What is the purpose of infant baptism?

[Truther]

You should argue with Jesus about this.

Jesus taught that His disciples were to baptize others in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit (Matthew 28:19).

A person who is baptized in Jesus' name is someone who has believed in Jesus as Savior. This shortened version stated in Acts 2 and 4 did not negate what Jesus taught, but rather emphasized salvation exclusively in Jesus. The practice of the early church was to baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Spirit as Jesus taught, emphasizing the Triune nature of God.




If that were actually true they would cease from praying to / talking to those that have died physically and have been separated from this world we are still living in.

Catholics are not Christians, they are not born again, and they are not going to Heaven.

That's because they follow man made catholic doctrine rather than what the Lord teaches in His Word.





You're not God, so you have zero contact with those separated from this world.

The sad thing is... you people reject Jesus as being the ONLY mediator between God and man... so you folks out calling on others when you should be praying directly to ther Father in Jesus Name as the Lord instructed His followers to do.

The catholics do not follow Jesus, instead they follow man made doctrine that is not of God.

What is the name of the son that Jesus commanded his disciples to be baptized in per Matt 28:19?

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

You should argue with Jesus about this.

Jesus taught that His disciples were to baptize others in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit (Matthew 28:19).

A person who is baptized in Jesus' name is someone who has believed in Jesus as Savior. This shortened version stated in Acts 2 and 4 did not negate what Jesus taught, but rather emphasized salvation exclusively in Jesus. The practice of the early church was to baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Spirit as Jesus taught, emphasizing the Triune nature of God.




If that were actually true they would cease from praying to / talking to those that have died physically and have been separated from this world we are still living in.

Catholics are not Christians, they are not born again, and they are not going to Heaven.

That's because they follow man made catholic doctrine rather than what the Lord teaches in His Word.





You're not God, so you have zero contact with those separated from this world.

The sad thing is... you people reject Jesus as being the ONLY mediator between God and man... so you folks out calling on others when you should be praying directly to ther Father in Jesus Name as the Lord instructed His followers to do.

The catholics do not follow Jesus, instead they follow man made doctrine that is not of God.

TRANSLATION:
Origen and Cyprian were heretics because they disagree with my private man made traditions.

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

You should argue with Jesus about this.

Jesus taught that His disciples were to baptize others in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit (Matthew 28:19).

A person who is baptized in Jesus' name is someone who has believed in Jesus as Savior. This shortened version stated in Acts 2 and 4 did not negate what Jesus taught, but rather emphasized salvation exclusively in Jesus. The practice of the early church was to baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Spirit as Jesus taught, emphasizing the Triune nature of God.




If that were actually true they would cease from praying to / talking to those that have died physically and have been separated from this world we are still living in.

Catholics are not Christians, they are not born again, and they are not going to Heaven.

That's because they follow man made catholic doctrine rather than what the Lord teaches in His Word.





You're not God, so you have zero contact with those separated from this world.

The sad thing is... you people reject Jesus as being the ONLY mediator between God and man... so you folks out calling on others when you should be praying directly to ther Father in Jesus Name as the Lord instructed His followers to do.

The catholics do not follow Jesus, instead they follow man made doctrine that is not of God.

Some object that the Catholic position on intercessory prayer is the same as necromancy, that is, calling upon the spirits of the dead to find out the future or obtain other information. Necromancy is a grave sin that, far from fostering communion, shows a lack of faith and trust in God. Necromancy was punishable by death under the Mosaic law (Lev. 19:31, 20:6). Some of the early Israelites practiced necromancy, including Saul (1 Sam. 28:3, 8-14), and they were punished severely for doing so (1 Sam. 28:17-19). This practice offended God (2 Kings 21:6) and led to the destruction of Israel.

Catholics do not practice necromancy, which is explicitly forbidden by the Church (cf. Catechism, nos. 2115-17). Rather, they ask for the prayers of the saints to foster communion in the Family of God.

Seeking the intercession of the saints is not necromancy for two reasons:

First, necromancers are usually trying to receive information that they do not have, such as what will happen in the future. Asking the saints to pray for us, however, is not a form of divination or fortune telling.

Second, necromancers are also trying to bring back and control the souls of dead people. Catholics, on the contrary, believe that those who have died in God’s grace are not dead but truly alive, and are able to help us by their prayers. As Jesus says, “[Moses] calls the Lord the God of Abraham and the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob. Now he is not the God of the dead, but of the living; for all live to him” (Lk. 20:37-38).

According to Jesus, death cannot separate the faithful—such as Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob—from God. And, if they are alive to God, they must be alive to us through Him as members of His one body. Otherwise, contrary to what Saint Paul says, Christ’s victory over death was incomplete, and His body is not truly one (cf. Jn.17:21; 1 Cor. 12: 12,13; 15:14 et al).

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

Dan Clarkston does the same thing as Joseph Geobbles, Hitler's Minister of Propaganda, by repeating the same lies over and over again.

Dan's church:



CATHOLICS ARE NOT CHRISTIANS!!!

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

Dan Clarkston does the same thing as Joseph Geobbles, Hitler's Minister of Propaganda, by repeating the same lies over and over again.

Dan's church:

View attachment 48462

CATHOLICS ARE NOT CHRISTIANS!!!

No, wait.... Dan has no church and no pastor. The root of his degree of anti-Catholicism is self hatred.

 

[Marymog]

Or, like myself, @Taken doesn't wish to waste his time arguing with you over nonsensical personal issues.

Better to use the time to discuss what the church got wrong.

Notice I spelled church correctly.
It's something the CC actually teaches, but apparently,
you STILL don't know the difference.
No matter.

You crack me up GG. You don't want to "waste his time arguing.... over nonsensical personal issues" but you continually argue over nonsensical personal issues!

OK...Lets move on!!


Let's discuss "what the church got wrong". But first, I need to know which church you are talking about. Baptist? Methodist? Lutheran? Catholic? Orthodox? etc etc

Mary

 

[Marymog]

[QUOTE="Marymog, post: 1880645, member: 7405"

I don't know what you mean by speaking for you. That makes no sense. I have challenged you to prove your accusations against me. You failed!

Taken said:
Lie. Not once have I said, I was taught by Protestant men.




You ask a question to me, then answer FOR me….IS you speaking FOR me what I never Claimed.

My forum name is not “Kiddo”.

One example is sufficient.

Your posts are full of you speaking for others and calling members names other than their forum names.

I have never claimed Protestant men or Catholic men are MY Teachers.

I have expressly claimed Christ Jesus IS my Teacher.

Example.

Apt 18, 2024 Taken quote:

“And Personally, Christ Jesus IS my high Priest and my Teacher and my FULL Trust is in Him, not human men appointed by human men.”

Glory to God,
Taken

LOL...hold on....HOLD ON @Taken

Me calling you "kiddo" is a SUFFICIENT EXAMPLE of me calling you by something other than your forum name?

Talk about grasping at straws..........you fit that definition to a tea

OK.....I am sorry that calling you kiddo hurt your feelings and I apologize for hurting your feelings. It is a common response from me to MULTIPLE MEMBERS on this forum. Go ahead....do a search for kiddo under my username and you will see that I am being truthful.

Mary

PS: BTW are you going to address your statement that we are not friends and my rebuttal to it? You know the rebuttal I am talking about....where I showed you that Scripture teaches OPPOSITE of what you said?

 

[Marymog]

Catholics follow Jesus.
Unfortunately, they've made up some doctrine that is not biblical.
But so have other denominations.
They shouldn't be demonized for it.

Hey GG,

What criteria do you use to determine if a church has biblical doctrine?

Curious Mary

 

[Marymog]

We had all the teachings we needed in the first 300 years after Jesus ascended.
The church should not have made any changes.
This is my belief.

Hey GG,

What source do you use to learn these "teachings"? Is one of your sources the Apostolic Fathers?

Also, you say "The church shouldn't have made any changes". What church are you talking about?

Curious Mary

 

[Taken]

It is a common response from me to MULTIPLE MEMBERS on this forum.

OK.....I am sorry that calling you kiddo hurt your feelings and I apologize for hurting your feelings.



Mary

You are not my friend.
You have not the consideration or power to “hurt” my feelings.
I pointed out your disrespect.
You pointed our your laughing insincere apology.

PS: BTW are you going to address your statement that we are not friends …

Your wanting, wondering is insignificant and waste of my time.

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

You are not my friend.
You have not the consideration or power to “hurt” my feelings.
I pointed out your disrespect.
You pointed our your laughing insincere apology.



Your wanting, wondering is insignificant and waste of my time.

Then stop wasting everyone's time, get back to the topic, and prove Origen and Cyprian were not Christians. Clues of what the early church believed and practiced is found in post #1374.

 

[Taken]

Then stop wasting everyone's time, get back to the topic, and prove Origen and Cyprian were not Christians. Clues of what the early church believed and practiced is found in post #1374.

I never commented on Origen or Cyprian, their philosophies, their teaching, their writings or their beliefs…OF WHICH has ZERO affect on me.

Demanding anyone prove some random men who lived nearly two thousand ago were or were not Christians is MOOT, and NOT the topic of this thread.

Whose time are you wasting by your deflections as you complain?

 

[GodsGrace]

As usual, your post is filled LIES and false accusations.

I have never accused ANYONE of being “unsaved”. I DO on occasion accuse people of being malicious and dishonest – like YOU . . .

If you’re looking for a church that exactly resembles the first century Church – you are ignorantly barking up the wrong tree.

Christ’s Church went from being an acorn to the mighty oak – the mustard seed to the largest of plants (Matt. 13:31-32).

Jesus told the leaders of His Church: “Whatever YOU BIND on earth will be bound in Heaven; whatever YOU LOOSE on earth will be loosed in Heaven (Matt. 16:19, 18:18).

He told them: “But when he comes, the Spirit of truth, he will guide you to ALL truth. He will not speak on his own, but he will speak what he hears, and will declare to YOU the things that are coming" (John 16:13-14).

He will glorify me, because he will TAKE from what is MINE and declare it to YOU” (John 16:13-14).

Infants were ALWAYS Baptized in the Early Church – before and after Augustine.

Augustine didn’t “invent” Infant Baptism – He explained it. The Church has never changed its position ono this.
You're just so used to vomiting out LIE after LIE that you're beginning to actually believe yourself . . . that

The above is a wonderful post written by a wonderful Christian.

HOWEVER,
You still have not explained WHY infants were baptized BEFORE, in the early churhc,
and they WHY they were baptized after the 5th century - after Augustine.


And, I NEVER said that infants were not baptized in the early church.
YOU LIE Bread.

You must LIE a lot so you think everyone does.

Please show WHERE I stated that infants were not baptized in the early church.....

BECAUSE I KNOW THEY WERE.

But, unlike yourself, I KNOW WHY.

Is the problem that you can't even find out?

 

[GodsGrace]

I’m not sure that you ARE a “fellow brother in Christ”.
A fellow brother in Christ wouldn’t LIE about or misrepresent what we believe

If you truly were a fellow brother in Christ – we wouldn’t be having this conversation because I would never have had to rebuke you for attacking His Church . . .

In the above thread you state that someone is NOT A BROTHER N CHRSIT.

IF a person is NOT a brother in Christ...
then WHAT IS HE?

The above is stating that the other member, not being a brother in Christ,
is therefore NOT BORN AGAIN...
NOT SAVED.

As I've stated it is not up TO YOU to decide if someone is saved or not.
it's up to GOD.

AND
I also suggested you read CCC 1271 but I see that you haven't done that either....
or you'd never state such nonsesnse.

You LIE continually.

 

[BreadOfLife]

You were not baptized as a baby in the name of Jesus.

Your sins remain via absence of His name and immersion in water.

Don’t try to tell me you remember.

I certainly WAS Baptized “in the name of” (by the AUTHORITY of) Jesus Christ per His explcit instructions n Matt. 28:19.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Show me a verse in the Bible where someone was baptized with the titles Father or Holy Ghost.

There is not a SINGLE Biblical example with the words of Baptism being spoken over someone being Baptized.
For that – we have to go directly to Jesus’s instructions in Matt 28:18.

As I said before – YOU need to obey the Master . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Are you going to explain
WHY infants were baptized in the early church
and
WHY they were baptized after Augustine?

It would be nice since you know so much.
Thanks.

As I educated you before – the Church has ALWAYS Baptized infants and children – before AND after Augustine.

We see in the NT that “entire “households” (Acts 16:33; 1 Cor. 1:16).

Even ONE believing parent in a household renders the children and an unbelieving spouse “holy” (1 Cor. 7:14) – and THAT’S why everybody living there was Baptized based on the faith of the ONE parent (Cornelius, Stephanas, Philippian Jailer).

The Church has ALWAYS believed in Original Sin. because the BIBLE teaches it. But it wasn’t until Augustine that it was explained so fully. As I taught you earlier, he didn’t “invent” the idea . . .

Psalm 51:5
Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me..

Romans 5:12
Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to ALL men because ALL sinned

Hermas
“‘They had need,’ [the Shepherd] said, ‘to come up through the water, so that they might be made alive; for they could not otherwise enter into the kingdom of God, except by putting away the mortality of their former life. These also, then, who had fallen asleep, received the seal of the Son of God, and entered into the kingdom of God. For,’ he said, ‘before a man bears the name of the Son of God, he is dead. But when he receives the seal, he puts mortality aside and receives life. The seal, therefore, is the water [of baptism]. They go down into the water [spiritually] dead, and come out of it alive’” (The Shepherd 9:16:2).

Theophilus of Antioch
“For the first man, disobedience resulted in his expulsion from paradise. It was not as if there were any evil in the tree of knowledge; but from disobedience man drew labor, pain, grief, and, in the end, he fell prostrate in death” (Ad Autolycus 2:25 [A.D. 181]).’

Irenaeus
“But this man . . . is Adam, if the truth be told, the first-formed man. . . . We, however, are all from him; and as we are from him, we have inherited his title [of sin]” (Against Heresies 3:23:2 [inter A.D. 180-190]).’

Tertullian
“On account of his [Adam’s] transgression man was given over to death; and the whole human race, which was infected by his seed, was made the transmitter of condemnation” (The Testimony of the Soul 3:2 [inter A.D. 197-200]).

Origen
“The Church received from the apostles the tradition of giving baptism even to INFANTS [Matt. 19:14; Luke 18:15-16; Acts 2:38-39]. For the apostles, to whom were committed the secrets of divine mysteries, knew that there is in everyone the innate stain of sin, which must be washed away through water and the Spirit”
[Titus 3:5] (Commentaries on Romans 5:9 [A.D. 244]).

 

[BreadOfLife]

The above is a wonderful post written by a wonderful Christian.

HOWEVER,
You still have not explained WHY infants were baptized BEFORE, in the early churhc,
and they WHY they were baptized after the 5th century - after Augustine.

And, I NEVER said that infants were not baptized in the early church.
YOU LIE Bread.

You must LIE a lot so you think everyone does.

Please show WHERE I stated that infants were not baptized in the early church.....

BECAUSE I KNOW THEY WERE.

But, unlike yourself, I KNOW WHY.

Is the problem that you can't even find out?

Show me where I said that YOU didn’t believe that infants were Baptized in the Early Church.

Until then – stop with the LYING and FALSE accusations . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

In the above thread you state that someone is NOT A BROTHER N CHRSIT.

IF a person is NOT a brother in Christ...
then WHAT IS HE?

OUTSIDE of the Body of Christ.

The above is stating that the other member, not being a brother in Christ,
is therefore NOT BORN AGAIN...
NOT SAVED.

As I've stated it is not up TO YOU to decide if someone is saved or not.
it's up to GOD.

AND
I also suggested you read CCC 1271 but I see that you haven't done that either....
or you'd never state such nonsesnse.

You LIE continually.

WRONG.

I never said that you weren’t a brother/sister in Christ.
I never said that you weren’t saved.

I said that I wasn’t sure if you were – but you vomit out LIES as easily as you draw breath . . .

 

[Taken]

The above is a wonderful post written by a wonderful Christian.

HOWEVER,
You still have not explained WHY infants were baptized BEFORE, in the early churhc,
and they WHY they were baptized after the 5th century - after Augustine.


And, I NEVER said that infants were not baptized in the early church.
YOU LIE Bread.

You must LIE a lot so you think everyone does.

Please show WHERE I stated that infants were not baptized in the early church.....

BECAUSE I KNOW THEY WERE.

But, unlike yourself, I KNOW WHY.

Is the problem that you can't even find out?

Some have a set narrative they repeat over and over to ad nauseam….

* They begin with the long rant of how despicable the other is…
* Followed by how perfect they are…
* Followed by “their church” IS the ancient church Christ Jesus established.

First of all Christ Jesus’ Church was established BY a JEW, The ROCK Foundation of HIS CHURCH, and His teaching TO Jews FOR Jews, who were sent to Jewish Synagogue's to Teach Jews AND any Gentiles electing to attend their meeting IN a Synagogue.

Bottom Line…Strength in numbers…can easily be manipulated that groups in LARGE numbers…is sufficient to make … LARGE numbers MEANS upstanding. That is a long standing underlying intent of a Catholic narrative.

Except that, the truth IS Christ’s Church was NOT established FOR Gentiles to LEAD… rather FOR Jews…which from the very beginning, with Hebrews, then the Tribes of Israel TO BE Gods mouth piece to the rest of the WORLD…of Gentiles.

Prov 4:
[14] Enter not into the path of the wicked, and go not in the way of evil men.

Matt 10:
[5] These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
[6] But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

I find NOTHING whatsoever where God Himself expressly CHOSE Gentiles to be the Jews Teacher.

God Bless you,

Glory to God,
Taken