THE GOSPEL
- Thread starter Doug
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But the scripture says they didnt understand
[Luk 9:45 KJV] 45 But they understood not this saying, and it was hid from them, that they perceived it not: and they feared to ask him of that saying.
I agree with you that it comes down to what scripture says. We’re not in full agreement because we connect scripture differently.
I’m unable to separate Gentiles from the gospel that the Messiah preached. You‘re able to separate them from the gospel he preached.
I believe and teach that everyone - Jew and Gentile alike - must hear the Messiah preaching.
You believe and teach that only Jews must hear the Messiah preaching, and that there is another gospel, unique and different from what the Messiah and other apostles preached.
Those are irreconcilable positions.
Something you and others should know about me and consider: I’m a 1st Jewish monotheist living in the 21st century.
Does that fact bias my thinking or inform it?
Yes they did understand the death and resurrection but look at what Peter was preaching
[Act 2:37-38, 40 KJV] 37 Now when they heard [this], they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men [and] brethren, what shall we do? 38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. ... 40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
Not Paul's gospel
So all of the apostles understood exactly the same thing Paul understood.
What are the “many other words”?
@Doug will you walk through Galatians 1:6-9 with me?
“I am amazed that you are so quickly deserting Him who called you by the grace of Christ for a different gospel; …”
(Galatians 1:6, NASB)
Is the “different gospel” Paul is alluding to the gospel of the kingdom that Jesus and the other apostles preached?
“… which is really not another; only there are some who are disturbing you and want to distort the gospel of Christ.”
(Galatians 1:7)
Do we think the gospel of Christ is or isn’t the gospel of God?
”But even if we, or an angel from heaven, should preach to you a gospel contrary to what we have preached to you, he is to be accursed!”
(Galatians 1:8)
Is the gospel of the kingdom preached by Jesus and the other apostles contrary to the gospel that Paul preached?
If we say that it is then how can we navigate Paul saying those who preached the gospel of the kingdom - the Messiah and the other apostles - are accursed?
”As we have said before, so I say again now, if any man is preaching to you a gospel contrary to what you received, he is to be accursed!”
(Galatians 1:9)
If the gospel of the kingdom is contrary to the gospel Paul preached then doesn’t it follow that Paul is saying that those who preach the gospel of the kingdom - the gospel (good news) which Jesus and the other apostles preached - to the gentiles are accursed?
Those who bring to the Gentiles the good news Jesus of Nazareth brought are accursed?
”And Jesus said to them, ‘Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation. He who has believed and has been baptized will be saved; but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned.”
(Mark 16:15-16)
The gospel is the gospel of the kingdom that Jesus preached. The gospel is the gospel of grace that Paul preached. The gospel, that is the one and only gospel, is to be preached to all creation —> to all the nations and people of the world.
The Messiah’s gospel is only for the Jews and Paul’s gospel is only for the Gentiles?
“I am amazed that you are so quickly deserting Him who called you by the grace of Christ for a different gospel; …”
(Galatians 1:6, NASB)
Is the “different gospel” Paul is alluding to the gospel of the kingdom that Jesus and the other apostles preached?
“… which is really not another; only there are some who are disturbing you and want to distort the gospel of Christ.”
(Galatians 1:7)
Do we think the gospel of Christ is or isn’t the gospel of God?
”But even if we, or an angel from heaven, should preach to you a gospel contrary to what we have preached to you, he is to be accursed!”
(Galatians 1:8)
Is the gospel of the kingdom preached by Jesus and the other apostles contrary to the gospel that Paul preached?
If we say that it is then how can we navigate Paul saying those who preached the gospel of the kingdom - the Messiah and the other apostles - are accursed?
”As we have said before, so I say again now, if any man is preaching to you a gospel contrary to what you received, he is to be accursed!”
(Galatians 1:9)
If the gospel of the kingdom is contrary to the gospel Paul preached then doesn’t it follow that Paul is saying that those who preach the gospel of the kingdom - the gospel (good news) which Jesus and the other apostles preached - to the gentiles are accursed?
Those who bring to the Gentiles the good news Jesus of Nazareth brought are accursed?
”And Jesus said to them, ‘Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation. He who has believed and has been baptized will be saved; but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned.”
(Mark 16:15-16)
The gospel is the gospel of the kingdom that Jesus preached. The gospel is the gospel of grace that Paul preached. The gospel, that is the one and only gospel, is to be preached to all creation —> to all the nations and people of the world.
The Messiah’s gospel is only for the Jews and Paul’s gospel is only for the Gentiles?
[Act 15:1 KJV] 1 And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, [and said], Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved.
Could be this
[Rom 1:1 KJV] 1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called [to be] an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,
Different gospels
Not accursed as the gospel preached by them was to be believed by those who heard it
This phase was interrupted by the dispensation of grace, but will resume in the tribulation. In the tribulation the provisions of verse 18 will be protective.
We should pair this with Mark 1:14-15. This establishes for me that the gospel of the kingdom preached by Jesus and the apostles is the gospel that Paul preached, the one gospel of God.
Does that sound reasonable to you?
I agree. The old covenant was being taught by some and not only did that disturb Paul, it was contrary to the gospel that he preached.
The important thing for our conversation is not to equate the gospel of the kingdom preached by Jesus and the other apostles with “another gospel” contrary to the gospel that Paul preached.
Paul certainly wasn’t saying the Messiah and the other apostles were accursed, further underscoring the important point that the gospel of the kingdom is not contrary to the gospel preached by Paul.
Paul has pointed out that there is only one gospel. Any other supposed gospel is contrary to to the one.
This cements in my mind that the gospel preached by Jesus and all of the apostles, including Paul, is the one gospel.
Paul is right, there is only one gospel. It is to be believed by those who heard it - Jew and Gentile alike.
I don’t see any interruption. My understanding is that the one and only gospel - the gospel of God - will be preached throughout the world to all peoples until the Messiah returns.
