Amen. The bible just doesnt' teach us to find common ground with unbelievers. What it does say simply is that friendship with the world is enmity with God and that we are to come out from among unbelievers and not be unequally yoked with them, but be separate. In the world but not of it. People are filling their heads with the fillers of men talking, talking, talking, and it is all like sand in their eyes burying alive and clouding over the simple words of God which they need to LIVE and not DIE. Man shall not LIVE by bread alone but by every WORD that proceeds from the MOUTH OF GOD, not men (or women) in pulpits. Matter of life and death!
Amigo's Question and Answer Thread
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amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
any doctrine contrary to GOD is a doctrine i will not , and by the grace of GOD may i continue not too , heed but rather will
warn all to beware . The RCC was a disaster from its birth . ITS BIRTH did not occur on the day of pentcost either .
IT has long taught doctrine contrary too even the very PETER it claims was its first pope .
As far as the youth . i am seeing this huge movement within all denominations
that too is cliaming the youth and peoples are hungry for something other than what they THINK or were told the world gave the churches .
ONLY it came from the very harlot herself to make an appearnce as though its trying to bring them all back to
the original beginning .
NOW many anabaptists claimed the same
as do i claim the same . TO bring us back to the original teachings .
ONLY TODAY the many who lip it sure seem to contradict , AS DID the institutions , the very teachings of ORIGINAL JESUS
and apostels . IN OTHER WORDS they can lip the same thing i do
but rather than try and get them back into the BIBLE , hell they decieve them away from the bible
and act and play believe like the doctrines of the bible and reading it for ourselves IS THE PROBLEM .
WHEN IN TRUTH they only used bad seeds who may have claimed to adhere to original scrips , BUT NEVER DID
as the examples to use when trying to decieve them away from trusting IN SAID BIBLE . THAT I DO NOT DO .
MANY are infected with the false version of LETS RETURN to original christanity .
THEY pull folks away from trusting in said bible . WHEREAS i do all to get people back into SAID BIBLE .
Many will wail on the day of the LORD . and never forget satan can quoate the scrips too .
BUT he wants our trust in men , NOT GOD and not that BOOK . This lamb DONT HEED that one .
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
most never were washed by the water in the first place . THEY were washed all right but it was in
the intepreations of what men SAID about said bible and about said CHRIST .
and now in this last hour
the enemy has come to bring them to merge as one . OH HE KNOW how to do and what to say too .
HE can lip even what i do lip . what i mean is , HE can also say WE NEED A RETURN to the original church
its doctrines . ONLY HE and his men WONT preach n teach ALL THINGS the ORIGINAL ONES LEFT US IN SAID BIBLE .
IN fact he will use every bad seed known to man to try and show us that to simply read the bible for ourselves IS dangerous .
Rather than being truthful and honest , HE will use the wicked men like men gone wrong in times past
TO THEN Try and say , SEE THEY ALL THOUGHT THEY KNEW That bible , THEY ALL read it FOR THEMSELVES
and look at the evil they did .
HIMS a liar . By grace i did read it , and i too warn against them bad seeds , ONLY DIFFERENCE IS
I TRY TO DO ALL toget people back into the bible to read for themselves . HE does all to try and get one to NOT do so
but rather to trust in these lost men who through false love , teach a love that will lead them into rebellion against GOD
and damnation . THE DEVIL is wise sister . But the SHEEP , the sheep wont be heeding that voice or his men .
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
There is good reason as to why the apostels did warn and remind
There is good reason as to WHY GOD himself did warn and remind
As did the prophets
As did the SON
There is good reason as to why GOD first told adam ye shall NOT eat of the tree .
Every word of the LORD is good and its meant for the good of the hearer and does of said words .
Error must be quickly corrected within the church
leaven must quickly be purged out of the church .
Why .
Error begets ........................
a little leaven ........................................
THAT IS WHY . error will beget more error
and a little leaven WILL leaven the whole lump .
It has occured and it was left uncorrected and look what it does .
Doctrine matters . The WORD and words of GOD do matter .
The desire is for the good of man . But men often resist the Word and words of GOD .
And they do so unto their own destruction .
THERE is a reason why GOD said BE ye not unequally yoked together with unbeleivers .
Yet many now try and find common ground with them . That is and will prove to be a fatal mistake on their part .
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
What i am about to type you probably already know . But please allow it anyway .
I am going to give us a few fill in the blanks .
Error begets .....................
A little leaven ........................................
There is a serious reason why error and sin must be quickly corrected within any church
There is a serious reason as to why GOD said all things HE did say , and through the prophets
lastly through the SON on earth as well as from heaven .
As well as all the Spirit inspired words left to us in that bible .
GOD desires the death of none
And HE surely knows what will lead to the death and second death
and HE surely knows what GIVETH LIFE and LIFE ETERNAL .
That every word of GOD is meat for our soul .
Error begets ...................ERROR
A little leaven will LEAVEN THE WHOLE LUMP .
IF we do contrary to GOD , if we twist and omit scrips , then we do so unto our own destruction .
From page one to page end , I SEE THE SAME GOD at work throughout the entire pages of the bible .
GOD warns from the day of adam what to do and what not to do .
HE does so for one reason . HE desires not the death of man but rather life .
We see this even thorugh the prophets . WHY WILL YE DIE , REPENT , I Desire not the death of the wicked .
Yet many repented not and many died .
WE see this same essence at work in CHRIST , who even wept over JERUSALEM
and had warned all it will be better for sodom on the day of judmgent than for you , THOSE WHO DENY CHRIST .
WE see it in paul and others .
Paul wrote , saying how he even wept for them that were the enemies of Christ . YET he sure did rebuke and warn too .
SO DID THE FATHER , SO DID THE SON . too many folks are not beholding both the SERVERITY and GOODNESS of GOD .
THERE is a reason why GOD said not to be unequally yoked with unbelievers
AND YET today the mantra is becoming lets find COMMON GROUND . this will work to the destruction
of all as they certainly shall fall . We need to get back to being more grave and sincere .
And doing all we can by the power of HIS grace to INSTRUCT and to REMIND all of ALL THINGS HE DID TEACH .
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
I too have zero desire to heed calvin andto warn others .
As with the mormon and etc .
ITs not the people i do hate , ITS the deadly doctrines of men gone wrong
that i desire men to flee from and get back into the scrips for themselves .
Just cause one warns out against the deadly errors of the RCC , mormon , jw and etc
do not mean one hates the people at all . The doctrine disgusts me , but the people i desire good for
and thus i am gonna do all to try and persaude them to get out of said places
that teach such deadly doctrines . And mark my words , in every false place
from every false religoin and etc , THEY will speak truths as well , not all lies
BUT that is how they DECIEVE . and they will twist truths to support that which is not TRUE .
Agreed. There should be no common ground with the world.
Re the CC, let me say that it's not so much that it teaches incorrectly the word of God...
it certainly does not, but they have ADDED to the word of God and thus nullifies some of the teachings.
I won't get into it here, but, yes, some teachings detract from the word more than change it.
There are persons sitting in the pews that don't really understand what Christianity is all about because Mass is all milk and no meat.
But there are born again Catholics who believe exactly as you and I do but that have extra stuff added on that does upset me, but this is their religion and they are not leaving it.
So I do my best, in discussions, to stick to what the Word says and not what the church says.
I find this to be a problem in every church...
which is why I say that I cannot call myself a Catholic or a Protestant.
Don't know what I am....
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Then this is the end.This is my last response to you-
Jesus accepted prayers of praise and petition
Some might say that prayers of praise to Jesus are legitimate while prayers of petition are not. I will argue that Jesus accepted and still accepts both kinds of prayer. Take note of both in the examples shown below.
New Testament Christians everywhere praying to Jesus
According to the apostle Paul, New Testament Christians were everywhere praying to Jesus. “Paul. . . to the church of God in Corinth, to those sanctified in Christ Jesus and called to be holy, together with all those everywhere who call on3 the name of our Lord Jesus Christ—their Lord and ours (1 Corinthians 1:1–2).”4 It appears that Paul includes himself among those who called upon the name of Jesus. These prayers directed to Jesus were universal. And the present tense of “call” suggests that the prayers were on-going.5
Paul petitions Jesus to remove the “thorn in the flesh”
Paul also prayed to Jesus when he “besought the Lord” to remove his thorn in the flesh (2 Corinthians 12:8). Why do we believe that the reference to “the Lord” here refers to Jesus instead of the Father? In the Pauline epistles, the term “Lord” (kurios) usually signifies Jesus,6 while “God” usually denotes to the Father. And look at the response of Paul when the Lord said to him, “[My] strength is made perfect in your weakness” (2 Corinthians 12:9). Paul tells us that he would glory in his weakness that the “power of Christ” (the Lord) would be revealed in him. So the referent for “the Lord” is Jesus. Paul prayed to Jesus, and Jesus responded. Notice that these were prayers of petition, not praise. These were not spontaneous petitions or petitions given in response to the voice of the Lord or a vision, but a prayer prayed three times, as Paul persisted in his request to Jesus. If it were inappropriate for someone to offer supplication to Jesus, Paul would not have asked Jesus three times to answer a specific request. Jesus did not rebuke Paul for praying the prayer, but He did inform Paul that he was better off without the request being granted.
Other prayers of Paul
In 2 Thessalonians 2:16–17, Paul blessed the Thessalonians with these words: “May our Lord Jesus Christ himself and God our Father. . . encourage your hearts and strengthen you in every good deed and word.” Even though this benedictory prayer is in a different form than other prayers, it implies a request to Jesus (and the Father), and this suggests the legitimacy of prayer to Jesus.7 Paul expected Jesus to answer this request. A similar benedictory prayer (invoking the name of Jesus) is found in 1 Thessalonians 3:11–14.
The worship of Jesus
In the Gospels, Jesus was worshipped, and He accepted it (John 9:38). Surely this involved verbal communication to Jesus or prayer. The Gospels are not the only place where worship of Jesus occurs. The angels are told to worship Jesus.8 There is worship of Jesus (the Lamb) in Revelation by both angels and humans (Revelation 5:8–13).
Since all three members of the Trinity are God, then worship is due to each of them, collectively and individually, because of the nature of the Trinity. Worship involves praise and adoration. It would be wrong to discourage people from addressing each member of the Trinity in praise and adoration. God expects us to worship Jesus. The Jehovah’s Witnesses will not pray to Jesus because they think that He is not worthy of worship. We pray to Jesus because we know He is worthy of worship, and that He even demands worship. Jesus commanded us to honor the Son just as we honor the Father (John 5:23). If we fail to give praise to the Son in our prayers, as we give praise the Father, would we really be honoring the Son as we do the Father?
The early church recognized the importance of worshipping Jesus through prayer. In fact, when Athanasius made his case against Arianism in the early 300’s, he pointed out that Christians had prayed to Jesus from the beginning. Athanasius argued that if Jesus was not of the same substance as the Father (homoousios) and was instead only a creature—only of like substance with the Father (homoiousios), then Christians from the beginning would have been committing idolatry by praying to Jesus.9
Petitions to Jesus in the Gospels
In the Gospels, many people asked Jesus for miracles. In a survey of the New Testament, I counted at least seven distinct times when people cried out to Jesus for mercy, treating him as a divine person, and they expected an answer. Should not these requests be considered prayers? Surely, Christ’s departure into Heaven does not mean that his followers can no longer bring petitions to Him.
Other examples of prayers to Jesus
There are other examples of appropriate prayers to Jesus in the New Testament.10 Stephen prayed, “Lord Jesus, receive my Spirit” (Acts 7:59). At Paul’s conversion, he prayed to Jesus: “Lord, what wilt thou have me do?” (Acts 9:6). Ananias conversed with Jesus when Jesus spoke to him in a vision (Acts 9:10–14). And the very last prayer in the New Testament is addressed to Jesus by the Apostle John: “Even so come, Lord Jesus!” (Revelation 22:20). If it were wrong to petition Christ, John the inspired writer may have said, “Father, may the Son come.” But instead he gave us these words to also cry out to Jesus: “Even so, come!”
The last verse referred to may allude to the phrase, “Maranatha” (found in 1 Corinthians 16:22), which is usually translated as the petition, “Come, O Lord.” “Maranatha” is an Aramaic expression that originated before Christians had filtered throughout the Gentile community. It seems that very early on, the Christians were crying out to Jesus, “Come, O Lord!”11 This was a prayer of petition.
Jesus claimed that He will answer our petitions
A verse in John 14 strongly encourages prayers of petition to Jesus. Jesus said, “Whatever you ask in My name, that will I do, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If you ask Me anything in My name, I will do it.”12 Jesus here says that he would answer prayer when we asked him anything in his name. So Jesus authorizes us to address him in prayer when we come in his name—in his own authority, and in his will. And he promised that he would answer.
Prayers in the name of Jesus
Prayers to Jesus are permitted and encouraged by Christ’s teaching in John 14:14, and by any passage in which Jesus says that we are to pray in His name. When Jesus told us to pray in His name, He wasn’t asking us to use a particular phrase at the end of each of our prayers, though the expression “in Jesus’ name, Amen” is certainly appropriate, and God-honored. Jesus was actually asking us to come to God (therefore any member of the Trinity) in His authority. We have the right to come to God and receive grace and help because of who Christ is, what He did for us, and what He promised. He has given us “great and exceeding promises” (2 Peter 1:1–4) and when we come to God with our requests, we have been authorized to come in faith, believing that He will fulfill what He has promised.
Can We Pray to Jesus?
It is appropriate to pray to the Father directly; however, just because we are permitted to pray to the Father, doesn’t mean that we are not permitted to pray to the Son.answersingenesis.org
So your saying God can have a God????
Joh 20:17 Jesus *said to her, "Stop clinging to Me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father; but go to My brethren and say to them, 'I ascend to My Father and your Father, and My God and your God.'"
Rev 3:2 'Wake up, and strengthen the things that remain, which were about to die; for I have not found your deeds completed in the sight of My God.
Rev 3:12 'He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he will not go out from it anymore; and I will write on him the name of My God, and the name of the city of My God, the new Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God, and My new name.
Silly child....
Rev 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him
Who gave Him?
I have only begun to spank your false theological post!!! So post again and I will give you a real theological spanking!!!
Boo Hoo... SAYS YOU... He spankes me and I need some one to ban him for making me look like the spritual stupid... CHILD I am!
You can not be God AND THEN CLAIM TO HAVE ONE!!!!
SILLY CHILD!!!!
Your the type Joel Stein... sucks money from every day like... taking candy from a SPIRITUAL baby...!!! and you want me banned for showing you the Truth!!!
I made my point...at least you could try... just get premission form your Joel Stein type pastor... You better get premission or you will get banned for making your church along with you look stupid...
Think before you post....
Paul
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
Well you right about that my friend . most churches i know DO exactly that . they might preach some doctrines that are solid truth
but then by thier own precepts and doctrines THEY MAKE IT VOID .
guess what that means , THEY DEADLY AND THEY DANGEROUS and men got no business sitting under them .
As far as your last question
that said i dont know what i am . DO you love the truth in scripture , that JESUS , HIS DOCTRINE
the doctrine the apostels left us in said bible . DO YOU LOVE THAT
and does it bother you big time when men twist it . IF SO , YOU A LAMB PARDNER .
but watch out where you sit . IF you aint gonna correct them , then get out .
Correct them who teach n preach things contrary to the TRUE DOCTRINE that was first delivered by the TRUE MEN .
Our purpose is TO DO SO . TO EDIFY the church , not to be a co helper to its destruction
but rather for its edification . THEIR blind leading the blind everywhere now .
And also due to the fact that people do and can err , EVEN THAT NEEDS to be corrected .
Correction is not sin nor is it judgmental . ITS RIGHT and its love and its good for all that we do so .
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amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
PS joel ostein is false . just a friendly reminder . I dont hate the man but i do hate his false doctrine .
And due to the fact he has seduced many , HE must be warned against . Hims false . I sure pray he do repent
before its too late . but on that note we got a whole mess of wolves all over christendom now .
We bess BIBLE UP . to not completely understand is one thing , but TO DENY the diety of CHRIST , BE DEADLY dangerous .
I know it might seem a bit harder to grasp at first . BUT the key is
BELIEVE what was written .
for example IT DO SAY GOD WAS THE WORD and that the WORD did become flesh .
JESUS did not stop thomas from kneeling before HIM nor DId he correct him for saying MY LORD and MY GOD .
AND YES i do know JESUS said the FATHER IS Greater than I . HE did say I GO TO YOUR GOD and to MY GOD .
THE ESSENCE O GOD HE IS . The WORD of GOD HE IS , HE IS the alpha and omega .
HE IS THE WORD . And the WORD is GOD and is OF GOD . its his own essence .
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
If i went to the ocean and drew water out of it into a bucket .
TELL me is that water now different somehow to the ocean water just because its in a bucket .
NOPE .
SO TOO BE GOD and HIS ESSENCE , HIS WORD and HE .
Just cause that WORD became flesh dont mean the essence changed .
GOD saved us . not man . GOD . AND in the beginning was the WORD
and the WORD was with GOD and GOD IS THE WORD .
I AM ALPHA AND OMEGA . BOTH GOD THE FATHER and THE CHRIST THE SON USED THAT LINE .
Exactly . GOD IS HIS WORD and HIS WORD BE HE .
I don't know who Joel Stein is.
The above is rather childish...which must conform to your thinking method.
I care not for anything you have to say.
I'm sorry that you think you're Christian when it's necessary for a person to believe that Jesus is God in order to be defined as Christian.
I don't report persons BTW.
I'm perfectly capable of protecting myself from this type of silliness.
Read John 1:1 many times until you understand what it means.
If you don't understand what it means,,,,then you don't know the GOD OF THE BIBLE.
I won't be responding to you in any future post of yours.
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
trivia questoin and answer time .
IS there two spirits , the spirit of GOD and then another one which is the spirit of christ . NO SIR .
THE SPIRIT OF GOD IS THE SPIRIT OF CHRIST . same SPIRIT .
GOD , His words , HIS WORD is HIS OWN ESSENCE , its that simple .
GOD is HIS SPIRIT , HE IS HIS WORD . Aint that lovely . THUS JESUS did say as did THE FATHER
I AM ALPHA AND OMEGA . this cannot be denied . its very deadly and very dangerous to do so .
I KNOW it aint understood perhaps as clearly at first . BUt to DENY the DIETY of CHRIST is deadly dangerous .
SEE even when i first was reading the bible i did not UNDERSTAND how this could be
BUT STILL I BELEIVED what as written . AND THEN later one day in an instant the understanding
OF HOW this could be CAME TO ME .
Be a Man..... Nothing you said above responds to my post! .... Silly Child... Call on me to be banned.... But First I must spritually SPANK your theological thoughts on John 1:1... So Bend over !!!
John 1:1
I have another train of thought for you think about. Is what you're reading into John 1 mostly church tradition? For almost 400 years, we have a read John 1 through the eyes of the Catholic Church. (reinforcing the Trinity). In the New Testament, “the Word” (Logos) happens to be of the masculine gender. Therefore, it's pronoun -"he" in our English translations - is a matter of interpretation, not translation. Did John write concerning “the word” that “he” was in the beginning with God or did he write concerning “the word” that “it” was in the beginning with God? As already stated, in the NT Greek the logos or word is masculine noun. It is okay in English to use “he” to refer back to his masculine noun if there is good contextual reason to do so. But is there good reason to make “the word” a “he” here?
It is a fact that all English translations from the Greek before the King James version of 1611 actually read this way: (notice Him and He are now “It”).
Tyndale 1534:
Joh 1:1 In the beginnynge was the worde and the worde was with God: and the worde was God. 2 The same was in the beginnynge with God. 3 All thinges were made by it and with out it was made nothinge that was made. 4 In it was lyfe and the lyfe was ye lyght of men
Cranmer 1539
John 1:1 IN the begynnynge was the worde and the worde was wyth God: and God was the worde. 2 The same was in the begynnyng with God. 3 All thynges were made by it and without it, was made nothynge that was made. 4 In it was lyfe and the lyfe was the lyght of men
Bishops 1568:
Joh 1:1 In the begynnyng was the worde, & the worde was with God: and that worde was God. 2 The same was in the begynnyng with God. 3 All thynges were made by it: and without it, was made nothyng that was made. 4 In it was lyfe, and the lyfe was the lyght of men,
Geneva 1587:
Joh 1:1 In the beginning was that Word, and that Word was with God, and that Word was God. 2 This same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by it, and without it was made nothing that was made. 4 In it was life, and that life was the light of men.
And now our modern Concordant Literal Version:
Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the word, and the word was toward God, and God was the word. " 2 This was in the beginning toward God. 3 All came into being through it, and apart from it not even one thing came into being which has come into being." 4 In it was life, and the life was the light of men."
The word logos appears many, many more times in this very Gospel of John. And nowhere else do the translators capitalize it or use the masculine personal pronoun "he" to agree with it !
The rest of the New Testament is the same. Logos is variously translated as "statement"
(Luke 20:20), “question" (Matt 21:24), "preaching" (1 Tim 5:17), "command" (Gal 5:14), "message" (Luke 4:32), "matter" (Acts 15:6), "reason" (Acts 10:29), so there is actually no reason to make John one say that "the Word" is the person Jesus himself, unless of course the translators are wanting to make a point to. In all cases logos is an “it.”
In the light of this background it is far better to read John's prologue to mean that in the beginning God had a plan, a dream, a grand vision for the world, a reason by which He brought all things into being. This word or plan was expressive of who he is.
"The Word" for John is an “it” not a "he." On one occasion, Jesus is given the name "the word of God" and this is in Revelations 19:13. This name has been given to him after his resurrection and ascension, but we will not find it before his birth. It is not until we come to verse 14 of John's prologue that this logos becomes personal and becomes the son of God, Jesus. "And the Word became flesh." A great plan that God had in his heart from before the creation at last is fulfilled. Be very clear that it does not say that God became flesh.
There is even strong evidence suggesting that John himself reacted to those who were already misusing his gospel to mean that Jesus was himself the Word who had personally preexist the world. When later he wrote his introduction to...
1 John, he clearly made the point that what was in the beginning was not a “who” he put it this way: "What was from the beginning, what we have heard, what we have seen with our eyes, what we beheld and our hands handled, concerning the word of life…"
Logos - This word is translated in English as "Word". This word has an actual meaning which has been almost completely lost due to the Greek philosophical interpretation of John 1:1-3 & 14.
who testified to the word of God and to the testimony of Jesus Christ, even to all that he saw. (Rev 1:2)
"I also saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their testimony to Jesus and for the word (logos) of God." (Rev 20:4)
Notice that they were beheaded for their testimony to Jesus AND for the logos of God.
Jesus and the word of God are not the same thing.
John 12:48 "He who rejects Me and does not receive My sayings, has one (God) who judges him; the word ( logos ) I spoke is what will judge him at the last day.
Again… Jesus spoke the Logos, as He is not the Logos! So who is the Logos? The very next verse tell us!
Joh 12:49 "For I did not speak on My own initiative, but the Father Himself who sent Me has given Me a commandment as to what to say and what to speak.
Pay attention....
Act 17:30 "Therefore having overlooked the times of ignorance, God is now declaring to men that all people everywhere should repent, 31 because He ( God) has fixed a day in which He will judge the world in righteousness through a Man whom He has appointed, having furnished proof to all men by raising Him from the dead."
Word of God in this verse means God's plan of salvation for us (NAB), i.e. the kingdom of God message. So what does "logos" mean?
Logos - 1. Denotes an internal reasoning process, plan, or intention, as well as an external word. 2. The expression of thought. As embodying a conception or idea (New American Bible (footnote) & Vine’s Expository Dictionary).
According to Liddell and Scott Greek Lexicon, it also means:
Logos - the inward thought which is expressed in the spoken word.
I will give you a brief paraphrase of John 1:1-3 using the definitions for "logos:"
"In the beginning was God's plan, will, or idea for our salvation. It was present in his mind, and God's plan or will possessed all the attributes of God."
The very Trinitarian Roman Catholic New American Bible has this comment on this verse:
"Lack of a definite article with "God" in Greek signifies predication rather than identification."
Predication - to affirm as a quality or attribute (Webster's Dictionary).
So how does the Word (logos) become flesh in John 1:14? Let me use an example which most of us can relate to. We are all familiar with the expression, "was this baby planned?" Let's say it was planned. You and your wife had a plan to have a baby. You had a logos, a plan. Your plan (logos) became flesh the day that your baby was born. In the same way, God's plan of salvation for us became a reality, became flesh, when Jesus was born. This verse is probably one of the biggest culprits in the creation of the trinity. The reason being that to someone educated in Greek philosophy such as the early church fathers of the 3rd, 4th, and 5th, centuries, logos had an entirely different meaning. Tertullian who was responsible for much of the creation of the trinity was a Stoic lawyer. The Stoics defined "logos" as the "divine principle of life." Which is basically a definition of God. With this definition you are going to arrive at a completely different interpretation than what John intended. You will interpret it something like this:
"In the beginning was the divine principle of life, and the divine principle of life was with God, and the divine principle of life was God. Then, the divine principle of life became flesh."
With this definition you arrive at the conclusion that the divine principle of life, which is God, became flesh. Now you have God's essence in two places at once. The explanation for this obvious problem came in the form of the Doctrine of the Trinity. Then you have God's essence in flesh, so the description of Jesus becomes that he is fully God and fully man. These concepts come straight out of Greek philosophy. Greek philosophers believed that man was composed of flesh and a divine spark.
John 12:48 "He who rejects Me and does not receive My sayings, has one who judges him; the word ( logos ) I spoke is what will judge him at the last day.
Again… Jesus spoke the Logos, He is not the Logos!
Deal with it!
Paul
Here's the translation for John 1:1
IN THE BEGINNING WAS THE LOGOS
AND THE LOGOS WAS WITH GOD
AND GOD WAS THE LOGOS.
Those old translations were so badly translated....
And the Trinity....
You must hate that too.
Many believe as the other member does.
I'm too tired to deal with it.
And he's too insulting.
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