Freed : From Calvinism and HyperCalvinism )Tulip<>5 Pont.

[Ritajanice]

NO.
You post verses that have NOTHING TO DO with the discussion at hand.
You post pages of verses and then don't explain what you mean by them.
You're not good at aligning verses to the topic.

BUT

I want to say this since I don't care to discuss with you more than absolutely necessary.

You keep asking @Behold and me HOW we know

1. That we chose to believe in God or
2. How we know that we're born again


The second question should never be asked of anyone UNLESS the question is very sincere,,,,in your case it IS NOT.

As to the first question as to how we can know we put our faith in God BEFORE we were born again,
here's my answer to you:

How do YOU know ANYTHING?
Do you know you woke up this morning?
Do you know you want to go food shopping today?
Do you know you need to return someone's phone call?

HOW?

Same for knowing how we put faith in God BEFORE becoming born again persons.

Because the ordo salutis is NOT what YOU think it is.

FIRST we come to know that God exists and we DECIDE to put our faith IN HIM.

Nonsense ...I’ve yet for you to show me how you can spiritually put your faith in God?

Are you saying that you have spiritual faith?

Or only human faith to put your faith in God...if it’s your human faith, then I’m afraid you can’t put your faith in someone you don’t know yet in your spirit....you can only know God in Spirit once he has gifted you the supernatural faith to believe in one’s spirit...that can only come by divine heart revelation ...not by walking as you do, yourself through scripture.

AT THAT POINT....we become born again.

In YOUR theoloy dear RJ.....
one must become born again before they can become born again.

Do you REALIZE how DUMB that idea is??

Do you ever wonder that MAYBE one day you should open up the NT and actually read it from cover to cover and THEN
you would understand all of Jesus' words:

Like these for instance:

John 3:5 JESUS STATES THAT TO SEE THE KINGDOM OF GOD A PERSON MUST BE BORN AGAIN.
John 3:16 JESUS TEACHES HOW A PERSON CAN BE BORN AGAIN.
John 3:20-21 JESUS TEACHES HOW TO BEHAVE - WE GO TO THE LIGHT OR WE DO NOT GO TO THE LIGHT.


Jesus said TO GO TO THE LIGHT....
This means that we are ABLE to CHOOSE to go to the light so as to become born again

You must be Born Again then we are in the Light?
All you post is man made religion.,I see no life of God in your heart/spirit.

Just your own understanding of scripture..there is no life in your words that you preach.and no life of God that comes out of your mouth...

 

[Ritajanice]

THEN i leave us with what JESUS himself said . My words are spirit and they are Life .
yet it sure seems that many do not want to rejoice in HIS WORDS .
Its not i who preach religoin . LEST ye think paul preached religoin
when he wrote to timothy and reminded him about the DIRE IMPORTANCE of the SCRIPS .
I think most people that wont really read the bible for themselves
and rather heed men who twist stuff are the ones who follow RELIGOIN and NOT GOD .
Every word of CHRIST , OF GOD is meat to the soul of a lamb .
Charity rejoices in TRUTH rita . never forget that . And i while i KNOW GOD
still speaks to us today through the SPIRIT , through men who speak by the SPIRIT
i also know a whole ton of folks claim to have the SPIRIT and claim to teach by the SPIRIT
and yet what they teach sure contradicts and twists the very words in that bible that I KNOW THE SPIRIT INSPIRED . keep that in mind .

Yeah, many don’t seem to want to shout out to the world that Jesus is Alive in Spirit.

All some want to do is condemn others, with their own religious views of said scriptures.

 

[amigo de christo]

I rejoice in knowing God in my heart/ spirit.

You preach religion...self taught religion you teach,I see no life of God coming out of your mouth.

and yet you see tons of life coming from the lips of epi . Now why is that sister .
Think on that sister . what it is about epi and his messages you seem to love
and what it is about mine you seem to see as self taught religion .
You seem to really enjoy his posts sister . Believe me i have no hate for him or anyone
but i sure have seen what he has wrote and while he will bring truths
HE SURE seems to not even preach the DIRE NEED TO FIRST BELIEVE ON JESUS THE CHRIST .
sounds like religion to me sister . HE even rebukes those who do remind us
that without FAITH IN CHRIST its impossible to even please GOD . You need to watch out and be on gaurd sister .
I wish you really would get back into daily bible reading again . its lovely sister . it really is .

 

[Ritajanice]

and yet you see tons of life coming from the lips of epi . Now why is that sister .
Think on that sister . what it is about epi and his messages you seem to love
and what it is about mine you seem to see as self taught religion .
You seem to really enjoy his posts sister . Believe me i have no hate for him or anyone
but i sure have seen what he has wrote and while he will bring truths
HE SURE seems to not even preach the DIRE NEED TO FIRST BELIEVE ON JESUS THE CHRIST .
sounds like religion to me sister . HE even rebukes those who do remind us
that without FAITH IN CHRIST its impossible to even please GOD . You need to watch out and be on gaurd sister .
I wish you really would get back into daily bible reading again . its lovely sister . it really is .

You show me where I said I see tons of life coming from Epi?

Epi is on a higher walk, which you and I don’t understand.

 

[amigo de christo]

Yeah, many don’t seem to want to shout out to the world that Jesus is Alive in Spirit.

All some want to do is condemn others, with their own religious views of said scriptures.

Yeah it sure does seem like that dont it . IT sure seems we have more and more
now who wont even remind the peoples about the dire need to have BELIEVED on JESUS the CHRIST .
yet USE HIS NAME to promote a faithless non beleiving IN HIM , religoin . EPI does that sister .
And some of us know that well .
OH he can preach against the hyper grace stuff , AS DO I ,
but then implies something even worse . The idea one does not have TO FIRST BELEIVE JESUS IS THE CHRIST .
you do realize inclusivism is a lie . OH it may state JESUS is the savoir but it clearly states
ONE does not have to beleieve . THAT BE THE LIE sister .
Many go about beleiving this lie that has come in many different ways and teachings
in order to gather the decieved to merge as one . Remember satan hates
the words YE MUST BELEIVE JESUS IS THE CHRIST . he wants us to beleive
that even false religoins somehow follow GOD , Even CHRIST , if they just had some form of the golden rule .
YOU had better watch out . always remember NO MAN BY THE SPIRIT
would seperate JESUS OUT . all false religoins DO so. sadly many within christendom now do so too .

 

[amigo de christo]

You show me where I said I see tons of life coming from Epi?

Epi is on a higher walk, which you and I don’t understand.

He is not on a higher walk . not at all . IF any man fails to remind of the dire need
to BELIEVE JESUS IS THE CHRIST and yet preaches his teachings , BELIEVE YOU ME ITS RELGION of man .
TRY getting him to start telling people THEY MUST FIRST BELIEVE JESUS IS THE CHRIST or its all in vain .
GET him to say that . IF YOU can . I NEVER have . OH he might claim to beleive
BUT HE SURE DONT think its necessary for others to BELEIVE JESUS IS THE CHRIST .
HE often has attacked me for that reminder sister , calling it religious ego .
Rather odd that EPI can attack the hyper grace , AS DO I , and yet I DIDNT REMOVE THE DIRE NEED TO FIRST BELIEVE ON JESUS
in fact I CONSTANTLY REMIND of that DIRE NEED and that without HIM we can do nothing . YOU really
need to go back to some earlier warnings i was giving epi and YOU SEE what he was telling me .

 

[Ritajanice]

Yeah it sure does seem like that dont it . IT sure seems we have more and more
now who wont even remind the peoples about the dire need to have BELIEVED on JESUS the CHRIST .
yet USE HIS NAME to promote a faithless non beleiving IN HIM , religoin . EPI does that sister .
And some of us know that well .
OH he can preach against the hyper grace stuff , AS DO I ,
but then implies something even worse . The idea one does not have TO FIRST BELEIVE JESUS IS THE CHRIST .
you do realize inclusivism is a lie . OH it may state JESUS is the savoir but it clearly states
ONE does not have to beleieve . THAT BE THE LIE sister .
Many go about beleiving this lie that has come in many different ways and teachings
in order to gather the decieved to merge as one . Remember satan hates
the words YE MUST BELEIVE JESUS IS THE CHRIST . he wants us to beleive
that even false religoins somehow follow GOD , Even CHRIST , if they just had some form of the golden rule .
YOU had better watch out . always remember NO MAN BY THE SPIRIT
would seperate JESUS OUT . all false religoins DO so. sadly many within christendom now do so too .

Praise the Lord in Spirit and truth.


The God of the universe is very much Alive in Spirit, he’s not the Bible everyone...he is a Living Spirit, His witness the Living Holy Spirit, is permanently Alive in our hearts/spirit...never ever to leave us.

In Jesus Name!..,Amen!

 

[Johann]

And once again if you practiced proper grammar and not throw it in the trash when you read Gods word you would know this is not a statement that either defends free will or election.

It is simply a declaratory statement of fact. It simply says whoever does A- then B will happen. But not a word on how A takes place. It uses the generic, instead of Jesus listing the 2+ billion or more souls who have accepted HIm as Savior over the centuries.

And until one is drawn to Jesus they cannot come. their human nature is incapable of turning to Jesus of its own volition. I have shown you the verses fromo God that prove that and instead of responding ot Gods Word you are more intent to slander, use ad-hominems and make emotional appeals that are untrue!

Ignore him-for the way and manner in which he is acting is not Christlike, showing neither reverence nor the fruit of the Holy Spirit.


Galatians 6:1:
"Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted."

2 Timothy 2:24-25:
"And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient, in meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth."

James 5:19-20:
"Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him; let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins."

Proverbs 27:5-6:
"Open rebuke is better than secret love. Faithful are the wounds of a friend; but the kisses of an enemy are deceitful."

Matthew 18:15:
"Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother."

Shalom.

J.

 

[Ritajanice]

He is not on a higher walk . not at all . IF any man fails to remind of the dire need
to BELIEVE JESUS IS THE CHRIST and yet preaches his teachings , BELIEVE YOU ME ITS RELGION of man .
TRY getting him to start telling people THEY MUST FIRST BELIEVE JESUS IS THE CHRIST or its all in vain .
GET him to say that . IF YOU can . I NEVER have . OH he might claim to beleive
BUT HE SURE DONT think its necessary for others to BELEIVE JESUS IS THE CHRIST .
HE often has attacked me for that reminder sister , calling it religious ego .
Rather odd that EPI can attack the hyper grace , AS DO I , and yet I DIDNT REMOVE THE DIRE NEED TO FIRST BELIEVE ON JESUS
in fact I CONSTANTLY REMIND of that DIRE NEED and that without HIM we can do nothing . YOU really
need to go back to some earlier warnings i was giving epi and YOU SEE what he was telling me .

Epi believes in the name of Jesus.

Do you believe in the Living Spirit..that’s what concerns me about you?

 

[amigo de christo]

Praise the Lord in Spirit and truth.


The God of the universe is very much Alive in Spirit, he’s not the Bible everyone...he is a Living Spirit, His witness the Living Holy Spirit, is permanently Alive in our hearts/spirit...never ever to leave us.

In Jesus Name!..,Amen!

Paul himself would be accused of you of worshipping the scriptures .
You never answered my question . What is so evil and wrong about reminding beleivers to be reading that bible .

 

[Behold]

No scripture I see, to support your fantasy story,Good day to you.

please don’t teach your fantasy story to me..my ears have cotton wool in them , when I read your posts.

You will never deceive this child of God.

Let me show you this...

"All who CALL... on the Name of the Lord Jesus, shall be saved"

"As many as RECEIVED Christ... God gave to them, the power to become a Son-Daughter of God".

Now, notice this NT verse CAREFULLY.......

"""""""and how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard?.... and how shall they hear without a preacher?"""""

So, you have to HEAR, before you can "CALL"... on Jesus.
You have to HEAR... before you can "RECEIVE". Jesus.

 

[JLB]

Lets look deeper now., into this "Doctrine of Devils" that started with Calvin, and was evolved into Hyper-Calvinism (TULIP) "the 5 points".

Amen, brother!

 

[Ritajanice]

Paul himself would be accused of you of worshipping the scriptures .
You never answered my question . What is so evil and wrong about reminding beleivers to be reading that bible .

What is so wrong in me proclaiming out of my mouth that God is a Living Spirit?

Nothing wrong in reading the Bible, unfortunately you imo have made it into an idol..

I will proclaim the Living word of God and keep giving you constant reminders of that truth.

 

[amigo de christo]

Epi believes in the name of Jesus.

SO DOES POPE FRANCIS sister . YET LOOK at what he teaches and implies . INCLUSIVISM .
the lie of anti christ . many CLAIM they believe . do ya really think that means THEY TRULY DO .
its lip service sister . No christain have i ever heard say THEY DO NOT BELEIVE IN JESUS .
IF simply cliaming it meant one did , THEN EVERY ONE IN CHIRSTENDOM would be fine .
MANY lip that name sister . sadly epi does quite simliar to what the pope does . I SAID SIMILIAR
and NOT IDENTICAL . but its inclusvism .
GET him to remind all about the dire need to BELEIVE JESUS IS THE CHRIST and then teach HIS teachings .
BUENO SUERTE with that sister . Perhaps you already know that about him . That would scare me to death if you do .
I had rather believe you simply have not seen all he has done .
My beef was never with EPI trying to teach aspects about the cross , CAUSE I DO
my beef against that man is HE NEVER Even dares to remind or say ONE MUST FIRST BELIEVE ON JESUS THE CHRIST .
MAKING IT ALL just another religoin in vain sister .

 

[amigo de christo]

What is so wrong in me proclaiming out of my mouth that God is a Living Spirit?

Nothing wrong in reading the Bible, unfortunately you imo have made it into an idol..

I will proclaim the Living word of God and keep giving you constant reminders of that truth.

There is NOTHING wrong with us procliaming out of our mouths that GOD is a living SPIRIT
but going after those who remind people to be reading the bible , IS WRONG sister .
that has been my point all along . WHY would you even have come after me
for just saying that in the first place .

 

[Ritajanice]

Let me show you this...

"All who CALL... on the Name of the Lord Jesus, shall be saved"

"As many as RECEIVED Christ... God gave to them, the power to become a Son-Daughter of God".

Now, notice this NT verse CAREFULLY.......

"""""""and how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard?.... and how shall they hear without a preacher?"""""

So, you have to HEAR, before you can "CALL"... on Jesus.
You have to HEAR... before you can "RECEIVE". Jesus.

Your doctrine is a fairytale..that is what you believe it means to be Born OfThe Spirit....plus what you post is not biblical on how one is Born Of The Spirit.

You add your own words to the word of God and make it say what you want it to say...you’re a deceiver.

You can’t deceive this child..

We must be Born Again..not we must hear to see the Kingdom of God...you add to Gods word, you deceive.youve been uncovered.of your deceit and fairytale lie...never any scripture to support your fairytale lies.

 

[Behold]

Nothing wrong in reading the Bible, unfortunately you imo have made it into an idol..

Jesus loved the word of God, and so should you.

The Holy Bible is "God Breathed"....its a SPIRITual book...

Jesus answered, “It is written: ‘Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.’”

Jesus is the WORD made flesh, and the Bible is the word of God.

The Holy Spirit and the Holy Bible work together as ONE.

See that Bible?
That is God talking to us..........revealing to us............ teaching us......... growing us.......enlightening us.

 

[Ritajanice]

Jesus loved the word of God, and so should you.

The Holy Bible is "God Breathed"....its a SPIRITual book...

Jesus answered, “It is written: ‘Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.’”

Jesus is the WORD made flesh, and the Bible is the word of God.

The Holy Spirit and the Holy Bible work together as ONE.

See that Bible?
That is God talking to us..........revealing to us............ teaching us......... growing us.......enlightening us.

You cannot grow in spirit , not until we have been permanently birthed by Gods Holy Spirit.

You cannot choose to be Born Again, just as Gods word says.your knowledge of such spiritual matters are extremely limited.

 

[Behold]

Your doctrine is a fairytale..

My "doctrine" is Pauline Theology.

Always.

Calvin denied it, which is why you do., and will.

Calvin hated some things that John wrote...

Like this.....>"For God so loved the WORLD that He gave Jesus, His only Begotten".

Calvin hated this verse, and changed it to.. "For God so loved only the elect, whom he pre-destined to choose".

Calvinism is of the Devil and it serves the Devil.
Avoid it.

 

[Ritajanice]

My "doctrine" is Pauline Theology.

Always.

Calvin denied it, which is why you do., and will.

Calvin hated some things that John wrote...

Like this.....>"For God so loved the WORLD that He gave Jesus, His only Begotten".

Calvin hated this verse, and changed it to.. "For God so loved only the elect, whom he pre-destined to choose".

Calvinism is of the Devil and it serves the Devil.
Avoid it.

Your doctrine is a fairy tale doctrine that you attributed to Paul.

You can’t even post scripture to support your doctrine..you have been deceived I’m afraid...you need to ask God for heart revelation..only he can sort out your skewed doctrine , listen to the Spirit let him be your guide, instead of you relying on self to understand Paul’s doctrine..praying that you do, in Jesus Name...Amen.