghost returned from Jordan, and was led by the Spirit into the wilderness, {2} Being forty days tempted of the devil. And in those days he did eat nothing: and when they were ended, he afterward hungered. {3} And the devil said unto him, If thou be the Son of God, command this stone that it be made bread. {4} And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God. {5} And the devil, taking him up into an high mountain, shewed unto him all the kingdoms of the world in a moment of time. {6} And the devil said unto him, All this power will I give thee, and the glory of them: for that is delivered unto me; and to whomsoever I will I give it. {7} If thou therefore wilt worship me, all shall be thine. {8} And Jesus answered and said unto him, Get thee behind me, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve. {9} And he brought him to Jerusalem, and set him on a pinnacle of the temple, and said unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down from hence: {10} For it is written, He shall give his angels charge over thee, to keep thee: {11} And in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone. {12} And Jesus answering said unto him, It is said, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God. {13} And when the devil had ended all the temptation, he departed from him for a season."

Do they believe God prepared the Lake of Fire for something that never existed?:

(Matthew 25:40-43) "And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me. {41} Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: {42} For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: {43} I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not."

Is the archangel Michael fighting against an allegory? Do they even believe an angel named Michael exists?:

(Revelation 12:7-9) "And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, {8} And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. {9} And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him."

If Satan isn't a real being, then who is God tossing into the fire in Revelation? Is God real? If so, is he like some four year old conversing and contending with imaginary beings?:

(Revelation 20:9-10) "And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. {10} And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever."

(Job 2:1-6) "Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them to present himself before the LORD. {2} And the LORD said unto Satan, From whence comest thou? And Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it. {3} And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? and still he holdeth fast his integrity, although thou movedst me against him, to destroy him without cause. {4} And Satan answered the LORD, and said, Skin for skin, yea, all that a man hath will he give for his life. {5} But put forth thine hand now, and touch his bone and his flesh, and he will curse thee to thy face. {6} And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, he is in thine hand; but save his life."

Are these people freaking joking? They can't possibly consider themselves to be true Christians, because if they don't believe Satan is real, the very being that tempted Adam & Eve to begin with, then neither is Jesus or any other character. Reducing Satan to some stupid imaginary, allegorical being makes the entire word of God null and void, and henceforth your faith.

 

[amadeus]

Much of what is known come from the fables or men or writings like "Dante's Inferno" rather than from scripture. Any child who has never read or heard the Bible read and has never been to church meeting or Sunday school can describe satan according to men.

Does anyone really know or care what God says? Is it necessary to know that? Is it our job to correct everyone else's apparent errors?

People jump to conclusions that someone's else's conclusions are necessarily correct or important with regard to a devil and then go with the flow instead of with the Holy Spirit. What Jesus says is important is important:

"Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
This is the first and great commandment.
And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets." Matt 22:37-40

Yes, there is much more to the scripture, but men have added and subtracted so many of their own understandings and interpretations, how can a person know what is true?

What is the truth? It is simply stated, Jesus.

But if we are more interested in proving someone is wrong than in simply understanding better just who and what Jesus is, where are we likely to be when the Lord says to some, "... His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord." Matt 25:21 and while others thinking they have done it right will say "... Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?" Matt 7:22. And Jesus answers them: "... I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." Matt 7:23 ????

"There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death." Prov 14:12

Do we suppose that because we believe we are so very right and we have pointed out to God and man the errors of others, we will ourselves make it into His Kingdom?

 

[101G]

Just understand this one thing, Satan is evil and not sin. God uses evil and God. for he created "Evil".

be blessed.

 

[amadeus]

Are these people freaking joking? They can't possibly consider themselves to be true Christians, because if they don't believe Satan is real, the very being that tempted Adam & Eve to begin with, then neither is Jesus or any other character. Reducing Satan to some stupid imaginary, allegorical being makes the entire word of God null and void, and henceforth your faith.

Is that all that you know or is it simply what you believe or is it even that? Is Satan or satan all so important as that to any believer in God and His Son Jesus?

I don't know all of the answers to all of the questions and on some of my beliefs I hesitate, because I am very uncertain, but why should we hint at or say that a belief that disagrees with our belief will make the Word of God null and void?

What is the Word of God?

"So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it." Isaiah 55:11

God spoke it and it is, whether we are correct always in our interpretations or not. Yet, you would declare it null and void because someone disagreed with you and perhaps the majority of believers about the devil.



If we agree on God and His Son, is that also "null and void" because someone else disagrees with us about that? People, believers, some of them, are growing toward God, and on their journeys they pass through many errors, but if they stay focused on the Light before them will they not make even though what they believe or disbelieve for the moment seems to be so terribly wrong:

"For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known." I Cor 13:12

Let he who already sees "face to face" speak up about this satan thing and squash the rest of us. I certainly see through as glass darkly when it comes to the things of God when I consider how much I do not know...

Help us all dear Lord while we still have time...