Predestination: A Calvinist Fairy Tale.
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Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
If you are trying to sound ignorant- you are succeeding! God loves all mankind, but that does not mean all mankind is saved! Gods love and His salvation are two different issues and trying to meld them into one issue is silly.
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
That has nothing to do with how a person gets saved (choice or election) It is a simple statement of fact that says nothing about the mechanics of soteriology.
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Well according to your prejudiced viewpoint. but asd for me, I spent 2 years studying just teh bible alone before I picked up any books on theology. I grew up in a free will church and returned to it after I got saved.
But when people confronted me in my new church, they tolds me I was a five point Calvinist. I didn't even know who Calvin was nor anything about his theology. So your lie here is just that a lie!
Nobody is saying universalism is true... but God's Word clearly teaches He has provided a way for ALL to be saved and He does not want ANY to perish.
Once again, calvinst twisting what is being said to deflect from what they believe which is God picks just a few calvinists to be saved and He is actively preventing all others from getting saved
ALL 5 points of calvinism.. is false doctrine.
The TULIP people have to twist scripture and ignore other scripture to remain with the TULIP people.
It's quite the comedy show seeing calvinists defend their UN-biblical beliefs
<--- Calvinist upset that others don't agree with their false doctrine 
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
1. If God did not want anyone to perish- no one would perish. Mans will does not trump gods will.
2. I agree God provided a means for man to escape th elake of fire.
BUT:
15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.
18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.
19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?
20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?
21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
Remember Romans 8:8-- the unsaved man can do NOTHING to please god. Getting saved would be something that pleases God and God said a man in the flesh (human nature) cannot please God.
And I know that Baptists ( me), Catholics, Methodists, Episcopalians, AOG's, Pentecostals et. al are being saved. I am not a Calvinist but a Baptist.
Seeing how you hate calvinism so much- which of the five points do you disagree with?
That's false because God created man in His Own Image... so man has free will just like God does.
Going by your logic, it's God's fault that Adam and Eve sinned in the garden.
This kind of foolishness is what makes calvinism demonic.
That's why in the New Covenant was see the Lord has tasted of death for ALL men
Lots of folks have resisted His will... this is how one ends up in hell.
This cannot mean God decided to make some people to not have opportunity to get saved... if that where true then there are lies in the New Testament because we see scripture saying God has provided for and does not want anybody to perish.
I was an unsaved person and I pleased God... I decided to accept the Gospel and get born again!
The context of Romans 8:8 is.... those living after the flesh cannot please God because they are rejecting the leading of the Holy Ghost.
And baptists believe and teach tenets of calvinism so both are the same.
You are arguing for calvinist doctrine!
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Well as your false accusations are not Calvinistic (AFAIK) your complaint is irrelevant. Adam had free will and lost it when he fell. As Scripture clearly and unambiguously declares man is a slave to sin.
God did not force Adam and Eve to sin, He just knew they would and allowed for reasons He has declared is none of our business
You are the one that said.... "If God did not want anyone to perish- no one would perish "
Going by your logic, it's God's fault that Adam and Eve sinned in the garden.
This kind of foolishness is what makes calvinism demonic.
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
I will keep my own counsel on what my logic is, thank you very much.
God knows the vast super majority of mankind will perish:
18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.
19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?
20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?
21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
- Matthew 7:13
Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
- Matthew 7:14
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Once again if (reread IF) god did not want anyone to perish, no one would perish. Gods will supersedes any supposed free will of men.
OK, so now you back peddle...
Now, you quit back peddling to contradict yo self
You obviously have no idea what God did when He created mankind and because of this you lack understanding.
Maybe you'll get it someday, I hope you do.
Currently though, you are following the false doctrines of John Calvin who was an un repentant murderer!
They taught you to believe that God not only wants most people to go to hell... He is actively preventing people from getting saved... this makes the god of calvinism to be... satan as this is what satan is trying to do is deceive as many as possible to reject the Lord and go to hell.
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Not in the least am I back pedaling. If God didn't move people to get saved guess what- none would be saved.
So tell me this. Which of the five points of Calvin do you believe in?Now, you quit back peddling to contradict yo self
You obviously have no idea what God did when He created mankind and because of this you lack understanding.
Maybe you'll get it someday, I hope you do.
Currently though, you are following the false doctrines of John Calvin who was an un repentant murderer!
They taught you to believe that God not only wants most people to go to hell... He is actively preventing people from getting saved... this makes the god of calvinism to be... satan as this is what satan is trying to do is deceive as many as possible to reject the Lord and go to hell.
Jesus has provided salvation for the whole world, it is a gift from God, Ephesians 2:8. The reason that he provided salvation for the whole world is because he loves the whole world, John 3:16. But he is not going to force you to love him. What kind of a love would that be? If you want to be saved you will have to call upon his name, which is an act of faith, "Whosoever that shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved" Romans 10:13.
ChristisGod
Well-Known Member
Good luck with that lol I was on that forum since 2000 as a Calvinist. I left Calvinism 3 years ago and they all turned on me like I had the plague. It’s run by Calvinists including the mods. No thanks :). All Matt does is ridicule and mock his opponents.
ChristisGod
Well-Known Member
Double predestination comes from the pit. It’s an assault on Gods nature and character and comes from Greek philosophy, paganism , Gnosticism which Augustine who believed in them married with Christianity in the 4th/5th centuries. He was a manichean. And both Luther and Calvin were disciples of Augustine and believed his many heresies. Many do not know or turn a blind eye to church history and where their per doctrines were developed.
But Jesus said He is drawing all men unto Himself...
ALL five points of calvinism are... false doctrine.
Good for you man!
There's plenty of non calvinists to fellowship with
That's what was always amazing to me... WHY couldn't they have simply gone back to God's Word rather than the writings from augustine's manicheism to learn of his pagan practices
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Yes the gospel is the power of God unto salvation- but that doesn't make your belief in universalism valid. You are a sloppy reader. Let us look:
John 12:32
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.
John 6:44
No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
Unless you are one who plays fast and loose with the Words of SCripture, being drawn by Jesus and being drawn by the Father are two separate things. the greek bears that out.
So let us review your rejection of all five points of Calvinism.
1. T--- You reject total depravity which says that in our human nature there is nothing good
Romans 7:18
For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
Romans 3:10
King James Version
10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:2. U--unconditional election-- you reject that a man has to do nothing other than believe in order to come to Jesus. So do you believe He must first clean up his act a little bit or do something before He can approach God?
Ephesians 2:7-9
King James Version
7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
3. L---limited atonement. You reject that Jesus only removes the sins of the elect. You are a universalist so you believe that everyones sins have been or will be removed.
Matthew 7:13
Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
4. I- irresistible grace. I am surprised you reject this being a universalist.
P--Perseverance of the saints (eternal security) Once again I am amazed you reject this as you have shown you are a universalist.
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
You should know what you are talking about before opening mouth and sounding stupid!That's what was always amazing to me... WHY couldn't they have simply gone back to God's Word rather than the writings from augustine's manicheism to learn of his pagan practices
Manichaeism has nothing to do with any of the five points of calvinism.
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