Is anyone else a Seer?

[JLB]

Here's the verse...

Acts:2:36
Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.

But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
9 You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And:
“You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands. Hebrews 1:8-10


LORD is YHWH !

 

[Peterlag]

But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
9 You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And:
“You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands. Hebrews 1:8-10


LORD is YHWH !

Some Biblical Unitarians believe that Psalm 45:6 and Hebrews 1:8 are calling the Messiah “god.” They recognize that this king is not being called “God” with a capital “G,” but they think the Messiah is being called “god,” and they translate both Psalm 45:6 and Hebrews 1:8 as having “god” with a lowercase “g.” It is true that in the biblical languages, including Hebrew, Aramaic, Greek, and Latin, the word “GOD” had a much broader meaning than it does today (Hebrew and Aramaic have only uppercase letters, and all the ancient Greek manuscripts were in capital letters, so the manuscripts all read “GOD”). In the biblical languages, “GOD” was a descriptive title applied to a range of authorities, including angels and demons, lesser gods, great people, rulers, and people acting with God’s authority. The word “God” in both Hebrew and Greek could refer to a human being, especially a human being acting under God’s authority. Even Jesus Christ said that (John 10:34-35). So with the understanding that the word “GOD” could refer to a human being, a Biblical Unitarian translation of Hebrews 1:8 is, “Your throne, O god, is forever and ever.”

 

[Peterlag]

Let all the house of Israel know for certain that God has made Him both Lord and Christ - Don't misunderstand this statement. Peter is not saying that God the Father will MAKE Jesus something (someone) that He was not before His incarnation. Beloved, Jesus has ALWAYS been Lord and Christ (Messiah), but by His death, resurrection and exaltation the Father "installs" (so to speak) Him in His rightful exalted position before all creation or as Peter says in Acts 10:36 "He is Lord of all!"

It is worth noting that Peter's sermon repeatedly emphasizes the central role of God the Father.

Acts 2:17 In the last days God says that I will pour forth of My Spirit
Acts 2:22 Jesus the Nazarene, a man attested to you by God
Acts 2:22 miracles and wonders and signs which God performed through Him in your midst,
Acts 2:23 this Man, delivered up by the predetermined plan and foreknowledge of God,
Acts 2:24 God raised Him up again, putting an end to the agony of death,
Acts 2:30 God had sworn to David to seat one of his descendants (MESSIAH) upon his throne
Acts 2:32 This Jesus God raised up again
Acts 2:33 Exalted to the right hand of God
Acts 2:33 Received the promise of the Spirit from the Father (only time called Father)
Acts 2:36 God has made Him both Lord and Christ.

Both Lord and Christ this Jesus - Peter used the word Lord (kurios) in Acts 2:34 to describe the Messiah in Psalm 110:1 and now he applies kurios to Jesus (Iesous). Peter is saying, based on the evidence of Jesus' life, death, resurrection and exaltation, this Jesus they killed was not simply a man, but in fact was God (Lord) and Messiah (Christ). He had described Him as Messiah (Christ) in Acts 2:31 but now adds that He is Lord.


F F Bruce - He was exalted not only as Messiah, but as Lord. The first apostolic sermon leads up to the first apostolic creed: “Jesus is Lord” (cf. Ro 10:9+; 1 Cor. 12:3; Phil. 2:11+) – “Lord” not only as the bearer of a courtesy title, but as bearer of “the name which is above every name” (Phil. 2:9+). To a Jew, there was only one name “above every name” – the Ineffable Name of the God of Israel, represented in synagogue reading and in the LXX text by the title “Lord.” And that the apostles meant to give Jesus the title “Lord” in this highest sense of all is indicated by the way in which they do not hesitate on occasion to apply to Him passages of OT scripture referring to Jehovah. Indeed, in this very context it may well be that the promise “that whosoever shall call on the name of Jehovah shall be delivered” (Joel 2:32) is viewed as being fulfilled in those members of Peter’s audience who repentantly invoke Jesus as Lord. (NICNT-Acts)

Lord (2962)(kurios) means the supreme one, the owner, the one in control. The Jews would be very familiar with this title as the Name of God for kurios was used in the Septuagint Scriptures in every place the Hebrew Name Jehovah was found. The Jews considered Jehovah or Yahweh too holy to pronounce, and so they substituted the word kurios. It follows that Peter's use of kurios was clearly understood by his Jewish audience as a reference to God.

And not surprisingly, Jesus is referred to as Lord repeatedly in Acts - Acts 4:33; 8:16; 15:11; 16:31; 21:13; 28:31. Do you (I) treat Jesus as "Lord?" I'm not speaking of just mouthing the word "Lord," but actually daily living (enabled by His Spirit) in light of the full orbed significance of all that the word kurios entails!

Get your act together and don't "lag"

My act is very together. God cannot lie or die and there's no record of anyone ever spitting at Him or beating Him up. You were dead if you walked in the wrong room in the Temple or dropped the Ark. God is a badass and always was. The low opinion you have of God is disgusting.

 

[JLB]

Some Biblical Unitarians believe that Psalm 45:6 and Hebrews 1:8 are calling the Messiah “god.”

But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
9 You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And:
“You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands. Hebrews 1:8-10

LORD is YHWH !

The Father says to the Son -

• You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth, and the heavens are the work of Your hands.

Do you understand that Jesus the Son created all things?


For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist. And He is the head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in all things He may have the preeminence. Colossians 1:16-18


Do you understand what the phrase "by Him all things were created that are in heaven and on earth"?

 

[Johann]

My act is very together. God cannot lie or die and there's no record of anyone ever spitting at Him or beating Him up. You were dead if you walked in the wrong room in the Temple or dropped the Ark. God is a badass and always was. The low opinion you have of God is disgusting.

You're not worth my time-on ignore you go.

 

[Peterlag]

But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
9 You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And:
“You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands. Hebrews 1:8-10

LORD is YHWH !

The Father says to the Son -

• You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth, and the heavens are the work of Your hands.

Do you understand that Jesus the Son created all things?


For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist. And He is the head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in all things He may have the preeminence. Colossians 1:16-18


Do you understand what the phrase "by Him all things were created that are in heaven and on earth"?

“all things were created.” The Greek verb translated “created” is ktizō (#2936 κτίζω), and it means to create. But this verse is not referring to God creating the world in the beginning. It is referring to His creating the positions of authority that are needed to run the Church, which started on the Day of Pentecost. The Bible describes both the physical and spiritual realities that God created by the phrase, “things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible.”

Many people think that because Colossians 1:16 says, “For by him all things were created,” the verse is speaking of the original creation of the universe but that is not the case. When the word “all” (or “every” or “everything”) is used, it is often used in a limited sense. For example, when Absalom was holding a council against his father, David, 2 Samuel 17:14 says that “all the men of Israel” agreed on advice that was given. “All” the men of Israel were not there and did not all agree, but the verse uses “all” in its limited sense, meaning, “all” who were there, and that limited group all agreed. Another example is Jeremiah 26:8, which says that “all the people” seized Jeremiah to put him to death, but the context makes it very clear that “all the people” were not even present. Again, “all” is being used in a limited sense.

The Bible says that Christians “know all things” (1 John 2:20), but that does not mean we know everything there is to know. The point is that whenever we read the word “all,” we must determine whether it is being used in the wide sense of “all in the universe,” or in the narrow sense of “all in a certain context.” When Colossians 1:16 says “all things were created by him,” we know from both the context and the scope of Scripture that “all” is being used in a limited sense. The things that God created as per this verse are not rocks, trees, birds, and animals, but are “thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities,” and these are the authorities and positions that were needed to run the Church.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

(post removed)

Hi there. Don't you think that there has to be something more to Jesus seeing as He is the only man that was actually conceived by the seed of God? That was why He never sinned even though the devil threw everything at Him to tempt Him. He never took the bait.

 

[Wrangler]

Do you understand that Jesus the Son created all things?


For by Him all things were created

No. Bad translation. Through him. I see by or through my peep hole. Doesn't mean I see by th peep hole.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Hi there. Don't you think that there has to be something more to Jesus seeing as He is the only man that was actually conceived by the seed of God? That was why He never sinned even though the devil threw everything at Him to tempt Him. He never took the bait.

Do we never ask why the devil, who knew who this “son of God“ was before he became Jesus the man, but even so, tried to tempt him into disobedience by putting selfish desires before obedience to his God and Father? This is how the devil created himself. Like all intelligent beings he was given free will.

What would satan have accomplished if Jesus had given in to his human desires instead of standing firm in his resolve to remain obedient? Jesus was fully human or he could not have served his role as redeemer.

Jesus had to be the exact equivalent of Adam in order to pay the price of redemption regarding Adam’s children. Jesus paid the price demanded to free Adam’s descendants from their inheritance of sin and death. (Rom 5:12) He had to be a 100% mortal human to do so. If he was an immortal, he could not die.

He had the weight of the entire human race on his shoulders and it would have been unthinkable for him to indulge any notion of selfishness……in this Jesus and the devil were in diametrically opposite camps.
Both were “sons of God”…..but in different corners of a fight….different sides of a battle.

There was only ever going to be one winner…..but the evil one was not going to be permitted to ‘do his thing’ without purpose. God could have vaporized all the rebels and been done with them, but the challenges and accusations raised by the devil, had to be addressed once and for all…otherwise there was nothing to stop this happening again and again……it was not God’s power on the line here…but his Universal Sovereignty that was challenged.

This tempter was going to be used to test the human race and Satan’s fellow angels as to their loyalty and devotion to their Creator. And in doing so he would force both humankind and the angels to make decisions that would show the the condition of their heart and the depth of the love they had for their rightful Sovereign Creator.

Once this test is carried out to its intended conclusion, then with all tried and tested, (both humans and angels) and separated out, God will dispatch the disobedient ones, and reward the obedient ones……because this is, was, and always will be, the difference between good and evil.

Obedience means doing as the Creator commands in the full understanding that he withholds nothing good from his obedient children, and he has no place in his kingdom for those who think they can do as they please. All God has ever demanded from his ‘children’ is obedience. If the first humans had simply obeyed that one simple command in the garden, none of what transpired after that would have taken place. Humans would be enjoying their paradise home here forever. (Gen 3:22-24)

Jehovah’s Sovereignty is all that matters, and his free willed creatures will have proven, like his precious son, that nothing will dissuade them from serving their God in any way he asks…they know him and love him for who he is and imitate his Christ in all that they do.
Love among themselves will identify them…..(John 13:34-35) And they will even love their enemies (Matt 5:43-44) Who demonstrates such love?

 

[Peterlag]

Hi there. Don't you think that there has to be something more to Jesus seeing as He is the only man that was actually conceived by the seed of God? That was why He never sinned even though the devil threw everything at Him to tempt Him. He never took the bait.

I don't follow you. More of what?

 

[Carl Emerson]

“all things were created.” The Greek verb translated “created” is ktizō (#2936 κτίζω), and it means to create. But this verse is not referring to God creating the world in the beginning. It is referring to His creating the positions of authority that are needed to run the Church, which started on the Day of Pentecost. The Bible describes both the physical and spiritual realities that God created by the phrase, “things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible.”

Many people think that because Colossians 1:16 says, “For by him all things were created,” the verse is speaking of the original creation of the universe but that is not the case. When the word “all” (or “every” or “everything”) is used, it is often used in a limited sense. For example, when Absalom was holding a council against his father, David, 2 Samuel 17:14 says that “all the men of Israel” agreed on advice that was given. “All” the men of Israel were not there and did not all agree, but the verse uses “all” in its limited sense, meaning, “all” who were there, and that limited group all agreed. Another example is Jeremiah 26:8, which says that “all the people” seized Jeremiah to put him to death, but the context makes it very clear that “all the people” were not even present. Again, “all” is being used in a limited sense.

The Bible says that Christians “know all things” (1 John 2:20), but that does not mean we know everything there is to know. The point is that whenever we read the word “all,” we must determine whether it is being used in the wide sense of “all in the universe,” or in the narrow sense of “all in a certain context.” When Colossians 1:16 says “all things were created by him,” we know from both the context and the scope of Scripture that “all” is being used in a limited sense. The things that God created as per this verse are not rocks, trees, birds, and animals, but are “thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities,” and these are the authorities and positions that were needed to run the Church.

Peter, What is your take on John 17 - Jesus shares the same Name as the Father and co-existed with Him before creation...

 

[1stCenturyLady]

I don't follow you. More of what?

Than just "created."

 

[Carl Emerson]

Peter has taken his spin on the Trinity elsewhere.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

Do we never ask why the devil, who knew who this “son of God“ was before he became Jesus the man, but even so, tried to tempt him into disobedience by putting selfish desires before obedience to his God and Father? This is how the devil created himself. Like all intelligent beings he was given free will.

What would satan have accomplished if Jesus had given in to his human desires instead of standing firm in his resolve to remain obedient? Jesus was fully human or he could not have served his role as redeemer.

Jesus had to be the exact equivalent of Adam in order to pay the price of redemption regarding Adam’s children. Jesus paid the price demanded to free Adam’s descendants from their inheritance of sin and death. (Rom 5:12) He had to be a 100% mortal human to do so. If he was an immortal, he could not die.

He had the weight of the entire human race on his shoulders and it would have been unthinkable for him to indulge any notion of selfishness……in this Jesus and the devil were in diametrically opposite camps.
Both were “sons of God”…..but in different corners of a fight….different sides of a battle.

There was only ever going to be one winner…..but the evil one was not going to be permitted to ‘do his thing’ without purpose. God could have vaporized all the rebels and been done with them, but the challenges and accusations raised by the devil, had to be addressed once and for all…otherwise there was nothing to stop this happening again and again……it was not God’s power on the line here…but his Universal Sovereignty that was challenged.

This tempter was going to be used to test the human race and Satan’s fellow angels as to their loyalty and devotion to their Creator. And in doing so he would force both humankind and the angels to make decisions that would show the the condition of their heart and the depth of the love they had for their rightful Sovereign Creator.

Once this test is carried out to its intended conclusion, then with all tried and tested, (both humans and angels) and separated out, God will dispatch the disobedient ones, and reward the obedient ones……because this is, was, and always will be, the difference between good and evil.

Obedience means doing as the Creator commands in the full understanding that he withholds nothing good from his obedient children, and he has no place in his kingdom for those who think they can do as they please. All God has ever demanded from his ‘children’ is obedience. If the first humans had simply obeyed that one simple command in the garden, none of what transpired after that would have taken place. Humans would be enjoying their paradise home here forever. (Gen 3:22-24)

Jehovah’s Sovereignty is all that matters, and his free willed creatures will have proven, like his precious son, that nothing will dissuade them from serving their God in any way he asks…they know him and love him for who he is and imitate his Christ in all that they do.
Love among themselves will identify them…..(John 13:34-35) And they will even love their enemies (Matt 5:43-44) Who demonstrates such love?

Can't respond. We are off topic. My fault.

 

[One 2 question]

Can't respond. We are off topic. My fault.

Can you summerise what a seer is.

 

[Johann]

Can you summerise what a seer is.

In Scripture, a seer is a term used to describe a prophet who receives divine revelation, often through visions. The term is found in both the Old and New Testaments, and different Hebrew and Greek words are used to convey this concept.

Hebrew Words for Seer
רֹאֶה (ro'eh):

Root: From the verb רָאָה (ra'ah), meaning "to see."
Usage: This term emphasizes the visual aspect of receiving revelation, often through visions.
Scripture Reference: 1 Samuel 9:9 - "Formerly in Israel, when a man went to inquire of God, he said, 'Come, let us go to the seer (רֹאֶה);' for he who is now called a prophet was formerly called a seer."
חֹזֶה (chozeh):

Root: From the verb חָזָה (chazah), meaning "to see" or "to perceive."
Usage: Similar to רֹאֶה, this term also focuses on seeing or having visions.
Scripture Reference: 2 Samuel 24:11 - "When David rose in the morning, the word of the LORD came to the prophet Gad, David’s seer (חֹזֶה), saying..."
Greek Word for Seer
ὁρῶν (horōn):
Root: From the verb ὁράω (horaō), meaning "to see."
Usage: This term is used in the Septuagint (the Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible) to translate the Hebrew words for seer.
Scripture Reference: 1 Samuel 9:9 (LXX) - "καὶ ἐν τῇ ἡμέρᾳ ἐκείνῃ οὕτως ἔλεγεν ἀνὴρ ἐν τῷ πορεύεσθαι ἐπερωτῆσαι τὸν θεόν, Δεῦτε καὶ πορευθῶμεν πρὸς τὸν ὁρῶντα (seer): ὁ γὰρ προφήτης καλεῖται τὸ πρίν ὁρῶν."
Exegesis and Explanation
Old Testament (Hebrew Bible)
רֹאֶה (ro'eh): This term is used in contexts where the prophet receives divine messages through visions. It is closely associated with the ability to see spiritually significant visions, providing guidance and revelation from God. An example is Samuel, who is referred to as a seer because he received direct visions from God.

חֹזֶה (chozeh): This word also emphasizes the visionary aspect of prophecy but is used in different contexts and often overlaps with רֹאֶה. Prophets like Gad and Isaiah are referred to as חֹזֶה, indicating their role in perceiving and conveying divine messages.

New Testament (Greek)
ὁρῶν (horōn): In the New Testament context, the concept of a seer is encapsulated in the broader role of a prophet. Prophets in the New Testament also receive revelations from God, sometimes through visions. The Greek term ὁρῶν, derived from ὁράω, conveys the act of seeing or perceiving divine messages. While the specific term for seer is less commonly used, the function is evident in the prophetic ministry of individuals like John, who received the Revelation (Revelation 1:1).
Summary
In Scripture, a seer is a type of prophet who receives divine revelations through visions. The Hebrew terms רֹאֶה (ro'eh) and חֹזֶה (chozeh) both highlight the visual nature of their prophetic experiences. In the Greek New Testament, while the specific term for seer is less frequent, the concept is integrated into the broader role of prophets who perceive and convey God's messages. This understanding underscores the importance of visionary experiences in the biblical portrayal of prophetic ministry.

You agree with her self appointed title?

 

[One 2 question]

Th

In Scripture, a seer is a term used to describe a prophet who receives divine revelation, often through visions. The term is found in both the Old and New Testaments, and different Hebrew and Greek words are used to convey this concept.

Hebrew Words for Seer
רֹאֶה (ro'eh):

Root: From the verb רָאָה (ra'ah), meaning "to see."
Usage: This term emphasizes the visual aspect of receiving revelation, often through visions.
Scripture Reference: 1 Samuel 9:9 - "Formerly in Israel, when a man went to inquire of God, he said, 'Come, let us go to the seer (רֹאֶה);' for he who is now called a prophet was formerly called a seer."
חֹזֶה (chozeh):

Root: From the verb חָזָה (chazah), meaning "to see" or "to perceive."
Usage: Similar to רֹאֶה, this term also focuses on seeing or having visions.
Scripture Reference: 2 Samuel 24:11 - "When David rose in the morning, the word of the LORD came to the prophet Gad, David’s seer (חֹזֶה), saying..."
Greek Word for Seer
ὁρῶν (horōn):
Root: From the verb ὁράω (horaō), meaning "to see."
Usage: This term is used in the Septuagint (the Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible) to translate the Hebrew words for seer.
Scripture Reference: 1 Samuel 9:9 (LXX) - "καὶ ἐν τῇ ἡμέρᾳ ἐκείνῃ οὕτως ἔλεγεν ἀνὴρ ἐν τῷ πορεύεσθαι ἐπερωτῆσαι τὸν θεόν, Δεῦτε καὶ πορευθῶμεν πρὸς τὸν ὁρῶντα (seer): ὁ γὰρ προφήτης καλεῖται τὸ πρίν ὁρῶν."
Exegesis and Explanation
Old Testament (Hebrew Bible)
רֹאֶה (ro'eh): This term is used in contexts where the prophet receives divine messages through visions. It is closely associated with the ability to see spiritually significant visions, providing guidance and revelation from God. An example is Samuel, who is referred to as a seer because he received direct visions from God.

חֹזֶה (chozeh): This word also emphasizes the visionary aspect of prophecy but is used in different contexts and often overlaps with רֹאֶה. Prophets like Gad and Isaiah are referred to as חֹזֶה, indicating their role in perceiving and conveying divine messages.

New Testament (Greek)
ὁρῶν (horōn): In the New Testament context, the concept of a seer is encapsulated in the broader role of a prophet. Prophets in the New Testament also receive revelations from God, sometimes through visions. The Greek term ὁρῶν, derived from ὁράω, conveys the act of seeing or perceiving divine messages. While the specific term for seer is less commonly used, the function is evident in the prophetic ministry of individuals like John, who received the Revelation (Revelation 1:1).
Summary
In Scripture, a seer is a type of prophet who receives divine revelations through visions. The Hebrew terms רֹאֶה (ro'eh) and חֹזֶה (chozeh) both highlight the visual nature of their prophetic experiences. In the Greek New Testament, while the specific term for seer is less frequent, the concept is integrated into the broader role of prophets who perceive and convey God's messages. This understanding underscores the importance of visionary experiences in the biblical portrayal of prophetic ministry.

You agree with her self appointed title?

Thanks for that description. I haven't really been following this thread closely, so I don't know the background to your question.

Just to clarify, are you saying that those who were prophesying in the churches in Paul's day were seers?

 

[Johann]

those who were prophesying in the churches in Paul's day were seers?

In the context of the New Testament and the early church, those who were prophesying were not specifically referred to as "seers" (using the exact terminology of רֹאֶה or חֹזֶה). Instead, they were generally called prophets. However, the function of receiving and delivering divine messages, sometimes through visions, aligns with the Old Testament concept of a seer.

New Testament Prophets and Prophecy
Greek Terminology and Function
Prophet (προφήτης, prophētēs):

Definition: One who speaks forth by divine inspiration; a foreteller or an inspired speaker.
Usage: This term is used extensively in the New Testament to describe those who received and communicated messages from God.
Scripture References:

Acts 13:1: "Now there were in the church at Antioch prophets (προφῆται) and teachers..."
1 Corinthians 12:28: "And God has appointed in the church first apostles, second prophets (προφῆτας), third teachers..."
Prophesy (προφητεύω, prophēteuō):

Definition: To speak under the influence of divine inspiration; to foretell events or to declare the mind of God.
Usage: This term is used to describe the act of prophesying, which includes both foretelling future events and declaring God's will.
Scripture References:

1 Corinthians 14:1: "Pursue love, and earnestly desire the spiritual gifts, especially that you may prophesy (προφητεύητε)."

1 Corinthians 14:3: "But the one who prophesies (προφητεύων) speaks to people for their upbuilding and encouragement and consolation."

The Function of New Testament Prophets
Receiving Divine Revelation: New Testament prophets received messages from God, often through the Holy Spirit. These revelations could include visions, words of knowledge, or direct inspiration.

Speaking Forth God's Will: The primary role of these prophets was to communicate God’s will to the church. This could involve guidance, encouragement, correction, or foretelling future events.

Building Up the Church: As Paul emphasizes in 1 Corinthians 14, the purpose of prophecy was the edification of the church. Prophets were to build up, encourage, and console the congregation.

Connection to the Old Testament Concept of a Seer
Visionary Experiences: Like the Old Testament seers, New Testament prophets could receive visions as part of their prophetic experiences. An example is John, who received the Revelation (Revelation 1:1).
Divine Communication: Both seers and prophets acted as intermediaries between God and the people, communicating divine messages.
Conclusion
While the term "seer" (רֹאֶה or חֹזֶה) is not specifically used in the New Testament to describe prophets in the early church, the functional role of these prophets is quite similar. They received divine revelations, sometimes through visions, and communicated these messages to build up the church. Thus, in terms of function, New Testament prophets could be seen as fulfilling a role similar to that of Old Testament seers, even though the terminology differs.

And there are no more prophets and Apostles and no "new" revelations.

 

[One 2 question]

In the context of the New Testament and the early church, those who were prophesying were not specifically referred to as "seers" (using the exact terminology of רֹאֶה or חֹזֶה). Instead, they were generally called prophets. However, the function of receiving and delivering divine messages, sometimes through visions, aligns with the Old Testament concept of a seer.

New Testament Prophets and Prophecy
Greek Terminology and Function
Prophet (προφήτης, prophētēs):

Definition: One who speaks forth by divine inspiration; a foreteller or an inspired speaker.
Usage: This term is used extensively in the New Testament to describe those who received and communicated messages from God.
Scripture References:

Acts 13:1: "Now there were in the church at Antioch prophets (προφῆται) and teachers..."
1 Corinthians 12:28: "And God has appointed in the church first apostles, second prophets (προφῆτας), third teachers..."
Prophesy (προφητεύω, prophēteuō):

Definition: To speak under the influence of divine inspiration; to foretell events or to declare the mind of God.
Usage: This term is used to describe the act of prophesying, which includes both foretelling future events and declaring God's will.
Scripture References:

1 Corinthians 14:1: "Pursue love, and earnestly desire the spiritual gifts, especially that you may prophesy (προφητεύητε)."

1 Corinthians 14:3: "But the one who prophesies (προφητεύων) speaks to people for their upbuilding and encouragement and consolation."

The Function of New Testament Prophets
Receiving Divine Revelation: New Testament prophets received messages from God, often through the Holy Spirit. These revelations could include visions, words of knowledge, or direct inspiration.

Speaking Forth God's Will: The primary role of these prophets was to communicate God’s will to the church. This could involve guidance, encouragement, correction, or foretelling future events.

Building Up the Church: As Paul emphasizes in 1 Corinthians 14, the purpose of prophecy was the edification of the church. Prophets were to build up, encourage, and console the congregation.

Connection to the Old Testament Concept of a Seer
Visionary Experiences: Like the Old Testament seers, New Testament prophets could receive visions as part of their prophetic experiences. An example is John, who received the Revelation (Revelation 1:1).
Divine Communication: Both seers and prophets acted as intermediaries between God and the people, communicating divine messages.
Conclusion
While the term "seer" (רֹאֶה or חֹזֶה) is not specifically used in the New Testament to describe prophets in the early church, the functional role of these prophets is quite similar. They received divine revelations, sometimes through visions, and communicated these messages to build up the church. Thus, in terms of function, New Testament prophets could be seen as fulfilling a role similar to that of Old Testament seers, even though the terminology differs.

And there are no more prophets and Apostles and no "new" revelations.

Thanks again for your thoughts.

I'm a bit confused though by your last statement....

And there are no more prophets and Apostles and no "new" revelations.

Why do you think that would be the case?

 

[Johann]

Thanks again for your thoughts.

I'm a bit confused though by your last statement....

And there are no more prophets and Apostles and no "new" revelations.

Why do you think that would be the case?

We have the Scriptures.

2 Peter 1:19 (KJV)
Text: "We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts."

Greek Text and Analysis
Greek: καὶ ἔχομεν βεβαιότερον τὸν προφητικὸν λόγον, ᾧ καλῶς ποιεῖτε προσέχοντες ὡς λύχνῳ φαίνοντι ἐν αὐχμηρῷ τόπῳ, ἕως οὗ ἡμέρα διαυγάσῃ καὶ φωσφόρος ἀνατείλῃ ἐν ταῖς καρδίαις ὑμῶν

Key Greek Words:
βεβαιότερον (bebaioteron):

Morphology: Comparative adjective, accusative singular masculine/neuter of βέβαιος (bebaios), meaning "firm" or "sure."
Translation: "More sure" or "more certain."
τὸν προφητικὸν λόγον (ton prophētikon logon):

τὸν (ton): Definite article, accusative singular masculine.
προφητικὸν (prophētikon): Adjective, accusative singular masculine of προφητικός (prophetic), meaning "prophetic."
λόγον (logon): Noun, accusative singular masculine of λόγος (logos), meaning "word."
Translation: "The prophetic word."
προσέχοντες (prosechontes):

Morphology: Present participle active, nominative plural masculine of προσέχω (prosechō), meaning "to pay attention" or "to heed."
Translation: "Taking heed" or "paying attention."
λύχνῳ φαίνοντι (lychnō phainonti):

λύχνῳ (lychnō): Noun, dative singular masculine of λύχνος (lychnos), meaning "lamp."
φαίνοντι (phainonti): Present participle active, dative singular masculine of φαίνω (phainō), meaning "to shine."
Translation: "As a light shining."
ἐν αὐχμηρῷ τόπῳ (en auchmērō topō):

ἐν (en): Preposition, meaning "in."
αὐχμηρῷ (auchmērō): Adjective, dative singular masculine/neuter of αὐχμηρός (auchmēros), meaning "dark" or "gloomy."
τόπῳ (topō): Noun, dative singular masculine of τόπος (topos), meaning "place."
Translation: "In a dark place."
ἡμέρα διαυγάσῃ (hēmera diaugasē):

ἡμέρα (hēmera): Noun, nominative singular feminine, meaning "day."
διαυγάσῃ (diaugasē): Aorist subjunctive active, third singular of διαυγάζω (diaugazō), meaning "to dawn" or "to shine through."
Translation: "Until the day dawns."
φωσφόρος (phōsphoros):

**Noun, nominative singular masculine, meaning "light-bringer" or "morning star."
Translation: "Morning star" or "day star."
ἀνατείλῃ (anateilē):

**Aorist subjunctive active, third singular of ἀνατέλλω (anatellō), meaning "to arise" or "to rise."
Translation: "Rises."
ἐν ταῖς καρδίαις ὑμῶν (en tais kardiais hymōn):

ἐν (en): Preposition, meaning "in."
ταῖς καρδίαις (tais kardiais): Noun, dative plural feminine of καρδία (kardia), meaning "heart."
ὑμῶν (hymōn): Pronoun, genitive plural of σύ (sy), meaning "your."
Translation: "In your hearts."
Interpretation and Context
In 2 Peter 1:16-18, Peter recounts the Transfiguration of Jesus, an extraordinary and personal experience where he witnessed Jesus' divine glory. Despite this significant event, Peter emphasizes in verse 19 that the prophetic word (Scripture) is even more reliable and certain than such experiences.

Key Points:
More Sure Word: The phrase "βεβαιότερον τὸν προφητικὸν λόγον" (more sure prophetic word) indicates that Scripture provides a more stable and trustworthy foundation for faith and practice than personal experiences, even extraordinary ones like the Transfiguration.
Light in a Dark Place: Peter likens the prophetic word to a lamp shining in a dark place. This metaphor emphasizes the guiding and illuminating role of Scripture in the spiritual darkness of the world.
Until the Day Dawns: This phrase points to the ultimate fulfillment of God's promises, culminating in the return of Christ, when all will be fully revealed and understood.
Morning Star: The "morning star" (φωσφόρος) rising in believers' hearts symbolizes the hope and assurance of Christ's return, bringing complete enlightenment and fulfillment of prophetic promises.
Summary

2 Peter 1:19 underscores the unparalleled reliability of the prophetic word (Scripture) compared to personal spiritual experiences. The Greek term "βεβαιότερον" (more sure) highlights the certainty and dependability of biblical prophecy. Peter encourages believers to heed the Scriptures as a guiding light in a dark world, providing hope and direction until the ultimate revelation of Christ, the "morning star," brings full understanding and fulfillment.

Thanks
J.