attacking another denomination are included in this rule.

[Brakelite]

Jesus is the truth, religions that seek after Him are not entirely absolute truth. Otherwise, all Christians would be in agreement. Let's just say religion is man's way of seeking, worshipping, relating to God. Christianity is God's way of seeking a relationship with man.
So let's dissect the statement, "all religions are of equal importance". To the individual, not God. He is just saying that man seeks God on many paths. It is just a general observation. And we finds truths in many religions. God's truth has permeated the world and so what is good and just became part of false religions. This is partially what keeps them blinded to Jesus, they cling to certain truths.

Tom Hoopes', (of Benedictine College) explanation:
"Pope Francis delights people worldwide, as we saw in his recent visit to East Asia and Oceania.
He also drives people crazy worldwide, and we saw that, too, for instance when he said: “All religions are paths to God. I will use an analogy, they are like different languages that express the divine.”
This alarmed many Catholics who believe, with the Catechism, that, “All salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body.” They worried that the Pope himself was saying otherwise. He’s not.
There are three simple steps Catholics can take when they are troubled by what the Pope said.
First: Double check the Catechism.
Often, the “troubling” things Pope Francis says are just paraphrases of the Catechism.
What I quoted above about salvation is from No. 846 of the Catechism. What comes right before it and right after it are also important.
Right before it, the Church teaches about truth in other faiths, and says about Muslims: “together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind’s judge on the last day.”
Right after it, the Catechism teaches that “Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart and, moved by grace, try in their actions do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience — those too may achieve eternal salvation.”

Of course Jesus is the only way. So was he spreading the gospel at that moment, no.
God draws man to Himself. His sheep will hear His voice. The Pope knows this, so he doesn't try to force feed anyone with an abrupt statement like: "Jesus is the only way ... following any other path is a dead end, empty and will lead you to destruction ... so just everyone in the world, stop what you are doing, turn from the path you are on and seek Jesus!"
You think that approach would work? No.
God converts the soul. Jesus is the Author and so people who have their door open to Christ, He will come in and sup them them.
I am not a Catholic. But I do know that the Catholic Church carries the gospel since their beginnings, imperfectly (as we all do).
Love is the way into the heart. Missionaries go out to those in need, help them, love them and then give them the gospel. Love has to come first, for God is Love. You prove that you love them by caring for them first, not just by words. That has been their method. Missions, hospitals, orphanages speak volumes.
A Tribe needs water, they go and dig wells, whatever they need, care and then share.
What do you do to love unbelievers?

You are taking Francis at face value, without knowing the agenda behind his speeches. He is a Jesuit. Do some research into Jesuit philosophy, and the goals, ambitions and agenda of the Catholic Church. Then you will see the true meaning behind what he is saying. Satan is a master of deception, and the Vatican is his current vehicle through which his goals are being pursued. Earlier it was the Jews through which he sought to destroy the church. Then pagan Rome. Then papal Rome. Soon the second beast of Revelation 13 will be exposed. American Protestantism in union with the state, who will give global accreditation once again to the Papacy, who through ecumenism, will rule as a tyrant for a short time before Jesus comes.
These plans have been developing for hundreds of years. We are seeing the final culmination of them. Don't be deceived.

 

[Taken]

attacking another denomination are included in this rule.

ATTACK is the “NEW” word to use instead of “DISAGREE”…

ATTACK invokes…an OFFENSE and VICTIM!

VICTIM invokes…visions of $$$$

I Know you were expressly speaking regarding the religious organizations…

And no doubt there is plenty of disagreements among religious organizations…Agree..as to so what?

It is the 3% of the population yapping 24-7 they, them, it’s are victims….YIPES yawn.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

You are taking Francis at face value, without knowing the agenda behind his speeches. He is a Jesuit. Do some research into Jesuit philosophy, and the goals, ambitions and agenda of the Catholic Church. Then you will see the true meaning behind what he is saying. Satan is a master of deception, and the Vatican is his current vehicle through which his goals are being pursued. Earlier it was the Jews through which he sought to destroy the church. Then pagan Rome. Then papal Rome. Soon the servings beat of Revelation 13 will be exposed. American Protestantism in union with the state, who will give global accreditation once again to the Papacy, who through ecumenism, will rule as a tyrant for a short time before Jesus comes.
These plans have been developing for hundreds of years. We are seeing the final culmination of them. Don't be deceived.

You don't seem to have taken into account the Sovereignty of God. I doubt you know what that means. Catholics believe in Christ, Protestants do. Currently there are 2.7 billion believers (1/3).The Body of Christ is under His control. You are the one looking at their sins and the outside appearance and judging them. How many of them do you personally know? "There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. Rom. 8:1-2 Jesus forgave our sins and so the Father sees pure souls.
Of course there are tares in the fold and we see church types as there were in Rev. 2 & 3. Remember, only two of those churches did not get a rebuke. One was almost dead, another was materialistic, another lukewarm, some with false doctrines, etc. So this has been going on from the beginning. Even Peter had to he rebuked by Paul for appeasing the Judaisers, ( the legalists). And we see legalism today in churches ( faith + works salavtion). But God has got each of His sheep in check. They may drift, backslide, go off the path, but He does not lose one. Those who are not His, are lost.
Satan currently has 2/3 of the population, all othe false religions that he has created and atheists which account for 10 %.
You should direct your efforts into spreading the Good News to those who are lost, not condemning over a billiion Christians!
God appoints all governing authorities (Rom. 13:1); not just world leaders, but spiritual leaders as well.

Btw, Rev. 13 has nothing to do with the Catholic Church! That Beast is an antichrist, he speaks against Christ and all those who worship him are not Christians. That Beast, led by Satan, is currently gathering ten Islamic nations to war against Israel. Russia is in there too so who knows who the Antichrist is - he is now at work and will be revealed soon.
Does that discount people like Klaus Schwab and his gathering of all nations behind this move towards a NWO? No, because it seems all nations are becoming anti- Israel at this point. And so we shall see. The Pope is for Christ, not against Him. He spent His entire life studying the Bible and worshiping Christ.

"All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast—all whose names have not been written in the Lamb’s book of life,..." Rev. 13:8

 

[Brakelite]

You don't seem to have taken into account the Sovereignty of God. I doubt you know what that means. Catholics believe in Christ, Protestants do. Currently there are 2.7 billion believers (1/3).The Body of Christ is under His control. You are the one looking at their sins and the outside appearance and judging them. How many of them do you personally know? "There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. Rom. 8:1-2 Jesus forgave our sins and so the Father sees pure souls.
Of course there are tares in the fold and we see church types as there were in Rev. 2 & 3. Remember, only two of those churches did not get a rebuke. One was almost dead, another was materialistic, another lukewarm, some with false doctrines, etc. So this has been going on from the beginning. Even Peter had to he rebuked by Paul for appeasing the Judaisers, ( the legalists). And we see legalism today in churches ( faith + works salavtion). But God has got each of His sheep in check. They may drift, backslide, go off the path, but He does not lose one. Those who are not His, are lost.
Satan currently has 2/3 of the population, all othe false religions that he has created and atheists which account for 10 %.
You should direct your efforts into spreading the Good News to those who are lost, not condemning over a billiion Christians!
God appoints all governing authorities (Rom. 13:1); not just world leaders, but spiritual leaders as well.

Btw, Rev. 13 has nothing to do with the Catholic Church! That Beast is an antichrist, he speaks against Christ and all those who worship him are not Christians. That Beast, led by Satan, is currently gathering ten Islamic nations to war against Israel. Russia is in there too so who knows who the Antichrist is - he is now at work and will be revealed soon.
Does that discount people like Klaus Schwab and his gathering of all nations behind this move towards a NWO? No, because it seems all nations are becoming anti- Israel at this point. And so we shall see. The Pope is for Christ, not against Him. He spent His entire life studying the Bible and worshiping Christ.

"All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast—all whose names have not been written in the Lamb’s book of life,..." Rev. 13:8

I feel your passion. But I believe it's somewhat misdirected. First, what have I said that motivated your strident defence of individual Catholics? I have never, in all my years as a protestant Seventh-Day Adventist, and prior to that a pentecostal and prior to that Catholic, again never, vilified, condemned, accused, or disparaged individual lay members of the Catholic Church, many of whom I believe are genuine Christians with a deep love for God and their fellow man, notwithstanding, or despite, their association with a system I believe is an abomination and a danger to mankind. You clearly believe that she has changed her character and mindset over the past 2or3 hundred years. Yet she herself declares her canons and doctrines infallible, her councils the embodiment of truth, and her history "excusable" as it was the fault of only 1or2 bad apples. You see, this is why I started this thread. So we could discuss these issues openly and without the fear of being cancelled. I know why you think the way you do. It's the way of modern protestant thinking, and it's been around for 100 years or so. But what you don't understand, and misjudge, are the reasons why I think the way I do. And it didn't start with Adventism. Of you want to learn... really learn about the world of politics, the occult, the roots of secret societies and their connections with Islam, Freemasonry, the UN, the world bank, and yes, even the Jesuit order of the Catholic Church, I can direct you to a series of discussions by an Adventist evangelist and retired professor of biology and familial relationship with a Freemason temple in south Africa, who uses original source material for all his lectures. And yes. That includes Klaus Schwab and his associates.
Or, as an alternative, a series of lectures from the same gentleman from 15 or so years ago, (pre Klaus S.), 30 odd in total, each at least an hour long again using original source material.
You don't know what you don't know. Let me know if you are interested. That goes for anyone reading this.

 

[Lizbeth]

You don't seem to have taken into account the Sovereignty of God. I doubt you know what that means. Catholics believe in Christ, Protestants do. Currently there are 2.7 billion believers (1/3).The Body of Christ is under His control. You are the one looking at their sins and the outside appearance and judging them. How many of them do you personally know? "There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. Rom. 8:1-2 Jesus forgave our sins and so the Father sees pure souls.
Of course there are tares in the fold and we see church types as there were in Rev. 2 & 3. Remember, only two of those churches did not get a rebuke. One was almost dead, another was materialistic, another lukewarm, some with false doctrines, etc. So this has been going on from the beginning. Even Peter had to he rebuked by Paul for appeasing the Judaisers, ( the legalists). And we see legalism today in churches ( faith + works salavtion). But God has got each of His sheep in check. They may drift, backslide, go off the path, but He does not lose one. Those who are not His, are lost.
Satan currently has 2/3 of the population, all othe false religions that he has created and atheists which account for 10 %.
You should direct your efforts into spreading the Good News to those who are lost, not condemning over a billiion Christians!
God appoints all governing authorities (Rom. 13:1); not just world leaders, but spiritual leaders as well.

Btw, Rev. 13 has nothing to do with the Catholic Church! That Beast is an antichrist, he speaks against Christ and all those who worship him are not Christians. That Beast, led by Satan, is currently gathering ten Islamic nations to war against Israel. Russia is in there too so who knows who the Antichrist is - he is now at work and will be revealed soon.
Does that discount people like Klaus Schwab and his gathering of all nations behind this move towards a NWO? No, because it seems all nations are becoming anti- Israel at this point. And so we shall see. The Pope is for Christ, not against Him. He spent His entire life studying the Bible and worshiping Christ.

"All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast—all whose names have not been written in the Lamb’s book of life,..." Rev. 13:8

Who are His sheep? If any try to enter the sheepfold by any other way than the door which is Christ, they do not belong to Him. Church leadership who do that are called thieves and robbers who try to steal the sheep away from Jesus unto themselves and their teachings. See John 10.

Mental belief and naming the name of Jesus does not make one His, and belonging to a "church" and performing rituals and incantations in His name does not make one His. It is only THROUGH receiving Christ/His Spirit into oneself that we become one of His sheep. AKA being born of the Spirit, with a faith that is not of our own. And when one is born of the Spirit they need to stop trying to offer Him strange fire, otherwise they could fall away again just as quickly.

2Co 6:14-18

Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?

And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you, (unclean = mixture, therefore impure)

And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.


We must not be deceived. If the foundation of the faith isn’t there, it isn’t Christian period, though it may call itself that. It’s a horse of a different colour entirely. As Jesus said it's not possible to serve God and mammon/Baal at the same time. Mixture of Christianity with pagan = pagan as far as God is concerned. We need to discern and know unequivocally what we’re dealing with in order to NOT BECOME UNEQUALLY YOKED with what is not of God but is of another spirit entirely. Same with Babylonish Talmudic Judaism….mixture = pagan.

The foundation of the faith is Christ....Him dwelling and walking in our hearts by His Spirit, not in mouth only.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

I have never, in all my years as a protestant Seventh-Day Adventist, and prior to that a pentecostal and prior to that Catholic, again never, vilified, condemned, accused, or disparaged individual lay members of the Catholic Church, many of whom I believe are genuine Christians with a deep love for God and their fellow man, notwithstanding, or despite, their association with a system I believe is an abomination and a danger to mankind.

Sounds like you are backpeddling. You laim lay persons are just fine dandy, just their Pope's, priests, nuns and system are an abomination. That is quite a conflicting and incongruous. They follow the system, worship Jesus, pray (though some of their prayers to saints or Mary are empty and misguided), learn and are guided by these authorities that YOU CLAIM ARE CORRUPT. I suggest you talk to a priest or a nun, get to know them, see what they are saying and doing.
If you say the system is an abomination, directed by Satan, than all it's followers should be doomed deceived doomed.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Church leadership who do that are called thieves and robbers who try to steal the sheep away from Jesus

Yes, people like Jim Jones, David Koresh, Warren Jeff's, or gay Pastors that lead a liberal flock, are deceived.
I agree with the gist of your post. We must be born again by the Spirit and enter through the narrow Gate. Jesus is the Door and our Shepherd. I just don't see Catholics, (it's leaders and their system) an abomination. I see that they_ in fact _ entered the narrow Gate and they believe in Christ.
Many Prostestants are anti- Catholic and vice versa. I am not part of that group. We will all be surprised when we get to heaven, how many actually made it - you'll see the popes their too. We may see during the Great Tribulation a bunch from all false religions and atheists turning to Christ. We'll see.

 

[amigo de christo]

attacking another denomination are included in this rule.

ATTACK is the “NEW” word to use instead of “DISAGREE”…

ATTACK invokes…an OFFENSE and VICTIM!

VICTIM invokes…visions of $$$$

I Know you were expressly speaking regarding the religious organizations…

And no doubt there is plenty of disagreements among religious organizations…Agree..as to so what?

It is the 3% of the population yapping 24-7 they, them, it’s are victims….YIPES yawn.

What a wonderful reminder my dear dear friend .
Thus let us know and understand its NOT an attack to expose SINS within the church .
Its not an attack to call a false prophet false , or doctrine that is false , FALSE .
An attack is an attack .
example time .
IF a gay married couple were sitting in a church
and claimning we beleive . ITS NOT A SIN to call out their error , to rebuke them and to even have them leave
said church if they refuse to repent .
HERE would be an example of an attack . If someone starting screaming harsh slurs at them
or perhaps trying to hit or punch them . THAT IS AN ATTACK .
correcting is not an attack . to expose sin is not an attack . an ATTACK is an attack .

 

[amigo de christo]

Sounds like you are backpeddling. You laim lay persons are just fine dandy, just their Pope's, priests, nuns and system are an abomination. That is quite a conflicting and incongruous. They follow the system, worship Jesus, pray (though some of their prayers to saints or Mary are empty and misguided), learn and are guided by these authorities that YOU CLAIM ARE CORRUPT. I suggest you talk to a priest or a nun, get to know them, see what they are saying and doing.
If you say the system is an abomination, directed by Satan, than all it's followers should be doomed deceived doomed.

and that is why WE OUGHT to warn such fellows within such systems to get out of said systems .
cause that is one deadly dangerous place for any man to sit under .
exposing false doctrines and false places is not wrong . ITS RIGHT and GOOD WE DO SO for the sake of the souls of men who sit under
such places . THANK ya for the reminder ronald david bruno .

 

[Marvelloustime]

and that is why WE OUGHT to warn such fellows within such systems to get out of said systems .
cause that is one deadly dangerous place for any man to sit under .
exposing false doctrines and false places is not wrong . ITS RIGHT and GOOD WE DO SO for the sake of the souls of men who sit under
such places . THANK ya for the reminder ronald david bruno .

 

[Lizbeth]

Yes, people like Jim Jones, David Koresh, Warren Jeff's, or gay Pastors that lead a liberal flock, are deceived.
I agree with the gist of your post. We must be born again by the Spirit and enter through the narrow Gate. Jesus is the Door and our Shepherd. I just don't see Catholics, (it's leaders and their system) an abomination. I see that they_ in fact _ entered the narrow Gate and they believe in Christ.
Many Prostestants are anti- Catholic and vice versa. I am not part of that group. We will all be surprised when we get to heaven, how many actually made it - you'll see the popes their too. We may see during the Great Tribulation a bunch from all false religions and atheists turning to Christ. We'll see.

We must not judge by outward appearance and human sympathies.. Judge/discern by the truth, not by human emotions/attachments and how things "seem" on the surface.

Yes, it's getting bad within protestant evangelical churches too (which is why they are increasingly finding things in common with the Catholic church). That's why I and many others have left them in recent times.

I'm afraid rather that many might be surprised at who didn't actually make it to heaven in the end. Though the number of the "Israelites" be as the sand of the sea, only a remnant will be saved - written for our example and admonition.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

and that is why WE OUGHT to warn such fellows within such systems to get out of said systems .
cause that is one deadly dangerous place for any man to sit under .
exposing false doctrines and false places is not wrong . ITS RIGHT and GOOD WE DO SO for the sake of the souls of men who sit under
such places

Well, we all know how you feel about Catholism. So, do you practice what you preach online? Do stand outside the Catholic Church on Sunday morning with a warning sign, waiting for the congregation to dismiss so you can warn them, ranting and shouting out to them as you typically do on this forum? I doubt it. You just hide behind your computer screen and type away your criticisms and condemnations. Your probably afraid to find a church of your own, maybe none of the Protestant churches are safe enough, you might be in danger of being corrupted?
Watch out amino de christo, Satan is out to get you. Lock the doors! If anyone rings the bell, don't answer it, it might be a priest or a nun coming to lure you to their church for a black mass!

 

[Brakelite]

Sounds like you are backpeddling. You laim lay persons are just fine dandy, just their Pope's, priests, nuns and system are an abomination. That is quite a conflicting and incongruous. They follow the system, worship Jesus, pray (though some of their prayers to saints or Mary are empty and misguided), learn and are guided by these authorities that YOU CLAIM ARE CORRUPT. I suggest you talk to a priest or a nun, get to know them, see what they are saying and doing.
If you say the system is an abomination, directed by Satan, than all it's followers should be doomed deceived doomed.

Yes, they are deceived. And some of them genuinely live up to what light they understand. Many others are merely nominal, they go to church 3 times a year to fulfil Catholic obligations, go to confession once a year, they are told that such is sufficient to make up for the drunkenness, the cursing, and the general worldliness that pervades so much of Roman Catholicism. Then there's the many who rely mainly on the superstitions... the relics, the indulgences, the rote meaningless prayers, the ritualistic, and the "holiness" and "merits" stockpiled in the Vatican bank by their local patron Saint. Some even go so far as to retain their old pagan spiritualism, and mix it with the rituals of the church: and the church condones, even encourages all of the above, so long as they bow to the Pope when he passes by on parade or to the local statue of Mary on occasion. Yes, the system that encourages all the above is rotten. Some Catholics are not a part of that. Some are real, they serve God in the best manner they know how through local charities and they actually do believe in Jesus and the gospel message. Some of them maybe even nuns and priests and brothers. Those are the ones who are God's people. And they are in Babylon, and God is calling them out.

We must not judge by outward appearance and human sympathies.. Judge/discern by the truth, not by human emotions/attachments and how things "seem" on the surface.

Yes, it's getting bad within protestant evangelical churches too (which is why they are increasingly finding things in common with the Catholic church). That's why I and many others have left them in recent times.

I'm afraid rather that many might be surprised at who didn't actually make it to heaven in the end. Though the number of the "Israelites" be as the sand of the sea, only a remnant will be saved - written for our example and admonition.

The greatest fault with Protestantism today is the mingling of church and state to create a union that will mirror that of the papacy in the dark ages.
“11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast (the papacy) before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.
13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they (the people who voted them to power)
should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, (through legislation) and cause (by coercion) that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.
16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark (of the papal beast) in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. ”
Revelation 13:11-17 KJV

 

[Brakelite]

You don't seem to have taken into account the Sovereignty of God.

In this context I absolutely do understand God's sovereignty. He expressed that here...
“And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities. ”
Revelation 18:4,5 KJV

 

[Lizbeth]

Well, we all know how you feel about Catholism. So, do you practice what you preach online? Do stand outside the Catholic Church on Sunday morning with a warning sign, waiting for the congregation to dismiss so you can warn them, ranting and shouting out to them as you typically do on this forum? I doubt it. You just hide behind your computer screen and type away your criticisms and condemnations. Your probably afraid to find a church of your own, maybe none of the Protestant churches are safe enough, you might be in danger of being corrupted?
Watch out amino de christo, Satan is out to get you. Lock the doors! If anyone rings the bell, don't answer it, it might be a priest or a nun coming to lure you to their church for a black mass!

The Son of Man had no where to lay His head.....do you think Jesus was at home in the synagogues and Temple of that day (which were leading up to the righteous wrath that befell them in 70AD)? "Let us therefore go to Him outside the camp, bearing His reproach."

Not many listened to Him either, but reproached and derided and crucified Him. Same with John....."You brood of vipers, who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?"....he was rebuking those who were responsible for leading the Jewish nation astray and thus inviting the wrath of God.

It looks very much to me that we are living in just such a time, with the church in general following the same pattern and example of Israel back then:

Rom 2:9
Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;

 

[Lizbeth]

In this context I absolutely do understand God's sovereignty. He expressed that here...
“And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities. ”
Revelation 18:4,5 KJV

It seems that we are living in a day when God is "remembering" her iniquities. Her sins are being exposed in the harsh light off day in recent years. Both in Catholicism and Protestantism. Scandal after scandal. Both Jesus and John exposed the sins of the religious leaders of Israel of that time. I am wondering if this means God is getting ready to judge......and actually deception/delusion is a judgment in itself upon all who did not receive a love of the truth, which will lead to wrath.

"God is sovereign". It's so true, He is!.......but unfortunately many use that as an excuse for complacency.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

In this context I absolutely do understand God's sovereignty. He expressed that here...
“And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities. ”
Revelation 18:4,5 KJV

That is the world system, Babylon. Remember all the rebelluous pride, false religions, forms of idolatry, mysticism, astrology, humanism, hedonism and the occults came out of that city and spread throughout the world. And the world fornicated with this harlot, a symbolic description used.

"Babylon is to be better understood as sort of the archetypical head of all worldly resistance to God. It is a trans-historical Babylon. It is the Babylon of idolatry. It is the eschatological symbol of worldwide satanic deception and power. It is a divine mystery that can never be wholly reducible to empirical earthly institutions. Babylon represents, in this chapter, the religious culture of the world dominated by Satan the deceiver.
Now its comprehensiveness can be seen further by noting that it is Babylon the Great, it is mega-Babylon, something massive and far-reaching. Further it is described as ‘The mother of harlots and of the abominations of the earth.’ That is to say that all of the harlots in the earth and all of the abominations in the world are spawned out of this Babylon." JOHN MacArthur

I have wrestled with Rev. 17 & 18 for many years, examining the different viewpoints. Certainly during John's writing of Revelation, ( 95AD) Rome was referred to as Babylon ( symbolically) yet the city Babylon still existed. Even Jerusalem was considered Babylon by some. But John's prophecy was about the far off future time in the world. The present world would not react to a destruction of Rome as described in Rev. 18. They would if NYC was destroyed. Recently NYC has been going down, people are leaving in droves to escape the high costs, crime and crazy life of decadence.

All people have sinned and have been seduced in some way or form by Satan and His system. Christ had a solution, many are saved and many are lost. He will destroy Babylon, but it won't be just one city, it will be the whole world system.

If Babylon is really a modern city, representing many languages, nations, religions uniting, and building wealth beyond what the world has ever seen, and worshipping money with all sorts of idolatry and sin, it would NYC. Even with the Statue of Liberty, one might regard her as a symbol of the Harlot? It is a mystery.

 

[amigo de christo]

Well, we all know how you feel about Catholism. So, do you practice what you preach online? Do stand outside the Catholic Church on Sunday morning with a warning sign, waiting for the congregation to dismiss so you can warn them, ranting and shouting out to them as you typically do on this forum? I doubt it. You just hide behind your computer screen and type away your criticisms and condemnations. Your probably afraid to find a church of your own, maybe none of the Protestant churches are safe enough, you might be in danger of being corrupted?
Watch out amino de christo, Satan is out to get you. Lock the doors! If anyone rings the bell, don't answer it, it might be a priest or a nun coming to lure you to their church for a black mass!

What a poor way to try and justify stuff my friend .
OF course i dont stand outside holding a sign .
Ps , if i am shouting on this forum , You must have some good ears to hear me .
cause the last time i checked writing words make about no sound at all when one reads them .
You all are scared to death to correct . that is what the problem is , and we both know it to be so ...........
Many love the judge not correct not , use not words stuff , cause deep down they are totally terrified of this world
and certain sins too .

 

[amigo de christo]

The Son of Man had no where to lay His head.....do you think Jesus was at home in the synagogues and Temple of that day (which were leading up to the righteous wrath that befell them in 70AD)? "Let us therefore go to Him outside the camp, bearing His reproach."

Not many listened to Him either, but reproached and derided and crucified Him. Same with John....."You brood of vipers, who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?"....he was rebuking those who were responsible for leading the Jewish nation astray and thus inviting the wrath of God.

It looks very much to me that we are living in just such a time, with the church in general following the same pattern and example of Israel back then:

Rom 2:9
Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;

Spot on right sister .

 

[Marvelloustime]

What a poor way to try and justify stuff my friend .
OF course i dont stand outside holding a sign .
Ps , if i am shouting on this forum , You must have some good ears to hear me .
cause the last time i checked writing words make about no sound at all when one reads them .
You all are scared to death to correct . that is what the problem is , and we both know it to be so ...........
Many love the judge not correct not , use not words stuff , cause deep down they are totally terrified of this world
and certain sins too .