Oops, the Deacon's Son is Gay

[Arthur81]

The scenario, the young man is said to be cohabiting with another young man. When questioned by the Pastor, the young man replies, "If it is any of your business, I have always been attracted to other males, emotionally, romantically and sexually. I have never had such feelings for a female, and in fact I find it repulsive to imagine sexual intercourse with a female. Now, God himself said it was not good that man be alone, so who are you to condemn me? Is there any verse that condemns me for this loving relationship? NO!"

By what authority does anyone possess to claim ability to read the mind of the young man and tell him it was his choice, and he can change by choosing. What use is it to blather on about LGBTQ, gays, or active and passive homosexuality? No one knows why 3-4% or so of males have this loving attraction. By what right does anyone tell him he needs to be cured, or that he needs a conversion by God, to love females? Frankly, such judging appears to be forbidden by God's word.

It is only our own spirit within us that knows all about us; in the same way, only God's Spirit knows all about God. (1Cor 2:11 GNB92)

The heart knows its own bitterness, and in its joy a stranger has no part. (Prov 14:10 REB)

The heart is devious above all else; it is perverse— who can understand it? (Jer 17:9 NRSV) *The heart of the one judging is devious too!

A person’s whole conduct may be right in his own eyes, but the Lord weighs up his motives. (Prov 21:2 REB)

None of us can see our own errors; deliver me, LORD, from hidden faults! (Ps 19:12 GNB92)

Make it your aim to live a quiet life, to mind your own business, and to earn your own living, just as we told you before. (1Thess 4:11 GNB92)

If you suffer, it must not be because you are a murderer or a thief or a criminal or a meddler in other people's affairs. (1Pet 4:15 GNB92)

“Do not judge others, so that God will not judge you, for God will judge you in the same way you judge others, and he will apply to you the same rules you apply to others. Why, then, do you look at the speck in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the log in your own eye? (Matt 7:1-3 GNB92)
Thayer - to pronounce judgment; to subject to censure; of those who judge severely (unfairly), finding fault with this or that in others, Mat 7:1; Luk 6:37; Rom 2:1; τινα, Rom 2:1; Rom 2:3; Rom 14:3, 10,13

Who are you to judge the servants of someone else? It is their own Master who will decide whether they succeed or fail. And they will succeed, because the Lord is able to make them succeed. (Rom 14:4 GNB92)

God is the only lawgiver and judge. He alone can save and destroy. Who do you think you are, to judge someone else? (Jas 4:12 GNB92) Thayer - hence equivalent to to condemn: Rom 2:27; Jas 4:11 f.

 

[Windmill Charge]

Actually Corinthians 6:9-11New King James Version
9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor [a]homosexuals, nor sodomites, 10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were [c]sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.

If the young man was attending church,, then the pastor had every right to talk to him about his behaviour/cohabiting with a ma.

As for judging others, it is something we do all the time.
The biblical requirements are to be subject to the same standard and to judge rightly.

 

[JohnDB]

And where it likely will not be popular....time for the deacon to step down or disassociate his son.

Thems the choices.

A deacon should manage his family well. And since a homosexual son is a definite sign of not managing his family well....nothing left but to get to it.

Excuses?
Everyone has them with extra to spare for giving them to everyone. But scriptures are the plumb line. Anything outside of it is wrong.

 

[BlessedPeace]

Beware those who call evil good and good evil.


Beware too those who call Sin acceptable and redemption out of the question.


Oops,the Deacon's son is damned to Hell.
Because,if it's anyone's business,he's always been attracted to that.

 

[Jack]

Actually Corinthians 6:9-11New King James Version
9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, 10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.

Amen Jesus!

 

[Jack]

What use is it to blather on about LGBTQ, gays, or active and passive homosexuality?

Jude 1:22-23
22 And on some have compassion, making a distinction;
23 but others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire,

 

[Windmill Charge]

Amen Jesus!

This is not something to rejoice in, as precious souls are being miss lead, deceived and lied to, to cause them to walk away from a saving knowledge of Jesus.

 

[Jack]

This is not something to rejoice in, as precious souls are being miss lead, deceived and lied to, to cause them to walk away from a saving knowledge of Jesus.

Who's rejoicing?

 

[Arthur81]

The replies I am reading on this thread show the Pharisaical attitude of too many self-professing Christians in this day.

 

[Wrangler]

And where it likely will not be popular....time for the deacon to step down or disassociate his son.

Thems the choices.

A deacon should manage his family well. And since a homosexual son is a definite sign of not managing his family well....nothing left but to get to it.

I don't agree, especially since it appears the son is now an adult and living on his own. One should not hold the father guilty for the sins of the son.

 

[Scott Downey]

God condemned all homosexual activity in both old and new testaments.
It was one of the reasons God destroyed the cities of the plain, Sodom etc...

Nothing in the NT took away that condemnation of sexual immorality.

 

[Jericho]

Let's play the substitution game:

The scenario, the young man is said to be cohabiting with another young man's wife. When questioned by the Pastor, the young man replies, "If it is any of your business, I have always been attracted to the other man's wife, emotionally, romantically and sexually. I have never had such feelings for my wife, and in fact I find it repulsive to imagine sexual intercourse with my wife. Now, God himself said it was not good that man be alone, so who are you to condemn me? Is there any verse that condemns me for this loving relationship? NO!"

Would that make sense? A Christian wouldn't excuse adultery or other sexual sins (or at least they shouldn't), yet for some reason, homosexuality is the only sin that some "Christians" feel the need to excuse.

Is there any verse that condemns me for this loving relationship?

There are plenty of verses that would condemn that kind of relationship.

No one knows why 3-4% or so of males have this loving attraction.

More like lust and unnatural affection. If someone is attracted to children, would that make it right? Would you call that loving? The same argument could certainly be applied.

Frankly, such judging appears to be forbidden by God's word.

Telling the truth is not judging, and we are allowed to judge our own.

"What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside?" (1 Co 5:12)

“Do not judge others, so that God will not judge you, for God will judge you in the same way you judge others, and he will apply to you the same rules you apply to others. Why, then, do you look at the speck in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the log in your own eye? (Matt 7:1-3 GNB92)

This verse is not a condemnation of judging, its about hypocrisy, juding someone for something they themselves are guilty of.

 

[Jack]

The replies I am reading on this thread show the Pharisaical attitude of too many self-professing Christians in this day.

Self professing? That sounds just like gays who profess to be Christians. Jesus said they are not Christians.

 

[Arthur81]

I see two replies that have quoted the NKJV which reads as follows:

"Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor [a]homosexuals, nor sodomites..."

[a] 1 Corinthians 6:9 catamites, those submitting to homosexuals
Corinthians 6:9 male homosexuals

The KJV reads - "nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind"

There is no variation or question about the manuscripts behind these two terms, malakos & arsenokoites, so can either of those quoting the NKJV like to justify why they chose the NKJV over the KJV? We know what the KJV meant by using the 1828 Websters -

EFFEMINATE, a. [L. effoeminatus, from effoeminor, to grow or make womanish, from foemina, a woman. See Woman.]
1. Having the qualities of the female sex; soft or delicate to an unmanly degree; tender; womanish; voluptuous.
The king, by his voluptuous life and mean marriage, became effeminate, and less sensible of honor.

There is nothing resembling homosexuals in that definition of effeminate.

ABUSER, n. One who abuses, in speech or behavior; one that deceives; a ravisher; a sodomite. 1 Cor 6.

RAVISHER, n.
1. One that takes by violence.
2. One that forces a woman to his carnal embrace.

The KJV "abusers of themselves with mankind" is clearly called a "sodomite" in the Websters and goes on to define a sodomite. I can justify my choice of the KJV over the NKJV, can anyone give a solid reason that causes such a drastic switch in meaning from the KJV to the NKJV?
I can only believe it is homophobia because I have as yet NOT seen any persuasive argument to support the NKJV. But at least, someone quoted a translation, rather than just giving their hateful opinion.

The 2021 NRSV Updated Edition has the following footnotes on this verse:

malakos "Meaning of GK uncertain"
arsenokoites "Meaning of GK uncertain"

 

[Jack]

I see two replies that have quoted the NKJV which reads as follows:

"Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor [a]homosexuals, nor sodomites..."

[a] 1 Corinthians 6:9 catamites, those submitting to homosexuals
Corinthians 6:9 male homosexuals

The KJV reads - "nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind"

There is no variation or question about the manuscripts behind these two terms, malakos & arsenokoites, so can either of those quoting the NKJV like to justify why they chose the NKJV over the KJV? We know what the KJV meant by using the 1828 Websters -

EFFEMINATE, a. [L. effoeminatus, from effoeminor, to grow or make womanish, from foemina, a woman. See Woman.]
1. Having the qualities of the female sex; soft or delicate to an unmanly degree; tender; womanish; voluptuous.
The king, by his voluptuous life and mean marriage, became effeminate, and less sensible of honor.

There is nothing resembling homosexuals in that definition of effeminate.

ABUSER, n. One who abuses, in speech or behavior; one that deceives; a ravisher; a sodomite. 1 Cor 6.

RAVISHER, n.
1. One that takes by violence.
2. One that forces a woman to his carnal embrace.

The KJV "abusers of themselves with mankind" is clearly called a "sodomite" in the Websters and goes on to define a sodomite. I can justify my choice of the KJV over the NKJV, can anyone give a solid reason that causes such a drastic switch in meaning from the KJV to the NKJV?
I can only believe it is homophobia because I have as yet NOT seen any persuasive argument to support the NKJV. But at least, someone quoted a translation, rather than just giving their hateful opinion.

The 2021 NRSV Updated Edition has the following footnotes on this verse:

malakos "Meaning of GK uncertain"
arsenokoites "Meaning of GK uncertain"

You like the KJV? Enjoy!

Romans 1:24-27 (KJV)
24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. 26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: 27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly,

 

[Dan Clarkston]

Oops, the Deacon's Son is Gay

That's what caused the deacon to start freakin.... cause his son is now on the highway to heLL

 

[Dan Clarkston]

No one knows why 3-4% or so of males have this loving attraction.

We know exactly why.... they allowed satan to trick them in to lusting after the same sex.

Once can look at the anatomy of a man's body and a woman's body and the evidence is very clear that men's equipment was designed to fit women's equipment so to speak.

Men have an outie, women have an innie... nuff said!

You obviously enjoy being gay but you are on the wrong track and need to REPENT.

 

[Arthur81]

You like the KJV? Enjoy!

Romans 1:24-27 (KJV)
24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. 26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: 27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly,

What did the scenario state about the Deacon's son? The boy said "I have never had such feelings for a female, and in fact I find it repulsive to imagine sexual intercourse with a female."

The Deacon's son was NEVER in any M-F relationship mentally or physically, from which to leave or forsake. Check the Robertson's Word Pictures, v27 is the only place in the NT that the Greek for "burned" and "lust" are to be found. Paul is describing what a Greek philosopher in Paul's day stated, and it is abundantly clear -

From the Greek philosopher Dio Chrysostom (40-110 AD) in The Seventh or Euboean Discourse

Phrasing lifted from text numbered 133 through 152, or do a "Find on Page", Ctrl-F

"In dealing with brothel-keepers and their trade we must certainly betray no weakness as though something were to be said on both sides, but must sternly forbid them...Such men bring individuals together in union without love and intercourse without affection, and all for the sake of filthy lucre...For evils are never wont to remain as they are; they are ever active and advancing to greater wantonness if they meet no compelling check...Indeed, beginning with practices and habits that seem trivial and allowable, it acquires a strength and force that are uncontrollable, and no longer stops at anything...Now at this point we must assuredly remember that this adultery committed with outcasts, so evident in our midst and becoming so brazen and unchecked, is to a very great extent paving the way to hidden and secret assaults upon the chastity of women and boys of good family...The man whose appetite is insatiate in such things, when he finds there is no scarcity, no resistance, in this field, will have contempt for the easy conquest and scorn for a woman's love, as a thing too readily given — in fact, too utterly feminine — and will turn his assault against the male quarters, eager to befoul the youth who will very soon be magistrates and judges and generals, believing that in them he will find a kind of pleasure difficult and hard to procure. His state is like that of men who are addicted to drinking and wine-bibbing, who after long and steady drinking of unmixed wine, often lose their taste for it and create an artificial thirst by the stimulus of sweatings, salted foods, and condiments."

Dio Chrysostom: Discourses 1-20 [Demonax | Hellenic Library Beta]

demonax.info

The sin in v27 is the all-consuming lust!

 

[Arthur81]

We know exactly why.... they allowed satan to trick them in to lusting after the same sex.

Once can look at the anatomy of a man's body and a woman's body and the evidence is very clear that men's equipment was designed to fit women's equipment so to speak.

Men have an outie, women have an innie... nuff said!

You obviously enjoy being gay but you are on the wrong track and need to REPENT.

I see, so the Deacon's son chose, made a decision, to be attracted to and love only other males? Do you remember making a decision about, or choosing your sexual orientation?

Have you never seen the amazing videos of a child born without arms, who learns to pick things up and handle them with his toes? Since Adam, man has not lived in a perfect world so to compare the created design in Eden to what exists today is not a proper comparison. Jesus said about divorce -

"He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery." (Matt 19:8-9 KJV)

 

[Arthur81]

The web site Webmd.com gives a very brief current understanding of sexual orientation, and unless one is belligerently and willingly ignorant, they know this common knowledge of today.

What Determines Sexual Orientation?

Most scientists agree that sexual orientation (including homosexuality and bisexuality) is the result of a combination of environmental, emotional, hormonal, and biological factors. In other words, many things contribute to a person's sexual orientation, and the factors may be different for different people.

Homosexuality and bisexuality aren’t caused by the way children were reared by their parents, or by something that happened to them when they were young. Also, being homosexual or bisexual does not mean the person is mentally ill or abnormal in any way. They may face burdens caused by other people’s prejudices or misunderstandings.

Can Sexual Orientation Be Changed?

Experts agree that sexual orientation isn’t a choice and can’t be changed. Some people who are homosexual or bisexual may hide their sexual orientation to avoid prejudice from others or shame they may have been taught to feel about their sexuality.

Trying to change someone to a heterosexual orientation, including so-called conversion therapy, doesn’t work and can be damaging. Experts don’t recommend this. In fact, the American Medical Association calls it “clinically and ethically inappropriate.”

An Overview of Sexual Orientation

Sexual orientation, including heterosexuality, homosexuality, and bisexuality, can be complicated to understand! Get in here to get answers to your queries related to sexual orientation!

www.webmd.com