Daniel Chapter 8 - the 2300 evenings and mornings prophecy

[CTK]

There was a bible teacher name A.W. Pink who explained why the Papacy, the Pope, cannot be the Antichrist. The person must be a Jew, who will become King of Israel, thought-to-be messiah.

My mistake! I thought the last response was from Earburner.....

 

[1stCenturyLady]

That is your response? You have repeatedly insisted the little horn is AE.

AE is the little horn from Greece in Daniel 8. The Antichrist which is the dragon of Revelation 12 is the little horn of Daniel 7. The dragon, Satan, will possess a man in the Great Tribulation. He is the beast of Revelation 13.

 

[Bladerunner]

Not many "names". Names are like "Bob", "Tom", "Jerry".

No those are proper names.....what about father, son, husband, etc.......those are names as well, same as 'man of sin, son of perdition' besides these are biblical

Instead, I would say many "labels". The labels describe the stages he goes through on the way to his demise.

stage 1 - as the little horn person
stage 2 - as the prince that shall come
stage 3 - as the Antichrist
stage 4 - as the revealed man of sin
stage 5 - as the beast king

No, the antichrist (man of sin and the son of perdition) tells us something...He is a Man and he is also the son of Satan.. This is used during the 2nd half of Daniel's 70th year where the man gets a mortal head injury and Satan overtakes the man's body and becomes the son of perdition. They are all evil and represent SATAN/ Lucifier, etc

 

[Bladerunner]

AE is the little horn from Greece in Daniel 8. The Antichrist which is the dragon of Revelation 12 is the little horn of Daniel 7. The dragon, Satan, will possess a man in the Great Tribulation. He is the beast of Revelation 13.

AE???what is this? the rest is correct.

 

[Earburner]

That is your respoonse? You have repeatedly insisted the little horn is AE. So I ask you at least a third time to identity how all the verses in Chapters 7 and 8 could possibly point to AE.... i know the little horn is indeed the papacy... which you are agressively rejected... so, please give it your best shot.....

As I have repeatedly shown, there was and is only one little horn, and AE was it.

In the KJV there is nothing in Dan. 7 and 8 saying otherwise. Furthermore, the recorded history of the Jews is accurately accounted for in 1&2 Maccabees, and can be easily seen through Dan. chs. 7, 8, 11 and 12.
The prophecy was for 2300 literal DAYS, not for 2300 literal years.

 Your dilemma is found in Dan. 7
[8] I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom [prior to] there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this [little] horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.

The clue, for discerning the "three of the first horns", is found in Dan. 11:4- key word: "broken".
One of those three Horns, is specifically shown to be prior to [A4E] in Dan. 11
[4] And when he shall stand up, his kingdom shall be broken, and shall be divided toward the four winds of heaven; and not to his posterity, nor according to his dominion which he ruled: for his kingdom shall be plucked up, even for others beside those.

Now, can you venture to name the beast with the other two horns, that were also plucked up, and was a world ruler in their time, before [prior to] A4E rose to power?

 

[ewq1938]

No! According to the KJV, there are no words that say "THE" Antichrist.

This is a strawman fallacy. No one claims the bible uses that, but it speaks of a particular singular Ac and in English, we can refer to that AC as "the AC" because the THE denotes a certain AC, the one John spoke of.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

AE???what is this? the rest is correct.

The Grecian emperor Antiochus IV Epiphanes. The 2,300 mornings and evenings was the first Jewish revolt of 6.3 years from 167 BC to 160 BC. He defiled the Jewish temple by sacrificing a pig on the Jewish altar. The Maccabees cleansed the temple.

 

[ewq1938]

Not many "names". Names are like "Bob", "Tom", "Jerry".

Instead, I would say many "labels". The labels describe the stages he goes through on the way to his demise.

stage 1 - as the little horn person
stage 2 - as the prince that shall come
stage 3 - as the Antichrist
stage 4 - as the revealed man of sin
stage 5 - as the beast king

There are no stages found in the bible for this person. There are simply different names/labels for him. The Ac does not exist before "the beast king" does. The same one man is the Ac and beast king at the same time simply because Ac comes from one book, while Rev does not use AC at all but rather speaks of him as a beast etc.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

As I have repeatedly shown, there was and is only one little horn, and AE was it.

In the KJV there is nothing in Dan. 7 and 8 saying otherwise. Furthermore, the recorded history of the Jews is accurately accounted for in 1&2 Maccabees, and can be easily seen through Dan. chs. 7, 8, 11 and 12.
The prophecy was for 2300 literal DAYS, not for 2300 literal years.

 Your dilemma is found in Dan. 7
[8] I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom [prior to] there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this [little] horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.

The clue, for discerning the "three of the first horns", is found in Dan. 11:4- key word: "broken".
One of those three Horns, is specifically shown to be prior to [A4E] in Dan. 11
[4] And when he shall stand up, his kingdom shall be broken, and shall be divided toward the four winds of heaven; and not to his posterity, nor according to his dominion which he ruled: for his kingdom shall be plucked up, even for others beside those.

Now, can you venture to name the beast with the other two horns, that were also plucked up, and was a world ruler in their time, before [prior to] A4E rose to power?

Daniel 7 has a little horn also and it is future. Then it will be THE Antichrist, the dragon, Satan, in Rev. 12 which depicts the first 3.5 years, then Rev. 13 which is the beast (the Antichrist possessed by the devil) and the false prophet, probably the pope.

 

[Bladerunner]

The Grecian emperor Antiochus IV Epiphanes. The 2,300 mornings and evenings was the first Jewish revolt of 6.3 years from 167 BC to 160 BC. He defiled the Jewish temple by sacrificing a pig on the Jewish altar. The Maccabees cleansed the temple.

The other way was 1150 morning and evenings which is the date when AE started His persecutions of the Jewish Temple. a double fulfillment. the 2300 morning ans evenings were the beginning of the cleansing of the temple after the revolt had triumphed. Thank You

 

[Earburner]

This is a strawman fallacy. No one claims the bible uses that, but it speaks of a particular singular Ac and in English, we can refer to that AC as "the AC" because the THE denotes a certain AC, the one John spoke of.

Actually, the word "the" can be used in both the singular and the plural. However, the word "that" is always used in the singular: "that spirit of antichrist".

 

[CTK]

As I have repeatedly shown, there was and is only one little horn, and AE was it.

In the KJV there is nothing in Dan. 7 and 8 saying otherwise. Furthermore, the recorded history of the Jews is accurately accounted for in 1&2 Maccabees, and can be easily seen through Dan. chs. 7, 8, 11 and 12.
The prophecy was for 2300 literal DAYS, not for 2300 literal years.

 Your dilemma is found in Dan. 7
[8] I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom [prior to] there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this [little] horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.

The clue, for discerning the "three of the first horns", is found in Dan. 11:4- key word: "broken".
One of those three Horns, is specifically shown to be prior to [A4E] in Dan. 11
[4] And when he shall stand up, his kingdom shall be broken, and shall be divided toward the four winds of heaven; and not to his posterity, nor according to his dominion which he ruled: for his kingdom shall be plucked up, even for others beside those.

Now, can you venture to name the beast with the other two horns, that were also plucked up, and was a world ruler in their time, before [prior to] A4E rose to power?

OK and thanks.

 

[ewq1938]

Actually

So back to the issue. Saying "the Ac" is perfectly valid according to English grammar. Will you stop protesting when people use it? It is not a quote from the bible, it is a reference to AC being used in the singular which is from the bible.

 

[Douggg]

There are no stages found in the bible for this person. There are simply different names/labels for him. The Ac does not exist before "the beast king" does. The same one man is the Ac and beast king at the same time simply because Ac comes from one book, while Rev does not use AC at all but rather speaks of him as a beast etc.

The five stages that the person will fit the labels of the little horn, the prince that shall come, the Antichrist, the revealed man of sin, the beast-king.... progress along a timeline.

Here are the five stages on a timeline....

 

[ewq1938]

The five stages that the person

There are no such stages of him becoming those things. It's pure imagination. He appears, and he rules for 42 months then will be destroyed by Jesus.

 

[TrevorHL]

Greetings again Earburner.,

As I have repeatedly shown, there was and is only one little horn, and AE was it.

The little horn of Daniel 7 is the Papacy, the little horn of Daniel 8 was the pagan Roman Empire.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[Douggg]

There are no such stages of him becoming those things. It's pure imagination. He appears, and he rules for 42 months then will be destroyed by Jesus.

definition of "stages"
noun
stages (plural noun)

1. a point, period, or step in a process or development:
   "there is no need at this stage to give explicit details" · "I was in the early stages of pregnancy"

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The period of 42 months of Revelation 13:5 is in the person's final stage - that of being the beast king.

 

[Earburner]

So back to the issue. Saying "the Ac" is perfectly valid according to English grammar. Will you stop protesting when people use it? It is not a quote from the bible, it is a reference to AC being used in the singular which is from the bible.

Ok. Let's play a little word game. Let's reverse that concept, and play it out.
Be aware, in your mind, it might be difficult for you to carry through with it.

Instead of using the word anti-christ, let's reverse the term to say anti-satan.
So, if I use the term that spirit of anti-satan, who exactly does that describe?
It would be:
1. That spirit of Christ himself.
2. All who have the spirit of Christ.

Now, for all who do have that spirit of anti-satan, they would be all who ARE partakers of the divine nature, having become "new creatures", and do not habitually live after the fallen nature of "the natural man", thus confessing that Christ CAME in the flesh.
All of such would be anti-satan.
A child of God.

Now, flip that back to the correct biblical use of the term: that spirit of anti-christ.
Who exactly does that describe?
It would be:
1. That spirit of satan himself.
2. All who have the spirit of satan.

Now, for all who DO HAVE that spirit of anti-christ, they would be all who ARE that man of sin, the son of perdition, remaining to be "the natural man", and do habitually live after their fallen nature, thus confessing that Christ HAS NOT come in the flesh.
All of such would be anti-christ.
A child of satan.

So then, let's conclude with these words:
Rom. 8:9.....whosoever HATH NOT the spirit of Christ, is NONE of his.
 Please see KJV 2 Thes. 1:7-10.

 

[Earburner]

OK and thanks.

You are welcome.

"Ok and thanks", but you don't have an answer to my question?
Post #372: Edit #365
Now, can you venture to name the beast with the other two horns, that were also plucked up, and was a world ruler in their time, before [prior to] A4E rose to power?
Please give it a try.
Thanks.

 

[Earburner]

Greetings again Earburner.,

The little horn of Daniel 7 is the Papacy, the little horn of Daniel 8 was the pagan Roman Empire.

Kind regards
Trevor

So, you also cannot answer my question in post #372: Edit #365.
"Now, can you venture to name the beast with the other two horns, that were also plucked up, and was a world ruler in their time, before [prior to] A4E rose to power?"
Please give it a try.
Thanks.