If Christian Universalism is true, what's the point in evangelism?

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amigo de christo

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seeker friendly and the methods of men IS what produces false conversions .
TRUTH is what we ought to speak . ONLY GOD can give the increase . LET HIM ADD whom HE shall add .
SPEAK THE TRUTH , whether grave or etc . Let the LORD be thy mouth
and trust not in thine own intellect . TRUST IN GOD and speak the truth . But never lie
and never sell unto the world a false image of GOD to win souls .
SPEAK THE TRUTH . LET GOD give thee a mouth . worry not what ye shall say
 
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Ritajanice

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If you threaten unbelievers with hell and they come into the church as members, you get people who have a human terror of God, not ones who have a godly respect, reverence, and awe of him. The latter people are true believers, not the former ones. So, you have false conversions.
He does it all the time on this forum,

Well said...Amen!!
 

amigo de christo

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man cannot produce a born again conversion . ONLY GOD CAN .
simply speak the truth . let the words of truth be sung to all . who so ever hears amen
who so ever rejects ITS ON THEM . but never pander to man . NEVER pander to man
never heed the lover of sins . FOR SEEKER FRIENDLY DID and it has destroyed all within its chambers .
 

amigo de christo

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He does it all the time on this forum,

Well said...Amen!!
ONLY GOD can produce a BORN again conversion . Let us never heed men and their wisdom on HOW to evangelize .
For many men have led this people far far astray , believing if we dont say this or maybe tone down that
WE can WIN the soul to GOD .
WITH MAN IT CANNOT BE DONE . i repeat , NOT ME , not any CAN PRODUCE A BORN AGAIN conversion .
ONLY GOD CAN . we must just speak the truth .
 

Ritajanice

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ONLY GOD can produce a BORN again conversion . Let us never heed men and their wisdom on HOW to evangelize .
For many men have led this people far far astray , believing if we dont say this or maybe tone down that
WE can WIN the soul to GOD .
WITH MAN IT CANNOT BE DONE . i repeat , NOT ME , not any CAN PRODUCE A BORN AGAIN conversion .
ONLY GOD CAN . we must just speak the truth .
Ephesians 3:19
Audio Crossref Comment Greek
Verse (Click for Chapter)
New International Version
and to know this love that surpasses knowledge—that you may be filled to the measure of all the fullness of God.

New Living Translation
May you experience the love of Christ, though it is too great to understand fully. Then you will be made complete with all the fullness of life and power that comes from God
.

English Standard Version
and to know the love of Christ that surpasses knowledge, that you may be filled with all the fullness of God.

Berean Standard Bible
of the love of Christ, and to know this love that surpasses knowledge, that you may be filled with all the fullness of God.

Berean Literal Bible
and to know the love of Christ surpassing knowledge, so that you may be filled unto all the fullness of God.
 

Skovand

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One thing I wanted to add. I’m not certain if it’s universalism or if it’s conditional immortality. I’m about 50/50. I think both make equally sound theological arguments. What I am 0% of is eternal conscious torment. ECT would be what an evil god does and in that case, we would not worship him and love him, we would be in total fear of him without any real choice in the matter.

But as someone who leans towards universalism as a legitimate sound doctrine developed off of top tier biblical interpretation that can be traced back to early Christianity this is why I think telling the story of Christ is important.

I don’t think we need to share his story to save them. I think they are already going to be saved. I think we share that story because he has already saved them. It’s the good news. Now I also share the good news because I think there is fake news being spread as well. Propaganda from those who hate the Bible and hate god. It’s even worse because they think they love God and that they love the Bible. They tell gay men and women they are an abomination who’s going to be tortured forever and ever. After creating laws and social norms that drives these victims of their hate to suicide they tell their family and loved ones that they did not escape suffering but went from the pan to the fire. They tell teens to ignore science, ignore vaccines causing millions of more to get sick and die. They say we are specially created, different from animals and therefor it’s ok to oppress animals by locking them in cages, torturing them and killing them…. To eat their corpses because…. God placed them here for us to eat….. and they destroy the environment because Jesus is coming and will fix it so it’s not important.

These men and woman hide behind a gospel of love, twisting his story by weaponizing it into a licenses to hate, steal and kill. These agents of Satan are misinformed, cruel to others and makes this life a living hell. So I share the good news to help make this life better from those people. By letting others arm themselves with the peace of Christ.
 

St. SteVen

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What I am 0% of is eternal conscious torment. ECT would be what an evil god does and in that case, we would not worship him and love him, we would be in total fear of him without any real choice in the matter.
Agree.
Each view of the final judgment comes with a declaration about the character of God. ECT is the worst.

[
 
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MatthewG

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Hello to the reader,

My question is regarding Christian universalism: why didn't God simply create a flawless human race that constantly worships Him? I believe that God is present with every individual on earth, but the key is that they must come to that realization themselves and be born again. I have no issue with those who believe in Christian universalism; I don't harbor any hatred or disdain towards you. Ultimately, it is your choice to make; personally, I do not subscribe to that belief because it seems illogical that we have choices to make. If it were true, everyone on earth would already be born again, and people would be worshipping God now rather than at some point in the future.
 

amigo de christo

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Ephesians 3:19
Audio Crossref Comment Greek
Verse (Click for Chapter)
New International Version
and to know this love that surpasses knowledge—that you may be filled to the measure of all the fullness of God.

New Living Translation
May you experience the love of Christ, though it is too great to understand fully. Then you will be made complete with all the fullness of life and power that comes from God
.

English Standard Version
and to know the love of Christ that surpasses knowledge, that you may be filled with all the fullness of God.

Berean Standard Bible
of the love of Christ, and to know this love that surpasses knowledge, that you may be filled with all the fullness of God.

Berean Literal Bible
and to know the love of Christ surpassing knowledge, so that you may be filled unto all the fullness of God.
Correct . To know the love of CHRIST .
but let us take heed . because many within christendom think they have the love of Christ when really its the love of the world
 

Ritajanice

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Correct . To know the love of CHRIST .
but let us take heed . because many within christendom think they have the love of Christ when really its the love of the world
Emulate the Love of God


John 15:7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you. 8 Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples. 9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love. 10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.11 These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full.12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. 13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

God’s Love is:

I. Tough Love


Heb. 12: 6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

A. The Lord disciplines his children because he loves them and wants the best for them. He is looking out for their good.
B. Romans 8:28 “And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.”
C. We should thank God for his discipline because he is omniscient.
D. We can emulate God’s love by displaying tough love also. We should discipline our children with firmness, love and work courageously for the good of others.

Dr. James Dobson wrote a best seller on this subject and sold over 1 million copies.
Sometimes love must be tough!

II. Tender Love

Psalms 69: 16 Hear me, O LORD; for thy lovingkindness is good: turn unto me according to the multitude of thy tender mercies.
A. God’s love is not only tough but it is also tender. He cares, understands, and is touched with the feeling of our infirmities.
B. God’s love, mercy, and grace are extended to all people in all places, at all times.
C. Emulate God’s tender love. Heed His words: “be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.” (Eph.4:32)

III. Trustworthy Love

Jer. 31: 3 The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying, Yea, I have loved thee with an everlasting love: therefore with lovingkindness have I drawn thee.

A. Today’s society is sadly lacking when it comes to trustworthy love. Divorce continually rises.
B. God’s love is trustworthy. He keeps his promises. “That in the ages to come he might show the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.” Eph. 2:7
C. We should be steadfast and dependable also, loving “in deed and in truth” (1John 3:18)

IV. Triumphant Love

1 Cor. 13:8 “Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.”

A. People, possessions, pleasures, and popularity fail, but God’s triumphant love never fails.
B. Before we can emulate God’s triumphant love, we need to possess his love. We must totally commit ourselves to God to be filled with his love.
C. God’s love is triumphant because “God is love” (1John 4:8,16) His love brings victory now and eternally. 1 Cor. 13:13 “And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity
 
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amigo de christo

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Emulate the Love of God


John 15:7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you. 8 Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples. 9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love. 10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.11 These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full.12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. 13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

God’s Love is:

I. Tough Love


Heb. 12: 6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

A. The Lord disciplines his children because he loves them and wants the best for them. He is looking out for their good.
B. Romans 8:28 “And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.”
C. We should thank God for his discipline because he is omniscient.
D. We can emulate God’s love by displaying tough love also. We should discipline our children with firmness, love and work courageously for the good of others.

Dr. James Dobson wrote a best seller on this subject and sold over 1 million copies.
Sometimes love must be tough!

II. Tender Love

Psalms 69: 16 Hear me, O LORD; for thy lovingkindness is good: turn unto me according to the multitude of thy tender mercies.
A. God’s love is not only tough but it is also tender. He cares, understands, and is touched with the feeling of our infirmities.
B. God’s love, mercy, and grace are extended to all people in all places, at all times.
C. Emulate God’s tender love. Heed His words: “be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.” (Eph.4:32)

III. Trustworthy Love

Jer. 31: 3 The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying, Yea, I have loved thee with an everlasting love: therefore with lovingkindness have I drawn thee.

A. Today’s society is sadly lacking when it comes to trustworthy love. Divorce continually rises.
B. God’s love is trustworthy. He keeps his promises. “That in the ages to come he might show the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.” Eph. 2:7
C. We should be steadfast and dependable also, loving “in deed and in truth” (1John 3:18)

IV. Triumphant Love

1 Cor. 13:8 “Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.”

A. People, possessions, pleasures, and popularity fail, but God’s triumphant love never fails.
B. Before we can emulate God’s triumphant love, we need to possess his love. We must totally commit ourselves to God to be filled with his love.
C. God’s love is triumphant because “God is love” (1John 4:8,16) His love brings victory now and eternally. 1 Cor. 13:13 “And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity
and my Words abide in you . yet many are under a sensual love that will often omit parts of his Words twisting them .
Charity . a key thing many miss about charity is IT rejoices IN the TRUTH . not in inquity .
And by all means loving in lip only means naught . If the LOVE of GOD is truly shed upon a heart
then it would have loved and rejoiced in TRUTH and never a lie and never in sin and unbelief .
So let me ask us all a question .
WHY are so many jumping onto the interfaith bandwagon that implies other religoins know God
and that our truth is no better than their truth . Why would anyone rejoice in a message
that teaches its okay if one did not believe JESUS is CHRIST . many love this sin accepting , non correcting
unbelief accepting broad brushed love which is of the world but has come cloaked in under the guise its of GOD .
 
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Ritajanice

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and my Words abide in you . yet many are under a sensual love that will often omit parts of his Words twisting them .
Charity . a key thing many miss about charity is IT rejoices IN the TRUTH . not in inquity .
And by all means loving in lip only means naught . If the LOVE of GOD is truly shed upon a heart
then it would have loved and rejoiced in TRUTH and never a lie and never in sin and unbelief .
So let me ask us all a question .
WHY are so many jumping onto the interfaith bandwagon that implies other religoins know God
and that our truth is no better than their truth . Why would anyone rejoice in a message
that teaches its okay if one did not believe JESUS is CHRIST . many love this sin accepting , non correcting
unbelief accepting broad brushed love which is of the world but has come cloaked in under the guise its of GOD .
we need to possess his love.
 
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St. SteVen

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New topic:


[
 

St. SteVen

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St. SteVen said:
It's clear to me that there are some who are predestined (the Elect) to renew their relationship with God
What you posted...
That is Calvinism-HyperCalvinism......so, if you are one of those, then that's very unfortunate for you.
If you are not one of God's Elect, that is very unfortunate for you.
You had better pray that Universalism is true. - LOL

[
 

Behold

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If you are not one of God's Elect, that is very unfortunate for you.

Everyone who gives God their faith in Christ, becomes the "elect". = "in Christ".

God "foreknew" who would do this, before He created Adam.

To "fore-know" is not to Predestine... so, this is where Calvin teaches one of His lies... .and regarding This deceiver, His Lies are "Legion".
 

St. SteVen

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Everyone who gives God their faith in Christ, becomes the "elect". = "in Christ".

God "foreknew" who would do this, before He created Adam.

To "fore-know" is not to Predestine... so, this is where Calvin teaches one of His lies... .and regarding This deceiver, His Lies are "Legion".
So you claim that the Elect are not predestined?
Those God foreknew he also predestined.

  • Romans 8:29
    For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son,
    that he might be the firstborn among many brothers and sisters.

  • Romans 8:30
    And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified.

  • Ephesians 1:5
    he predestined us for adoption to sonship through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will—

  • Ephesians 1:11
    In him we were also chosen, having been predestined according to the plan of
    him who works out everything in conformity with the purpose of his will,

[
 

Behold

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So you claim that the Elect are not predestined?
Those God foreknew he also predestined.


The confusion is "what is predestined"...

So, the confused Calvinist says "being born again is predestined".. yet the NT does not say you are predestined to be born again.

It says you are born again "in CHRIST" to then be "conformed" and "Adopted".

Calvinists can't see this... because they are trained by a false doctrine, to not see it.
They can only see "predestined" instead of "Fore-Knowledge"..so, that is their disconnect that Calvin causes in their mind.

Paul says of these.... "WHO...has bewitched you, that you no longer obey the truth"..

A.) John Calvinism is the "WHO".
 

amigo de christo

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The confusion is "what is predestined"...

So, the confused Calvinist says "being born again is predestined".. yet the NT does not say you are predestined to be born again.

It says you are born again "in CHRIST" to then be "conformed" and "Adopted".

Calvinists can't see this... because they are trained by a false doctrine, to not see it.
They can only see "predestined" instead of "Fore-Knowledge"..so, that is their disconnect that Calvin causes in their mind.

Paul says of these.... "WHO...has bewitched you, that you no longer obey the truth"..

A.) John Calvinism is the "WHO".
Jesus wept , HOW often i would have gathered thee as a mother hen her chicks
only YE WOULD NOT .
The gospel must be preached and proclaimed to all . Who so ever hears amen but who so ever rejects will
be damned . have you noticed THAT IS HOW JESUS preached and later paul and others .
THEY didnt sit around trying to debate who was predestined . THEY WAS BUSY PREACHING THE ANSWER .
And that answer is real simple . SO darn simple a five year old can grasp it .
BELIEVE YE ON JESUS THE CHRIST . rather odd that many no longer preach that .
 
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