Friendly Bible Study - participants must agree to Nicene Creed.
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If you consider Jesus seperate from the Godhead maybe - but I don't.
OK let's Look at Acts 7 over the next few days and consider what inspiration and understanding we would like to share with others.
Please pray for a good encouraging exchange.
Please pray for a good encouraging exchange.
I agree on all.
Anyone might have the power/ability to heal and instead some ordained ministers/priests may not.
God gives different gifts to all.
1 Peter 4:10
10As each has received a gift, use it to serve one another, as good stewards of God's varied grace:
Romans 12:6a
Having gifts that differ according to the grace given to us, let us use them:
I didn't answer this sorry.
My deep concern is that we now have professional Christians under contract.
There are problems with this.
1. There is a disconnect between the giving heart and the support of those in the gathering. The direct connection between giving receiving and enabling is broken.
2. Tithing is promoted to sustain out of obligation when giving should be free, and motivated by love.
3. There is a career to be perused rather than a service to be rendered in seasons of the Lord's enabling. Some hate having to do sermons but the contract requires it.
4. Commercial confidences crush transparency and family cannot grow.
In this sense we have an institution rather than a family/community.
I agree on the above and these certainly are problems within the church.
But
I also believe that without an institution Christianity would not have been able to survive.
Having a group of persons praying and worshipping all together would hold for a while, but would have died eventually
without something concrete to keep them together.
I used to think that Jesus did not come to start a new church but to show us how to live our lives the way God desired.
I have since changed my mind realizing that the early Christians used to gather in homes or in the synagogues in order to meet and learn and share communion. Soon there were too many of them and soon the Jews no longer wanted them in the synagogue.
And there were just too many Christians to be accomodated.
An institution soon became necessary and there was a hierarchy even in the 1st and 2nd century.
Yes, structure has been and is critical but we have drawn on the practices of the world and it is hindering and limiting our potency.
Friends - we are waiting to begin Acts 7.
However I have just heard one of the best sermons by far in recent times.
Pete Greig speaks about the Lords Prayer (and he touches on the prayer in Acts 4.)
This resonated deeply with me - it is 45 minutes and I can't more highly recommend it.
Please take time out and listen.
However I have just heard one of the best sermons by far in recent times.
Pete Greig speaks about the Lords Prayer (and he touches on the prayer in Acts 4.)
This resonated deeply with me - it is 45 minutes and I can't more highly recommend it.
Please take time out and listen.
I have to agree.
Some churches are being influenced more by the world.....
than the world is being influenced by them.
The Episcopal church in England hardly seems Christian anymore.
@Brakelite @amadeus @Azim @Pearl @Rita @Ritajanice @APAK @MA2444 @faithfulness @GTW27 @Berean @rockytopva @quietthinker @ScottA @marks @grace @Oneoff @Hillsage @VictoryinJesus @Angelina @seatts79 @GodsGrace
OK Acts 7...
First off the detail we have about Stephens defence is amazing - I wonder how it was remembered so well...
It was at the point when Stephen switched from his OT survey to accusing them of Murdering the Righteous One that they were to repeat the the same abominable crime and murder another 'righteous one' as their fathers had.
Judaism had become the synagog of Satan and apposed the witness of God through faithful servants and continues to do so to this day.
Oh that the vail would be lifted and again Jews would see and believe as they once did. His love for the Jews has not changed. I note that there are many in Israel today that believe in Jesus but the cost of being a follower is very high.
Sadly it is pride that blinds and sadly the Jews had and have plenty of it, including Paul at the time. Yet Jesus loved Paul and appeared to him as He appeared to Peter who denied Him - such is His precious Love towards the undeserving.
OK Acts 7...
First off the detail we have about Stephens defence is amazing - I wonder how it was remembered so well...
It was at the point when Stephen switched from his OT survey to accusing them of Murdering the Righteous One that they were to repeat the the same abominable crime and murder another 'righteous one' as their fathers had.
Judaism had become the synagog of Satan and apposed the witness of God through faithful servants and continues to do so to this day.
Oh that the vail would be lifted and again Jews would see and believe as they once did. His love for the Jews has not changed. I note that there are many in Israel today that believe in Jesus but the cost of being a follower is very high.
Sadly it is pride that blinds and sadly the Jews had and have plenty of it, including Paul at the time. Yet Jesus loved Paul and appeared to him as He appeared to Peter who denied Him - such is His precious Love towards the undeserving.
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Was it just pride , I think they were blind to see the reality of what they had done. Jesus himself conveyed from the cross ‘ Father forgive them for they no not what they have done ‘
Stephen didn’t hold back with his words, full of conviction to say what was needed. Yet it didn’t convict, it angered. Pride certainly blocked them even considering that what was being said was valid.
These were Stephen’s brothers and fathers - his fellow Jews, Like the original ‘ Brotherly death ‘ it was anger that led to Abel being killed, so this anger equally led to death of a brother ( one of the ongoing themes throughout scripture ) This in turn led to people being scattered ………….( another ongoing theme )
Stephen didn’t hold back with his words, full of conviction to say what was needed. Yet it didn’t convict, it angered. Pride certainly blocked them even considering that what was being said was valid.
These were Stephen’s brothers and fathers - his fellow Jews, Like the original ‘ Brotherly death ‘ it was anger that led to Abel being killed, so this anger equally led to death of a brother ( one of the ongoing themes throughout scripture ) This in turn led to people being scattered ………….( another ongoing theme )
I was making the subtle distinction between 'paid' and 'supported' - contracted and committed - teacher and Father - institution and family.
I was thinking again about our first martyr falling prey to the religious Jews as Jesus did.
What seems way worse is when believers are martyred by the church !
Is this not a sign that we have a fundamental problem when this happens - Is there not in fact a pride in the church that took hold and blinded believers in a similar way ?
What seems way worse is when believers are martyred by the church !
Is this not a sign that we have a fundamental problem when this happens - Is there not in fact a pride in the church that took hold and blinded believers in a similar way ?
Power and status corrupts as well, we know that the religious leaders feared Jesus, they had been the ones holding the control. They felt threatened - with Jesus it was others who physically took Jesus life, with Stephen it was them.
Look at Englands dark history - the church once gain had the power and it used it.
Although it’s the ‘ Church ‘ verses ‘ The real church ( true body of believers )
@marks
This is a quote from the Catholic Encyclopedia
A stipend is a fixed pay, salary; retribution for work done; the income of an ecclesiastical living. In canon law stipend is a general designation of means of support (sustentatio congrua or congrua) provided for the clergy. In the early ages of the Church no special provision was made for the maintenance of the clergy. St. Paul, the tent-maker, set the example (1 Corinthians 4:12) of earning his own livelihood. In imitation of him many clerics worked at some craft or followed some profession, living by the labour of their own hands. Even in the fifth and sixth centuries there were bishops, priests, and deacons, who in keeping with the advice of the Fourth Council of Carthage (a. 398, cann. 52, 53) supported themselves by their own labour. Early legislation (Canon. Apost., can. 6), which forbade the clergy to take up certain occupations and professions, is an indication that clerics sought to maintain themselves. Many of the laity, however, even from the beginning, were quick to follow the instructions of Christ and his Apostles (Matthew 10:10; Luke 10:7; 1 Corinthians 9:13; 1 Timothy 5:17-18), founded on the practice in vogue among the Jews (Leviticus 27:30 sq.; Numbers 18:23 sq.; etc.), who gave tithes of all their goods and produce for the sustenance of priests and levites. Thus did the laity provide for the bodily welfare of the clergy in return for the spiritual gifts received through their ministry.
So it seems the 'first love' that sustained the early church leaders grew cold and the Jewish tradition of tithing took over the loving support of members. Later this became a paid position and here we are today.
From John to Ephesus
Revelation 2
4 But I have this against you, that you have left your first love. 5 Therefore remember from where you have fallen, and repent and do the deeds you did at first; or else I am coming to you and will remove your lampstand out of its place—unless you repent.
So it seems this 'support by love' was lost pretty early on.
This is a quote from the Catholic Encyclopedia
A stipend is a fixed pay, salary; retribution for work done; the income of an ecclesiastical living. In canon law stipend is a general designation of means of support (sustentatio congrua or congrua) provided for the clergy. In the early ages of the Church no special provision was made for the maintenance of the clergy. St. Paul, the tent-maker, set the example (1 Corinthians 4:12) of earning his own livelihood. In imitation of him many clerics worked at some craft or followed some profession, living by the labour of their own hands. Even in the fifth and sixth centuries there were bishops, priests, and deacons, who in keeping with the advice of the Fourth Council of Carthage (a. 398, cann. 52, 53) supported themselves by their own labour. Early legislation (Canon. Apost., can. 6), which forbade the clergy to take up certain occupations and professions, is an indication that clerics sought to maintain themselves. Many of the laity, however, even from the beginning, were quick to follow the instructions of Christ and his Apostles (Matthew 10:10; Luke 10:7; 1 Corinthians 9:13; 1 Timothy 5:17-18), founded on the practice in vogue among the Jews (Leviticus 27:30 sq.; Numbers 18:23 sq.; etc.), who gave tithes of all their goods and produce for the sustenance of priests and levites. Thus did the laity provide for the bodily welfare of the clergy in return for the spiritual gifts received through their ministry.
So it seems the 'first love' that sustained the early church leaders grew cold and the Jewish tradition of tithing took over the loving support of members. Later this became a paid position and here we are today.
From John to Ephesus
Revelation 2
4 But I have this against you, that you have left your first love. 5 Therefore remember from where you have fallen, and repent and do the deeds you did at first; or else I am coming to you and will remove your lampstand out of its place—unless you repent.
So it seems this 'support by love' was lost pretty early on.
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@Brakelite @amadeus @Azim @Pearl @Rita @Ritajanice @APAK @MA2444 @faithfulness @GTW27 @Berean @rockytopva @quietthinker @ScottA @marks @grace @Oneoff @Hillsage @VictoryinJesus @Angelina @seatts79 @GodsGrace
Dear friends,
I was in a car smash today but not injured Praise God...
We live close to the edge, and it was our only good car needed for work.
The car was slowly rolling uncontrollably down a slope and I managed to avoid hitting cars and people and in the moment avoided a gas main and a large plate glass window in a shop front but crashed into a concrete pillar.
I was in shock and we were surrounded by wonderful people with loving support - that was amazing - I will never forget it.
May we not miss any aspect of the blessing He intends to bring out of this tragic accident.
We live another day by His grace so Acts 8 will be next !!!
Dear friends,
I was in a car smash today but not injured Praise God...
We live close to the edge, and it was our only good car needed for work.
The car was slowly rolling uncontrollably down a slope and I managed to avoid hitting cars and people and in the moment avoided a gas main and a large plate glass window in a shop front but crashed into a concrete pillar.
I was in shock and we were surrounded by wonderful people with loving support - that was amazing - I will never forget it.
May we not miss any aspect of the blessing He intends to bring out of this tragic accident.
We live another day by His grace so Acts 8 will be next !!!
Pleased you are ok xxxx
I will pray that you will continue to feel okay as I know it can impact our bodies over the days that follow- be kind to yourself and rest as much as you can xxxx
I will pray that you will continue to feel okay as I know it can impact our bodies over the days that follow- be kind to yourself and rest as much as you can xxxx
Glad you were not injured. Keeping you and yours in prayer.
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