Christians, Christ Followers, and Lapsed Christians How Say You ?

[TigersPaw]

My First thread requested by a member that I post this.

Christians, Christ Followers, and Lapsed Christians—along with potential risks and advantages associated with each. These distinctions are helpful in understanding different levels of faith engagement, commitment, and spiritual growth within the Christian experience.
I consider myself a Christ Follower.

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1. Christians​

A “Christian” traditionally refers to someone who identifies with Christianity and believes in Jesus Christ as Savior. This group can range from active believers deeply involved in their faith to those who identify culturally as Christians but may not be as active in their relationship with Christ.

Advantages:​

• Community and Identity: Identifying as Christian often provides a strong sense of belonging within a community that shares core beliefs and values.
• Moral Foundation: Being part of Christianity offers teachings and values that encourage ethical living and love for others, following the principles of Jesus’ teachings.
• Foundation of Faith: Identifying as a Christian provides a framework for spiritual growth, Bible study, and worship that can lead to a deeper relationship with God over time.

Risks:​

• Cultural Christianity: There’s a risk of having a nominal faith, where one identifies as Christian without actively following Christ's teachings. This can lead to a life that resembles the world rather than the transformative life Jesus calls His followers to.
• Complacency: Some may feel that simply identifying as a Christian is enough, risking a lack of spiritual growth and intimacy with God.
• Misalignment of Belief and Action: Those who identify as Christians but don’t live out Christ’s teachings may risk misunderstanding or misrepresenting Christianity to others, leading to confusion or misinterpretation of what it means to follow Christ.

---

2. Christ Followers​

A “Christ Follower” often represents someone who is actively pursuing a relationship with Jesus and is committed to following His teachings in all aspects of life. This term emphasizes a relationship and dedication to Jesus rather than a label.

Advantages:​

• Deepened Relationship with God: Christ Followers actively engage in prayer, Bible study, worship, and service, which often results in a stronger relationship with God.
• Personal Transformation: Their lives are frequently marked by the fruit of the Spirit (love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, etc., as described in Galatians 5:22-23), demonstrating the transformative work of the Holy Spirit.
• Purpose and Fulfillment: Christ Followers often feel a strong sense of purpose in serving others, spreading the gospel, and fulfilling God’s unique calling for them.

Risks:​

• Persecution or Opposition: A committed Christ Follower may face opposition, whether subtle or overt, from a world that doesn’t always align with Christian values. Jesus warned that His followers would face trials because of their faith (John 15:18-20).
• Legalism or Burnout: In their dedication, some Christ Followers may fall into a performance mindset, where they feel their value is based on what they do rather than God’s grace. This can lead to burnout or legalism if not balanced by grace and rest in God.
• Isolation or Intolerance: Christ Followers may be tempted to isolate themselves from others they perceive as less committed. While setting boundaries is sometimes necessary, it's important not to lose compassion or the ability to relate to others in a meaningful way.

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3. Lapsed Christians​

A “Lapsed Christian” usually refers to someone who previously identified as a Christian but has distanced themselves from regular practice, active belief, or community involvement. Reasons for lapsed faith vary widely, from life circumstances to disillusionment or even doubts and unanswered questions.

Advantages:​

• Opportunity for Reflection: Sometimes, stepping back from active faith can lead to a period of soul-searching and rediscovery. It may allow a person to revisit their beliefs, confront doubts, and come to a more personal, genuine faith.
• Awareness of Spiritual Needs: Being away from a faith community can help lapsed Christians become more aware of their spiritual void and may inspire them to seek a deeper, more personal relationship with God.

Risks:​

• Spiritual Apathy or Drift: The longer one stays disconnected from a faith community or practice, the easier it is to become indifferent to spiritual matters, potentially leading to a drift from God’s presence and guidance.
• Susceptibility to Worldly Influences: Without the grounding and encouragement of a faith community, lapsed Christians may adopt values, behaviors, or beliefs that distance them further from God.
• Feelings of Guilt or Shame: Some lapsed Christians feel a sense of guilt or shame that makes it hard to return to faith, even if they desire to reconnect. This may prevent them from experiencing the forgiveness and grace God offers.

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Summary: Keys to Growth and Avoiding Risks​

• For Christians: Seek a meaningful, personal relationship with Christ rather than settling for cultural identification. Actively pursue spiritual growth through community, worship, and Bible study.
• For Christ Followers: Remain rooted in grace, balancing commitment with dependence on the Holy Spirit. Stay humble and compassionate, recognizing that we all need God’s grace daily.
• For Lapsed Christians: Remember that God’s arms are always open, and He welcomes those who seek Him. Returning to faith may involve addressing doubts or pain, but it can lead to a renewed and transformed life in Christ.

Each group faces unique risks, but the key to growth lies in staying close to Christ, cultivating a sincere faith, and leaning on God’s grace. In Christ, there’s always an invitation to a deeper, more fulfilling relationship, no matter where one starts.
These are my opinion, based on my interpretation.

 

[marks]

I'd sooner say, either one is or is not regenerate, a child of God.

Much love!

 

[JohnDB]

 

[FaithWillDo]

My First thread requested by a member that I post this.

Christians, Christ Followers, and Lapsed Christians—along with potential risks and advantages associated with each. These distinctions are helpful in understanding different levels of faith engagement, commitment, and spiritual growth within the Christian experience.
I consider myself a Christ Follower.

---

1. Christians​

A “Christian” traditionally refers to someone who identifies with Christianity and believes in Jesus Christ as Savior. This group can range from active believers deeply involved in their faith to those who identify culturally as Christians but may not be as active in their relationship with Christ.

Advantages:​

• Community and Identity: Identifying as Christian often provides a strong sense of belonging within a community that shares core beliefs and values.
• Moral Foundation: Being part of Christianity offers teachings and values that encourage ethical living and love for others, following the principles of Jesus’ teachings.
• Foundation of Faith: Identifying as a Christian provides a framework for spiritual growth, Bible study, and worship that can lead to a deeper relationship with God over time.

Risks:​

• Cultural Christianity: There’s a risk of having a nominal faith, where one identifies as Christian without actively following Christ's teachings. This can lead to a life that resembles the world rather than the transformative life Jesus calls His followers to.
• Complacency: Some may feel that simply identifying as a Christian is enough, risking a lack of spiritual growth and intimacy with God.
• Misalignment of Belief and Action: Those who identify as Christians but don’t live out Christ’s teachings may risk misunderstanding or misrepresenting Christianity to others, leading to confusion or misinterpretation of what it means to follow Christ.

---

2. Christ Followers​

A “Christ Follower” often represents someone who is actively pursuing a relationship with Jesus and is committed to following His teachings in all aspects of life. This term emphasizes a relationship and dedication to Jesus rather than a label.

Advantages:​

• Deepened Relationship with God: Christ Followers actively engage in prayer, Bible study, worship, and service, which often results in a stronger relationship with God.
• Personal Transformation: Their lives are frequently marked by the fruit of the Spirit (love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, etc., as described in Galatians 5:22-23), demonstrating the transformative work of the Holy Spirit.
• Purpose and Fulfillment: Christ Followers often feel a strong sense of purpose in serving others, spreading the gospel, and fulfilling God’s unique calling for them.

Risks:​

• Persecution or Opposition: A committed Christ Follower may face opposition, whether subtle or overt, from a world that doesn’t always align with Christian values. Jesus warned that His followers would face trials because of their faith (John 15:18-20).
• Legalism or Burnout: In their dedication, some Christ Followers may fall into a performance mindset, where they feel their value is based on what they do rather than God’s grace. This can lead to burnout or legalism if not balanced by grace and rest in God.
• Isolation or Intolerance: Christ Followers may be tempted to isolate themselves from others they perceive as less committed. While setting boundaries is sometimes necessary, it's important not to lose compassion or the ability to relate to others in a meaningful way.

---

3. Lapsed Christians​

A “Lapsed Christian” usually refers to someone who previously identified as a Christian but has distanced themselves from regular practice, active belief, or community involvement. Reasons for lapsed faith vary widely, from life circumstances to disillusionment or even doubts and unanswered questions.

Advantages:​

• Opportunity for Reflection: Sometimes, stepping back from active faith can lead to a period of soul-searching and rediscovery. It may allow a person to revisit their beliefs, confront doubts, and come to a more personal, genuine faith.
• Awareness of Spiritual Needs: Being away from a faith community can help lapsed Christians become more aware of their spiritual void and may inspire them to seek a deeper, more personal relationship with God.

Risks:​

• Spiritual Apathy or Drift: The longer one stays disconnected from a faith community or practice, the easier it is to become indifferent to spiritual matters, potentially leading to a drift from God’s presence and guidance.
• Susceptibility to Worldly Influences: Without the grounding and encouragement of a faith community, lapsed Christians may adopt values, behaviors, or beliefs that distance them further from God.
• Feelings of Guilt or Shame: Some lapsed Christians feel a sense of guilt or shame that makes it hard to return to faith, even if they desire to reconnect. This may prevent them from experiencing the forgiveness and grace God offers.

---

Summary: Keys to Growth and Avoiding Risks​

• For Christians: Seek a meaningful, personal relationship with Christ rather than settling for cultural identification. Actively pursue spiritual growth through community, worship, and Bible study.
• For Christ Followers: Remain rooted in grace, balancing commitment with dependence on the Holy Spirit. Stay humble and compassionate, recognizing that we all need God’s grace daily.
• For Lapsed Christians: Remember that God’s arms are always open, and He welcomes those who seek Him. Returning to faith may involve addressing doubts or pain, but it can lead to a renewed and transformed life in Christ.

Each group faces unique risks, but the key to growth lies in staying close to Christ, cultivating a sincere faith, and leaning on God’s grace. In Christ, there’s always an invitation to a deeper, more fulfilling relationship, no matter where one starts.
These are my opinion, based on my interpretation.

Dear RootedwithGod,
Scripture teaches that there are only TWO groups of believers:

1. The first group is made up of unconverted believers who have only been given the Early Rain of the Spirit. They have been "called to be saints" but their election has not been confirmed. These believers are spiritual "babes" who can only draw milk. They remain carnally minded & spiritually blind and cannot mature because they cannot receive any nourishment of truth beyond "Christ and Him crucified". Because of these spiritual weaknesses, all unconverted believers will become apostate shortly after Christ's gives them the Early Rain of the Spirit. They are "many" in number and they make up the approximately 2,000 different denominations/sects of Christianity in the world. It is through these apostate believers that a false Christ is presented to this world.

2. The second group is made up of converted believers who have have been given both the Early and Latter Rains of the Spirit. They are "saints" and their election has been confirmed. These believers have moved from being babes who can only draw milk to being little children to can begin eating bread, meat and New Wine. It is by this strong nourishment of truth that Christ will mature them into a perfect man of full age. Upon their conversion, they come out from the apostate church and are relatively unknown by this world. They are "few" in number and are the true witnesses of Christ to this world.

Joe

 

[Behold]

1. The first group is made up of unconverted believers

What cult teaches that there are "unconverted believers'..

As a BELIEVER< as defined by the NT< is a Born again Christian, so, this one has to be "converted" as that is to have BELIEVED.

What cult are you from @FaithWillDo ?

 

[FaithWillDo]

What cult teaches that there are "unconverted believers'..

As a BELIEVER< as defined by the NT< is a Born again Christian, so, this one has to be "converted" as that is to have BELIEVED.

What cult are you from @FaithWillDo ?

Dear Behold,
Christ says differently:

Mat 18:3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Being "born again" (entering the Kingdom of Heaven) happens to a believer when they are converted (Latter Rain and judgment, Mat 3:11-12). Upon their conversion, they will mature from being "babes" to being "little children" who are no longer spiritually blind.

When Christ made this statement above, the Apostles had been given the Early Rain of the Spirit and had become "babes". And like all babes, they were spiritually blind and could not understand the spiritual teachings of Christ (Mark 8:15-25). But after the Apostles were converted on the Day of Pentecost, their spiritual blindness was healed and the Spirit of Truth they had just received began guiding them into "all truth".

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

The Latter Rain of the Spirit is the Spirit of Truth.

Joe

 

[Behold]

Dear Behold,
Christ says differently:

Mat 18:3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children,

Jesus said you must be "born again"..

If you are counting on water to do that for you, then you're not a Christian.
If you are counting on your trying to "do righteousness" to get you into heaven... then you are not a Christian..
IF you belong to a cult that proclaims themselves to be of "the elect" and yet they can't explain what it means to be "born again" as the "blood atonement" that is the Cross of Christ, that is the New Covenant.... then they are leading you to HELL, with a Bible and a hymnbook.

A Christian, is a God Birthed Spirit, that has become a "new Creation" ""in CHrist""" as a "Son/Daughter" of God.

This is "not of yourselves", it is "the Gift of God".

 

[FaithWillDo]

Jesus said you must be "born again"..

If you are counting on water to do that for you, then you're not a Christian.
If you are counting on your trying to "do righteousness" to get you into heaven... then you are not a Christian..
IF you belong to a cult that proclaims themselves to be of "the elect" and yet they can't explain what it means to be "born again" as the "blood atonement" that is the Cross of Christ, that is the New Covenant.... then they are leading you to HELL, with a Bible and a hymnbook.

A Christian, is a God Birthed Spirit, that has become a "new Creation" ""in CHrist""" as a "Son/Daughter" of God.

This is "not of yourselves", it is "the Gift of God".

Dear Behold,
"Water" is a spirit word (John 6:63) which represents the Holy Spirit/Christ. Spiritually blind believers can usually understand that much but there are some babes who are too blind to even understand that.

Consider these verses on the Early and Latter Rains:

Hos 6:3 Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he (Christ) shall come unto us as the RAIN, as the latter and former RAIN unto the earth.

James 5:7 Be patient therefore, brethren, unto the coming of the Lord. Behold, the farmer waiteth for the precious fruit of the earth, and hath long patience for it, until he receives the EARLY and LATTER RAIN. 8 Be ye also patient; stablish your hearts: for the coming of the Lord draweth nigh.

John 14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again (as the Latter Rain), and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

Psa 68:9 Thou, O God, didst send a plentiful RAIN (Latter Rain), whereby thou didst confirm thine inheritance, when it was weary (apostate).

Prov 16:15 In the light of the king's countenance is life; and his favour is as a cloud of the latter RAIN.

Job 37:6 For he saith to the snow, Be thou on the earth; likewise to the small rain (Early Rain), and to the great rain (Latter Rain) of his strength.

John says that apostate believers will deny that Christ ever came to them as the Early Rain when He appears "in the flesh".

1John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

John is referring to the time when Christ comes to a person as the Early Rain of the Spirit. John makes this statement because when Christ first comes to a person, they can only see Christ in a carnal way (in the flesh) because the Early Rain does not heal a person's spiritual blindness. But since the Early Rain of the Spirit does give a person a measure of faith and certain spiritual gifts, the new believer thinks that they have been baptized by the Spirit (the Latter Rain/Spirit of Truth) like the Apostles were on the Day of Pentecost. But this is not true. The new believer (a babe) has only received the Early Rain of the Spirit like the Apostles did when Christ first appeared to them.

Also, from my past conversations with you, I know that you do not believe that salvation is a free gift. You believe that a person (from their own works) must "receive" the free gift. However, that is not how Christ saves a person. Christ saves a person by coming to them without their knowledge, asking or permission and gives them the Early Rain of the Spirit. Then if the person is also "chosen", He will "come again" at a time of His choosing and freely give them the Latter Rain of the Spirit. With the Spirit of Truth within the person, the true Christ will finally be revealed to them. After Christ appears, Christ will commence His judgment which will remove and destroy all the spiritual things (the chaff) within a person that has made them carnal and sinful. This is when they are converted, when the new birth occurs and when they enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Salvation happens solely by the grace of God and the work of Christ. Christ does not need anything in return from the person for Him to save them. It truly is a free gift. To believe that Christ does need anything in return from a person comes from Satan's "another gospel" which is taught in the apostate church.

A saved person's confession of faith, repentance from works and works of faith happen BECAUSE they are saved and not the other way around.

Joe

 

[Behold]

Dear Behold,
"Water" is a spirit word (John 6:63) which represents the Holy Spirit/Christ.

The "washing of regeneration "......is not getting inside a baptism pool.

Its the application of the Blood Atonement, that deals with your sin (washes your sin away").

Water Cults teach the heresy that "water washes your sin away".. but in fact, its the BLOOD OF JESUS, that is the BLOOD Atonement, that applied by God is the "washing of regeneration".
This is all a part of becoming Born again.......... and has NOTHING to do with getting wet during a water baptism ceremony.

How do you know?
Its because MILLIONS of water baptized religious people, went to HELL believing their Water Baptism ceremony was their Salvation.
THey found out it didnt save them.
They found out their water cult lied to them.

 

[FaithWillDo]

The "washing of regeneration "......is not getting inside a baptism pool.

Its the application of the Blood Atonement, that deals with your sin (washes your sin away").

Water Cults teach the heresy that "water washes your sin away".. but in fact, its the BLOOD OF JESUS, that is the BLOOD Atonement, that applied by God is the "washing of regeneration".
This is all a part of becoming Born again.......... and has NOTHING to do with getting wet during a water baptism ceremony.

How do you know?
Its because MILLIONS of water baptized religious people, went to HELL believing their Water Baptism ceremony was their Salvation.
THey found out it didnt save them.
They found out their water cult lied to them.

Dear Behold,
You said:
The "washing of regeneration "......is not getting inside a baptism pool.

I have never said that it did. Why do you think I have? You should re-read my posts.

The water used in the physical act of baptism is a symbol for the Holy Spirit.

The act of water baptism "foreshadows" the time when Christ will return to an Elect person as the Latter Rain to baptize them with the Spirit. It does not represent that they have already received that baptism, it only foreshadows it.

A person is water baptized because they have received the Early Rain of the Spirit. It was the same water baptism that the Apostles performed on others when they walked with Christ.

Also, when a person dies, they do not go to heaven or hell. They are dead and are waiting to be resurrected from the grave.

Joe

 

[Behold]

A person is water baptized because they have received the Early Rain of the Spirit.

No verse in a NT says that...

Not one.

 

[FaithWillDo]

No verse in a NT says that...

Not one.

Dear Behold,
Here are a couple::

John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.

John 4:1 When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John, 2
(Though Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples,)

The water baptism mentioned in the verses above was performed for a person after they received the Early Rain of the Spirit. It could not have been after the person received the Latter Rain (baptism of the Spirit) because the baptism of the Spirit (Latter Rain) had not come yet.

Below is where Paul mentions the water baptisms that he and others performed on new believers just after they received the Early Rain of the Spirit.

1Cor 1:14 I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius; 15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name. 16 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.

The Corinthian believers to whom Paul addressed his letters had only received the Early Rain of the Spirit. They were only "called to be saints" and were carnal babes - they were still waiting for the Lord to "come again" with the Spirit of Truth (Latter Rain) to convert them.

As I said, water baptism is performed after a person receives the Early Rain of the Spirit to foreshadow the spiritual baptism that comes to an Elect person when Christ comes to them a second time with the Latter Rain. The Latter Rain of the Spirit is when a person is converted and saved - not when they receive the Early Rain of the Spirit.

Below is another example of people being baptized in water after they had received the Early Rain of the Spirit. It is the Early Rain of the Spirit that gives a person their faith and belief in Christ - a person cannot have them any other way (1Cor 12:3).

Acts 8:12 But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.

Joe

 

[Behold]

Dear Behold,
Here are a couple::

John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.

This verse does not say... """""""A person is water baptized because they have received the Early Rain of the Spirit.""""

John 4:1 When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John, 2
(Though Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples,)

This verse does not say... """""""A person is water baptized because they have received the Early Rain of the Spirit.""""

1Cor 1:14 I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;

This verse does not say... """""""A person is water baptized because they have received the Early Rain of the Spirit.""""

 

[FaithWillDo]

This verse does not say... """""""A person is water baptized because they have received the Early Rain of the Spirit.""""



This verse does not say... """""""A person is water baptized because they have received the Early Rain of the Spirit.""""



This verse does not say... """""""A person is water baptized because they have received the Early Rain of the Spirit.""""

Dear Behold,
You said:
This verse does not say... """""""A person is water baptized because they have received the Early Rain of the Spirit.""""

No, it doesn't but it doesn't need to say it because a person can only call Jesus "Lord" and want to be baptized in water if they have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit - even just the small amount of the Spirit that is the Early Rain.

1Cor 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Spirit.

Job 37:6 For he saith to the snow, Be thou on the earth; likewise to the small rain (Early Rain), and to the great rain (Latter Rain) of his strength.

Deu 32:2 My doctrine shall drop as the rain, my speech shall distil as the dew, as the small rain (Early Rain) upon the tender herb, and as the showers (Latter Rain) upon the grass:

Joel 2:23 Be glad then, ye children of Zion, and rejoice in Jehovah your God; for he giveth you the former rain (Early Rain) in just measure (a small amount that gives a person their faith), and he causes to come down for you the rain, the former rain and the latter rain, in the first month.

Without the Spirit, a person has no desire to seek out Christ nor can they even understand and accept the truth of "Christ and Him crucified".

Rom 3:10 As it is written, there is none righteous, no, not one: 11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

1Cor 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

What these verses above teach is in direct conflict with what the apostate churches teach about how a person accepts Christ has their Lord.

The apostate churches teach that mankind has a free will ability to either choose Christ or reject Christ. They say that it is an individual decision that only they can make. But scripture says that belief is a lie (mixing works with faith) that comes from Satan .

Mankind was created spiritually marred and subject to vanity. In that condition, 100% of mankind has become the children of the Devil who will NEVER accept Christ as their Lord and Savior. And because of mankind's sin, all mankind is "condemned already" (John 3:18) and is going to perish. For this reason, God took pity upon mankind and sent Christ into the world to freely give mankind a new birth as a child of God who is not condemned. Until a person is spiritually converted into this "new creation", they will remain under the penalty of death according to the Law. But because Christ is "not willing that any should perish" (2Pet 3:9), Christ will come to each and every person who has ever lived and spiritually change them PRIOR to them perishing by the Law. This is mankind's salvation and it is a free gift from God.

To be converted, Christ will come to a person TWO times, followed by judgment. The first time Christ comes, He will give the person the Early Rain of the Spirit. This small measure of the Spirit will not convert the person and will leave the person susceptible to Satan's deceptions. After the new believer (a babe) has fallen away and become apostate, Christ will return to them and pour out the Latter Rain of the Spirit. This is the "great Rain of His strength" (Job 37:6) which will give the person a new birth as a child of God who is not spiritually blind. Now, as a child of God who can "see", Christ (Word of God/Truth) will appear to them. It is Truth that will judge the person and complete their conversion (baptism of fire).

James 5:7 Be patient therefore, brethren, unto the coming of the Lord. Behold, the farmer waiteth for the precious fruit of the earth, and hath long patience for it, until he receives the EARLY and LATTER RAIN. 8 Be ye also patient; stablish your hearts: for the coming of the Lord draweth nigh.

Mat 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Spirit (Latter Rain), and with fire (judgment that removes the chaff from the believer): 12 Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

This concept is VERY IMPORTANT: God's Word teaches truth "here a little, and there a little" (Isa 28:9-12). To find the truth, you must combine the teachings of different scriptures. If you do not learn truth in this manner, you will not find it. This is true of the verses that I quoted on water baptism. They do not say that the person has received the Early Rain of the Spirit but we can know for certain that they have because of what other scriptures teach on why a person accepts Christ. Without the Early Rain of the Spirit, a person would never accept Christ or want to be baptized in water.

Therefore, when a person wants to be baptized in water, it can only be because they have been given the Early Rain of the Spirit. With the Early Rain of the Spirit (even just a small amount), they can no longer call Jesus accursed (1Cor 12:3).

Joe