Behold
Well-Known Member
If you really meant that, then you would not have posted yet another False Theology thread that is designed to cause strife.,. @St. SteVen
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Spiritual Extortion - The threat of consequence for refusing the "Free Gift" of salvation
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If you really meant that, then you would not have posted yet another False Theology thread that is designed to cause strife.,. @St. SteVen
Ritajanice
Born-Again
I’m not in combat with her, she keeps quoting my posts..I was quite happy posting, then she quoted my post.....therefore I post and answer her..what I believe the word of God to be saying..my opinion,my belief.
So sorry I missed this post. It's important. At least to me.
The gift if FREE because it's not forced onto anyone. This is the point I've been making with another member.
The restrictions are only what I've stated till now...GOD MUST BE ACKNOWLEDGED.
This is what Hebrews states:
Hebrews 12:22-29
” 22But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to myriads of angels,
23to the general assembly and church of the firstborn who are enrolled in heaven, and to God, the Judge of all, and to the spirits of the righteous made perfect,
24and to Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood, which speaks better than the blood of Abel.
Verse 23: TO GOD THE JUDGE OF ALL....what is God judging if all will be saved?
THE SPIRITS OF THE RIGHTEOUS will be made perfect....NOT ALL SPIRITS.
Some are beyong being made righteous because they did NOT choose God while living.
The Unshaken Kingdom
25See to it that you do not refuse Him who is speaking. For if those did not escape when they refused him who warned them on earth, much less will we escape who turn away from Him who warns from heaven.
As you know, this is referring back to Moses' time. Moses warned from the earth. JESUS is warning us from heaven.
WHY warn us??
26And His voice shook the earth then, but now He has promised, saying, “YET ONCE MORE I WILL SHAKE NOT ONLY THE EARTH, BUT ALSO THE HEAVEN.”
27This expression, “Yet once more,” denotes the removing of those things which can be shaken, as of created things, so that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.
28Therefore, since we receive a kingdom which cannot be shaken, let us show gratitude, by which we may offer to God an acceptable service with reverence and awe;
29for our God is a consuming fire.
We offer to God an acceptable service.
Also Romans 12:1
So how do you reconcile this FREE GIFT,,,,with all the rest of scripture??
It MUST be reconciled by using scripture....not by making up a new concept of Christianity.
It's reconciled because the gift is free....
But conditions must be met, and those conditions are not either WORKS or going about without ACKNOWLEDGING GOD.
But it's easy:
Hebrews 11:6
6And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him.
Who told you this?
Have you not read Romans????
Romans 1:18-20
18For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,
19because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them.
20For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.
God has always made Himself be known.
No man will have an excuse.
Every person has the ability to acknowledge and serve the one True God.
Paul dealt with it.
See also
Romans 2:14-16
14For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, 15in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them,
16on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.
They have been met.
God wishes that all be saved.
And the conditions are very simple.
Ritajanice
Born-Again
Sorry, I had to answer this...God did not make himself known to me..as the natural man cannot know God, just as his word says....I never knew God, not until he birthed my spirit,then he made himself known to my spirit..his Spirit witnessing to our spirit..the Spirit witnesses to our spirit that we are Gods children.
No problem if you believe what you said above..
I believe we must know God in our spirit= Born Again.regenerated, Born Again of imperishable seed..all mean the same.
I really don't think that anyone posts in order to cause strife.
I think persons these days have differing opinions about doctrinal beliefs.
I've said many times that the reformation was necessary....but it was also unfortunate.
Why?
Because it disintegrated the core beliefs of Christianity, which had always been believed...
in order to reject those that had been added on by the CC.
Since Sola Scriptura became the norm....it was possible to read different ideas into the scriptures that were NEVER believed in the early church. There's mention of predestination in the NT, so Calvin concentrated on that, devoted himself to Augustine and. voila, Calvinism.
There's mention of how God wants everyone to be saved, so universalism. It's difficult to understand the hypostatic union...so JWs.
And on it goes.
I wish we could get back to the very beginning,,,maybe till the middle of the 2nd century...
but we cannot...so, here we are.
Behold
Well-Known Member
And when did God forgiven your sin?
Was it, when He birthed you, before You knew Him, and had faith to believe?
Did you read Romans 1:19-20?
What do you think it means?
Why don't you believe scripture?
Ritajanice
Born-Again
You cannot know God, without his witness the Holy Spirit..why don’t you believe that truth?
PS
It IS a problem....you're not quoting what Jesus and Paul and all the other writers taught.
You're quoting what A MAN taught,,,,John Calvin.
Again,,,PLEASE show me WHERE in the NT it states that we have to be BORN AGAIN FIRST
and
THEN BELIEVE.
I ask because the NT teaches that we MUST BELIEVE FIRST
and THEN WE BECOME BORN AGAIN.
Please provide some scripture to support your doctrinal belief.
No Ritajanice....
You're not a new Christian...
so....
I asked you to read Romans 1:19-20 and then tell us all what you think it means.
THIS is what you must do to continue this conversation...
Not come back and tell me something or other (as you accuse me of doing)....
What does Romans 1:19-20 mean?
18For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,
19because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them.
20For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.
Ritajanice
Born-Again
I’m posting Gods word, please prove that I’m not?
Where in scripture does it say believe first then we become Born Again @GodsGrace ?
Show me...Jesus has already explained to nicodemus how we are Born Of The Spirit.. the Spirit is like the wind, you never know the time or place, when the Holy Spirit will birth us.
1 Corinthians 12:3New King James Version (NKJV) Therefore I make known to you that no one speaking by the Spirit of God calls Jesus accursed, and no one can say that Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit.
Ritajanice
Born-Again
I asked you why you deny this scripture.
1 Corinthians 12:3New King James Version (NKJV) Therefore I make known to you that no one speaking by the Spirit of God calls Jesus accursed, and no one can say that Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit.
The Holy Spirit in my spirit, is the one who witnesses to my spirit that Jesus is Lord.
I wouldn’t know who Jesus was..without his witness, witnessing that truth to my heart/ spirit.
Just as his word says.
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Behold
Well-Known Member
He does it to cause Strife.
Look at the title of This Thread... Its an attack on the "Gift of Salvation".. and He calls it "Spiritual Extortion".
Its always been that you have Truth and you have the other.
I think that before i could agree with your post, you would have to list a few "core belief's of Christianity" that were disintegrated by the "Reformation"
Like what?
Yes, its always the case that a verse, or 2 or 3,.....are misunderstood or they are misused on purpose by a MAN, who creates a teaching.
This becomes a Cult, eventually,........... once enough people believe it.
Well, regarding the forum....we are "here" because there are a handful of topics that are allowed on most Forums, that generate all the arguing and the anger.
If you end those Topics, if you ban them from Discussion..... you end not only the fighting, but you end the daily reason that bring a good portion of the people back to the forum everyday.
They wont stick around and that is good for the Forum and for the members.
See...They are not here to learn, .. They are here to grind the Dull Axe Head of their Theology, into the Forum, and then fight with whomever responds.
That is their carnal need.. and they have to feed it all the time, here... and on most forums, that allow certain Topics, that brings these types around, daily.
You don't seem to understand how this works.
YOU make a statement.
It MUST BE supported by scrpture.
You don't post back to ME,,,asking me to prove that you're scripture is wrong - or whatever you said.
What does 1 Cor 12:3 have ANYTHING to do with what we're discussing?
YOU said we have to become born again first and THEN we can believe.
It's on YOU to show where this is stated in scripture.
Guess what? You won't find it because it's NOT what the NT teaches.
However, IF you're going to make a bold statement...you MUST back it up with scripture.
Either do that, or stop posting to me.
Ritajanice
Born-Again
What does Romans 1:19-20 mean?
18For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,
19because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them.
20For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.
The wrath of God is on the unbelievers..
We are not under God’s wrath, the Born Again, we’re under grace.
18For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,
19because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them.
20For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.
The wrath of God is on the unbelievers..
We are not under God’s wrath, the Born Again, we’re under grace.
Ritajanice
Born-Again
I have posted scriptural support...I ask show me my error ?
Instead of keep posting your opinions?
Ritajanice
Born-Again
Because they aren’t Born Again.
..the natural man is alienated from the Spirit of God?.yes or no?
I asked you why you deny this scripture.
1 Corinthians 12:3New King James Version (NKJV) Therefore I make known to you that no one speaking by the Spirit of God calls Jesus accursed, and no one can say that Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit.
You have to post scripture that states that a person must be born again FIRST
and THEN they can believe.
Here's what you're doing by your statements:
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